New York 180 (Endgame)

[ika]

dragonspawn: SilverWolf, Aeronaut
Cheetory6: dragonspawn
Shinobi: Cheetory6
TSO: marquis

[Aeronaut]

Um.....

Ika

[SilverWolf]

You're one of the people who knows dragon from that other site, right? Is this indicative of his regular town game? Or does it seem different?

Well, the not well explained votes is kind of what he does and is a playstyle thing for him I think.

The comments regarding boasting scum, town sure is failing, and I leave for a day and you rush a lynch-all that stuff is odd.

The beginning of his ISO looks fine and typical dragon but the stuff in the middle and up until the last two days is really not all that great, however even though I hated him outing the neighbourhood and how he did it, his play today seems a lot better.

I am going to dig deeper into his ISO and meta to see if I can figure this out when I have more time.

@ika-That's pretty cool!!

[Aeronaut]

Oh lol that looked so confusing on mobile.

[T S O]

I'm sorry, Shinobi, we're not having another day where we hem and we haw and Marquis is "indecisive", tells us he's paranoid of me, and we lynch dragonspawn in a deadline panic.

that was not a fucking deadline panic

there was a week left and everyone was just sick of everything

and you even liked my fa_q2 case, brought up points to back it up, and advocated his lynch for the whole rest of the day

You're right - however, what I described was exactly how this day would have panned out if not for my intervention. You would have done nothing useful except fake paranoia.

You're also right on FA_Q2 - I did like that wagon. By the way, you never explained to me how us both supporting the wagon made me nullscum and you town. I'd love to hear it. Except I don't think I ever will, because you've flat out refused to explain any of your read progresses this game. <---

This is a huge fucking scumtell, I don't know why people don't see that.

i don't care what you have to say about me knowing or not knowing your scum game, because i already know i'm not 100% on that

So why did you say it, then?

the real issue i have is you having multiple experiences with both my town and scum games, and then somehow having the audacity to say my towngame isn't opaque and by definition open and easy to see- and that's a totally bullshit misrepresentation.

See, this is why you're scum. Let me lay out what was said:

TSO: Marquis's game here has been completely and utterly opaque - his towngame is not usually like this.
Marquis: Hey, he's saying my towngame isn't opaque! THAT MUST MEAN HE'S SAYING IT'S COMPLETELY OPEN! SCUM!

It's these random fucking moments of bullshit you keep pulling.

i don't even care how it looks that i'm arguing my town game sucks, but you should know this and know how easy it was for me to act natural and get you to townread me when i was scum.

You knew that, after beating me in Rick Santorum, if you came in here and tried the same shit I'd probably nail your ass to the wall. So you tried to vary your scumgame. Maybe insert a little paranoia. I know what you were thinking.

so right now, especially after letting me slide yesterday then only coming at me now when i've started to express a stronger scumread on you, i want you dead.

Ahahaha this is bullshit and lies. I'm taking a separate post to address this because it's such a blatant falsehood.

it looks like i'm going to flip first.

Damn fucking straight it does - big bright red letters in the OP.

[T S O]

Wait, hold up, I'm not voting Marquis? I was sure I was.

VOTE: Marquis

[Aeronaut]

VOTE: TSO

Let's see where this takes us.

[SilverWolf]

Why TSO now Aero when you were so set on dragon?

[Cheetory6]

V/LA.
I need to pass classes.
Will try to get a post in a day.

[goodmorning]

Won't lynch: Cheetory6, Aeronaut
Could lynch: Marquis, dragonspawn, SilverWolf
Would lynch: Shinobi, Ozgin, Kitz
Should lynch: T S O, elusive

This is kind of where my head is at right now.

[Aeronaut]

I'm not a big fan of TSO's push on Marquis today. I'm also wondering about his over-agressiveness this day phase.

I'm by no means finished with Dragon.

[Aeronaut]

That was @SW

[Aeronaut]

Goodmorning, why Elusive?

[SilverWolf]

Won't lynch: Cheetory6, Aeronaut
Could lynch: Marquis, dragonspawn, SilverWolf
Would lynch: Shinobi, Ozgin, Kitz
Should lynch: T S O, elusive

This is kind of where my head is at right now.

Why do you think elusive is scum?

[goodmorning]

My biggest problem with elusive is her fade-out. She's become less active and less of a pusher, and seems to be trying more to blend in. Actual content in her posts has been decreasing since before her lack of posting and subsequent V/LA.

I get that she's on V/LA right now. That's not really the activity I'm talking about.

[SilverWolf]

I'm feeling especially paranoid right now and I need to re-think things and step back.

UNVOTE:

[SilverWolf]

RL is a super fucking bitch right now so I'll be stepping away from the game today.

[Shinobi]

Won't lynch: Cheetory6, Aeronaut
Could lynch: Marquis, dragonspawn, SilverWolf
Would lynch: Shinobi, Ozgin, Kitz
Should lynch: T S O, elusive

This is kind of where my head is at right now.

Explain how you came to your conclusions plx?

[Shinobi]

That's like 8 people in your lynch pile, and your entire "would lynch" is a bunch of people fighting amongst themselves.

[T S O]

I'm not a big fan of TSO's push on Marquis today. I'm also wondering about his over-agressiveness this day phase.

And yet you're clearly a fan of Marquis's push on me.

[T S O]

so right now, especially after letting me slide yesterday then only coming at me now when i've started to express a stronger scumread on you

Okay, so this is a straight up-lie.

Spoiler: Yesterday

VOTE: tso

didn't finish reading but i like this right now. a lot.

Votes for me for no reason, never given either.

VOTE: tso

didn't finish reading but i like this right now. a lot.

Okay, you've made your mind, go justify it now. Off with you.

I ask for justification.

"oh fa is scum"
"wait no"
"oh tso is scum"
"wait no"
"oh fa is scum again"

What are you doing, Marquis?

I'm not aggressive.

I don't like Marquis' read progression at all - I don't have a particular issue with him jumping around, I often do the same, but his thought process is completely opaque and has been in everything he's done so far.

Still not aggressive.

I like the names on the FA wagon a lot more than those on the Marquis wagon.

FA_Q2 -is- being lynched today, and there's towncred available - the only question is whether scum have the guts to bus him or not.

I back the FA wagon over the Marquis wagon.

So, yesterday, you can see Marquis openly supported my wagon and I did not do what Marquis's apparently saying I always do by attack people who attack me as scum. Point disproven.

Spoiler: Today

VOTE: dragonspawn

goodmorning goes up into town, unrelated to dragon's things.

tso is nullscum again. part of me thinking he was town end of yesterday was related to me being hugely overconfident about fa_q2 scum. i feel like a lot of his recent posts now in hindsight go along with that, like he's pushing easy targets that town has already made a case on or driving a lynch on. just... his recent attacks and scumreads seem to be pushing easy target after easy target.

actually i kind of really want to just lynch tso but nobody's probably up for that.

pedit oh my god that response pings as honest town though gahhhhhhh

UNVOTE:

...recalculating............ this is.....

why do i get the feeling that we just have a lot of town outclassed by scum in experience at looking town?? shinobi, tso? i could see those two easily driving a scumteam.

i'm just going to get rid of my do-not-lynch list entirely and go for the easier, less-potential-disaster option between those two. there's an added benefit in that i don't remember any significant reads on or from him or things he's done. scum removing himself from significant interactions? likely

VOTE: shinobi

"TSO is nullscum, Shinobi is more scum!"

yeah 4456-7 and his response to me voting him are super gross

let's go shinobi wagon

Fully backs Shinobi wagon...

"Hey, can you elaborate on your vote?"

lol bs on that, all you did was threaten me with a past game where i got lynched over you, plus i already elaborated in my original vote and i'm not ashamed to admit your posting after my vote is only strengthening my fortitude and confidence here

so don't pretend like you're innocent. the difference here is this game i'm town, and even if i lose this 1v1 i'm totally ready to have, it's not the end of the world now. i'll be on the record as having started a wagon on scum and died for it in the end

...goes on to tell us he doesn't mind dying because Shinobi's scum.

I support Marquis dying, guess I'm scum too?

Fully support a Marquis wagon at this juncture, will probably push it sooner or later.

Can you walk through why exactly? Or point me in the direction of a post you've made which reflects your current feelings on him?

To summarise my thoughts:

Marquis' stance on me, and stances in general, are fluctuating bullshit. His read on FA_Q2 also kept going back and forth yesterday. His justification of this is "Well, you can't expect me to have static reads when I've only just replaced in." This is true. However, his reads on me are not simply "not static." They are ever-changing. There's never any reasoning for them, ever. It's true that this could be from town-Marquis. I told him he had one day yesterday. His stance on me today, summarised, is "he's null-scum because he's been pushing easy targets like faq, who I also pushed on and off yesterday." That was the final straw for me. I cannot reconcile how he could post this, when the thought process required to do so would be something like this:

"I wanted FA dead for being scummy yesterday, and I was wrong! And TSO was the same, so I'm gonna give him a scumread."

I just cannot see town Marquis doing that. Maybe if he was able to detail why his read on me and FA, in particular, went "town-scum-town-scum-tum-scown-town-scum", but I doubt he remembers those. I have no idea why he felt his thought process needed to be opaque this game - opaque thought processes are a bad idea 99% of the time. And he's not usually into super-opaqueness, at least now as town, from what I've seen of him.

I say I want Marquis dead.

UNVOTE:

I've been in a "fuck my reads" mood since the FA_Q2 flip, and up until now I've tried not to care about people scumreading me but now it's "fuck my reads and fuck this game".

I don't know what's up. This game seems to have a heavy split between significantly experienced players and not very experienced at all, and how the flips have gone this game signify to me that the scum is hiding in the experienced pool.

Shinobi right now I'm still not liking at all, but I'm willing to admit that my approach to that was flawed so any response he has to me would naturally incense me in return. I just... I really have no idea anymore. I feel like I'm sabotaging my own reads at the very least. Ignoring again for now.

Then it comes to the main thing I'm used to TSO-scum doing, which is pushing back on people when they start scumreading him and pushing for their lynch, and that's a part of what I see him doing here. Not to mention that post above about my meta sounds like bullshit because he knows when I'm actually scum I'm comfortable as fuck, and when I'm town that's when I have no idea what's going on and I just feel weak and unsure of everything. And I also feel like his sudden attack on me, after mostly letting my insecurity regarding FA_Q2 slide yesterday, is part of him taking advantage of how uncomfortable and unsure I am here, not only about my reads but about how I'm starting to feel about how I'm perceived.

VOTE: TSO

As of this post the only reads I'm sure of are townreads on Silverwolf and goodmorning. I don't even know what I saw as town in dragonspawn earlier but right now that's back to null because I'm afraid I've gotten into the habit of townreading scum for doing stupid things lately.

I'll be back later, I need to take a breath.

And I'm scum, and Shinobi isn't. Magical.

i don't care what you have to say about me knowing or not knowing your scum game, because i already know i'm not 100% on that

the real issue i have is you having multiple experiences with both my town and scum games, and then somehow having the audacity to say my towngame isn't opaque and by definition open and easy to see- and that's a totally bullshit misrepresentation.

i don't even care how it looks that i'm arguing my town game sucks, but you should know this and know how easy it was for me to act natural and get you to townread me when i was scum. so right now, especially after letting me slide yesterday then only coming at me now when i've started to express a stronger scumread on you, i want you dead. given how the rest of this game seems to blindly trust you for some reason, it looks like i'm going to flip first. but i really don't give a damn anymore because this is all bullshit and if it takes my mislynch for you to finally flip too, then, well, that's fucking great.

as you said, we only need one scumflip to finally open this game up. i agree, and i want you lynched.

And then the old classic we saw before with Shinobi: "I don't mind dying because TSO is scum."

I think it's again obvious as fuck he's making up his reads out of thin air to fit whatever agenda he wants to push. It was scum-Shinobi, now it's scum-TSO.

[T S O]

Like, can someone who disagrees with me/agree with Marquis, other than him, explain why we're not razing him into the ground? Because I genuinely don't get it.

[T S O]

Like, scum-Marquis is not a bad player. He's a pretty convincing guy. Here's a game where he got me fucking mislynched just like he's trying to do here. Here's another game where his hydra Doublade was literally townread by everyone, including me, as scum, before getting shot n1. Read those games. Especially the latter one. Then come back to me and tell me you don't think Marquis can play scum.

[T S O]

*getting shot n3 or something, it was me who got shot n1.

[Shinobi]

I don't really think the quotes you've pulled are particularly damning.

Other than the fact that Marquis is fixated on you, I don't see the issue. It seems like what he's saying is legitimate, despite being wrong.