Mini 1604 -- Zodiac Mafia (Game Over)

[Nachomamma8]

psst let's kill salamence together xay

[Nachomamma8]

i know people will complain and shit when you sheep me for the second time today but I'll yell them off, I'll get this lynch, and he will flip scum
believe in me who believes in myself thanks to my horoscope which legitimately says "you can do anything"

[Xayzeck]

VOTE: Salamence

I'm not really a fan of becoming "Nacho's Second Vote" but okay I guess, not that I really have a problem with the sala wagon

[PeregrineV]

OK, Nacho, you can might be town. For now.

[Nachomamma8]

unless there are cults, my towniness is here to stay
additionally, you aren't voting salamence with us

[Juls]

I would like to challenge her on her "feels townie but isn't townie" comment because I'm with her on StrangerCoug feeling townie but don't understand how that suddenly translates to him not being townie.

When I initially read it, I felt like it wasn't sincere feeling. Like it was more of a "meh, this is what I would say if I were town". But when burn piggybacked it that seemed far more scummy. As in "this townie is making the argument I want so I will just agree with him and he will get blamed if it blows up". So I feel pretty good that they aren't scumbuddies together and burn is the more likely of the two to be scum in my opinion. These aren't solid reads, they are page 5 reads. They have every opportunity to change them but so far burn hasn't done anything to make me feel different and I don't think SC has posted since (?). So I'm good.

As for Salamence, he is firmly planted in neutral land for me at the moment. Probably not opposed to lynching him if need be.

[Nachomamma8]

But when burn piggybacked it that seemed far more scummy.

What was scummy about what burn said other than it having gaps in logic?

[PeregrineV]

unless there are cults, my towniness is here to stay
additionally, you aren't voting salamence with us

Meh. Just for you. For now.

Vote: Salamaence20

[Gemini Blind]

I'm concerned Dry-Fit is taking a more rhetoric approach rather than looking at the situation objectively when he discusses the scumtell of "strategizing."

Talking about the dayvig can't lead to someone's role, at most we can garner some clue of alignment when it's used, so this talk about setup/role stuff doesn't really apply. The idea that scum would appear to be talking as opposed to lurking certainly makes sense but I hardly think attacking people for trying to discuss something on its own is a scumtell, since there wasn't a whole lot to discuss.

VOTE: Dry-Fit

WP has only posted once, it would be nice to see his face again.

Personally I'd rather wait for Salamence to get his bearings before I consider doing anything with him since we're not in a rush.

~STD

[Elyse]

To be quite honest, I'm kinda at a loss for words right now. I don't know what to say :/ I think Nacho and Juls are town but I'm not really scumreading anyone at the moment.

[RedCoyote]

Prodding Witness Protection

Deeply intuitive and sentimental, Cancer can be one of the most challenging Zodiac signs to get to know. Emotion runs strong for this sign, and when it comes to family and home, nothing is more important. Sympathetic and empathetic, Cancerians are greatly attuned to those around them. Devotion is the keyword for this sign, making them wonderfully sensitive people to be around.

Cancer's lucky numbers today: 14, 29, 17, 12, 24, 46

"The price of anything is the amount of life you exchange for it. " - Henry David Thoreau

---

Vote Count 1 - 4

• Salamence20 (5) ( StrangerCoug - Dry-fit - Nachomamma8 - Xayzeck - PeregrineV)
  
  burn_209 (2) ( Salamence20 - Juls -
  Gemini Blind
  )
  Xayzeck (2) ( Witness Protection - Elyse)
  Witness Protection (1) (
  PeregrineV
  - Iecerint -
  Nachomamma8
  -
  Xayzeck
  )
  Juls (1) ( burn_209)
  Dry-fit (1) ( Gemini Blind)
  
  Not Voting (0) ()

With twelve alive, it takes seven to lynch.
Current Deadline:

(expired on 2014-09-08 15:35:00)

[Juls]

Deeply intuitive and sentimental, Cancer can be one of the most challenging Zodiac signs to get to know. Emotion runs strong for this sign, and when it comes to family and home, nothing is more important. Sympathetic and empathetic, Cancerians are greatly attuned to those around them. Devotion is the keyword for this sign, making them wonderfully sensitive people to be around.

Cancer's lucky numbers today: 14, 29, 17, 12, 24, 46

That's me! And 12 is a very special number for me. Neat.

[StrangerCoug]

My point would be just as valid even if this was an open game. I'm not just talking about speculation but strategizing instead of scumhunting as well.

Why would it be a scumtell to strategize? You expect the town to screw itself over? Is that what I'm supposed to be getting?

It's a scumtell because in my experience scum is more likely to talk exclusively about strategy in the early game. Why that is I'm not sure. It may be rolefising. It may be trying to look protown without taking any actual stances. In any case it's not strategizing in itself that's scummy. It's making strategizing te entirety or almost the entirety of your play.

I really do not buy this crap. Nobody's been talking exclusively about strategy, I don't smell anybody trying to rolefish, and while you admit that strategizing is not a scumtell, when we have some idea of who could have what, strategizing is quite protown. It's not unknown to break setups that way (though it's far too early for there to be evidence either way of a broken setup).

UNVOTE: Salamence20 (though I still wouldn't mind that person lynched)
VOTE: Dry-fit

[PeregrineV]

Deeply intuitive and sentimental, Cancer can be one of the most challenging Zodiac signs to get to know. Emotion runs strong for this sign, and when it comes to family and home, nothing is more important. Sympathetic and empathetic, Cancerians are greatly attuned to those around them. Devotion is the keyword for this sign, making them wonderfully sensitive people to be around.

Cancer's lucky numbers today: 14, 29, 17, 12, 24, 46

That's me! And 12 is a very special number for me. Neat.

My brother is a Cancer, and while I could see about half of this, the other half must be buried DEEP DEEP DEEP.

[Juls]

But when burn piggybacked it that seemed far more scummy.

What was scummy about what burn said other than it having gaps in logic?

Agreeing with people absent of anything else always rubs me wrong. It's basically latching on to a townie (and yes, if burn is scum then SC is a townie) thought process without having to provide your own analysis. This early, that's enough for me.

[Salamence20]

I'll be on tonight, with a bunch of stuff.

As a fan of the quickhammer. I'd still prefer I not get lollynched beforehand.

[Juls]

Anybody who has ever played with me ever know that "emotions run high with me" and that I am "sensitive". The rest though is pretty spot on. I would say the "deeply intuitive" is the biggest stretch.

[Gemini Blind]

Oooh Salamence wagon huh? Not jumping on that one quite yet. I'd like to see more from him though. His posts so far seem to be lacking in substance. Which is understandable on p 5 or so, but he's in the spot light now so I want to see what he does.

Nacho seems town to me, although it wouldn't mind if he explained some more of the later reads he gives, (Elyse, Burn and Ice).

Obviously if WP wants to show up again that would be awesome.

I'm not sure how I feel about the rest of you all. I'm not really scum reading anyone at the moment, so I'm happy rolling with my bro's vote for now.
-Rolls

-PEDIT Can't wait for your "bunch of stuff" Salamance.

[Dry-fit]

I really do not buy this crap. Nobody's been talking exclusively about strategy

Then how would you characterize Salamence's play in this game?

I don't smell anybody trying to rolefish, and while you admit that strategizing is not a scumtell, when we have some idea of who could have what, strategizing is quite protown. It's not unknown to break setups that way (though it's far too early for there to be evidence either way of a broken setup).

As I said it's not talking about strategy. It's only or almost only talking about strategy.

Talking about the dayvig can't lead to someone's role, at most we can garner some clue of alignment when it's used, so this talk about setup/role stuff doesn't really apply

Sure it can. For instance if you goad player X into saying that he believes the dayvig should shoot before page five, and no one is shot before page five, player X is probably not the dayvig.

Nacho I think you're wrong about Elyse. Coming right out and saying you have no scumreads is most likely town

[StrangerCoug]

I really do not buy this crap. Nobody's been talking exclusively about strategy

Then how would you characterize Salamence's play in this game?

Part the strategizing you talk about, part fluff, and no scumhunting whatsoever.

I don't smell anybody trying to rolefish, and while you admit that strategizing is not a scumtell, when we have some idea of who could have what, strategizing is quite protown. It's not unknown to break setups that way (though it's far too early for there to be evidence either way of a broken setup).

As I said it's not talking about strategy. It's only or almost only talking about strategy.

And I acknowledged that. Read my post again.

[Dry-fit]

Ah so it's his fluff posting that's saved him.

[Gemini Blind]

*blink blink*

Dry-fit you are aware the dayvig is extraneous to the roles handed out, yes?

~STD

[Dry-fit]

Yes I know dayvig is not their role pm but a horoscope. What does that have to do with my example?

[Gemini Blind]

I should just be as blunt as possible.

From my point of view, you're talking about strategizing in terms of talking about the setup/roles as a scumtell.

The dayvig is a random kill that's out there that is irrelevant to anyone's role.

Discussing the dayvig kill and even outting the dayvig doesn't lead to anyone's role information, but it could lead to alignment information.

This early? Role info is bad. Alignment info is tasty.

Since the dayvig is dangling out there, of course many people would probably jump on that.

As far as "strategy" goes, you mention things like role fishing, role/setup information, etc. All we know get to know is potentially who has the dayvig, and potentially what alignment they are. I'm concerned both with how early you brought up this tactic of looking towards people who strategize and speculate in order to post fluff as well as your definition of strategery since I question whether it applies in this particular situation.

~STD

[Dry-fit]

Honestly I still don't really get what you're saying and don't think we're going to make any progress continuing along these lines.