Newbie 1592: The Masquerade -- Game Over!

[Stabulous]

Predict that Pistachio will vote/unvote me three more times before the day's up.

[Stabulous]

VOTE: Pistachio

[pistachi0n]

You're deliberately being vague, and it's obvious. "People made arguments that decreased my suspicion?" Really? Why don't you commit to something, Pistachio? You can't even commit to pressuring your scumread because you unvote me every time I ask politely.

My suspicion was decreased when Ilhom pointed out to me in 261 that you didn't hammer because you were already on the wagon. My argument against you was basically "If Stab wanted a hammer, why didn't he do it himself?" That is a prime example of me being bad at mafia.

[pistachi0n]

Predict that Pistachio will vote/unvote me three more times before the day's up.

Are you trying to egg me on? The message I'm getting is "keep voting for me, I dare you." Okay, I will.

[Ilhom]

Will post in an hour or two. Also I'm not sure if it matters, but do you need to properly spell the person's name for a vote? So pistachi0n instead of Pistachio.

[juckter]

Sorry for the inactivity. Will post more details later. For now:

After reading Stab's defense, I think it holds up, liking him again. I townread Nero and Xay earlier, and that hasn't changed. I'm town, so that leaves scum in pistachi0n/Ilhom/Futan. Seeing as I want more information:

VOTE: Futan

[Ilhom]

I don't believe you can't tell the difference between lynching a habitual lurker who has given every intention of never posting anything useful without waiting for a post and lynching someone who has promised content and has delivered on promises in the past without waiting for a post.

I can but that doesn't change the fact that a claim was possible. It could have resulted in an easy PR kill whilst mafia could make a shot at another if one existed. In no way is it a towny move to not allow a possible claim.

If he claimed JK/Cop with no CC he would be conf-town, but I've seen too many games where scum gets lucky with an early Doc/BP claim (they have a better chance at guessing because they have setup knowledge) and is regarded as conf-town for the whole game.
Let me repeat that: Scum has set-up knowledge and can find very good odds to make a claim that can't be CC'd. That's part of the design of Matrix6. Calling someone conf-town because their doc or BP claim was uncontested is, well, lying about basic gameknowledge.

You also need to learn to distinguish between "bad at mafia" and "scummy". You can accuse me of being bad at mafia for lynching someone who claims a PR if you like, that's your prerogative. But what on earth do I gain as scum from admitting I would have lynched someone who claimed doc? How is that alignment-indicative?

The possibility of him having JK/Cop still existed. All I said earlier was a PR with no CC and you said you still lynch him. You say that JK/Cop would be confirmed town, so would you still lynch him if he claimed either of those with no CC? Not calling you bad at mafia, I'm saying you not allowing a possible claim is scummy, even if he didn't play like a PR. Literally no reason as a town to lynch him without allowing him to claim, but there is a reason for a mafia.

[Ilhom]

An issue I have with your analysis is with juckter. Xayzeck and Nero you have as egging, but not juckter even though he had Tetaes as a scum lean and even said that Tetaes would be the best lynch of the day. Can you point out their egging that juckter didn't do?

[Stabulous]

He was never going to claim. I was asking him for a claim for a full two days, during which he logged in to mafiascum and check the thread. If he didn't claim then, I wasnt going to pay much mind to whatver bullshit claim came next.

[Futan]

Seeing as I want more information:

Ask away, I'm not going to be much help.

Unvote:

I actually liked those answers Stab, a lot better than some of your priors.

[insanity018]

Votecount 2.4

Futan

(2): Nero Cain, juckter

(L-2)

Stabulous

(2): Ilhom, pistachi0n

(L-2)

pistachi0n

(1): Stabulous

Not Voting

(2): Xayzeck, Futan

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch.

Deadline

: (expired on 2015-04-27 21:15:00)

[Ilhom]

He was never going to claim. I was asking him for a claim for a full two days, during which he logged in to mafiascum and check the thread. If he didn't claim then, I wasnt going to pay much mind to whatver bullshit claim came next.

You cannot tell me he wasn't going to claim. There is no way you can have 100% certainty that he wouldn't.
You did not ask for two full days. 198 then 202. About 30 hours.
Pistachi0n mentioned him being online after you made your post urging for the hammer. You made no mention of it before.

Right so if he did claim JK/Cop with no CC you weren't going to pay much mind to it and just lynch him? Somehow that would be a bullshit claim?

[juckter]

Seeing as I want more information:

Ask away, I'm not going to be much help.

Unvote:

I actually liked those answers Stab, a lot better than some of your priors.

I'd like to hear your thoughts on pistachi0n, Ilhom, and Xay. I want to evaluate which scumlean to follow, and whether Xay's towniness still makes sense to everyone else.

[Stabulous]

I couldn't lynch him even if I wanted to, I was on the wagon already. If he claimed doc/bp I would have wanted to lynch him, and the chance of him claiming cop without cc after continually logging in and posting nothing was low enough that it was safe to lynch him without waiting. No I would not lynch conf-town. Not sure what your point about pistachio posting he was online is, I had been checking it because I wanted to fakehammer as soon as he was online but didn't get the chance.

[Stabulous]

Predict that Pistachio will vote/unvote me three more times before the day's up.

Are you trying to egg me on? The message I'm getting is "keep voting for me, I dare you." Okay, I will.

I doubt it.

[Xayzeck]

Prodge, catch up later. Been busy with school

[Xayzeck]

Can someone explain why Futan is getting voted? I don't really see it

[Xayzeck]

Does it have something to do with being onwagon?

[Xayzeck]

So I get back from school around 9 and I eat and all that so it's normally 11 or 12 when I get to this

And I'm usually sleepy as hell, so Ilhom

Can you explain Stab-scum to me as if I were the sleepiest person you ever met, like I'm too lazy to pick up my cup to drink water even though I'm thirsty as heck.

Because I did think Stab was scum, but not anymore, and I really can't follow this entire hammering Tet thing.

[Xayzeck]

If I missed something please quote it for me

[Nero Cain]

He pushes for pistachi0n's hammer on Tetaes without allowing Tetaes to even post anything.

no

Tet, you're at L-1. You should post all of your current reads in case you end up being lynched. If you're a PR, claim it when someone announces intent to hammer.

Are you even around right now?

If Tet had flipped scum I *might* consider this coaching but I think this whole "oh Stab didn't give Tet a chance" is proven false.

I intend to hammer. I will not cast my vote until someone acknowledges that they have seen this post.

Here pist claims intent to hammer and seemingly doesn't care if Tet claims or anything. How is this different than what you are claiming stab did?

but both

I see it, but I think we should let him claim and post reads before you hammer. Can you wait 24h?

Yes. I will wait until he says something.

seem to be willing to let Tet claim and jazz. Of the two Stab is the townier of the two. This continues to disprove your argument.

I looked on Tet's profile and he was online this morning, which was after he was put at L-1, and didn't post anything to defend himself.

I am willing to hammer in one hou

r unless
a) Someone has already hammered first
b) Tetaes logs on and sufficiently defends himself
c) Nobody has acknowledged this post.

Here pist is doing exactly what you are accusing Stab of doing. Point B kinda points to her not doing that but meh.

I want to hammer Tet. I said 24h and I don't think we need to wait longer than that

This is apparently your point but I really don't get the "ZOMG he tried to get pist to hammer him before he could do anything." Tet had his chance do do something to change their minds in 187 but he didn't do anything.

Tl;dr
nothing in the thread supports your argument.

[Nero Cain]

In no way is it a towny move to not allow a possible claim.

You do know that he (tet) had a chance to claim and instead of claiming he self hammered.

Does it have something to do with being onwagon?

b/c he's scum and my wincon says we have to lynch them. Is yours different?

I don't like his posting today. I don't like how he moseyed onto the Stab wagon.

Hammering me before I post tonight is a scum claim. I'm on my phone and will post in a couple of hours.

Last post was 22 hours ago.

And these are the type of egging on posts that I expect from scum.

[Ilhom]

He pushes for pistachi0n's hammer on Tetaes without allowing Tetaes to even post anything.

no

Yes. 230. That is clearly a push for the hammer. Tetaes had made no posts since he was L-1 at this point.

Tet, you're at L-1. You should post all of your current reads in case you end up being lynched. If you're a PR, claim it when someone announces intent to hammer.

Are you even around right now?

If Tet had flipped scum I *might* consider this coaching but I think this whole "oh Stab didn't give Tet a chance" is proven false.

You misrepresent what I'm trying to say again. A push for the hammer on Tetaes before he could post is scummy. There is NO reason why a town should push for that there. Town gains NOTHING, but mafia do.

I intend to hammer. I will not cast my vote until someone acknowledges that they have seen this post.

Here pist claims intent to hammer and seemingly doesn't care if Tet claims or anything. How is this different than what you are claiming stab did?

It's different because she recognized it should wait and said 203. She didn't just push for the hammer immediately which would have been scummy. Instead she would wait until Tetaes posts.

but both

I see it, but I think we should let him claim and post reads before you hammer. Can you wait 24h?

Yes. I will wait until he says something.

seem to be willing to let Tet claim and jazz. Of the two Stab is the townier of the two. This continues to disprove your argument.

Apparently you ignored my explanation of this post earlier.

I looked on Tet's profile and he was online this morning, which was after he was put at L-1, and didn't post anything to defend himself.

I am willing to hammer in one hou

r unless
a) Someone has already hammered first
b) Tetaes logs on and sufficiently defends himself
c) Nobody has acknowledged this post.

Here pist is doing exactly what you are accusing Stab of doing. Point B kinda points to her not doing that but meh.

Someone hammers first - not her fault.
Tetaes logs on and actually posts - very good.
Nobody acknowledges the post - just ask her to wait for Tetaes post. This is the only questionable one but she saw that Tetaes was online that morning and didn't post, so it seemed unlikely that he was a PR. I would disagree with this but at least this has some sort of weight to it instead of Stabulous's "This game will be super easy for town no matter how Tetaes's flips." Also, if she was scum she could have just agreed with Stabulous and just dropped the hammer.

I want to hammer Tet. I said 24h and I don't think we need to wait longer than that

This is apparently your point but I really don't get the "ZOMG he tried to get pist to hammer him before he could do anything." Tet had his chance do do something to change their minds in 187 but he didn't do anything.

Tl;dr
nothing in the thread supports your argument.

Tetaes wasn't at L-1 at that point, and he could have been completely unsure or nervous on what to do at L-2. Regardless, this is completely irrelevant to my point.

[Stabulous]

Also, if she was scum she could have just agreed with Stabulous and just dropped the hammer.

No, she couldn't have. It'd be completely out of character. I mentioned this in my earlier post, Pistachio is not exonerated for not taking the easy lynch- she can't even vote someone for two hours in a row, saying "eh yeah good point" and hammering would have (at least in her mind) been suspicious.

[Stabulous]

but your general logic here is why I thought that scum had to be on the wagon (ergo, town would easily win the game). Fails to WIFOM as I said before.