Open 575: Friends & Enemies-Together At Last (OVER)

[Mathdino]

Also, I forgot to say this earlier, but you've yet to factor in that her "I thought it was the deadline" was in response to me raging at her for hammering, while she responded "I was in a weird mood" immediately to BMWS asking her reason for it.

She then explained that weird mood today, and it checks out.

Edit: Ooh, okay, there's something to talk about. NM's a lurker, but where does the BMWS read come from?

[Wisdom]

The general feeling I have about him is that everytime he comes to the thread, he posts summaries of things that have happened. I haven't seen anything to make me feel he's town yet.

Re: the deadline thing, that doesn't tell me much. It's a given she switched to her "Victor is flipping scum" stance immediately anyway. What's weird is she didn't state right away that she's hammering him because she's sure of him being scum but brought up deadline stuff.

[Wisdom]

Well his twilight posts towards Mala aren't bad. Don't really think he's her buddy.

[Mathdino]

Okay bear with me because I'm still trying to understand this.

I'm in a really weird mood.

Plus I thought the DL was creeping close

This is her initial reaction to me and BMWS being like "WTF".

Ew guess there was 12 hours left. Although I'd still be asleep better than a NL

This wasn't in response to anything; 904 was me noping the fuck out.

Because his apathy to being run up felt forced. He could have fought the lynch, caught up and gave up reads. His last effort was to stall reads til the morning, felt scummy. His early pushes were bad.

This is in response to BMWS's "Tell me why he's scum, right now. I want reasoning."

So your scenario states that she saw Victor's apathy, panicked and thought he was being obvscum, and then hammered. Now, if this were true, why would she keep this reason until being asked about it?

Like I said, the weird mood checks out. The deadline issue doesn't seem forced, IMO. But the issue with your psychoanalysis is in the part where she panics and impulse-busses because she thought everyone else would notice him being obvscum.

I thought I'd have more to say on this than "I'm really not sure", but that's all I've got, sorry.
If Mala gets lynched and flips town, who will you vote tomorrow?

[Mathdino]

Also, what's your read on Riddleton and why? You didn't respond to my saying that you've had a lot of qualms about him today for a townread.

Any thoughts on my analysis of Victor's interaction with SilverWolf?

Any thoughts on SilverWolf's actions in general?

[reinoe]

MOD STUFF

VOTE COUNT!!!!

Wisdom- malakittens, Newbie, Not_Mafia
borkjerkfin-
wgeurts-
St. Constantine The Hermit-
Newbie-
Malakittens-Riddleton, Wisdom
Riddleton-Mathdino
Not_Mafia-
Mathdino-St. Constantine-
blindmewithscience-
acryon-

not voting- borkjerfkin, wgeurts, blindmewithscience, acryon

With 11 Alive it's 6 to lynch.
(expired on 2014-11-14 21:00:00)


You all wake up and decide to have stomach pumps for breakfast!

[Wisdom]

Now, if this were true, why would she keep this reason until being asked about it?

That's what I'm saying. Why wouldn't she state the reasons she is so sure Victor is scum in the first place? Why make up deadline excuses?

[Wisdom]

If Mala gets lynched and flips town, who will you vote tomorrow?

I can't answer such hypotheticals. If such a thing happens, ask me then.

[Not_Mafia]

But you're fine doing pre-flip associative?

[Wisdom]

Riddleton feels townier now because of his insistence about his mistake. I don't see scum going on about it for so long after their mistake got invalidated by the flip anyway. The only thing I.don't like is that he isn't doing much other than talking about himself.

There's also me seeing SW's scum game in the game I linked. I don't think it resembles her play in this game much.

[Wisdom]

But you're fine doing pre-flip associative?

Sure? If I can figure out the whole scumteam I will. It's not like I'm telling you to lynch acryon because of preflip associations either.

[Mathdino]

If they both agree to it, I'd be up for lynching Wisdom and Mala in succession if the first lynch flips town or claims mason; their meta record of correctly reading each other is pretty undeniable. Just need Mala to convince me this isn't TvT.

Paging

blindmewithscience

,

borkjerfkin

, and

acryon

for their thoughts on this after Mala posts.

[Wisdom]

Mathdino you never asked her to explain her read on me, as far as I can tell. How come, especially given the fact she even said that

your

posts lead to me being scum?

[Mathdino]

A. She explained back here, and her read on you seems largely dependent on gut.
B. Okay I was originally going to say that I understand how this post might lead her believe that my posts 'lead straight to Wis-scum' but actually you have a good point. If she's scum, I'm guilty as charged for subconscious naivete.

Mala, wtf do you mean about my posts leading to a Wisdom scumread?

Note that you said that

before

I started actually rethinking my read on Wisdom (#1033).

Thanks, that point is starting to sway my read on you vs Mala in your favour.

Thoughts on my proposal? If it comes to that, up for being lynched to prove Mala scum?

[Wisdom]

No, because mistakes happen and I'd rather not have two townies dead served to scum in a silver plate. I want to see Mala responding first.

[Malakittens]

Fuck I'm not reading that insane amt of spam from Wisdom.

[Malakittens]

Shit phone are you kidding me. I asked for overall activity not for you to hit enter.

Dino -- I pretty much did the same analysis as you on VDA's scum meta and found exactly what you did other than i didn't use all the words. I would have if I needed too. Hence me telling people you were for the doing the exact thing I did on VDA

[Mathdino]

I didn't find a scumread on Wisdom.

I'd appreciate if you did read that insane amt of spam from Wisdom, and at least respond to the ABCDEFGH case.

[Malakittens]

No, Dino is very much town.

Here's where the meat of our Victor analysis is going to be.

Well Newbie, that explains your wallposting, haha. Are there any records left of one of your scum games and town games?

Hey Math, why so keen to get some early meta off Newbie?

I'm not sure what the problem is. I would think getting meta would be sharing useful information. I intend to look at meta of the players here. So even though you said you wanted to know why mathdino wanted that particular info. I guess I fail to see the problem with this and your explanation really didn't help me much. You are making way too much of a simple question as though you are looking for a reason to suspect someone. It's possible you just want to question Mathdino like you said, but this seems an odd thing to question him about. This is something else I am taking note of. FoS VictorDeAngelo

So do a lot of players, but I was wondering why he was looking to get meta off that player so early on. Often people looking for meta in the first few pages would have a particular reason, and I wanted to know his.

Mala looks pretty damn townie off her opening posts. I think I should be able to metaread you fairly well now, so I last long enough I will see if your scum.

Does not read as distancing, reads more like trying to appeal to Mala to keep Victor around.

I don't like Wguerts 105. This post doesn't fit the play at all.

As said, not bussing. 0 interaction with wgeurts.

Nor do I like Wisdom's 108 - particularly since he accused me of reaching and asking loaded questions earlier.

I like both the vote and point from Newbie in 124.

Awful rvs in 127.

@TTH are you really implying in 130 it's a waste time asking for reasoning because if a player is scum they will simply lie or have I misread that?

132 & 134 (this should really be one post anyhow ) Asks to meta read to help players understand his style and then tells everyone to ignore Newbie's meta because "the fact he's provided it probaly means he's aware of it and able to manipulate it."

If Wguerts is scum I can see Silverwolf being scum with him for 135.

Aha, okay. In one of his games he did exactly this. "If [townplayer] is scum, I can see [my scumbuddy] being scum with him." Not making me feel more comfortable about Riddleton.

Is the reason this game is so many pages because wgeurts is multiposting. Actually wgeuers and Newbie. Any chance we can keep it to one post at a time folks?

Blindmewithscience is sitting back too much with this post. Especially considering it's his only one outside of rvs.

Not bussing.

I still like my vote on Wguerts, but I really wish I had a second one for blindmewithscience. Not too sure on anyone else right now. A few players on the list need to show still so we'll see.

And like that - I am gone.

Hey Bork,

The post above makes me really lean-dino town, do you agree?

Fun fact,

Dino is scaring me with how town he is.

Like, actually scaring me.

@Preedit:

I disagree. His mindset is exactly like mine. His analysis is EXACTLY WHAT I DID during the night. Like he meta'd VDA and found the exact tells that I found with vda.

he's fucking town

@Mala - This probably isn't a solid scum tell, but in the few times I've encountered it, every time a player kept trying to confirm someone as town, even when no one else was pushing the issue, one of the two ended up being scum. Can you just explain this to me a little bit more, because I'm not really catching your drift here

I'm not talking about the RVS-tell at all.

I'm talking about how MathDino went and meta'd VDA scum games. He took his meta and put it on a cloth line to dry. That's

exactly

what I did last night phrase and what he has bolded is exactly what I caught. So I'm pretty damn sure that's in my mindset and a damn town mindset to do.

Again, what's your reaction to his reaction after my hammer, do you really think that was a scum reaction? I don't.

[Malakittens]

My lynch pool is this:

{Wisdom, BMWS, Riddleton, Wgegurts}

In that order.

[Mathdino]

...

I didn't ask you where you got your townread on me, since that seems to already be a popular opinion as someone pointed out.

I asked where you got your scumread on Wisdom, and how my posts prior to #1033 lead one to a Wisscumread.

[Malakittens]

I didn't find a scumread on Wisdom.

I'd appreciate if you did read that insane amt of spam from Wisdom, and at least respond to the ABCDEFGH case.

I will later right now I just woke up to the thread being 3++ pages rather than it was when I went to bed bc wisdom did his spam.

Plus work and plus his read is bullshit and he admits that has has read me wrong in the past as town but still would likely flat out go hey hey I thought she was town after I tunneled her so I can still read her which I find highly annoying. He did incorrectly read me and read me right after I claimed, so yes hence bullshit because he can't tell town mala from scum mala

[Malakittens]

...

I didn't ask you where you got your townread on me, since that seems to already be a popular opinion as someone pointed out.

I asked where you got your scumread on Wisdom, and how my posts prior to #1033 lead one to a Wisscumread.

Read my posts correctly then. I stated that I had done the same work you did in terms of finding how VDA assicaotes his scum buddies. I just didn't wall it like you did because I had no intention of doing it plus I always like to keep some meta tells hidden (not that it would have been anyways)

Hence where my lynchpool came from. Not because I was sheeping your damn analysis but because I did it myself and came to the same conclusion.

[Malakittens]

I had wrote it first, but never explained where my pool came from, but that's where because of how he tends to say well if X is scum then Y is a scum buddy and he always puts a town with a scum partner there

[Mathdino]

...

I didn't ask how my posts led YOU to believe Wisdom was scum.

I asked how my posts would lead ONE to believe Wisdom is scum.

I did not come to the same conclusion as you. Read my posts correctly.
Also, explain your scumread on him if there's anything besides meta that proves your point.

Edit: Is that it?