Mini 1581--The Final Radiant Tales...(Fin)

[Bert]

What exactly is there to talk about?

I have alts. End of story. However, I think you are just insulted that I called you lynch bait, which actually makes me feel better about you. I think scum would be more likely to take the lynch bait title and roll with it, than to fight it.

This doesn't make me feel better about you making stuff up considering no one has pushed or even mentioned me at all so far.


Again, I have not made anything up. You need to stop saying that like it's a fact. You think it sounds fake, ok, then that's what you think. That doesn't mean it actually is. And I don't think you get what I meant at all.

If I think X is an easy mark, I'm going to be looking for the people who are opportunistically going for an easy lynch. It helps me sort other people, and sharing my insight might help others sort other people as well.

Does that mean that X is already being pushed? No.... I never said it did and the statement isn't dependent on that in any way.

ETL

It seems to me like you are really trying to poke holes in my reads only because I'm not sure about you yet. The defensiveness at this point, especially with a null read, is a little overblown if you ask me.

You didn't even bother to ask me for any additional details, or press me for more reasoning. If you thought it was fake, this would seem the logical action to follow, but instead you just tried to discredit the entire thing. Why?

And then.. weird appeal to Mirhawk.. that is really.. very strange

Address these please, Rubicon. And yes, that includes both your jester comment and now your assertion that I'm an SK (lol).

[Bert]

You mean Oversoul right? because that's who you voted.

There is no super scent of you reading into things 'not' literally, as evidenced by this question. My vote on Oversoul was a snarky response to his plead for a bandwagon.

I place my votes for my own reasons, and right now it goes to Rubicon for his scummy half-catch-up posts and how little connection his reads seem to have with the gamestate. His phrasing against ETL was strange, and he's glossing over our points addressed to him.

[Bert]

VOTE: Rubicon

[Rubicon]

ETL's response that some of her comments were pre-ISO read clears up most/all of the issues I had with her at that point. (I'll have to go through the games where I could plausibly have been called lynch-bait to find her alt, sometime.)

I said I was

definitely not the jester

for fun and because I like making odd comments in RVS that can be used to move the game out of RVS.

I'll explain why I see you as an SK later and after I finish reading, but for now, your counter-vote on me makes me feel damn good about the world.

[Rubicon]

His phrasing against ETL was strange, and he's glossing over our points addressed to him.

What phrasing did you not like?

[Bert]

I'll explain why I see you as an SK later and after I finish reading, but for now, your counter-vote on me makes me feel damn good about the world.

Oh, lol, now you bail when asked to actually say plainly why you think I'm an SK. *shakes head*

The only reasons I can think of as to why you if town might think I'm an SK are:

(1) Eagerness to claim suggests not being scared of a NK. I'm actually not scared to claim since I'm not a super special special. Weaker roles = me not afraid to dare scum to NK me. If I were something really powerful, like a cop or something, I wouldn't claim like this, no.

Why does my counter-vote on you make you feel so good? If you're thinking I'm an SK, that means you think I'm scumhunting, so what's bad about my vote on you?

(2) something about my flavor?

Which is it.

[Bert]

Even in the case of (1), why SK over mafia?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Even in the case of (1), why SK over mafia?

This is exactly what I was thinking and I'm very interested in the word choice there.

will quote later when I'm not busy.

[Interdimensional Arsehole]

so I was starting to read and then on page 8 I saw the enormous walls and stopped


why haven't everyone flavorclaimed yet? DO THAT

[Interdimensional Arsehole]

(1) Eagerness to claim suggests not being scared of a NK. I'm actually not scared to claim since I'm not a super special special. Weaker roles = me not afraid to dare scum to NK me. If I were something really powerful, like a cop or something, I wouldn't claim like this, no.

also, that is a good analysis and I'm totally going to use that as scum somewhen. Bert is def. town; and I didn't even take into account the DV, which is EXTREMELY overpowered in scum hands imo

[KingdomAces]

SHUT UP ABOUT FLAVOR CLAIMS ALREADY!

Scum do have believable fakeclaims, or else the game wouldn't have gotten past the review phase, and scum should have no problems locking into something. Heck, in Dark Age of the Law, the scum fakeclaims were the exact same flavor that their actual role was in the first place. At the very least, flavor claims WILL cause scum to start narrowing down PRs, and will do absolutely nothing for town.

Anyway, compiling a post now, but I need to say this as soon as possible.

[Rubicon]

The only reasons I can think of as to why you if town might think I'm an SK are:

(1) Eagerness to claim suggests not being scared of a NK. I'm actually not scared to claim since I'm not a super special special. Weaker roles = me not afraid to dare scum to NK me. If I were something really powerful, like a cop or something, I wouldn't claim like this, no.

Why does my counter-vote on you make you feel so good? If you're thinking I'm an SK, that means you think I'm scumhunting, so what's bad about my vote on you?

(2) something about my flavor?

Which is it.

If you wanted to know my reasoning, giving me reasoning to choose from and preemptively defending yourself against it is a weird way to go about it.

I'm considering you a possible SK because I played a Natirasha-reviewed game on another site a few months ago where the SK had a double-voter power. This being a pure Natirasha setup, I'm not going to try to outguess him about whether the power is SK here, but I do know that he considers it a reasonable SK power, and your reaction here is weird.

[KingdomAces]

Okay nevermind, too busy fuming to actually say anything reasonable right now.

I am definitely thinking that Bert is doing too much joking around right now, and I'm going to have to go through the games I've played with him before on this, but I think that's something he does more as scum than as town.

Rubicon seems town.

I think there's enough information for me to have a read on Mirhawk, and possibly Gameplay, but I'm going to need to do some ISO's for that and that's not happening until next time I feel like doing work.

[KingdomAces]

Wait, Guyett was on the scumteam for Dark Age of the Law. He REALLY should know better than this.
VOTE: Interdimensional Arsehole

[Interdimensional Arsehole]

SHUT UP ABOUT FLAVOR CLAIMS ALREADY!

Scum do have believable fakeclaims, or else the game wouldn't have gotten past the review phase, and scum should have no problems locking into something. Heck, in Dark Age of the Law, the scum fakeclaims were the exact same flavor that their actual role was in the first place. At the very least, flavor claims WILL cause scum to start narrowing down PRs, and will do absolutely nothing for town.

This insistance that scum can narrow PRs by the flavor is foolish and I wonder why you keep at it. If it wasn't clear for you, I'll make it so:

It seems I'm on deck! Here's my little blurb.

THE FINAL RADIANT TALES OF THE GOLDEN DRAGON TRIGGER

-Thirteen player mini featuring various characters from JRPGs of all ages!
-Reviewed by Majiffy, Fakegod and Serrapaladin! Back up modded by the illustrious Shadow Dancer!
-Incredibly bastard!

Power madness!

-No specific mutations! Just 'classic' mafia...except note the above!

I wanna stress that this game is BASTARD and you should check your expectations at the door.

So there ya go. don't bullshit a bullshitter.

Wait, Guyett was on the scumteam for Dark Age of the Law. He REALLY should know better than this.
VOTE: Interdimensional Arsehole

This is Shos posting, not Guyett. You can generally tell because I am the logic one and he is the insane

[KingdomAces]

I'm not saying that they can narrow down who is a PR, I'm saying that they can narrow down what PR's are what, so they can pick off the best ones. Just because it's power madness, it doesn't mean that everyone is equal.

[Bert]

I'm considering you a possible SK because I played a Natirasha-reviewed game on another site a few months ago where the SK had a double-voter power. This being a pure Natirasha setup, I'm not going to try to outguess him about whether the power is SK here, but I do know that he considers it a reasonable SK power, and your reaction here is weird.

My double vote doesn't work today. You *are* trying to outguess him, and I can do more than "double vote." I can also talk to the dead every night - can pick a different one each night. Bulba was right about the"guardian spirit" ability - which is what the double vote is. Like I said, unless I have some sort of investigative/protective power in such a bastard/themed game, then I always dare scum to NK me. I have absolutely nothing to hide.

Okay nevermind, too busy fuming to actually say anything reasonable right now.

I am definitely thinking that Bert is doing too much joking around right now, and I'm going to have to go through the games I've played with him before on this, but I think that's something he does more as scum than as town.

I hope fuming isn't related to this game.

While it's no longer relevant, my only scum games with you are Dark Age of the Law and serrapaladin's Mini 1462 where I provided next-to-zero meaningful discussion/content. Dark Age, I was in a hydra where Nacho could carry, and 1462 was a year ago. Where have I been joking a lot in this game? I keep it light in parts, and in some parts serious. This is not a self-meta defense, this is saying that you are way off-base and are adding onto my suspicion that you're scum. I can't see how you as town would draw such conclusions.

Also, is your vote on ETL because she was town in Serra's game when I was scum, and thus in your opinion should be scumreading me?

VOTE: KingdomAces

This vote is not moving again.

[Bert]

ETA: tl;dr the way you came about to a semi-read on me - I can't see any town motivation - "joking more than I vaguely remember (when I've been mostly serious)" instead of commenting on my actual play.

Wait, Guyett was on the scumteam for Dark Age of the Law. He REALLY should know better than this.
VOTE: Interdimensional Arsehole

Know better about me as scum?

I am definitely thinking that Bert is doing too much joking around right now, and I'm going to have to go through the games I've played with him before on this, but I think that's something he does more as scum than as town.

Wait, Guyett was on the scumteam for Dark Age of the Law. He REALLY should know better than this.
VOTE: Interdimensional Arsehole

Wait a minute! Look at the time stamps. In SIX minutes, you went from "I need to double check, but Bert might be scum" to "woah Guyett was in Dark Age and knows better about Bert than this." How do you arrive at such a swift conclusion without some type of confirmation bias?

[Bert]

Also, you understand that Ffery was also in Dark Age, too, right? Cabd was also a backup mod, oh and ETL was in that game too as Drunken Lies. This reeks of you naming *just* Guyett to fit your agenda.

[Bert]

SHUT UP ABOUT FLAVOR CLAIMS ALREADY!

Scum do have believable fakeclaims, or else the game wouldn't have gotten past the review phase, and scum should have no problems locking into something. Heck, in Dark Age of the Law, the scum fakeclaims were the exact same flavor that their actual role was in the first place. At the very least, flavor claims WILL cause scum to start narrowing down PRs, and will do absolutely nothing for town.

OK, I just checked AA and I incorrectly recalled that you started breaking the game with the flavor/role full claims. However,

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 3#p5503553

I notice how much more tactfully you disagreed with those that wanted to massclaim, e.g.,

"And no to the flavor claim. Something tells me that all it will end up doing is outing the PR's. Just look at the flips so far: PhoenixPR and Lotta/Oldbag VT's. If we are doing a flavor claim, then we might as well fullclaim, since we might as well be giving the same information to the scum. Now is also way too early for a fullclaim."

" whereas here you seem *extremely* jumpy/paranoid whenever we suggest flavor claims. Notice post #1148 in that game as well, where it's

"I don't understand Edgeworth being a hider flavorwise. Also mod WIFOM, but I don't think that both Marquis and Kalimar would be town, because that would mean that all of the non-Manfred prosecutors would be in the game and town, which doesn't seem right to me. There seems to be far too many PR's at present, and a large portion of them are confirmable in one way or another. Because of that, I think we should be focusing on the non-Mac VTs for today. That leaves just geists/Kalimar/Slimer, though myself should probably also be included in that list for everyone else also."

[KingdomAces]

The thing about Guyett was talking about knowing how idiotic flavor claims are right now, not about you. And I have absolutely no tact right now because the arseholes are trying to force this flavor claim through despite pretty much everyone else in the game telling them how stupid of an idea it is. If you look back, I had already tried the tact strategy, and it was subsequently ignored. So yes, I was fuming at this game.

Next point, I haven't actually done any of the rereading yet because I was too busy being pissed at the arseholes and not feeling like doing any actual work. I still am going to have to go through them before I say anything for certain.

Also, ETL is lying scum who I've been calling town constantly, so I don't know why you think my vote is on her.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

This head of Lying Scum hydra has a very unexpected V/LA of indeterminate length. Should still have mobile for a bit.

[MafiaSSK]

Wait, Guyett was on the scumteam for Dark Age of the Law. He REALLY should know better than this.
VOTE: Interdimensional Arsehole

QFT

VOTE: IA

[Mirhawk]

@IA
Why are you still pushing for the flavorclaim? What possible advantage is there for town to claim?

@Bert
Are you seriously accusing KA of conformation bias while you push a case on him having different tone on the

same position

in two different games?

[Varsoon]

Apologies for disappearing like that. I got kidnapped.
Will read through soon. Anything I should keep in mind while reading?

Irl or in game?

IRL.
Did a good skim of the game, don't know what to think.
Bastard game, so I also don't know what to expect.