NY 177: Simple Complexity (GAME OVER: Scum Wins!)

[House]

PV was at L-1 and his lynch didn't happen, even when 75% of players were endorsing it. If a Townie had been in that position, he'd have been hammered.

I'm going to have to find the section where he was being wagoned and read up on it. I can't justify a lynch with, "if at first you don't succeed, try try again" mentality, and nobody is giving much of anything else.

[Pine]

That is not the justification I'm suggesting. I'm saying that with so much stated support, it fell apart easily

[House]

That is not the justification I'm suggesting. I'm saying that with so much stated support, it fell apart easily

Yeah I get that, but that's saying we should lynch one person based on the interactions of other people.

I get why scum would fake supporting a lynch without follow through... but couldn't that be done on a townie to keep a suspicious player floating around?

[House]

Not saying that I don't like the wagon... I just don't know enough about his play to support it yet.

Going to ISO him and nail down a read. Gimme a bit.

[Skybird]

VOTE: Pine

He's scum. I also think one of Psyche or Marquis is scum. PV is also scum.

[reinoe]

Holy Hannah!!!! I thought my vote was the hammer.

[reinoe]

VOTE: Pine

He's scum. I also think one of Psyche or Marquis is scum. PV is also scum.

Thinks PV is scum. Doesn't vote PV.

Please lynch Skybird tomorrow in case I'm night-killed. B.TW I did forget that you asked why I think you're scum.

I'll do it tonight.

[shaddowez]

VOTE: Pine

He's scum. I also think one of Psyche or Marquis is scum. PV is also scum.

You're saying that PV and possibly Psyche are scum, both of which have wagons forming on them already. Why would you vote for the third option, rather than voting someone with a wagon and just pushing for a future lynch?

[Wake1]

Vote Count 5.4

Gameplay506 (0):

House (1):

PeregrineV

Marquis (0):

notscience (0):

PeregrineV (3):

Marquis, Shaddowez, reinoe

Pine (3):

Gameplay506, notscience, Skybird

Psyche (2):

House, Pine

reinoe (1):

Psyche

Shaddowez (0):

Skybird (0):

Not Voting (0):

~ With 10 players alive, it takes 6 to lynch!
~ Deadline expires 10/27/14, @2PM Central.
~ Seeking a replacement for Psyche.

OP | Game Rules | Day Start
1.1 | 1.2 | 1.3 | 1.4 | 1.5 | 1.6 | 1.7 | 1.8 | 1.9 | 1.10 | 1.11 | 1.12 | 1.13 | 1.14 | 1.15 | 1.16 | 1.17 | 1.18 | 1.19
Aegor's Lynch & Flip
Elyse and T S O's Murders & Flips
2.1 | 2.2 | 2.3 | 2.4
Aeronaut's Lynch & Flip
Texcat and Josh_B's Murders & Flips
3.1 | 3.2 | 3.3 | 3.4 | 3.5 | 3.6 | 3.7 | 3.8 | 3.9
tn5421's Lynch & Flip
Titus's Murder & Flip
4.1 | 4.2 | 4.3
OkaPoka's Lynch & Flip
Majiffy and Mirhawk's Murders & Flips
5.1 | 5.2 | 5.3 | 5.4 | 5.5
PeregrineV's Lynch & Flip
Gameplay506 and notsciences' Murders & Flips
6.1 | 6.2 | 6.3

[shaddowez]

Holy Hannah!!!! I thought my vote was the hammer.

Sadly not, the fakemason reveal derailed the Pere wagon.

P-Edit: Sorry Sky, thought notty was still voting Psyche, wagon sizes are about the same according to this VC.

[shaddowez]

Mod

- Can we get a prod on gameplay please?

[Skybird]

VOTE: Pine

He's scum. I also think one of Psyche or Marquis is scum. PV is also scum.

You're saying that PV and possibly Psyche are scum, both of which have wagons forming on them already. Why would you vote for the third option, rather than voting someone with a wagon and just pushing for a future lynch?

Because after all the interaction with Pine I am fully convinced he is scum. I don't think anyone will listen if I don't vote for him.

[Skybird]

Holy Hannah!!!! I thought my vote was the hammer.

Sadly not, the fakemason reveal derailed the Pere wagon.

P-Edit: Sorry Sky, thought notty was still voting Psyche, wagon sizes are about the same according to this VC.

No worries Shaddow.

Why is Pine's vote on Psyche then?

[Marquis]

Pine is town. Lynch PV.

[Wake1]

Gameplay506 prodded.

[House]

Some things that jumped out at me about PereV's posts while reading up on his ISO:

Spoiler: quotes

Def not a great post but other tn podts merit z scumread more than that.

Treevote plox.

His other 4 posts following that were Tree is scum because he gambitted twice. Which, given 240, make them null, and almost confirms Tree as town.

Why does post 240 make tree/Marquis town?

OkaPoka's push on gameplay is horrible. I completely agree with Alina and Aeronaut in regards to that.

However

I think majiffy's push on tree is fabricated. It makes sense for an RVS-ending vote, but somehow we've made it to page twenty and he still acts relatively confident that tree's pretty bland couple of fakeclaim ploys make him scum. It would be okay if he were just egging it on for tactical reasons, but I just have no doubt reading his posts that he'd be happy if tree died right now.

At this point, I think he continues to tunnel on tree just because 1) it's easier to act through than it is to look soberly at what he's doing and what could be done, and 2) tree is really easy to push and is the sort of player likely to dig his own grave. And I'm asking his sheep about the wagon so I can see if anyone else is following suit, or if the

actual

scum carrying out this really cliched approach to D1 is one of those. It seems pretty likely to me that the tree wagon is just too shitty not to be astroturfed.

I know I'm fooling around a lot, but it's because I can, because it's harmless. But I didn't join the game for the captive audience.

Quite frankly tree dug his own grave by trying to gambit twice, ESPECIALLY and SPECIFICALLY his IC claim.

I disagree with you on your current majiffy read, weren't you following the flowchart and sheeping majiffy 10 pages ago anyway?
I've got him as relatively neutral, slightly leaning town.

What was his second gambit? The IC one seems like a joke to me.

I don't like how Oka has to be asked to give explanations for his reads. Saying "Psych is weird" is not an explanation. It's like you have opinions, but you're afraid to share them until you absolutely have to. Making it look like you have scumreads, without giving weight to them so that nobody can suspect you. Not to mention, you're saying we should kill people who claim PRs.

I wouldn't be surprised if this is an SK.

VOTE: OkaPoka

The bolded makes me think Aeronaut is scum who genuinely thinks Oka is scum also, but knows he's not group scum because Aero is.

I see it more like bet hedging. They are calling them scummy, but can't name partners yet so call them an SK.

Terrible. You don't have to have any idea on a scum's teammates to call them scum. Elyse was totes right.

OkaPoka's push on gameplay is horrible. I completely agree with Alina and Aeronaut in regards to that.

However

I think majiffy's push on tree is fabricated. It makes sense for an RVS-ending vote, but somehow we've made it to page twenty and he still acts relatively confident that tree's pretty bland couple of fakeclaim ploys make him scum. It would be okay if he were just egging it on for tactical reasons, but I just have no doubt reading his posts that he'd be happy if tree died right now.

At this point, I think he continues to tunnel on tree just because 1) it's easier to act through than it is to look soberly at what he's doing and what could be done, and 2) tree is really easy to push and is the sort of player likely to dig his own grave. And I'm asking his sheep about the wagon so I can see if anyone else is following suit, or if the

actual

scum carrying out this really cliched approach to D1 is one of those. It seems pretty likely to me that the tree wagon is just too shitty not to be astroturfed.

I know I'm fooling around a lot, but it's because I can, because it's harmless. But I didn't join the game for the captive audience.

Quite frankly tree dug his own grave by trying to gambit twice, ESPECIALLY and SPECIFICALLY his IC claim.

I disagree with you on your current majiffy read, weren't you following the flowchart and sheeping majiffy 10 pages ago anyway?
I've got him as relatively neutral, slightly leaning town.

What was his second gambit? The IC one seems like a joke to me.

I don't like how Oka has to be asked to give explanations for his reads. Saying "Psych is weird" is not an explanation. It's like you have opinions, but you're afraid to share them until you absolutely have to. Making it look like you have scumreads, without giving weight to them so that nobody can suspect you. Not to mention, you're saying we should kill people who claim PRs.

I wouldn't be surprised if this is an SK.

VOTE: OkaPoka

The bolded makes me think Aeronaut is scum who genuinely thinks Oka is scum also, but knows he's not group scum because Aero is.

Serial Killers generally tend to be careful not to get lynched, and careful trying to not get NKed by scum. Oka is giving us his "scumreads" without really giving reasoning. This way, it looks to the town like he's trying, but the scum won't target him because his claims have no weight.

SKs are also often bullet-proof, so don't really care about becoming the NK.
Town and scum often give no reasons for their scumreads, the hard part is sorting the town that does it from the scum that do it.

Rationalizing unsupported reads is bad. I don't see why town would do this.

If either Pscyhe or Marquis are scum with me, then pushing the fact they are fake masons is stupid scum-play and would be against my win-con. So think again.

Not necessarily, considering this is a multiball game.

VOTE: PeregrineV

[shaddowez]

Marquis

- Do you think PV is more likely to be scum or SK? Also, who else do you think is scum?

[House]

Marquis

- Do you think PV is more likely to be scum or SK?

Would that be relevant?

[Pine]

Holy Hannah!!!! I thought my vote was the hammer.

Sadly not, the fakemason reveal derailed the Pere wagon.

P-Edit: Sorry Sky, thought notty was still voting Psyche, wagon sizes are about the same according to this VC.

No worries Shaddow.

Why is Pine's vote on Psyche then?

Because AS I ALREADY STATED, ON THIS PAGE, EVEN, THAT I THINK PSYCHE IS MORE LIKELY TO WEASEL OUT

READ THE GODDAMN FUCKING THREAD

[Pine]

Okay, it was last page. But it was really motherfucking recent

[House]

VOTE: Pine

He's scum. I also think one of Psyche or Marquis is scum. PV is also scum.

You're saying that PV and possibly Psyche are scum, both of which have wagons forming on them already. Why would you vote for the third option, rather than voting someone with a wagon and just pushing for a future lynch?

Because after all the interaction with Pine I am fully convinced he is scum. I don't think anyone will listen if I don't vote for him.

Why do you think he's scum? Because he thinks you are? That's not a good road to travel.

Pine and shaddowez are my strongest town reads.

[Wake1]

Please tone it down a bit.

[Pine]

Aww man

I'm totes going to eat a NK

PE: aye aye

[House]

Gameplay506:

Dumb town

House:

Town

Marquis:

Prob scum

notscience:

Could be sold on scum; all that Majiffy buddying & sheeping was suspicious as hell.

PeregrineV:

Scum

Pine:

Town

Psyche:

Scum

reinoe:

Copfirm Town; still wary

Shaddowez:

Town

Skybird:

Thinking town, but (apparent) OMGUSish stance makes me nervous

[shaddowez]

Marquis

- Do you think PV is more likely to be scum or SK?

Would that be relevant?

It might provide insight into his other reads. If he thinks PV is the SK, I'd want to look at interactions between anyone else he lists as scum; on the other hand, if he lists PV as scum, we'd be able to look at PV's interactions with whoever else Marquis lists. Make sense?