Micro 267 - Indie Game: The UPick - Game Over!

[Trine]

How would you rank Des/Hermy/GG in terms of scumminess right now?

Desp>GG>Hermy

Why is GG scummy? And if GG is scummy is there some reason why we are not? If your read of GG is dependent on his stance re Hermy, then I feel that we should also be somewhere in your list.

~ Zoya

To be fair here, I only asked BRO to compare these three because 122 seemed to suggest he thought all three were scummy.

Then my question is even more relevant. Why wasn't I mentioned in post 122?

[BROseidon]

Is he?

BRO, is it fair to say you are not on board with the 'wait-and-see' approach for hermy?

I am as long as I don't think Hermy's scum.

Re Desp: I'm not parroting penguin's opinions in marginally different wording immediately after she does. That's what I mean by "lockstep"

Do you have a theory why Scum-Desperado would shadow TV?

Perception of penguin/mala being strong players, and ones that long-term he'd keep around after getting a cheap townread out of them.

It's what I pulled on Nacho in Xenoblade.

Why is GG scummy? And if GG is scummy is there some reason why we are not? If your read of GG is dependent on his stance re Hermy, then I feel that we should also be somewhere in your list.

Gut+makes more sense w/ Desp scum.

Bro says I'm scum for following Penguin and being in perfect lockstep with her while simultaneously pushing the same agenda we were pushing. IDGI, and normally I do get it when Bro is town.

...um?

Xenogears: metown youscum
Sabotage: mescum youtown
[redacted]

Define "normally"

To be fair here, I only asked BRO to compare these three because 122 seemed to suggest he thought all three were scummy.

Hermy is independently scummy, but Desp+GG makes a lot more sense than Desp+Hermy.

Then my question is even more relevant. Why wasn't I mentioned in post 122?

Given my scumreads, you're implicitly town. Why should I give scum a sense of relative strength of townreads?

[Trine]

Given my scumreads, you're implicitly town. Why should I give scum a sense of relative strength of townreads?

Back up and explain why GG is scum again. I'm missing something pretty important if you have him as scum and me as town.

~ Zoya

[BROseidon]

It's associative and contingent on Desp being scum.

So obviously I'm pushing Desp before anyone else.

[Trine]

Your strongest scum read is based on apparent synch with a perceived strong player. Is there more to the Desperado scumread?

~ Zoya

[Who]

I unvoted TV because things were going slowly and I decided to get a wagon going. Then I realized that someone else had voted TV so a wagon was going. TV is currently at L-2.

Why did you feel the need to justify your vote?

People seemed to be not understanding.

I can buy that.
VOTE: Who needs to get in the game.
@Who: Why wagon the hydras?

It was RVS, the game was going slowly, wagons often move the game out of RVS, so I wagoned. Why the hydras? It was RVS, why not?


I think that GG is town from the thing with Hermy. BROseidon I see as null due to me not knowing what to make of things, Desp is null-scum, Hermy, TV, and XScorpion are all null due to lack of info though I may just have been missing their important posts rather than them not making any.

Oh, and UNVOTE: since we're out of RVS.

[XScorpion]

Explain the desp read. Why aren't you voting anyone?

[Who]

You're the first one to say that, and you only say that. Interesting.

Desp is usually much better than he is here. When I say "usually" I'm going off of the game I modded recently where he was town and better, though he does have a reputation for being good but I haven't verified that and I don't know in what way. Null-scum rather than scum because A) I'm not basing this off of that much and B) reasons in that game make me think he may have been better than he usually is. Also post #91 felt wrong to me.

I don't have enough of a reason to vote anyone, and I wanted to see what happened when I didn't vote.

[XScorpion]

You're the first one to say that, and you only say that. Interesting.

What else did you expect me to say?

I don't have enough of a reason to vote anyone, and I wanted to see what happened when I didn't vote.

Why?

[Desperado]

Re Desp: I'm not parroting penguin's opinions in marginally different wording immediately after she does. That's what I mean by "lockstep"

But you would have been if you were around when I was, right? Because your thoughts DO parrot ours.

And you and I both know I can't define it right now.

[Who]

You're the first one to say that, and you only say that. Interesting.

What else did you expect me to say?

You might have said something totally unrelated (Something about someone else) but you didn't. Probably completely irrelevant.

I don't have enough of a reason to vote anyone, and I wanted to see what happened when I didn't vote.

Why?

I said why my vote on Desp was still null and unworthy of a vote, nobody else was close to being worthy of a vote, thus I did not have enough of a reason to vote anyone. Why did I want to see what happened? Curiosity.

[XScorpion]

Why did I want to see what happened? Curiosity.

You have a very strange method of scumhunting, if that is what this is.

[Trine]

It's associative and contingent on Desp being scum.

So obviously I'm pushing Desp before anyone else.

How is Grim connected to Desp?

-Amadeus

[Grimgroove]

During the previos game I've played with Hermy, she set herself up as lynchbait in the beginning of the game as well. I would like to see her operate without any pressure at all before reaching any conclusions on that slot.

"I'm okay with letting players obfuscate scummy play with meta-level stupidity."

...

Please communicate more directly instead of paraphrasing me (incorrectly) and not making your own stance clear.
Do you think Hermy has shown scummy play here?
I noticed in 151 you're not thinking she's scum. Why is this?
In that same post you agree with the "wait and see"-approach. Yet here you can only bring yourself to make a snappy comment about my proposition of doing exactly that.

And for the record, before this thing starts leading its own life: I never defended Hermy. I simply advocated another approach based on my earlier experiences with her. Just read the game I linked you to earlier you'll see perfectly where I'm coming from. Even that game itself I had resevrations about Baezu because of her lynchbait characteristics, but still went after her in the end after she failed in some reaction tests. And I went after Hermy for not recognizing the fact she was lynchbait as well. Lynchbaits are lynchbaits exactly because they fail reaction tests, regardless of alignment. So how to discern the alignment of lynchbait? Not through reaction tests, but by letting them act on their own accord.

...except you are...

Could you tell me what the purpose of making such a comment is? I don't see it.

[Alduskkel]

Vote Count 1.06

BROseidon (2) - Trine, Desperado
Who (1) - XScorpion
Hermy (1) - Turkish Van
Desperado (1) - BROseidon
Trine (1) - Grimgroove

Not Voting (3) - Sanhora, Hermy, Who

9 alive, 5 to lynch.

Deadline is on December 14th, 12 p.m. PST.

Countdown:
(expired on 2013-12-14 12:00:00)

Searching for a replacement for Sanhora.

[BROseidon]

Re Desp: I'm not parroting penguin's opinions in marginally different wording immediately after she does. That's what I mean by "lockstep"

But you would have been if you were around when I was, right? Because your thoughts DO parrot ours.

And you and I both know I can't define it right now.

1) I wouldn't dedicate a post to it.

2) Point stands: unless you've read a lot of my games, you don't have much range with my gameplay to define how I "normally" behave and how frequently our thoughts aline.

[BROseidon]

Your strongest scum read is based on apparent synch with a perceived strong player. Is there more to the Desperado scumread?

~ Zoya

gut.

I'll figure out what's driving the gut when I'm less tired. Probably tomorrow.

[BROseidon]

It's associative and contingent on Desp being scum.

So obviously I'm pushing Desp before anyone else.

How is Grim connected to Desp?

-Amadeus

Duo-ISO them. They're avoiding each other.

[BROseidon]

Please communicate more directly instead of paraphrasing me (incorrectly) and not making your own stance clear.
Do you think Hermy has shown scummy play here?
I noticed in 151 you're not thinking she's scum. Why is this?
In that same post you agree with the "wait and see"-approach. Yet here you can only bring yourself to make a snappy comment about my proposition of doing exactly that.

Here's the difference:

You're saying that you want to take pressure off her because she does objectively scummy shit as town, then proceeds to continue to be scummy under pressure.

I'm saying that what she did is scummy, but that I'm seeing two other people that are acting more scummy, which would mean that Hermy's town. I'm then moving in accordance to what I think the gamestate is.

[BROseidon]

Could you tell me what the purpose of making such a comment is? I don't see it.

To point out that you're misrepping your own play in an attempt to make it look better.

Sorry not sorry that you can't read through the sarcasm.

[XScorpion]

Who are your townreads, BRO?

[Angry Frat BROs]

Implicitly everyone that isn't Desp/GG

If you want relative strength beyond that, I'm not giving that out yet

[BROseidon]

Implicitly everyone that isn't Desp/GG

If you want relative strength beyond that, I'm not giving that out yet

I need to stop hydra slipping :/

[XScorpion]

Who, do you only vote when you are confident someone is scum? What makes one "worthy" of a vote? Why not vote Des if you are suspicious, even if you aren't sure?

[Who]

I wanted to see the difference between Desperado's reaction to that and Desperado's reaction to this:
VOTE: Desperado