Open 536: Faith Plus One Game Over! Mafia Win!

[Guyett]

Also that game is still active so no talking about it

[XScorpion]

Sorry mod, I didn't notice :X

[pieceofpecanpie]

Ai, I've managed to swing out of the loop here.

Reading over what I've missed I seem to not want to vote for anyone who's posting regularly.

[Obscurity]

VOTE: Taylor

[Paschendale]

Time for a big post where I ISO everyone and give reads on everyone.

XScorp: Just generally argumentative. Seems to prefer to argue with people rather than craft a theory. Seems to vote more based on who he's mad at rather than who he can articulate a case on. still, not all of his points are bad and he does seem to mainly be criticizing bad ideas. I find emotional outbursts to more common among town. Weak town.

Taylor: Extremely reactionary. Just as argumentative as Scorp, but seems only interested in diffusing others' ideas rather than offering their own. I don't like the faux friendly talk, and I don't like the "trust me" bits. They apparently have only one scumread, and it's just the one person they've been arguing with. Taylor has no theories because Taylor isn't trying to figure out anyone's alignment. Scum!

Helium: I don't know. Helium says as much that I find loathsome as that I can agree with. I don't see any malice here, but haven't seen any points by Helium that I've thought "Yeah, I wanna sheep that". Weak town.

Grimgroove: I got nothing bad to say about Grim. Though, I would like to see a more solid case on someone from him. Town.

Shos: Shos hasn't been screwing around at all. Props. Seems to be a little tunnel-y of XScorp, but not too much. I'd definitely like more reads on other people from Shos. Town.

Guyett/Phok: Phok contributed a lot to this game. He'll be missed. Guyett is a sad shade of Phok's glory. I'd like a little explanation of the reasoning behind 420. Need more for a solid read. Null.

N64/Yoshi: Yoshi basically never made it past RVS. N64 is ballin', despite the late arrival. No nonsense scumhunting and analysis. But I would like to see more scumreads than just Taylor. Town.

TSO: I don't know what was up with TSO's intentional lurk. I don't think it revealed anything about anyone. Pretty much hasn't offered anything of substance. Weak scum.

Pecanpie: Not doing very much, minimal opinions. Could be lurkscum. Needs to contribute more. Most of his actual content is null. Weak scum.

Blueberry: Bad vote, misrep, and a big wall of wtf. Quotes with argumentative comments are not content. Shos vote is maybe okay. Weak scum.

Willwang and Obscurity are basically not playing.

@Shos, what is the deal with all the saying that your content is bad?

Town: Grim, N64, Shos
Weak Town: XScorp, Helium
Null: Guyett
Lurker: Willwang, Obscurity
Weak Scum: TSO, Pecanpie, Blueberry
Scum: Taylor

Blueberry would be my second choice for a lynch over TSO and Pecan, because it's based on what the suspect has said, rather than what they haven't.

[XScorpion]

Shos: Shos hasn't been screwing around at all. Props. Seems to be a little tunnel-y of XScorp, but not too much. I'd definitely like more reads on other people from Shos. Town.

In my universe, "hasn't been screwing around at all" and "votes without explanation" do not fit together.

[pieceofpecanpie]

VOTE: Taylor

What's your justification for that vote?

[XScorpion]

Shos: Shos hasn't been screwing around at all. Props. Seems to be a little tunnel-y of XScorp, but not too much. I'd definitely like more reads on other people from Shos.

Town.

Blueberry: Bad vote, misrep, and a big wall of wtf. Quotes with argumentative comments are not content.

Shos vote is maybe okay.

Weak scum.

Something doesn't fit here.

[XScorpion]

VOTE: Taylor

What's your justification for that vote?

Whoa I didn't even see that vote. What the hell is with the lurkers in this game?
Mod can I become a dayvig please? I have a lot of people I want to shoot...

[Paschendale]

Shos: Shos hasn't been screwing around at all. Props. Seems to be a little tunnel-y of XScorp, but not too much. I'd definitely like more reads on other people from Shos.

Town.

Blueberry: Bad vote, misrep, and a big wall of wtf. Quotes with argumentative comments are not content.

Shos vote is maybe okay.

Weak scum.

Something doesn't fit here.

You do know that town players often vote for each other for perfectly good reasons, right? I didn't say the vote was right, just that it wasn't scummy. Please try to keep up.

[Taylor]

@Taylor: Explain the 180 from:

Even after reading Taylor's wall, I still don't know where they stand. Everything from that slot is purely reactionary.

Town reads:

grim

, helium
Probably town: pecan, pasch
Null: blueberry, obscurity
Maybe scum: shos
Scum: xscorpion

Pasch, I'm a little surprised to see you say this when I stated both my town and scum reads by name in there.

T

I would

say

it was hydra dissonance, that T made that list without my consent. However, that'd be inaccurate. T is beginning to come around to my point of view. T made that list without my input; that is still true. However, I cannot claim hydra dissonance anymore because T is actually agreeing with my revised reads, and not T's stated reads. Thus, this IS a question that can be answered, but not by me. By T.

The basic reason behind it, though, is that T--like me--feels that there is something

off

about Grimgroove's play this game. Going off of our guts, we're both beginning to see a lot of the same things, and they're the things I've been pointing out. For instance, that your posting has gotten much better.

I'm thinking if TSO flips scum Taylor will also flip scum. if he flips town Taylor will flip town. Call this an extremely good hunch

Eh, TSO isn't really a read of mine. (T might have a read, but if so, I can't remember. I certainly don't.) But we're town.

what else you got

Unfortunately not much, aside from GG being scum. There are some random tidbits in our QT which I can track down and give, but mostly, that's about all we've got right now. Got anything specific in mind? That'll likely work much better.

Taylor: Extremely reactionary. Just as argumentative as Scorp, but seems only interested in diffusing others' ideas rather than offering their own.

If you think we haven't been offering our own opinions, Pasch, I don't know what to say to you. Seriously. You're not reading the same game. We've offered plenty. Hell, nearly the entirety of our iso on other players is focused on giving insight into them.

I don't like the faux friendly talk, and I don't like the "trust me" bits.

Pasch. I respect you as a player. I think you're town. I think you have talent. I don't throw those words idly around. So when I say this, I say it with the nicest possible intentions.

Fuck. off.

You. Are. Wrong. When I say you can trust me. I FUCKING MEAN YOU NEED TO BLOODY DAMN WELL TRUST ME. I am town. You are town. SO STOP BEING A STUBBORN ASS AND REASSESS THINGS. You're wasting your time on us. Seriously, SERIOUSLY going up the wrong tree.

They apparently have only one scumread, and it's just the one person they've been arguing with.

Again, not true. XScorp, the guy we were arguing with, we were arguing with TO DISCERN HIS ALIGNMENT. We originally thought scum, yes. BUT THE PROCESS OF THE ARGUMENT AND THE CONTENT FOLLOWING HAS CONVINCED US OTHERWISE. THAT IS FUNDAMENTAL SCUMHUNTING. You're better than this. You should recognize this. Hell, your own list only has one player in the scum category. That doesn't mean you've only got one scumread, now, does it? Same applies to us. We've only got one listed as a scumread. (Currently GG.) That doesn't mean we don't have them on others. Stop being a moron. You're not that stupid, Pasch. You can have good insights. But your read on us is not one of them.

Helium is town. Yoshi's slot is town, too. Pecan's a weak townread. Talk to us on why you've labeled Grim as town off of nothing. (And it better damn well not involve us scumreading him.) Talk to us about Blueberry. Blueberry is a null of ours. And we would love to hear more from you on that. Hell, talking about your nulls in greater detail could be helpful as well, given that Guyett, Obscurity, and TSO are all null-reads of ours.

So work with us. Don't sabotage us. We are town. You are town. You can be smart, so don't be stupid and discard this reach-out.

[Grimgroove]

The basic reason behind it, though, is that T--like me--feels that there is something

off

about Grimgroove's play this game. Going off of our guts, we're both beginning to see a lot of the same things, and they're the things I've been pointing out.

Talk to us on why you've labeled Grim as town off of nothing.

You serious?

[Guyett]

Time for a big post where I ISO everyone and give reads on everyone.

Guyett/Phok: Phok contributed a lot to this game. He'll be missed. Guyett is a sad shade of Phok's glory.

I'd like a little explanation of the reasoning behind 420.

Need more for a solid read. Null.

I don't think I can without outing one of the heads of the hydra and until they're happy to not be anonymous.

[Grimgroove]

ok so future drunk guyett may have a problem with rule 8 :/

Grim is town, not sure on Taylor yet though...

So much fluff early on about hydra head spec.

VOTE: Shos

Can you expand on all of what you said here please?

[Guyett]

I will in a few hours, I have to go to college now but once I'm in I'll lash out some better reads.
this is looking like town you btw Grim. I had a flick through one of your scum games to see if taylors argument about spam posting made sense and it doesn't.

Regarding the bit about drunk guyett you should know already

[Grimgroove]

I really need to re-iterate why helium is scum, don't I?

I see nothing good coming from this slot, and I KNOW mollie can do better, and I KNOW she knows me better than that. She's not working with me.
The only thing they are doing is taunting me. One could think: reaction-test. But they're doing nothing with the results. Right now they're even ignoring me again. Waiting to see if that wagon on me will somehow gain momentum, but already eying shos inc ase it doesn't.

The following quote is their case on me:

strong hints of surface-level scumhunting combined with soft underlays of going after low hanging fruit based on superficial reasons with the faintest hint of him looking a bit nervous.

Following that quote, "their case" has been addressed on all fronts. They squirmed. In 337 it suddenly wasn't about my lack of scumhunting. But then it was.

But I asked questions as well. Have they been addressed? No. 307, 347, 349.

The main things that interest me and still have not been addressed properly.

1. Their initial interest in me. Already in 217 I was "standing out".

At that time, I had only posted the following:

VOTE: XScorpion

Mr. X-planation needs to be X-ecuted.

An RVS.

I will only have time for this game tomorrow. Be ready for me to take over this thread but do keep yourselves busy until that time.

A prod dodge.

What stands out there?

Not only that, but they actually wanted to vote me over that shit. 255 shows they were discussing voting me over an RVS vote and that prod dodge.

When I ask what it was that was standing out, Mollie finally answers me after repeated requests in 294: I WAS NOT DOING ANYTHING.

EXACTLY! I was not there. This has got nothing to do with alignment. How the fuck does that make me stand out? Those two fucknuts simply decided to call me out over bullshit and thought they were on to some Grim-lynching after my catch-up. Yes, my catch-up. So after not having been here, I caught up with this topic in my usual way: questions, comments, votes.

Their case? It entirely revolved around one thing I did: my vote and case on Blueberry. They have misrepped it as an exclusive tunnel several times, they have claimed I was looking for low-hanging fruit without ever properly explaining what would make Blueberry low-hanging fruit in my eyes and they are using meta-BULLSHIT against me. Town-Grim would do this, Town-Grim wouldn't do that. They know perfectly well what I do as town and it's this shit right here. There is nothing superficial about my efforts.

They had no case on me. They just grabbed for arguments along the way of my defense. Just look at our interactions. There's subtle changes in their argumentation whenever I addressed something. Whatever they can twist, they do, apart from their read on me. It's completely mechanical.

What's more: look at their ISO. Prior to 255, helium did not have any case on anyone. They had reads, yes, but cases? Arguments? Can you see any? Yet THEY call ME out for going for easy pickings.

The only case they have is the one they have on me and it's excruciatingly bad.

What makes them town? Mollie's insistance is of the emotional kind "I AM RIGHT YOU ARE WRONG" and is null. Antihero I don't know, he's definitely aggravating me and I know he knows it. I'm just waiting for him to turn my aggravation into a scumtell. "Nervousness", right?

And that experienced Taylor-head is just as bad really. Calling others out for calling me town for no reason, yet why is he calling me scum?
Because I spampost. That I don't do that as town. That's a lie. Plain and simple. Taylor wants me lynched over a lie. How can that not be scum?

[Guyett]

What do you think about TSO?

[Grimgroove]

this is looking like town you btw Grim. I had a flick through one of your scum games to see if taylors argument about spam posting made sense and it doesn't.

Why did you need to flick through my scum games? You've played with town-me plenty of times, that's all you need to see Taylor's argument is shit.

I do have difficulty believing you actually flicked through my scumgames. Your involvement in this game hasn't been extremely in-depth, so I have a hard time imagining you going throughb the effort of doing a meta-study on me based on one argument you read. Seems very detailistic for someone who's been posting mainly in general terms so far.

[Grimgroove]

I'm waiting for his RVS-analysis. That trick he mentioned. RVS has been over for a while now, so I wonder what's the delay.

T S O is null. The only thing he's adamant about is his townread on Taylor. I don't see it the way he does, but that doesn't make him scummy. Nor townie.

[Guyett]

I had a brief flick through hd's great idea game .
I've only just replaced in and I was nursing the mother of all hangovers yesterday so I couldn't really play to the best of my abilities but I'm much better today. Going to get some reads done when I get into college

[helium-3]

I see nothing good coming from this slot, and I KNOW mollie can do better, and I KNOW she knows me better than that. She's not working with me.

Have you given her a reason to work with you? no

The only thing they are doing is taunting me. One could think: reaction-test. But they're doing nothing with the results. Right now they're even ignoring me again. Waiting to see if that wagon on me will somehow gain momentum, but already eying shos inc ase it doesn't.

I'm not eyeing a case on shos. Which ass are you pulling that out of?

What stands out there?

Not only that, but they actually wanted to vote me over that shit. 255 shows they were discussing voting me over an RVS vote and that prod dodge.

When I ask what it was that was standing out, Mollie finally answers me after repeated requests in 294: I WAS NOT DOING ANYTHING.

EXACTLY! I was not there. This has got nothing to do with alignment. How the fuck does that make me stand out? Those two fucknuts simply decided to call me out over bullshit and thought they were on to some Grim-lynching after my catch-up. Yes, my catch-up. So after not having been here, I caught up with this topic in my usual way: questions, comments, votes.

i explained this already, and you totally left it out

also, call mollie and I fucknuts again, and i'll start posting kuribo-ized versions of your avy

What makes them town? Mollie's insistance is of the emotional kind "I AM RIGHT YOU ARE WRONG" and is null. Antihero I don't know, he's definitely aggravating me and I know he knows it.

o_o oh look neither of these are scumtells either

[Grimgroove]

You should consider a namechange to "Hot Air". Though the lighter than air-element of your arguments is already accurately expressed through your current name, mollie's (supposed) hot temperedness combined with that unbearable lightness makes for just that. Pump the two of you into a balloon and it will be flying to the moon and back.

I'm not going to call you fucknuts again. I actually meant to say knuckleheads. Seriously :p Don't know how fucknuts ended up being typed. DO NOT TOUCH MY AVY! It is sacred.

[Guyett]

shos

- null with a scum lean. Most of the posts here are contentless, it looks like you are trying to look busy but you actually aren't.

Taylor

- Scum. A lot of your early play looks like you are getting super defensive and could be scum frustrated for being caught for the wrong reasons. Also if taylor is scum so is TSO. If Taylor is town TSO is town. The 180 between town reading grim and then voting him is pretty bad.
I disagree with the last part of 150. You spend a lot of time arguing with scorpion giving out to him for not scumhunting (180) but I'm not seeing much scum hunting from you

XScorpion

- null with a considerable town lean, didn't like the early hydra head spec, I felt that instead of driving the game out of RVS it just muddied the waters.
I like 56, I also like 110. Town emotion in 134 to 141. I like you back and forward with Helium over the whole Grim/berry thing

N64Lord

- Town, I like the content so far. You totally need to get a vote down though. I take it you have shos in your scum pile after 412?!?

T S O

- scum, 2 reasons. the first is the association with the Taylor hydra, If they are scum TSO is scum. I can't go into too much detail on that yet. Other than that he has just posted fluff and promised a mega read list using some new scum hunting method. I patiently wait.

helium-3

- scum. I really don't like your case on Grim at all. Lots of early fluff trying to look busy. nice chainsaw with your attacking scorpion to protect taylor. you say Taylor is scummy in 187 but no vote? then this read seems to vanish come 209 and 217. 297 is kinda ironic seen as you're tunnelling on Grim

Grimgroove

- Town. Take that one to the bank. this is town grim. Grim spam posts regardless of alignment... If the only reason you have for him being scum is that he hasn't structured his posts into one nice large post then good luck to you lol. His mega spam post looks like what Mastin did in antihero where he just went through the thread and posted after each interesting post.

Blueberry

- town. 102 is wrong, he was pushing a PL not a quick lynch. Much of the early posts are bad and I see why people thought he might be scummy but I really like 370
It cuts through Shos's bullshit and shows that he has been active lurking. His point about Pasch pushing for his lynch without actually voting is a good argument (@ Grim this reminds me of what LC was doing in the anti hero game)

Paschendale

- Town, I like your case on Taylor, not seeing your reasoning for your push on berry. I agree with some reads in 429 but some are way off imo. You're looking much better in this game than in others we've played in.

willwang123

- Null. There is not enough content here to analyse. Should be posting now though as V/La is finished.

pieceofpecanpie

- null with a scum lean. There is so much active lurking going on here. 51 was bad and your reaction to the wagon that followed was worse. Pushing for a PL just because you don't know who the heads are is terrible. No real reasons given for the scorpion wagon and the reason for jumping off the wagon is pretty bad too.. it looks like you just got off as the wagon was failing.

Obscurity

- Null. Where is the content!!! Care to explain your reasoning behind the Taylor vote?


I'm calling it now
Scum team of Helium-3, TSO and Taylor

I'm keeping my vote on TSO but I am willing to vote for either of the other two.

[Grimgroove]

And you didn't explain anything.

This was your supposed explanation:

Well, i'd like to start off by saying that you were on my watch list because you pinged my gut. Your first two posts are trying to be cutesy and disarming, and I know you're not the cutesy kind of guy from the two town games I've seen you in.

Now, why you're all butthurt about being on the watch list is kind of beyond me...

Cutesy? Disarming?


Is anyone reading this "explanation"?




Please pop that stuff and vote those heliumheads out of here.

[Guyett]

I would prefer to lynch Taylor or TSO as their flip will tell us the alignment of the other