Mini 1564 - Nyctapolis (~owari~)

[pieguyn]

votecount 2.2

Number_0ne (2) - Empking, InsidiousLemons
Faster Than Light (1) - thenewearth
undo (1) - Remilia Scarlet
iamsteve (1) - Number_0ne

Not voting (6) - notSakura, undo, Faster Than Light, Raging Bull, Tanzklaue, iamsteve

With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. Deadline is 4/19, 22:00 GMT-7 or in (expired on 2014-04-19 22:00:00).

Mod Notes: thenewearth is V/LA until 4/14.

Faster Than Light has been prodded.

[InsidiousLemons]

votecount 2.2

iamsteve (2) - Number_0ne, InsidiousLemons
Faster Than Light (1) - thenewearth
undo (1) - Remilia Scarlet
Number_0ne (1) - Empking

Not voting (6) - notSakura, undo, Faster Than Light, Raging Bull, Tanzklaue, iamsteve

With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. Deadline is 4/19, 22:00 GMT-7 or in (expired on 2014-04-19 22:00:00).

Mod Notes: thenewearth is V/LA until 4/14.

Faster Than Light has been prodded.

@Mod: This VC is incorrect in multiple places.

[pieguyn]

@Mod: This VC is incorrect in multiple places.

Fixed (I think). Let me know if you see any problems.

[Faster Than Light]

I didn't receive a prod

[Faster Than Light]

I don't want a prod either

[Faster Than Light]

This is game is supposed to be easy, why can't I find the scum??

It's like xeno saga day 6 except That this game is supposed to be easier

Gah

[Faster Than Light]

vote undo

Until I can find scum on my own, sheeping remilia

[undo]

If I were vig and thought SV was scum I'd just let him get lynched the next day since it was likely anyway. Worst thing that happens is he convinces everyone else he's town and you shoot him the next night. For the 1st night I'd just shoot a different one of my scumreads.

Wrong, it should be the other way round. If the vig knows there's a town consensus to get rid of a player (SV in this case), he will want to NK him and be done with it, so that town doesn't have to waste yet another day of discussion to lynch someone everyone already wants dead. Discussion is precious and moves the game forward, and it should be used to pursue new leads. A vig is not a loner -- he wins with the town, and should not kill someone that hasn't been under town scrutiny first, just because he thinks he's sure that person is scum.

ILemons, I must say your play is degrading. At the end of Day 1 you said no-one wanted a CD lynch when you had just unvoted him to take him out of L-1. Now you just assume scum NK'd SV, and you justify your assumption with an anti-town logic.

These slips seem to come from someone more oblivious than scummy, though, so I am giving you the benefit of the doubt. Maybe you've fallen in love or something. But I expect you to do some good scumhunting now to compensate.

Meanwhile I'd really like to hear from Number_0ne.

[Raging Bull]

Prod dodge for now.

@undo, that was in reference to post 374. I was talking about your vote on CD, but remilia talked about metal sonic.

[Empking]

Not sure I like undo chatting theory, but regardless he's right.

[InsidiousLemons]

Remilia please explain your vote on undo.,

[Faster Than Light]

I've lost a lot of steam in this game, but it's also just been a really busy last 10 or so days.
If people have questions for me, make sure to bold 'em.
-V

[pieguyn]

Remilia Scarlet and Number_0ne have been prodded.

[Remilia Scarlet]

Sorry for the delay.

Remilia please explain your vote on undo.,

Probably best illustrated via constrasting #387 with #383.

383 (from tans) displays some incredulity (which I share, cause I ardently believe scum aren't killing a claimed VT that was a counter wagon to flipped town) but is being posted with the motivation to gain information. This is good.

387 is completely different in tone. It's accusatory toward IL (if someone seriously wants to argue otherwise, I'm listening).
In this light, it's not considering:
1) generally people are going to at least reflexively react that 1 kill = scum successfully killed their target and nothing else happened, killwise. Even if this might be wrong in this particular case (in all likelihood, but I'll allow for the outside shot that scum is attempting to WIFOM this for a reason I can't discern), it's reasonable to put forth as a possibility.
2) IL coming to a conclusion that undo thinks is likely wrong should indicate that IL has as much or less, and not more, information than him.
3) scum aren't going to burst into the thread and comment on how shitty they thought their kill was.

There's no rational thought process here. and the post really does nothing but serve to paint IL in a bad light and certainly not to gain info.

Also look at the rest of undo's ISO and show me one thing that looks town. I'll wait (hint: not #407)

-b

[Remilia Scarlet]

Possibly willing to entertain a steve lynch too, depending on stuff.

-b

[notSakura]

Been gone for the last couple days, I'm currently not liking Number_0ne, and i like bork's points on undo, going to wait and synch up with ns and see where we move from there.

[undo]

387 is completely different in tone. It's accusatory toward IL (if someone seriously wants to argue otherwise, I'm listening).
In this light, it's not considering:
1) generally people are going to at least reflexively react that 1 kill = scum successfully killed their target and nothing else happened, killwise. Even if this might be wrong in this particular case (in all likelihood, but I'll allow for the outside shot that scum is attempting to WIFOM this for a reason I can't discern), it's reasonable to put forth as a possibility.
2) IL coming to a conclusion that undo thinks is likely wrong should indicate that IL has as much or less, and not more, information than him.
3) scum aren't going to burst into the thread and comment on how shitty they thought their kill was.

There's no rational thought process here. and the post really does nothing but serve to paint IL in a bad light and certainly not to gain info.

Really, just read post 407 attentively, you'll find all the answers to these points.

[Remilia Scarlet]

Yes, 407 is an excellent writeup of why he's

arguing bad theory.

Whoopdeeshit.

"You justify your assumption with anti-town logic" means fucking

nothing.

Arguing bad theory is in no way tied to alignment, but if you think he earnestly believes
what he's arguing, even if it's totally fucking wrong, then I can't possibly see how this should even remotely make you want to post anything like "Your play is degrading" or "I expect you to scumhunt better to compensate". A town player would look at that and say, "hey, IL seems legitimately oblivious to what I think actually happened - he's probably town!" Rather than this really underhanded emotional blackmail you ended the post with.

If you think he's faking not knowing how the kills went down (and you obviously don't, since you favored 'oblivious' over 'scummy') then I'd expect a scum lean on IL.

But you're not really doing either, you're trying to spin his bad theory to gain an advantage rather than read him, because your conclusions don't actually support your premises.

-b

[undo]

Why, your tone sure is accusatory, Remilia Scarlet. Should I place my vote on you?

[Remilia Scarlet]

-b

[Tanzklaue]

IL just seems to not know that vigging scumsuspects is normal courtesy in mafia.

i am disconnected to this game though, I will reread when i find my motivation again.

[iamsteve]

Number0ne: Still around?

[InsidiousLemons]

@Mod: I'll be going on a ~65 hour V/LA from the morning of the 14th to the night of the 16th.

I see what you mean with your points on undo, bork, but what's even more damning to me is undo's responses, which are making it clear to me that this guy may indeed be scum, and looking back at his other posts in conjunction with these I can't help but want to vote him. You know why my vote's on Number_0ne, but at this point it's looking like inactivity rather than question dodging. I'm gonna keep my vote on him for a short while longer and if he doesn't post/posts a good defense I'm sticking my vote squarely on undo.

[Number_0ne]

Nope, I'm not going to elaborate just yet. However, I'd like to hear what people have to say about my vote

If you haven't posted about what you think about my vote on iamsteve, then please make your opinion heard. I want to know what you think of it.

[InsidiousLemons]

In response to number one, nope. Maybe he was lurky in the first day, but since then he's been posting fairly good stuff. Now explain yourself. Don't wait for people to give you their opinions on one of your posts that's COMPLETELY unrelated to what we're asking you. Also I find it funny you'd accuse steve of lurking while you yourself have been gone from April 2-4, 5-11 and then 11-14. Nice try.