Micro 447: Shameless Mafia -- Game Over!

[Aneninen]

I've already told that I'm Lip.

(I haven't read the recent posts; I've just only spotted this above.)

[insanity018]

Votecount 2.2

Aneninen

(1): Toon Fighter

droog

(1): Alchemist21

Toon Fighter

(1): shos

Not Voting

(5): TierShift, Aneninen, droog, ArcAngel9, This Christmas

With 8 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.

Deadline

: (expired on 2015-03-23 22:00:00)

[droog]

Reading back, I don't like Droog's and Christmas's votes on TS. They came out of nowhere at the end of day. At least one of them is scum, maybe both.

VOTE: Droog

why me over christmas

[Alchemist21]

Why not?

[shos]

VOTE: AA9.

I'll give you a list of some vital characters.

Deb
Carl
Ian
Lip
Fyona
Frank
Sammy
Liam
Vivian
Kevin
Mickey
Mandy
Karen
Karen's mom
their sex adddict boyfriend
Steve/Jimmy
Gus


who is scum?

[droog]

Why not?

fair enough man

[droog]

@AA9: Why did you ask for estival to nameclaim? What was your purpose there?

Didn't already said why i wanted the names out? Anywayz, I want all the names out so that we can sort the characters accordingly... EX: You are Carl, Carl is a good role and part of Gallagher family, I want to list out vital characters from the show so that our chances of catching scum may improve. Example, If someone claims as Debbie Gallagher, I think the chances of them being town more than Mickey being town, I am more than postive that mod have used Frank, Lip, Fiona, & few other characters who have chances to be town. And estival turned out be Ian... Before this game gets any worse than this.. Can I now have Characters from everyone...

Anennine - You go first Please!!!

first
reads please
i get your looking to join in now
but reads matter more

[droog]

[insert vague insanity could switch flavor
kind of bullshitty arguments here]

[droog]

read some of the pages i never read yet

Ok after really reading the game for the first time I have some remarks to do, topped off with a nice vote. Here it goes:

That was one of the most blatant crumbs I've ever seen, lol.
I hear anen's scumgame is good, though.

From here, and contrary to everyone else's opinion, my initial reaction was that TS and anen might be scum together. Anen's complete, and dare I say, undeserved, reaction to the sentence only makes me more certain of the theory. Alchemist seems like the townie trapped in the discussion. In 20, anen is the first one to bring dodgy into the fold, as he thinks he is obviously connected to TS's opinion on his scumgame. I don't like the exchange on anen's part, and it feels like he is grasping at straws. Initially I thought TS was his scum partner, but after reading the following posts I became more convinced of anen's scumminess but less convinced of TS's. Another post in particular captured my interest:

I know your scumgame is good because I saw it nominated for a scummy. I (closely) follow the nominations, as is evidenced by my egopost in that specific thread. That is the reason I knew it; it would be nonsensical to talk with a scumbuddy about every townie's scum meta.

My problem is that I simply can't ignore your 12, and I don't think I'll ever be able to drop the idea that it was a slip. So I examine all of your posts assuming that you're scum.
For example this one. Yes, we were nominated, I was in an excellent team (Wicked and Heartless). It

is

possible that you saw that but if so, you would have mentioned it

right after

my post about your slip.

So, everyone: here's my idea.
I can't imagine anyone as scum but Tiershift and Dodgy. Because of this, I don't think I can do anything useful Today.
So, let's lynch Tiershift. (Eg. Alchemist thinks that my read about the slip is wrong but Tieshift is scum because of his other posts.)

If he flips town, it's clear that my reads were wrong (and I'm really sorry, of course).

But

in this case you may think that I'm scum who has set up a clever mislynch and it would be risky with an unconfirmed-me in the town. (I'm town but I can't proove it.) So, fire away any kind of investigation you have on me at Night1. (Yes, I might have some kind of immunity, eg. Ninja, but because I have no idea about the Setup I can't have immunity against everything. Jailkeeper doesn't work, it would proove nothing, I suppose. Even a town-Vig shot would be useful, I think.)

If he flips scum, there are two players to be investigated: Dodgy and me. (Why me? Even if Tiershift flips scum, I could be his buddy, who tries to get away with a shrewd Day1-bussing.) Hopefully, by Day2 either Dodgy or me will be confirmed in either way.

Of course, regardless of the flip DO NOT CLAIM any PR prematurely; only if you have a sure read on anyone.

Discuss!

I'm adding this prematurely: Tiershift, if you're scum (especially if you're scum with Dodgy) but my read is wrong and there was no slip at all, I'm really, really sorry for spoiling your game. I don't think it's fair to catch a scum merely by sheer luck instead of good scumhunting.

In the post above, anen tries to dictate town's day and night behaviour for the first two game days, at least, by page three. I don't know if all this paranoia and seeming town leading are frequent in him, but it rubs me the wrong way. Even if you are correct in your theory, even if you had a 100% guilty read on those players, you'd need much stronger arguments to convince me to vote with you, to block and/or investigate you at night, and to basically follow you everywhere. It's just not happening with 2 and a half pages of content, when one of them is pretty much RVS. So, I want some more explanations for these prompts, as they just make me suspect Anen himself. Anen, do you still believe town should follow everything you suggested here? Has your opinion changed in any point?

ToonFighter, I've only seen one episode but mass claiming is probably not the best idea. Why did you suggest it?

The conversation between TierShift, Alchemist, dodgy56, and Aienen seems based on some meta reads?

I can see why scum would talk about another players scum meta if they were to set them up for a lynch but it seems a bit reaching?

I suggested it on the off-chance the game was poorly designed (sorry insanity, but had to check) and that scum had poor fakeclaims/ the game could be broken. If the game is well-designed, mass claiming shouldn't be a problem, if not, it could provide an advantage to town.

As for familiarity with shameless, it ties with the mass claim/ scum's fake claims. Players who haven't watched the show would have a more difficult time coming up with a convincing claim than someone who has watched everything.

In the last three pages, I saw little of note. So, I'll finish this post with my vote:

VOTE: Aneninen

case doent work

1) tf doesnt like anen suspecting tiershift
thinks it means theyre obth scum
to me this sounds like the same mistake
anen made in the first place

2) >anen tries to dictate towns behavior
> "heres my idea"
> "discuss!"
]
3) ttf tried something similar
by proposing a massclaim
and then ahs to defend it in the same post

so otoh
"anen is dictating play"
otoh
"its ok when i do it"

[Toon Fighter]

unvote, vote: AA9

That explanation doen's convince me (after shos almost lynching me for a similar reasoning). Also, you didn't vote last day and continue not voting and not giving relevant reads today. Hope this post will *motivate* you to contribute more

[insanity018]

This Christmas has been prodded.

[ArcAngel9]

unvote, vote: AA9

That explanation doen's convince me (after shos almost lynching me for a similar reasoning). Also, you didn't vote last day and continue not voting and not giving relevant reads today. Hope this post will *motivate* you to contribute more

this is a horrible reason to vote someone. I mean for real...
I didn't vote becuz after your claim as Carl, I backed off and when i returned day 1 was ended. What do you want me to contribute more? I still Aneniem is scum and i have been babbling about it since yesterday while nobody cares!!

[Toon Fighter]

vote then

[ArcAngel9]

I ll vote when I am ready for this day phase.
Ann is lip
Toon is carl
shos is mickey
estival is Ian (dead)

Droob, Alchi, this christmas and Tier shift, Your character roles please.

[ArcAngel9]

droog* I meant

[TierShift]

This game is probably not breakable by flavour, but oh well. Let's do this so arcangel can go on after this.

I'm debbie gallagher.

I'll dive into the flavour when I do ISO's so I can see if something is up. Iso's coming today/tomorrow-ish.

[ArcAngel9]

Ann is lip
Toon is carl
shos is mickey (Not Gallagher)
estival is Ian (dead)
Tier is debbie

[This Christmas]

Roles? I claimed character already

[ArcAngel9]

What is your character?

[shos]

STOP FUCKONG CLAIMING YOUR CHARACTER OH FOR FUCJS SAKEEEE


why would you join a Shameless mafia if you dont know shameless

TGERE ARE NOT ENOUGH GALLAGARS TO FILL A TOWN

AND THERE ARE PLENTY NON-GALLAGHARS WHO ARE PRO-GALLAGHARS


YOU ARE ONLU HELPING SCUM ISOLATE PRS

[TierShift]

The only thing worse than flavour claims is discussion about flavourclaims

[shos]

VOTE: AA9.

I'll give you a list of some vital characters.

Deb
Carl
Ian
Lip
Fyona
Frank
Sammy
Liam
Vivian
Kevin
Mickey
Mandy
Karen
Karen's mom
their sex adddict boyfriend
Steve/Jimmy
Gus


who is scum?

AA9, answer me.

[shos]

I think that at least some of the gallaghars are scum fakeclaims that do not exist in the setup. I'm also pretty damn sure AA9 is scum.

[TierShift]

I'm also pretty damn sure AA9 is scum.

because why

[TierShift]

The line of reasoning that some of the gallaghers are scum fakeclaims because they are all obviously town is as dumb as the original line of reasoning that all the gallaghers are town.

Anyway, the fact that you say that there is information to be had from flavourclaiming as some gallaghers HAVE to be scum (I don't agree) contradicts your statement that flavourclaiming is useless and only helps scum. Care to explain?