Mini 1604 -- Zodiac Mafia (Game Over)

[Salamence20]

@Rolls: Like I said, it's possible Elyse is just sitting around waiting for something to happen, but then why isn't she voting me. She has stated she would be fine with my lynch, but why hasn't she voted me. It could be a reach for townie points.

[StrangerCoug]

This would be where I have to disagree with you a little, because I feel meta is a great tool for scumhunting, but only if you've played with the person. I don't think you can meta someone you have never played with, whereas if you play with the person a lot, meta reads make more sense.

What Elsye did is she started out with a (i think sort of)scumread on me, which was bad enough as it is because she never explained how it was scum indicative, and then dismissed it herself through metatells(maybe because of Nacho), yet keeps her vote on me(maybe because of Sala).

You seem to be asking me why I care about her meta? That isn't the case, I'm curious as to how she arrived to "It's probably playstyle/personality" which is a metatell she's using on me to nullify the scumread she has on me(not sure if nullify is the correct word here, since she has expressed that PV could be scum yet hasn't moved her vote, so i'm scummier than PV? idk).

There's so little effort to read me here, and so much of looking good to good players while still staying on a small, supported, safe wagon, which I think to be scum.

I'm just sheeping Nacho at the moment because Elyse doesn't have much support(to be fair i didn't really push for it), plus I don't mind a Sala lynch(for now at least).

You said that I was asking for meta in general was more forgivable? I'm not sure I understand, because I don't recall asking for her meta? I do recall asking her if she meta'd me though, but I get the feeling that's not what you understood.

In any event, my job is not to be a playstyle critic. I do seem to have misunderstood you (I do have some legitimate concerns about Elyse), and in any event you are not on my scumlist.

[Elyse]

Where is this hyper defensiveness you're seeing? If it wasn't playstyle would it be scum indicative?

What do you dislike about PV or Sala?

It's in all of your posts. It might be indicative of newbscum if not a playstyle.

I do agree that Sala's early posts seemed noncommittal and only theory-based, but I don't think his recent content has been bad and he seems alright now.

PerV's ISO has a large chunk about just horoscopes and I feel like his Salamence vote is meh, though he's pretty open about just sheeping his townread Nacho. He's a player I usually get a gut feeling about and my gut says scum.

I guess I'll start there.

VOTE: PeregrineV

@SC
I have reads - just not scumreads. But now I'm voting PerV.

@Rolls
Salamence's sentiments toward Xay are similar to how I feel about him. He explained it pretty well himself. I also agree that PerV's vote was weak and I am also scumreading him.

What Elsye did is she started out with a (i think sort of)scumread on me, which was bad enough as it is because she never explained how it was scum indicative, and then dismissed it herself through metatells(maybe because of Nacho), yet keeps her vote on me(maybe because of Sala).

I voted you because you seemed easily excitable and would react under pressure. I thought I would be able to discern your alignment through pressuring you, but it seems as though your hyper defensiveness is just playstyle and not alignment indicative. I came to this conclusion because you are being defensive about everything - even things that aren't alignment indicative. I kept my vote on you because I didn't really have anyone else to move it to, and it's not like I'm townreading you or anything.

@Rolls: Like I said, it's possible Elyse is just sitting around waiting for something to happen, but then why isn't she voting me. She has stated she would be fine with my lynch, but why hasn't she voted me. It could be a reach for townie points.

When did I say that?

[Salamence20]

Nacho I think you're wrong about Elyse. Coming right out and saying you have no scumreads is most likely town

I don't get your reasoning for this. The could maybe see you calling it town because it's something that's too risky for scum to say, but taking the position on page 6 doesn't seem that risky and thus not that town, and it prevents her from having to take positions on who to lynch because she doesn't have that opinion. I also didn't really like how she called me town and yet didn't engage my scumread on Salamence (aka pick out flaws in it) to see where I was coming from which shows me she not only lacks a scumread, but lacks interest in developing a scumread as well.

It's not that I'm not interested in developing a scumread. Salamence has said he'll be away for a few days so I don't think it's scummy that he's been elsewhere on site or barely present.

As far as only talking about theory, yeah I guess that's true, but it's early in the game and it's not like Salamence purposely avoided talking about current events in the topic and used theory as a crutch to avoid taking stances. Id like to see him come back and hear what he has to say. I certainly understand the votes on him, though

.

[Nachomamma8]

sorry, i got a holiday work other commitments punch will be back soon

[Elyse]

I still don't see where I said I would be ok with your lynch.

[Salamence20]

Saying you dont disagree with the votes and actually admitting Im playing out if character earlier isnt a non-verbal way of supporting a lynch?

[Elyse]

I honestly don't understand how you would think I'm ok with your lynch based on the bolded. I said that the main reason people were scumreading you wasn't that strong and I wanted to hear what you said when you came back. In what way does that make it seem like I would be good with your lynch?

[PeregrineV]

Vote: ToastyToast

[PeregrineV]

@PV: No, not quite. Try again.

Just a single question.

You said:

PV waits until Nacho tells him to hop on to vote, which seems as justified as Xay's reasoning.

I said:

Am I sheeping scumNacho?

If the answer is no, then I'm sheeping townNacho. And that's good enough at the time.

[Salamence20]

@PV: No, not quite. Try again.

Just a single question.

You said:

PV waits until Nacho tells him to hop on to vote, which seems as justified as Xay's reasoning.

I said:

Am I sheeping scumNacho?

If the answer is no, then I'm sheeping townNacho. And that's good enough at the time.

Vote: ToastyToast

These posts made me lol.

[PeregrineV]

Every time I have been lynched as scum, my wagon has been incredibly fast because I'm usually pretty successful in fighting it off otherwise: remember how quickly I was lynched in Event Card?

Even that took too long.

Speed of wagon becomes more relevant when reads are stronger, both for the wagon and the wagon composition.

[PeregrineV]

Idk, it dont really matter since i have no qualms moving to Xay. But I cant read Xay because he always has this "I dunno what ur talking about, Im town" feel that makes it hard to accurately read him.

PV though. He should know better

What should I know better?

[Salamence20]

I honestly don't understand how you would think I'm ok with your lynch based on the bolded. I said that the main reason people were scumreading you wasn't that strong and I wanted to hear what you said when you came back. In what way does that make it seem like I would be good with your lynch?

Because you didnt disagree with the wagon at all, you just wanted to wait it out, rather than hop on.

I mean if you think the votes are justified why are you not voting me?

[Salamence20]

Idk, it dont really matter since i have no qualms moving to Xay. But I cant read Xay because he always has this "I dunno what ur talking about, Im town" feel that makes it hard to accurately read him.

PV though. He should know better

What should I know better?

Youre not someone Id expect to "LOLSHEEP" as town

[Elyse]

I did disagree with it though. I said I understand the votes, but I think your scumminess was being overhyped.

I'm not scumreading you...

[PeregrineV]

This would be where I have to disagree with you a little, because I feel meta is a great tool for scumhunting, but only if you've played with the person. I don't think you can meta someone you have never played with, whereas if you play with the person a lot, meta reads make more sense.

What Elsye did is she started out with a (i think sort of)scumread on me, which was bad enough as it is because she never explained how it was scum indicative, and then dismissed it herself through metatells(maybe because of Nacho), yet keeps her vote on me(maybe because of Sala).

You seem to be asking me why I care about her meta? That isn't the case, I'm curious as to how she arrived to "It's probably playstyle/personality" which is a metatell she's using on me to nullify the scumread she has on me(not sure if nullify is the correct word here, since she has expressed that PV could be scum yet hasn't moved her vote, so i'm scummier than PV? idk).

There's so little effort to read me here, and so much of looking good to good players while still staying on a small, supported, safe wagon, which I think to be scum.

I'm just sheeping Nacho at the moment because Elyse doesn't have much support(to be fair i didn't really push for it), plus I don't mind a Sala lynch(for now at least).

You said that I was asking for meta in general was more forgivable? I'm not sure I understand, because I don't recall asking for her meta? I do recall asking her if she meta'd me though, but I get the feeling that's not what you understood.

In any event, my job is not to be a playstyle critic. I do seem to have misunderstood you (I do have some legitimate concerns about Elyse), and in any event you are not on my scumlist.

I see an FoS, and a vote based on some sort of interaction between two other players, but I can't seem to discern your scumlist. Would like to see it.

[Salamence20]

I did disagree with it though. I said I understand the votes, but I think your scumminess was being overhyped.

I'm not scumreading you...

K fine. Im not too worried about it because PV/Xay should fall today,

Ill stash this up for another day

[Iecerint]

Salamence, what type/manner of "connection" are you referring to?

I'm asking about the "connection" you alluded to between me and Juls.

[Salamence20]

With Juls daykill on you, ect.

[Iecerint]

That was because I RVS'd her.

My point is, like, is there any substance or inference in what you are saying? What is your point?

[Juls]

I'm sorry, I haven't been real interested in playing and it's not fair to hold the spot if I am not going to participate.

Mod: Please replace me.

Sorry red

[Gemini Blind]

VOTE: PeregrineV

@SC

I have reads - just not scumreads

. But now I'm voting PerV.

@Rolls
Salamence's sentiments toward Xay are similar to how I feel about him. He explained it pretty well himself. I also agree that PerV's vote was weak and I am also

scumreading him

.

Do you not have scum reads or are you scum reading PV?

@ PV Why the vote on ToastyToast?

-Rolls

[Elyse]

I was referencing earlier.

I am currently scumreading PV but when SC made that statement I wasn't.

[Gemini Blind]

Eeew the quote tags got messed up that top part is Elyse's quote, my bad, and that first Q is addressed to Elyse. Sorry I tried to cut out some of Elyse's quote and I messed it up.

-Rolls

PEDIT Okay.