Open 579: Pick Your (Chocolate) Power -- Game Over

[insanity018]

Votecount 1.14

Siveure DtTrikyp

(5): Alchemist21, Ankamius, davesaz, Venrob, wgeurts

Alchemist21

(2): farside22, Mathdino

Aneninen

(2): Amy Farrah Fowler, Siveure DtTrikyp

Mathdino

(1): droog

wgeurts

(1): Flubbernugget

Not Voting

(3): Aneninen, TheAdrienC, Formerfish

With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch.

Deadline

: (expired on 2014-12-07 08:00:00)

Aneninen is LA
Venrob is V/LA until December 8

[Mathdino]

I didn't see the questions at all, lol. Assumed they were directed at Flubber. Whoops.

I'll swing by Day 2 to see what's going on with Flubbernugget but something just caught my eye that I think needs to be addressed right now. We had a weak wagon get started on Alchemist once the Siv wagon stalled. Ane did a nice breakdown showing us that Mathdino was on all three of the major wagons before hand. Now he's part of the second biggest wagon on right now. I'm just getting a vibe that he's trying to mislynch whoever he can.

I'll give him one post to answer these questions in a manner that makes me feel better about him before officially moving my vote onto him. Because I'm fair and stuff.

1) What was your reasoning for voting for then removing your votes on all three of them?

2) Who were your top two or three scumreads during the time of each wagon, including the wagoned player?

3) Who are you scumreading right now (including your voted read, Alchemist)? You sidestepped when you were asked before. You mentioned scenarios making people go either way before, I'll accept an explanation of that if it still applies.

1. Amy I believe I gave sufficient reasons for voting for. Her wagon developed too quickly in quick succession. wgeurts was a meta tell and I wanted to see where voting him would take me. Took me to L-2, jumped off to regroup and look at the wagon behaviour. By 3rd, do you mean Flubber? Siveure? Flubber I voted for RVS weirdness, jumped off to vote Amy. Siveure I'm off because I think Alchemist is a better idea and I realised I was only sticking to Siveure's wagon because he prematurely claimed VT and thus isn't really a loss if he gets lynched. Alchemist is higher risk. But more reward, since Siv's been acting pretty townish since the wagon developed.

2. Uh, don't know? I can retroactively guess.
Amy: Probably Amy and Flubber.
wgeurts: Amy, Flubber, wgeurts.
Siveure: I don't even remember, this was when I started getting into groupy mode.
Read my ISO if you want to know. I'm too lazy to do so now.

3. Scumteam if Siveure's scum is probably him (which rules out dave and Alchemist and sorta Aneninen and sorta Flubber, yay), and probably people in {Venrob, Ankamius, Amy, Adrien, the Romitelli slot}. Dunno, don't have flip. I could go into more detail of that hypothetical if you want. If Siv's town, which I'm coming around to, Alchemist and Aneninen rocket to the top of my scumreads, not sure on whether they're scum together, will have to check that. Otherwise, would look at {Flubber, Amy, Ankamius}.
I don't like the top scumreads question when I've already shown you I have a slightly more nuanced view of the game. It's fine if someone's inactive or isn't giving any reads but honestly, again, read my posts.

[droog]

wisdom?

[wgeurts]

wisdom?

A player that would spam pages with catch-ups in open 574

[Mathdino]

Wisdom is online constantly and posts a LOT. He's the only one that consistently got a higher post count than me in the last game I played with wgeurts. He even filled 2 pages with like 40 posts.

He ended up being scum.

Edit: 575.

[TheAdrienC]

1. Amy I believe I gave sufficient reasons for voting for. Her wagon developed too quickly in quick succession. wgeurts was a meta tell and I wanted to see where voting him would take me. Took me to L-2, jumped off to regroup and look at the wagon behaviour. By 3rd, do you mean Flubber? Siveure? Flubber I voted for RVS weirdness, jumped off to vote Amy. Siveure I'm off because I think Alchemist is a better idea and I realised I was only sticking to Siveure's wagon because he prematurely claimed VT and thus isn't really a loss if he gets lynched. Alchemist is higher risk. But more reward, since Siv's been acting pretty townish since the wagon developed.

2. Uh, don't know? I can retroactively guess.
Amy: Probably Amy and Flubber.
wgeurts: Amy, Flubber, wgeurts.
Siveure: I don't even remember, this was when I started getting into groupy mode.
Read my ISO if you want to know. I'm too lazy to do so now.

3. Scumteam if Siveure's scum is probably him (which rules out dave and Alchemist and sorta Aneninen and sorta Flubber, yay), and probably people in {Venrob, Ankamius, Amy, Adrien, the Romitelli slot}. Dunno, don't have flip. I could go into more detail of that hypothetical if you want. If Siv's town, which I'm coming around to, Alchemist and Aneninen rocket to the top of my scumreads, not sure on whether they're scum together, will have to check that. Otherwise, would look at {Flubber, Amy, Ankamius}.
I don't like the top scumreads question when I've already shown you I have a slightly more nuanced view of the game. It's fine if someone's inactive or isn't giving any reads but honestly, again, read my posts.

Mostly responding to number 3: I think I got the gist of your scenario and understand what your point of view. What I'm wondering is you have this all planned out for Siv's flip, but you might not know what his flip will be now that the wagon on him is starting to disappear. What lynch do you think you can learn from other than his if we aren't lynching him? Because if I'm understanding how you're playing this game based on your last post, you are wanting to lynch you can connect the dots with. You're no longer voting the person you laid out your scenarios for so what now?

[TheAdrienC]

I mean, I know you're voting Alchemist, but what are you expecting from his flip in either direction?

[wgeurts]

UNVOTE: Siv
Doesn't seem so scummy to me anymore, I'm going to meta his more recent games.

[droog]

That's a lot of posts Droog, please don't go and do a Wisdom.

so yo'ure tarring me with someone who was scum because i posted a lot
ok

[Mathdino]

Mostly responding to number 3: I think I got the gist of your scenario and understand what your point of view. What I'm wondering is you have this all planned out for Siv's flip, but you might not know what his flip will be now that the wagon on him is starting to disappear. What lynch do you think you can learn from other than his if we aren't lynching him? Because if I'm understanding how you're playing this game based on your last post, you are wanting to lynch you can connect the dots with. You're no longer voting the person you laid out your scenarios for so what now?

Good question, something that I needed to be asked I think.

Right now, I'm going with the "Siv is town" scenario and looking at Alchemist and Aneninen. Of them, I'm currently going with Alchemist, but I could settle for an Anen lynch just fine.

I haven't really planned out for those flips, because I don't have many interactions with Alchemist to look at. The main reason I had such a fleshed out scenario for Siveure's lynch is because pretty much everyone ended up talking about it. Alch, not so much. Will get back to you on that.

Siveure was at first a lynch for low content/wagonhopping/sheeping, then became a sunk cost lynch (didn't feel like lynching a PR) along with an info lynch, and now I'm going for a scum lynch. Higher risk, higher reward.

[TheAdrienC]

I look forward to when you do get back to me on that. Though with you saying you were unsure of them being scum together. If Alchemist flips scum, where is Anen then and also if he flips town?

[Mathdino]

No ideer. I have an inkling of a mental note that said they may not be scum together, but that may just be sleep deprivation doubt. I don't have the time to go through any ISOs tonight since I'm going to bed after I do some stuff, but I can do that tomorrow.

[Formerfish]

Through page 10 now, dumping this here so I don't have a huge fucking wall for you guys to work through.

The first thing that struck me as kind of odd was that droog rvs votes someone, and then pedits to vote aneninen, most likely to build a wagon on top of the previous vote. Nothing strange in that right? Wrong, later on page 1 droog questions Romitelli about not liking rvs, stating that he had not participated. Still nothing odd, right? Well how about droog pedit to vote a wagon on aneninen was building on Romitellis rvs vote. The words and actions aren’t adding up here. You mention catching people in lies later on, what do you usually do with liars? I do however, agree with your Math read though, fake as fuck. Telling a guy to notify a mod about a trust tell is horrible.

Hayate giving someone shit about putting an rvs vote down on page 2 without looking is laughable. Their reasoning, rvs might be over. It is page 2. And I’ve come in and rvsed after it was over when I was making my first post in game. Then my eyes glazed over with the debate of to vig or not to vig between this guy and Math. I’d rather have my starfish waxed again before trying to read those posts.

Alchemist21- are you an alt or a newbie? Why the move to wgeurts in #62? Ok, you claim that you want him to respond to your vote, why would he respond to one naked vote on him?

@Mathdino

why does this explanation satisfy you?

Math why are you so interested in peoples reads on page 3? In post #116 you attack someones line of questioning, saying it sucks. Isn’t this along the same lines as what you were scumreading and voting Amy for?

So I don't really have a good history, everyone always reads me as scum.

Did I miss someone asking for your scum history or are you just throwing this out here?
Because if this is out of the blue then saying 'I'm always scumread' is sure a great way to get people off your back for a while.

Venrob, isn’t this how you got killed in FTL? What were you in that game again?

Aneinen- the only two posts I remember of yours are the 2 “catch up” posts where you just give us a rundown of what happened since you last posted with a little bit of analysis at the end. Are you familiar with the term IIoA? You disagree with a read, do go on! Jesus I hate all of your posts, just read 118 and I wanted to gouge my eyes out.

Wgeurts- A lot of your posts seem to be just pointing out buzz words that would apply to people, selfmeta, omgus, opportunistic. What is the point you are trying to make by singling these out?

[Formerfish]

I'll finish tomorrow.

[Alchemist21]

@Formerfish, Still noobie. I expected wgeurts to respond to the vote because it was a naked vote. People just respond to naked votes in general. Having early reads on Mathdino amd Droog already, I wanted a read there so I would have early reads on all three of the people I had just played 574 with. I didn't think he would jump into the setup conversation that was going on at the time, so I voted him to give him something to talk about.

[Flubbernugget]

Also, Anen's latest post looks really confbiasy. So what if she's not scumhunting?

Actually, I didn't notice this first time around. Hm.

Alchemist, do you believe scum would make a statement as obvious as "It's cool if y'all don't look for us"? This seems like a sentence scum would correct immediately with a simple reread of the post.

I don't know. It's not something I want to just completely dismiss because it seems to obvious. If we give him a pass for it, then even if he's town it gives the scum a pass for it too. This is something we need to push.

ISO'd Alchemist and saw this. Looks like scum disguising a policy vote.

[Amy Farrah Fowler]

V/LA until probably the 5th of December, possibly until the 7th

/phonepost

Noted. ~insanity

[wgeurts]

I dropped meh iPod, my only good keyboard while my PC is kaput, my posts will probably be shorter and contain more typos due to android sucking.

[Alchemist21]

Also, Anen's latest post looks really confbiasy. So what if she's not scumhunting?

Actually, I didn't notice this first time around. Hm.

Alchemist, do you believe scum would make a statement as obvious as "It's cool if y'all don't look for us"? This seems like a sentence scum would correct immediately with a simple reread of the post.

I don't know. It's not something I want to just completely dismiss because it seems to obvious. If we give him a pass for it, then even if he's town it gives the scum a pass for it too. This is something we need to push.

ISO'd Alchemist and saw this. Looks like scum disguising a policy vote.

Why would anyone try to disguise a policy vote? Policy votes aren't even considered scummy.

[Mathdino]

The first thing that struck me as kind of odd was that droog rvs votes someone, and then pedits to vote aneninen, most likely to build a wagon on top of the previous vote. Nothing strange in that right? Wrong, later on page 1 droog questions Romitelli about not liking rvs, stating that he had not participated. Still nothing odd, right? Well how about droog pedit to vote a wagon on aneninen was building on Romitellis rvs vote. The words and actions aren’t adding up here. You mention catching people in lies later on, what do you usually do with liars? I do however, agree with your Math read though, fake as fuck. Telling a guy to notify a mod about a trust tell is horrible.

Hayate giving someone shit about putting an rvs vote down on page 2 without looking is laughable. Their reasoning, rvs might be over. It is page 2. And I’ve come in and rvsed after it was over when I was making my first post in game. Then my eyes glazed over with the debate of to vig or not to vig between this guy and Math. I’d rather have my starfish waxed again before trying to read those posts.

Alchemist21- are you an alt or a newbie? Why the move to wgeurts in #62? Ok, you claim that you want him to respond to your vote, why would he respond to one naked vote on him?

@Mathdino

why does this explanation satisfy you?

Math why are you so interested in peoples reads on page 3? In post #116 you attack someones line of questioning, saying it sucks. Isn’t this along the same lines as what you were scumreading and voting Amy for?

Aneinen- the only two posts I remember of yours are the 2 “catch up” posts where you just give us a rundown of what happened since you last posted with a little bit of analysis at the end. Are you familiar with the term IIoA? You disagree with a read, do go on! Jesus I hate all of your posts, just read 118 and I wanted to gouge my eyes out.

Trust tell: I didn't tell him to just notify the mod, I told him to actually confirm the 'trust tell' and then report it if it turns out to be something. As it is, that entire discussion was useless.

On droog: While what you're pointing out may be worthy of mockery, I'm not seeing it as alignment indicative if the lie isn't actually useful. Probably just a result of personal confusion or bad memory.

On Alchemist: I don't recall that satisfying me, so I'm not sure what you're asking. I said I didn't like it and tabled it when I moved to Siveure and realised they're prob not scum together.

On Hayate: Good point, I didn't take much note of that at first since I was more focused on setup spec at the time. Will take into account when reading Ankamius.

On reads, myself, and Amy: Not really sure what you're asking here either? My default question for someone who's doing nothing or being useless is "Any reads?", and I don't believe it's ever too early to get very basic reads. On Amy, I think you're misreading my ISO, don't recall scumreading her for asking questions. I scumread her for multiple fishy statements that I can go dig up again if you'd like.

On Aneninen: Meh, I don't really have a problem with his playstyle.

[Flubbernugget]

Also, Anen's latest post looks really confbiasy. So what if she's not scumhunting?

Actually, I didn't notice this first time around. Hm.

Alchemist, do you believe scum would make a statement as obvious as "It's cool if y'all don't look for us"? This seems like a sentence scum would correct immediately with a simple reread of the post.

I don't know. It's not something I want to just completely dismiss because it seems to obvious. If we give him a pass for it, then even if he's town it gives the scum a pass for it too. This is something we need to push.

ISO'd Alchemist and saw this. Looks like scum disguising a policy vote.

Why would anyone try to disguise a policy vote? Policy votes aren't even considered scummy.

I must have missed the memo.

[Mathdino]

No ideer. I have an inkling of a mental note that said they may not be scum together, but that may just be sleep deprivation doubt. I don't have the time to go through any ISOs tonight since I'm going to bed after I do some stuff, but I can do that tomorrow.

Mental note to do this after taking care of some other games.

[Flubbernugget]

UNVOTE:

I know it's pre flip associatives but it's bothering me.

[Mathdino]

What? Not understanding the above post. You're unvoting wgeurts for associatives??

[Aneninen]

Small catching up, don't expect too much after 12 hours of work.
Some player says that I'm performing IIoA. Where exactly?

Druuge. I appreciate that you're spending that much time with scumhunting and I like it anyway. However, here are a few answers for you. In 559 you were talking about my 83. Do you really think that I should have provided firm reads in such an early post? The same goes for your next post, which is also about an early post from me.
Also, you should think about this: there

was

a reason for sheeping my Amy-case. At that point you thought that it was okay and you find it terrible now. What changed and why?
As for your 573, I still don't understand the logic behind that readlist. Even if my read on Amy changed later I still find that strange, even if it's not essentially scummy.
579 – okay, what sort of conclusion can you draw out of all those wagon movements? You told me that you didn't agree, that'swhy I ask.
586 – there were other things there about you. However, my reads are changing, right now you're in the "I don't know what to think" cathegory.
587 – you interpreted my unsorted and unsorted–lean scum reads as scumreads. If you're doing this, sure there are too many scumreads there. Also, you skipped the very last part of my post: "

I'm still short on time. (This latest bit can also mean that I'm a subject of misreading and missing things right now. Too much work, that's what I have.)

"
TL;DR: you're searching for the scum at the wrong slot. I'm not one of them.

Siveure. The post where you voted for me contains nothing about me. So, in practice, it's a naked vote.

MathDino. I still don't understand clearly the logic behind the scumlists regarding of Siveure's flip.

Formerfish. Hi there! You needn't like my posting style. Especially since during your catch-up you'll find that it gets worse later. ^_^

That's all for now, folks! Maybe I'll have some time next evening too.