Why do people play open setups?

[Jake from State Farm]

I personally think the fun is not knowing the setups so I don't play but curious why people do like playing them?

[Majiffy]

A lot of it is working it out like a logic puzzle. You can see all the pieces, so you don't get tainted by fakeclaims or uncertainties. A claim is a claim, a counterclaim is a counterclaim, etc. Everything is available to be worked out publicly.

[Jake from State Farm]

But doesn't that hinder scum cause they know they are going to get cc'd?

[quadz08]

Generally speaking, yes. Which is why balance is different in opens than in closed games.

[Jake from State Farm]

The only open I like doesn't seem to run often. It's the one were you turn vengeful if lynched. Though I'm never lynched lol

I like killing people

[Jake from State Farm]

Thanks btw. Kinda felt weird making a thread but didn't really know how to get my answer lol

[Antihero]

sometimes, not having to think about setup spec is nice

[PeregrineV]

Not a big fan of open setups. They are especially unfun when you draw scum.

[BROseidon]

It's also fun to speculate on how to break open setups.

[Jake from State Farm]

It's also fun to speculate on how to break open setups.

That doesn't sound fun

[RedCoyote]

Years ago, EM was all open setups all the time. It brings a different dynamic to the game. The scum and the town know what can/cannot be claimed. In a way, open setups were more "pure". The scum and the town did a dance at times over "who should claim first?" When you had two people counter claiming, they would reach back into the previous days and point to evidence as to why

they

were actually the PR. It was quite fun, and it's a different type of game compared to when everything is hidden.

I miss it, if you want me to be honest. I miss it dearly.

[Oversoul]

I feel like it's harder to win open games as scum. The trouble is most open games are fairly scum sided.

[LlamaFluff]

Open games are fun because you can avoid or find certain things.

Don't like Role X? We have a setup for that.
Want to play a multi-scum setup? We have a setup for that.
Interested in a setup that can be puzzled? We have a setup for that.
Want something guarantee to be simple? We have a setup for that.

That is why these types of setups are fun to people. You can find a game that you like and don't have to worry about playing a game that you think was unfair, bastard, had a role you hate, was multi-scum, etc.

[Jake from State Farm]

^ That's a good explanation thanks llama

[Antihero]

Open games are fun because you can avoid or find certain things.

Don't like Role X? We have a setup for that.
Want to play a multi-scum setup? We have a setup for that.
Interested in a setup that can be puzzled? We have a setup for that.
Want something guarantee to be simple? We have a setup for that.

That is why these types of setups are fun to people. You can find a game that you like and don't have to worry about playing a game that you think was unfair, bastard, had a role you hate, was multi-scum, etc.

as an aside, i think it's good modding policy to label multi-scum games in the sign-up thread / game advertisement even for closed setups.

[Majiffy]

Sometimes the lack of knowledge of multi-scum is a primary balancing or intended mechanic, however.

[reinoe]

I can't stand the idea of scum being given a list of fake claims. It's hard enough trying to corner scum at L-1 only for them to claim a role handed to them on a silver platter in order to fake claim. And to fake claim a PR at that. If scum get to cornered they should be forced to think about the theme, conjour up something obscure enough to be in the game but not so likely as to be counter-claimed, and hope for the best.

Meanwhile a vanilla townie (or the theme equivalent) gets run up to L-1, claims vanilla townie and gets lynched anyway, because nobody cares about the life of vanilla townie (or the theme equivalent). That's b.s.

[Majiffy]

That's why an artful scum claims VT and sells that shit well.

[Jake from State Farm]

I don't think I have ever fake claimed a role that I didn't actually have. If you get run up to L-1 claim VT and get lynched anyway, you aren't doing something right.

[Antihero]

That's why an artful scum claims VT and sells that shit well.

shouldn't work with an at least semi-competent town.

I can't stand the idea of scum being given a list of fake claims. It's hard enough trying to corner scum at L-1 only for them to claim a role handed to them on a silver platter in order to fake claim. And to fake claim a PR at that. If scum get to cornered they should be forced to think about the theme, conjour up something obscure enough to be in the game but not so likely as to be counter-claimed, and hope for the best.
's hard enough trying to corner scum at L-1 only for them to claim a role handed to them on a silver platter in order to fake claim. And to fake claim a PR at that. If scum get to cornered they should be forced to think about the theme, conjour up something obscure enough to be in the game but not so likely as to be counter-claimed, and hope for the best.

i disagree. players shouldn't have to factor flavor meta into their lynch decision. theme mods absolutely should give scum safe flavor claims.

[reinoe]

That's why an artful scum claims VT and sells that shit well.

shouldn't work with an at least semi-competent town.

I can't stand the idea of scum being given a list of fake claims. It's hard enough trying to corner scum at L-1 only for them to claim a role handed to them on a silver platter in order to fake claim. And to fake claim a PR at that. If scum get to cornered they should be forced to think about the theme, conjour up something obscure enough to be in the game but not so likely as to be counter-claimed, and hope for the best.
's hard enough trying to corner scum at L-1 only for them to claim a role handed to them on a silver platter in order to fake claim. And to fake claim a PR at that. If scum get to cornered they should be forced to think about the theme, conjour up something obscure enough to be in the game but not so likely as to be counter-claimed, and hope for the best.

i disagree. players shouldn't have to factor flavor meta into their lynch decision. theme mods absolutely should give scum safe flavor claims.

But scum, when cornered, should be forced to think about the game they're playing when they're caught. Fake claims should take effort.

Let's say someone is playing a fictional "super mario RPG mafia". Scum is pretty much caught and at L-1. Scum is assigned smithy, but can't claim Smithy from 'cuz that would be autolynch. Smithy is obviously one of the villains. But scum could claim Jinx or croco, because they're not quite a bad guys, may be in said hypothetical game, are not so obscure as to question "who is that", but are not so popular that they would have been given to actual town players. Scum couldn't claim Princess Toadstool because that role is obviously going to be assigned to a town player and will be counter-claimed in this hypothetical theme. Knowing the meta of super mario Rpg in this hypothetical theme game should be a benefit to town and scum alike.

I know I'm in the minority on this but since the topic came up I figured I'd share my thoughts on theme games and scum being handed safe fake claims.

[Shadoweh]

If you're talking about being handed a Power Role to claim, I believe general consensus is not to do that.
If you're talking about flavor claims, scum should absolutely have a safe character to claim. It's not the meta of Super Mario RPG you would have to guess against in that instance, it's the meta of the moderator of the mafia game you're playing. No scum wants to lose because they claimed Croco, VT, and got counterclaimed for it.
Also the time that that's most important isn't when scum 'get caught', it's on Day 1 when someone proposes a massclaim. If the meta of a certain mod's theme games involved never giving flavor claims to scum, I personally would force everyone to flavor claim that day.

[Kagami]

This is another reason why some people might enjoy open games more.

In a closed game, regardless of your alignment, you're often playing against the mod as much as the opposing faction.

[Antihero]

But scum, when cornered, should be forced to think about the game they're playing when they're caught. Fake claims should take effort.

Let's say someone is playing a fictional "super mario RPG mafia". Scum is pretty much caught and at L-1. Scum is assigned smithy, but can't claim Smithy from 'cuz that would be autolynch. Smithy is obviously one of the villains. But scum could claim Jinx or croco, because they're not quite a bad guys, may be in said hypothetical game, are not so obscure as to question "who is that", but are not so popular that they would have been given to actual town players. Scum couldn't claim Princess Toadstool because that role is obviously going to be assigned to a town player and will be counter-claimed in this hypothetical theme. Knowing the meta of super mario Rpg in this hypothetical theme game should be a benefit to town and scum alike.

I know I'm in the minority on this but since the topic came up I figured I'd share my thoughts on theme games and scum being handed safe fake claims.

a theme game without scum safe flavor claims would be easily broken by Day 1 flavor massclaim.

[reinoe]

But scum, when cornered, should be forced to think about the game they're playing when they're caught. Fake claims should take effort.

Let's say someone is playing a fictional "super mario RPG mafia". Scum is pretty much caught and at L-1. Scum is assigned smithy, but can't claim Smithy from 'cuz that would be autolynch. Smithy is obviously one of the villains. But scum could claim Jinx or croco, because they're not quite a bad guys, may be in said hypothetical game, are not so obscure as to question "who is that", but are not so popular that they would have been given to actual town players. Scum couldn't claim Princess Toadstool because that role is obviously going to be assigned to a town player and will be counter-claimed in this hypothetical theme. Knowing the meta of super mario Rpg in this hypothetical theme game should be a benefit to town and scum alike.

I know I'm in the minority on this but since the topic came up I figured I'd share my thoughts on theme games and scum being handed safe fake claims.

a theme game without scum safe flavor claims would be easily broken by Day 1 flavor massclaim.

I disagree.