Newbie 1484 (Day Two)

[JarJarDrinks]

@jarjar Can you explain your reasoning when you say that me flipping will make Bulba look scummy?

When I asked bulb about you his one word response was "scum". Yet he hasn't voted for you. He hasn't questioned you or pressured you at all aside from a single throwaway comment. The fact that you're a vote from being hammered and he isn't discussing it @ all is odd.

And also the fact that you named him as potential scum in your list of reads looks like you're trying to give him some credibility for when you flip.

So you think that he is scum also?

Maybe it's just the way I'm reading it, but look @ the way this last post is worded. Shouldn't he say it more like: "So you also think that he is scum?". The way he says it kinda sounds like he's scum claiming.

[Hopkirk]

Vote Soctor

And that's 5/you're dead.
Bye.

This is super scummy given that discussion is still prevalent.

After a votecount... you don't notice it's a fake hammer how?

Explain why you think a fake hammer is scummy.

And thanks to the person who ruined it right away

I don't understand. What is a fake hammer supposed to accomplish?

If he gives up thinking it's real (he's new so he may) then we know for sure this is a very good lynch.
We can judge his reaction either way.
Unless someone ruins it.

[Thesoctorisin]

It's just the way your reading it.

Also, why would I scum claim? Is it a strategy or are you saying I did it on accident?

[Thesoctorisin]

Ohhhh I see! If I were to say it your way I would mean that we both think bulba is scummy. Well I guess that's true

[Bulbazak]

While we're at it, could you link the post where Hopkirk unvoted? I could have sworn I saw him just recently change his vote to Soctor and leave it on Soctor.

Sorry, I must have misread it.

If you'd prefer, I'll just rephrase my argument.

Even though you are the most experienced player, and thus, the player who should be able to provide the most information, you choose not to provide information unless it's directly related to you.

I already answered this question in that post you are complaining about: I have not been providing information only when it's directed at me, which you would see if you looked through my ISO. Why do you want me to answer your question in one big paragraph, instead of 2 pinpointed sentences?

[Hopkirk]

It's just the way your reading it.

Also, why would I scum claim? Is it a strategy or are you saying I did it on accident?

If you thought you were hammered (out/dead) you may have given up. It works sometimes.

[JarJarDrinks]

Vote Soctor

And that's 5/you're dead.
Bye.

This is super scummy given that discussion is still prevalent.

After a votecount... you don't notice it's a fake hammer how?

Explain why you think a fake hammer is scummy.

And thanks to the person who ruined it right away

I don't understand. What is a fake hammer supposed to accomplish?

If he gives up thinking it's real (he's new so he may) then we know for sure this is a very good lynch.
We can judge his reaction either way.
Unless someone ruins it.

Yeah that seems kinda shady. And are we even allowed to post after someone is hammered? I thought we had to stay silent.

[JarJarDrinks]

It's just the way your reading it.

Also, why would I scum claim? Is it a strategy or are you saying I did it on accident?

If you thought you were hammered (out/dead) you may have given up. It works sometimes.

He was talking to me cause I said he may have "scum claimed" above. I guess I really meant "scumslipped"

[LessThanOriginal]

I was going to come in and attempt to get people to bounce off soctor for useful reactions when he flips. Apparently that's getting sorted already though.

Still, I think we need to get more people talking than just the main five or so. And yes, I'm including myself in the "people who should probably be talking more" category. What do you guys say to a questionnaire for everyone to respond to? If yes, I'll take question suggestions, though no fishing for PT roles is allowed, for obvious reasons :V.

[Hopkirk]

@Jarjar: Sounds like he was talking to me as he i said he may scum claim.

And you can post between hammer and flip.

Lessthan is giving me bad vibes man.

[LessThanOriginal]

Vibes are such a wonderful reason to lynch people, aren't they?

Nah, it annoys me when people don't give real reasons. It makes it harder to figure out when they're being genuine and means there's a lot less evidence to prove them either way later on.

Carry on.

[Thesoctorisin]

@hopkirk I was talking to jarjar but I was also wondering that too so thanks for clearing it up

[Hopkirk]

Vibes are such a wonderful reason to lynch people, aren't they?

Nah, it annoys me when people don't give real reasons. It makes it harder to figure out when they're being genuine and means there's a lot less evidence to prove them either way later on.

Carry on.

And i try and lynch you where?
Just putting it out there in case i forget later (i should really do spreadsheets again).

[LessThanOriginal]

Vibes are such a wonderful reason to lynch people, aren't they?

Nah, it annoys me when people don't give real reasons. It makes it harder to figure out when they're being genuine and means there's a lot less evidence to prove them either way later on.

Carry on.

And i try and lynch you where?
Just putting it out there in case i forget later (i should really do spreadsheets again).

It was a general comment on the culture of people lynching on vibes. Your post may have triggered it, but being pre-emptively defensive really isn't my style. Nice job trying to pin something on me though, I guess. Slightly more solid than just "vibes".

[Number_0ne]

UNVOTE:

I'm just feeling really suspicious of this lynch right now.

What exactly are you suspicious about?

Never mind. I was suspicious of Hopkirk for demanding a claim so early, as well as his accusations on so many people and focus on getting a lynch. Well, now the early claim demand ties in with him trying to get thesoctor to reveal himself through fakehammer. Still, I'm a bit more hesitant to lynch thesoctor, because it seems like he has been making a bunch of newbie mistakes rather than try and get a townie lynched.

[I Love Fairies]

Vote Soctor

And that's 5/you're dead.
Bye.

This is super scummy given that discussion is still prevalent.

After a votecount... you don't notice it's a fake hammer how?

Explain why you think a fake hammer is scummy.

And thanks to the person who ruined it right away

I really think you're just trying to cover your ass here. If I noticed that it was fake, so did everyone else. You're trying to deceive people and in this manner, that's a bad thing.

I think a "fake hammer" is scummy because it serves no purpose and calling it a "fake hammer" means nothing to me. I know and you know and everyone else knows that you thought it was a real hammer. Now that we have taken out the fake in hammer, I'll explain why hammering in this situation is super scummy. Reason number one: information is the most valuable commodity in this game, and ending Day early ends discussion and limits the maximum amount of information the town can get. Reason number two: hammers and other decisions that make a big impact on the game (what targets a claimed cop should investigate, who should be lynched, when someone should be lynched, etc) should be decided upon as a group. You thought it was best if you did it on your own, without the group, giving the town little chance to make the decisions.

I'll reply to Bulba later tonight, but I gotta go for now.

[Thesoctorisin]

@number1 Now that you unvoted me, are you still leaning to me or are you leaning to someone else?

[Bulbazak]

Yeah that seems kinda shady.

Fake hammers are actually a pretty good reaction test. You're going to see it a lot more often outside Newbie games.

And are we even allowed to post after someone is hammered? I thought we had to stay silent.

We are allowed to continue posting in twilight, unless the mod has made a rule stating otherwise, which he has not in this case.

What do you guys say to a questionnaire for everyone to respond to? If yes, I'll take question suggestions, though no fishing for PT roles is allowed, for obvious reasons :V.

Why do you need our permission to ask questions?

[catboi]

I think a "fake hammer" is scummy because it serves no purpose and calling it a "fake hammer" means nothing to me.

This isn't true, fyi. it's entirely valid to try to convince a player, particularly an inexperienced one, that they've been hammered in order to get a genuine reaction out of them. It doesn't work often, but it can produce results and has a few times. There's legitimate town motive to fake a hammer, especially in this situation.

Which isn't to say that he could have faked it as scum to seem town, but in a newbie game he's less likely to get credit for an unconventional play like that. It all devolves into WIFOM at some point, but in my eyes? more likely to come from town.

soctor certainly could potentially be noobish town, but I don't really like letting people off the hook based on emotional appeals like his, because it could just as well come from a scum player in this instance, I think. Still, I'm going to look over everyone else tomorrow now that I have more to read off.

[Hopkirk]

UNVOTE:

I'm just feeling really suspicious of this lynch right now.

What exactly are you suspicious about?

Never mind. I was suspicious of Hopkirk for demanding a claim so early, as well as his accusations on so many people and focus on getting a lynch. Well, now the early claim demand ties in with him trying to get thesoctor to reveal himself through fakehammer. Still, I'm a bit more hesitant to lynch thesoctor, because it seems like he has been making a bunch of newbie mistakes rather than try and get a townie lynched.

IF YOU ARE ON L-1 YOU CLAIM.
THIS IS BASIC STUFF.

[Bulbazak]

Actually, you should only claim if you are at L-1 and intent to hammer has been given. This way, PRs can try to keep their role hidden for as long as possible. Anybody who says otherwise is horribly anti-town.

[Hopkirk]

Vote Soctor

And that's 5/you're dead.
Bye.

This is super scummy given that discussion is still prevalent.

After a votecount... you don't notice it's a fake hammer how?

Explain why you think a fake hammer is scummy.

And thanks to the person who ruined it right away

I really think you're just trying to cover your ass here. If I noticed that it was fake, so did everyone else. You're trying to deceive people and in this manner, that's a bad thing.

I think a "fake hammer" is scummy because it serves no purpose and calling it a "fake hammer" means nothing to me. I know and you know and everyone else knows that you thought it was a real hammer. Now that we have taken out the fake in hammer, I'll explain why hammering in this situation is super scummy. Reason number one: information is the most valuable commodity in this game, and ending Day early ends discussion and limits the maximum amount of information the town can get. Reason number two: hammers and other decisions that make a big impact on the game (what targets a claimed cop should investigate, who should be lynched, when someone should be lynched, etc) should be decided upon as a group. You thought it was best if you did it on your own, without the group, giving the town little chance to make the decisions.

I'll reply to Bulba later tonight, but I gotta go for now.

Trying to deceive scum... it's called a reaction test...
Fake hammers do serve a purpose and are relatively common (i've done several before+seen many if you want to look at old games), one time (off site, link if wanted) a scum on l-2 didn't notice it was fake and admitted they were scum.
"I know and you know and everyone else knows that you thought it was a real hammer" Fuck you. I take extreme offense at your implication I'm a fucking moron. That is exactly what you're saying if you thing I'm too fucking stupid to not look before placing a vote when there's a vote count saying l-2 and only my vote on the last page.

Pedit: Yeah intent to hammer. There was going to be intent and wasting time wasn't necessary.

[Number_0ne]

UNVOTE:

I'm just feeling really suspicious of this lynch right now.

What exactly are you suspicious about?

Never mind. I was suspicious of Hopkirk for demanding a claim so early, as well as his accusations on so many people and focus on getting a lynch. Well, now the early claim demand ties in with him trying to get thesoctor to reveal himself through fakehammer. Still, I'm a bit more hesitant to lynch thesoctor, because it seems like he has been making a bunch of newbie mistakes rather than try and get a townie lynched.

IF YOU ARE ON L-1 YOU CLAIM.
THIS IS BASIC STUFF.

No, you claim when there is intent to hammer. Since you asked for a claim before intent was given, I got a bit confused.

@thesoctor

I don't think so, but if there doesn't seem to be a better wagon as the deadline approaches, I will lynch you.

[LessThanOriginal]

[quote="In post 217

What do you guys say to a questionnaire for everyone to respond to? If yes, I'll take question suggestions, though no fishing for PT roles is allowed, for obvious reasons :V.

Why do you need our permission to ask questions?[/quote]
Quite a lot of things are different here so I was unsure how a questionnaire would be taken. Also, if there's no interest then there's no real point in putting out the questions if they'll just be ignored. The questions people suggest themselves may be useful though. There's the obvious stuff: your opinion on the current lynch; who do you want to flip next; potential distancing/buddying, and so on. But the questions that others suggest may give stuff away as well.

[LessThanOriginal]

Messed that quote up. Will fix later.