Micro 382 - CREDIMVS PAVONI DEORVM (Game Over!)

[Josh_B]

You have outside communication in this game?

I want to quote this post in my own ISO so I know where it is at end game.

[Josh_B]

The results of the test are not in yet. I'm pretty sure everyone else can put the pieces together, though. (I'll answer come your flip. Suffice to say that I feel the test was successful.) So, you really think it's an Asher/BBT scumteam?

I really do. 419

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Can you finish your reads-list now Josh?

[BlueBloodedToffee]

You could do Wake next. Then Vettrock.

Sound good?

[Wake1]

Online now. Will be reviewing thread soon.

[Asher Kendrell]

Damn, nicely done on the italics. So now we wait for a full reads list and see if it's followed by a self-hammer?

[TierShift]

Asher, outstanding questions to you in my iso.

[Asher Kendrell]

Scripten & BBT: I've got a moderate town read on these two, especially because they're focused on generating discussion and scumhunting. Then again, could be a scum pair, never know. But I would be much more surprised to find them as scum versus josh/vettrock.

Why do you think they could be a pair? Why not together with other players?

Most of that relies on older posts like 26 and 54 where scripten is seemingly against bbt, but then he chooses to flip and go for josh once he calls out bbt as well. Even now they're both focused on josh again, but so is everyone but wake88 and vettrock. The amount of discussion they've produced, especially with each other, leads me to believe that they're part of the same team. Since they're producing discussion, I heavily lean towards town for my reads on them.

[TierShift]

Nhmm ok.

You're still weird.

What do you think about the reaction test?

[The Bulge]

Votecount 2.5

BlueBloodedToffee (2) -

vettrock, Josh_B

Asher Kendrell (0) -

Josh_B (3) -

BlueBloodedToffee, Asher Kendrell, TierShift

(L-1)

Scripten (0) -

Wake88 (0) -

TierShift (0) -

vettrock (0) -

Not Voting -

Wake88, Scripten

With 7 alive, it's 4 to lynch.

Deadline in (expired on 2014-09-14 20:28:00) (September 14).

[vettrock]

I see the crumb, but I'm not sure what he was trying to get out of the alignment test. I understand that to mean he was shifting his vote to BBT to see his reaction, rather than because he really thought he was scummy. I don't see how that makes anyone scum or not scum. The only thing would be that Josh then shifted is vote to BBT, hoping to build a wagon apparently. I don't think that necessarily makes him scum.

The thing that is suspicious about the josh wagon is that is it the same people as the wolfy wagon.

With regards to my lack of further defending Wolfy, yes, I thought he was town, and given more time during Day 1, I probably would have put out more trying to defend him, but Mr. Ree hammered before much more could really be said.

I don't like the way BBT tunnels and seems to ignore everything that doesn't support his theory.

Asher has provided more reasoning behind his reads, although his entrance in the game with a quick vote with no information behind it seems scummy to me.

While I don't think scripten's test proves anything, I think it does indicate that he is probably town and is scumhunting.

[vettrock]

You could do Wake next. Then Vettrock.

Sound good?

This is scummy to me. He is already planning the next mislynch. If you are town, you opinion of who you want to lynch next depends on the flip and the nightkill. Town doesn't have enough information prior to that to make an informed decision as to who they want to lynch. If Josh flips town, does that change your opinion any? How about if he flips scum?

[Josh_B]

Vettrock, http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 5#p6191745

[Wake1]

OK guys, I just got off work. Please give me a bit of time to right stuff up.

[Wake1]

Did I really just do that now?

"Write." Not "right."

[Wake1]

Well, I'm posting a few days later than I wanted to. Work slammed me really hard. Like, multiple 10-hour shifts, unexpectedly. The only reason I'm posting right now @10pm central today is because my 18-hour shift starting @6am tomorrow was cancelled. So now I'm completely off on Saturday, and it's driving me bonkers just thinking of not having any work to do. So, I've got some time to post here now. Gonna try something a bit different so I can keep my big posts, but make it easier for everyone to read (number them bullet-point style, and break 'em up a bit into smaller posts).

For now, in case any emergency work calls nab me at this critical juncture, I'm going to very tentatively
VOTE: BlueBloodedToffee.

Please keep votes at the beginning of a new line. Fixed for you. -Mod

Going through it now.

[vettrock]

Vettrock, http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 5#p6191745

So apparently something about the way I play tend to make people think I am scummy. I think part of it has to do with my hesitation to commit given limited information. I've played town everytime I've played on this site, with the exception of a game I replaced into and made I think two posts before the game was over. I've had a wagon built up against me to L-1 in all of the 9 player games, and had a fair amount of suspicion against in the Marvel game. If I knew a good way to prevent that, I would, and I'm not sure what it is that causes that to happen. I think to best strategy is to just watch, and the contribute what I see and think. If I am lynched, hopefully there is enough information generated to help town win in the end. I don't want to be lynched but going into a defensive position doesn't seem to be helping the town as much as looking at others behavior. I know I'm town, I don't need to concentrate on the cases against me as I know they are bogus, except with respect to how it reveals to scumminess of the player making the case. If someone wants an explaination from me as to why I did something or my reasoning, I provide it. That to me is the best case I can make at that point.

[Wake1]

I'm going to have to wait until tomorrow morning. Got a draft readied, but am falling asleep! It's 11PM here and I've been up since 5AM. I'll be here tomorrow when I'm rested up. Thanks for your patience everyone.

[TierShift]

I see the crumb, but I'm not sure what he was trying to get out of the alignment test. I understand that to mean he was shifting his vote to BBT to see his reaction, rather than because he really thought he was scummy. I don't see how that makes anyone scum or not scum. The only thing would be that Josh then shifted is vote to BBT, hoping to build a wagon apparently. I don't think that necessarily makes him scum.

It literally goes like this:
Josh says: hey I'm pretty sure scripten is scum!
Scripten says: hey uh BBT is scum
I say: yeah bbt uh looks good
Josh goes: lol I was wrong scripten isn't scum BBT is
Josh: intent to hammer

You really don't see how that is scum?

UNVOTE:

Not because I'm not sure josh is scum. Just to see wtf wake and vettrock are doing

[BlueBloodedToffee]

I would appreciate it if we could just hammer Josh and get this day done with. I see no need to drag it out further.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Tier, we can work out what Wake/Vettrock are doing on D3.

[Josh_B]

It literally goes like this:
Josh says: hey I'm pretty sure scripten is scum!
Scripten says: hey uh BBT is scum
I say: yeah bbt uh looks good
Josh goes: lol I was wrong scripten isn't scum BBT is
Josh: intent to hammer

You really don't see how that is scum?

Oh yeah, I can actually see that. It makes sense but I guess my excitement ruined it. What do you think about BBT and Asher having nearly identical cases against vettrock and myself like I pointed out earlier? that is a team slip. You know it is.
As town you are part of an uninformed majority, against an informed minority. You know that in the Night Phases the scum have a chance to work out their plan for the next day. Check it out and get back to me. Especially Scripten and Tiershift.

I could hammer myself but at this point I'm a

little

lot worried that even after I flip that Tiershift and Scripten won't look at that, and the thing is that

ALL three towns

who are left won't be able to work together.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Oh yeah, I can actually see that. It makes sense but I guess my excitement ruined it. What do you think about BBT and Asher having nearly identical cases against vettrock and myself like I pointed out earlier?

that is a team slip.

You know it is.
As town you are part of an uninformed majority, against an informed minority. You know that in the Night Phases the scum have a chance to work out their plan for the next day. Check it out and get back to me. Especially Scripten and Tiershift.

I could hammer myself but at this point I'm a

little

lot worried that even after I flip that Tiershift and Scripten won't look at that, and the thing is that

ALL three towns

who are left won't be able to work together.

It's poor play to try and push associative cases without a flip.

[Josh_B]

It's poor play to try and push associative cases without a flip.

Tell that to Asher. I think he misunderstood you when you explained the whole "team" thing to him. There is no such thing as a "town team."
Besides, I'm not pushing moderate associatives. The stuff between vettrock and me is an associative case. The stuff between you and Scripten is an associative case. I'm pushing a unified team theory- An informed minority with an agenda and a plan.

You both made the same case against two different players, I'll admit, it was kind of clever and it took me doing PbPA to see it because it didn't pop out at me at first, but it's there plain as day. I would ask who created the idea for that case, but I'm pretty sure it was you.

Are you going to ask him to respond to my questions that I asked him? Are you going to respond to the questions I asked you? Particularly, what are you doing to get better reads on the other players that you think are possible scum?

[BlueBloodedToffee]

It's poor play to try and push associative cases without a flip.

Tell that to Asher. I think he misunderstood you when you explained the whole "team" thing to him. There is no such thing as a "town team."
Besides, I'm not pushing moderate associatives. The stuff between vettrock and me is an associative case. The stuff between you and Scripten is an associative case. I'm pushing a unified team theory- An informed minority with an agenda and a plan.

You both made the same case against two different players, I'll admit, it was kind of clever and it took me doing PbPA to see it because it didn't pop out at me at first, but it's there plain as day. I would ask who created the idea for that case, but I'm pretty sure it was you.

Are you going to ask him to respond to my questions that I asked him? Are you going to respond to the questions I asked you? Particularly, what are you doing to get better reads on the other players that you think are possible scum?

I haven't pushed any case on Vettrock and you, I'm pushing you only. I don't know why you're referring to other people's posts when you're addressing me. I am not pushing any associatives at all, just you.

Are Tier and Scripten not also pushing the same points as to why you're scum? Is it only me and Asher? You should rethink that.

Did Tier not say he liked my first initial attack post on Wolfy D1? Is he not scum with me? He basically sheeped me right after my vote on Wolfy, so he used my reasoning. Why are me and Tier not a team but me and Asher are? What's the difference?

I'm not particularly interested in any of your questions, but I don't remember not answering any?

I'm waiting for your flip before I pursue other avenues. Have I not made my reads clear enough for you?