Newbie 1488: Igloo-Town Tragedy (Game Over)

[Billi bilaði]

So, DDD, your thoughts about Jake being a likely townie because he seems to be reading the game too carelessly? Of the top of my head I can cite two instances where he is not registering what has been said (I do hand my mafia-partners if I deem it good, and therefor can believe that jk would do the same), and not understanding until weeks later what is being said (that he was being isolated from the heard by a nightkill).
Am I wrong to get the feeling that I'm doing a repeat of innocent if I start to focus on Jake as a mafioso?

I don't think that's accurate at all; if he's a bad player then he's a bad player as town and scum. I have played with him before and he has plenty of site experience so I believe it's much more likely that he's affecting such behavior because he believes it'll sway you into thinking just that.

Bb: Thank you. It is good information. I haven't looked at Jakes backlog, but I will try to find time for that now.

...

Soon there will be half the day done, with nothing much to show for it, and then at the end DDD will be unhappy if I retract my vote from an L-1.
So, I believe we can easily continue this day with the

status at L-1

(and DDD won't be so unhappy should I retract):

VOTE: DDD

No, instead I'll be unhappy with you right now and would really like to call you all sort of names with a liberal sprinkling of curse words for good measures. But yeah, this is awful.

Bb: But I don't think L-1's are that awful in general, unless you know for sure there are players out there that will quickhammer by default no matter their alignment. I don't think there is such a player left; at least not that isn't currently on your wagon.

So DDD, why do you think we should give power to you. Not why do you WANT us to give power to you, why SHOULD we give it to you.

Btw, saying 'cos I'm town' isn't a viable response

I'm pretty sure my record stacks up better than anyone else's in calling town and scum correctly in this game. Billi wanted to know the difference between the PrivateI votes on day one? The difference is my vote was first, it wasn't influenced because of the popularity of the wagon, it wasn't a product of convenience it was because in a vacuum I thought PrivateI most likely to be scum.

And do you see where Jake says he'll gladly bus his scum partner well let me tell you something about me, I almost never bus my scum partner, the only times when I do that is when they are literally confirmed as scum due to power roles.

About the only mistake that I made was pushing you yesterday instead of Jake but even that is a relative town tell because it would've been super easy for me to sheep jk's random read but instead I trusted my own town read on him until he was pretty much the only option.

Bb: Thank you wery much for this red part above. I like this very much, and think it is much better than word-fencing.
At least, it looks to me that my L-1 vote on you is giving much better results than the 5 days before that.
Hence...

UNVOTE: DDD

[Billi bilaði]

Oh and to add to the last point as to why I'm town and should be listed to, today I've tried to get the confirmed town players involved and pissed them off instead of trying to hide in the background because I think it's generally better for the town though if it's drawing town votes on me maybe I was wrong.

Well, you might be depending on me being a fickle voter.

So why not jklash12 over Jake?
jklash is much better at lurking than Jake, and seems to do it every nightfall.
His reluctance to respond to questions before the No Lynch was not good in my book. (Otherwise he's played a solid game.)

[jklash12]

Do you mean twilight because no one posts at night?

I didn't respond because I was offline while you guys decided on the no lynch.

[Billi bilaði]

Do you mean twilight because no one posts at night?

I didn't respond because I was offline while you guys decided on the no lynch.

Yup. Twilight. (Are you doing something tonight, or are you doing something to-twilight? )

Post 625 Sun May 04, 2014 3:51

am

- jklash12 "At this point my vote wouldn't matter anyway. Looks like we aren't lynching anyone."
Post 633 Sun May 04, 2014 4:09

pm

- jklash12 "My thoughts didn't matter because you guys just no lynched when I was offline."
Post 634 Sun May 04, 2014 4:13 pm
- jklash12 "My thoughts were pretty obvious that I wished we lynched random."
Post 636 Sun May 04, 2014 4:44 pm
- Ser Arthur Dayne [Nightfall]

You had plenty of time to communicate about very important revelations of random and dawn. You chose to lay low.
Not responding just because it was twilight is not good enough for me.

VOTE: jklash12

[Debonair Danny DiPietro]

At least, it looks to me that my L-1 vote on you is giving much better results than the 5 days before that.

Not really, the majority of that response and the useful stuff was in response to DTD. That it was useful in persuading you was helpful but it was DTD who did the useful thing and engaged instead of your random vote throwing around.

So why not jklash12 over Jake?
jklash is much better at lurking than Jake, and seems to do it every nightfall.
His reluctance to respond to questions before the No Lynch was not good in my book. (Otherwise he's played a solid game.)

I already laid out my thoughts on both players in separate posts in regards to them. Two big conclusions, back to the Zephyr kill I'm still going back to the experienced player theory. That's just not a kill a player like jklash is going to make most of the time, maybe he saw something I didn't and we'll find out a reason in post-game but for now I think it's vastly more likely Jake made that kill than jk. And second, have you seen how oblivious jk looks today? Jake might be on this big "pretending I don't care" kick but jk literally looks like he doesn't know what's going on half the time, maybe he's faking it but I tend to believe it's sincerity over Jake's obvious fakery.

And I don't find any significance in your "doesn't talk in twilight" theory, I'm pretty sure it's something I don't generally do regardless of alignment so I have a hard time assigning any credence to it.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Vote Count 4.03

• Debonair Danny DiPietro (1) -
  Jake from State Farm
  
• jklash12 (1) -
  Billi bilaði
  
• Billi bilaði (0) -
  
  
• Jake from State Farm (0) -
  
  
• dawn_to_dusk (0) -
  
  
  
  
• Not Voting (3) – dawn_to_dusk, Debonair Danny DiPietro, jklash12

With 5 alive, it takes 3 to lynch.

Deadline is 12AM EST May 21
Countdown: (expired on 2014-05-21 00:00:00)

[/i][/area]

[Billi bilaði]

...I already laid out my thoughts on both players in separate posts in regards to them. Two big conclusions, back to the Zephyr kill I'm still going back to the experienced player theory. That's just not a kill a player like jklash is going to make most of the time, maybe he saw something I didn't and we'll find out a reason in post-game but for now I think it's vastly more likely Jake made that kill than jk. And second, have you seen how oblivious jk looks today? Jake might be on this big "pretending I don't care" kick

but jk literally looks like he doesn't know what's going on half the time

, maybe he's faking it but I tend to believe it's sincerity over Jake's obvious fakery.

And I don't find any significance in your "doesn't talk in twilight" theory, I'm pretty sure it's something I don't generally do regardless of alignment so I have a hard time assigning any credence to it.

But the other half of the time suggests to me he knows it pretty well.
And when you don't talk in twilight repeatedly in the same game, even when you have questions on you about things that overthrow your statements, I think that is worth looking into.

My experince shows me pros and cons to all of you three guys, but you have the luxury of having played with Jake before.
If you are this certain about your hunch, is there anything to wait for in voting him?

But, I'll follow you based on the evidence you provided about not going after your partners. So, if you vote for Jake, I will too.

[Debonair Danny DiPietro]

But the other half of the time suggests to me he knows it pretty well.

Eh, I've played with him before as well, I was night killed early in the game but somehow jk managed to get himself lynched when there was a PR claim and a counter claim on the board which to my mind shouldn't even be a possibility so I'd be surprised if there was some sort of high level guile from him.

My experince shows me pros and cons to all of you three guys, but you have the luxury of having played with Jake before.
If you are this certain about your hunch, is there anything to wait for in voting him?

I'm not claiming to have a fabulous meta read on him so don't take it that aggressively and I haven't voted because I just don't see the need to rush things for once. Maybe one of them does something that screams town or scum to me instead of Jake's "you know where I stand and I'll do nothing to attempt to persuade you" or jklash's... has he even said anything today that wasn't just repeating what someone else said?

[Billi bilaði]

OK. Good that you've played with jklash12 before also. I'll look at his backlog when I get time. (I looked at Jake's and saw that he, in a couple of years, had overtaken you by quite a margin, so, I back off from reading him for the time being.)

Yeah, I'm probably way too impatient to wait for things to speed up. But I still believe that votes give more action than passive waiting.
I'll try to chill.

[jklash12]

3:51 am was my last post before I went to bed then I have no time in the morning usually. I then am stuck at school all day and get home around 3:30-4:00 pm. I am usually on for most of the night then.

[jklash12]

I think Jake is more likely scum than DDD. So my vote will go there for now.

VOTE: Jake

[Jake from State Farm]

For the record DDDs only game with me was a game where I had correctly identified that 1 was scum and 1 was the SK and instead them both going for the win, they lynched me and the SK won cause he was nk immune.

I can point you to tons of lylo/mylo where I did work and I get ignored or I choose wrong or whatever. I can probably find scum games too.

My laziness today is really the first time that I can recall being lazy and refuse to do anything. So even if you read all my games I don't think you could ever find meta that supports my play this game. Also if you read any game from 2013 and prior you will see a different player than you would if you read my 2014 games.

I'm find with using meta to lynch someone or clear someone but ddd doesn't have the meta knowledge he thinks he has. In fact if you relied solely on meta I'd say the evidence would prove I'm not scum. But don't take my word for it. Read my 2014 games for yourself.

P.edit - at least you have decided to act. You are wrong but I appreciate you finally moving the game along.

[jklash12]

I would be fine lynching you or DDD because one of you is scum. Its not that I think you are more scummy. I just think DDD is more towny than you but I could be wrong.

[Billi bilaði]

...My experince shows me pros and cons to all of you three guys, but you have the luxury of having played with Jake before...

As I said above, Jake, I see pros and cons with all of you. So for me, today is a coin toss.

VOTE: Jake from State Farm

[Jake from State Farm]

well ddd is most likely going to hammer me so good luck.

I still think scum is most likely DDD over jk but it's mostly gut. If jk is scum he did an excellent job

[dawn_to_dusk]

I'm thinking DDD is pretty townie. Which is good as, if we mislynch today, we have a much better chance at winning the next day. The main question here is: who do I think is scum right now?

And the answer is jake. I haven't really been interacting with him much but between him and jk, jk is seeming more town. Still, if jake flips town, we can lynch jk tomorrow which puts a lot of pressure on him to pin DDD. Which at this point, is incredibly hard to do.

I won't vote yet, but the point is made.

[dawn_to_dusk]

Glad I didn't vote, just realised jake is L-1

[Jake from State Farm]

Yep, but at least we aren't at mylo yet. Obviously my new playstyle needs some work. This will be the first time I've been mislynched that I can recall.

[Jake from State Farm]

can either of you guys give me a reasoning why you are voting me at least? I honestly don't know why people suspect me cause I have literally done nothing scummy all game

[Billi bilaði]

can either of you guys give me a reasoning why you are voting me at least? I honestly don't know why people suspect me cause

I have literally done nothing scummy all game

As I have stated a number of times, I don't fully agree with the red part. But I see your point.

My reasoning is the following:
DDD's statement (backed with a quote that can be researched) that he doesn't bus his mafia-partners, currently puts him in the chokolate-corner (icelandic children game reference).
That means the toss is between you and jklash12, and, as has been stated, he has been a bit more townie than you, Jake.

I can still see reasons to vote for jklash12, but I stand by my convictions that L-1's are more good than not, and currently with little risk to the igloos.

[Jake from State Farm]

I used to never bus my partners and even said something to the effect on a thread in mafia discussion, and than 1 day I did.

Also according to DDD's wiki he has bussed his partner before so him saying he doesn't bus is a lie

[Jake from State Farm]

oh nvm he didn't say that he never busses, he said he almost never busses...

[Billi bilaði]

I noticed this, and took it into consideration.

[Debonair Danny DiPietro]

My laziness today is really the first time that I can recall being lazy and refuse to do anything. So even if you read all my games I don't think you could ever find meta that supports my play this game. Also if you read any game from 2013 and prior you will see a different player than you would if you read my 2014 games.

I'm find with using meta to lynch someone or clear someone but ddd doesn't have the meta knowledge he thinks he has. In fact if you relied solely on meta I'd say the evidence would prove I'm not scum. But don't take my word for it. Read my 2014 games for yourself.

I've already said many times that mine is not a specific meta but more a meta that you're not an idiot but given that you're intentionally playing like an idiot here and scum reasons are much more compelling than lazy reasons. I see no reason to ever excuse lazy reasons as just that, it just enables scum.

[Jake from State Farm]

Many people would disagree with you about me not being an idiot..

But seriously I'm not playing like an idiot and I don't appreciate you saying I am.