Twin Trap (Game Over) [TM2015]

[Quilford]

[serrapaladin]

I guess misrep was a bit exaggerated, but I don't think I was being unclear about my intent toward mina, and I don't like that she attacked the way in which I presented my points rather than respond to the content.

[Mina]

What content do you want me to respond to?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I am back again but not really (sorta kinda?) back and I am sorry!! I have tonsillitis! I can prove it but it would be gross.

I think I will do better with direct interaction.

Here's my gut reads!

town {mina, quil}
maybe town? {serra, bpc?}

null {patrick, bb, mara}
maybe scum? {alchemist}

Most interested in sorting the bolded today, with a preference on the nulls. continuing ISOs now as well. anyone wanna chat while i'm here?

hmm also i should note quil read not as strong as mina read. definitely leaning on her a bit here. serra read is mine - several games and hydraing with him gives me a good base there. actually was considering switching quil with serra. bpc read is my team's. sthar also thinks quil could be scum.

oh oh and patrick's read on me is so soft and nervous and i dont like it. he is on his way moving downward. mara is based almost entirely on what i read in the first few pages, and that is probably the weakest in the list thus far. bb is bb and i still don't like alchemist ISO at all but i'm getting paranoid about it.

[Alchemist21]

Sorry about your tonsilitis, ETL!

I'm here, so you can talk with me.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

actually.

VOTE: patrick

[Patrick]

quite zzz

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Sorry about your tonsilitis, ETL!

I'm here, so you can talk with me.

hello.

can you explain what you were saying about why you jumped to my side when quil was questioning me? i mean, i can understand asking questions to figure out what someone is thinking, but there are several ways to go about that and you did it in a way that really made it look like you were trying to get me on your side, and the fact that we have no games together makes me think there is some other reason.

that other reason being the same reason i catch titus time and time again - if your scum partner DOES have experience with me and told you not to push me because they know that doing so would make me focus on you.

this is why it really sticks out to me because there was no reason for you to do that - we have no games together, no prior meta. so where did that even come from? at the beginning of the game there are no connections, no reads, and yet for some reason you felt the need to step in between me and quil and his questioning of me.

can anyone understand what i'm trying to say here?

[Quilford]

ya etl for probs town

[Alchemist21]

Sorry about your tonsilitis, ETL!

I'm here, so you can talk with me.

hello.

can you explain what you were saying about why you jumped to my side when quil was questioning me? i mean, i can understand asking questions to figure out what someone is thinking, but there are several ways to go about that and you did it in a way that really made it look like you were trying to get me on your side, and the fact that we have no games together makes me think there is some other reason.

that other reason being the same reason i catch titus time and time again - if your scum partner DOES have experience with me and told you not to push me because they know that doing so would make me focus on you.

this is why it really sticks out to me because there was no reason for you to do that - we have no games together, no prior meta. so where did that even come from? at the beginning of the game there are no connections, no reads, and yet for some reason you felt the need to step in between me and quil and his questioning of me.

can anyone understand what i'm trying to say here?

It was about trying to understand Quilford's push. When he said your posts looked knee-jerkey, I just didn't see it. Sometimes people see something I don't, but if they point it out to me then I might see it or I still might not.

I think you're misunderstanding here. Titus just said, "ETL can towntell if pushed hard enough." She didn't say not to push you, but I never saw anything to push from you. She wanted me to reach out to you emotionally because you're better at reading people by emotions. If I didn't want you focusing on me at all, I wouldn't be doing this right now.

[Patrick]

oh oh and patrick's read on me is so soft and nervous and i dont like it.

Not nervous, your large catchup post didn't tell me anything about you. Your most recent post at least looks like you're trying to do something.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I'm not talking about Titus or what she told you.

I used her as an example of what I am talking about, which is getting feedback on how to deal with the playerlist, which just isn't necessary as town.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

If I didn't want you focusing on me at all, I wouldn't be doing this right now.

Except I've already said I won't be pursuing you today unless forced to. There is no danger for you to do this, especially when I've asked for people to talk to me.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

oh oh and patrick's read on me is so soft and nervous and i dont like it.

Not nervous, your large catchup post didn't tell me anything about you. Your most recent post at least looks like you're trying to do something.

Blase then. Nonchalant. With kid gloves.

It's not like I'm a complete lurksack. I have a decent amount of opinions in the thread already and was quite involved early on. How is it that BPC, quil, mina and others have been able to form a conclusion but you go "ehhhhhh town i guess cuz my team says blahblah"

are you not playing this game? are you not interested in sorting me? one way or the other, i would think you'd want to be.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I get really skeevy about people who seem to be afraid of passing a read on me. Like I said early on, I'm inclined to think anyone brave enough to attack me outright probably isn't scum.

And you, Patrick, seem super hands-off on actually getting into this with me, and I want to know why.

[Alchemist21]

I'm not talking about Titus or what she told you.

I used her as an example of what I am talking about, which is getting feedback on how to deal with the playerlist, which just isn't necessary as town.

I think she thought if I reached out emotionally you would be able to read me more accurately. It's not about dealing with the player list but being able to understand a player and vice versa.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

You and I are talking about two different things, Alchemist.

[Alchemist21]

Then I'm not sure what you're talking about here.

[Alchemist21]

Also, Titus wants me to post a message here. It's not a direct copy/paste but these are all her points.

MESSAGE FROM TITUS:

Spoiler:

She still thinks the scum in this game are Quil and Molla.

She thinks most people are tuning me out because that usually happens to non-group thinkers on D1.

She says Quil only provided content in response to tearing down my reasoning. She says it's not good content but general feel-good buddying.

She wants you to look at BBMolla's ISO and his tunneling on me and compare it to the last game Titus played with ETL. She says scum did the same thing in that game but had the ability to move discussion elsewhere. She also feels like BBmolla is just repeating "Alch is scum" without much real content.

Lastly, she says a wagon that forms and sticks like mine with no counterwagon is a sure sign that it's on Town.

[Quilford]

It could also be the sure sign of a hopeless scum player with only one partner who can't afford to fail to start a counterwagon

[Patrick]

I get really skeevy about people who seem to be afraid of passing a read on me. Like I said early on, I'm inclined to think anyone brave enough to attack me outright probably isn't scum.

I think that seems pretty self-centred as a policy, but it's possible you've found it to be true over a good number of games. I'm not especially afraid of passing a read on you, but I'm more interested in a bunch of others than I am you (Alchemist, serra, Mina for starters). When looking at 8 others, none of which I've played a game of forum mafia with before, I'm unlikely to come up with very definitive reads on every single one, and I'm going to put time into metagaming any of those before you, most likely. I don't think that's a very unusual approach, most reads lists seem to have some "meh idk" type gaps, especially on day 1.

I think your last few posts look like you're trying to discern some alignments, in a way that didn't really show in your catchup.

[Quilford]

Hey Alchemist. Can you or any of your team buddies provide some actual close analysis? You're all very good at making sweeping generalisations about what a player is saying or doing, but you constantly fail to provide any evidence in the form of a player's words and actions in specific posts.

[Patrick]

Lastly, she says a wagon that forms and sticks like mine with no counterwagon is a sure sign that it's on Town.

If you're scum, I think its entirely possible your partner feels compelled to push against you.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

it is self-centered, but only in that i am aware of how i operate, and its quite transparent. my focus shifts where it's been shifted onto me because i can only deal with so much at one time. in my experience, and i think BB or serra would be able to corroborate it, mafia who leave me alone more easily fly under the radar because i cant see them without more effort on my part. it is a failing of mine that i know about. its not that easily overcome.

[Patrick]

alch, what do you think of serrapaladin this game?