New York 180 (Endgame)

[Kitz]

Though, it'd be great if Kitz started saying more things

I already said what I can say, and no one cares about it.
My logic and deduction is not adequate in any shape apparently.

[Shinobi]

Uh, thoughts, so I put some effort into this game.

I personally think Shin is the best vote. He just sat on the sidelines in the TSO/Oz debate, which was probably the safest place for scum. Nobody appears to agree with this, so whatev.

I think GM is the most town person playing. I liked the PT he shared with SW. Plus I don't think a scum-neighborizer picked the town who was already neighbored to a scum neighbor. I'm therefore willing to sheep GM because he has a wider grasp on the game than I do.

I was the counterwagon to scum on day 5.

How the fuck is my "sidelines" on day 6, which I completely explained, scummy?

[Shinobi]

We're you worried someone would hammer or did you change your mind on gm?

Little bit of both tbh.

[Shinobi]

VOTE: shinobi

gc i've been for this and in part for reasons really similar to yours for a while now. shin lynch is best lynch

I still don't know what scum action theory is.

[Green Crayons]

As a default, scum are disinclined to bus or defend a buddy. A 1 v 1 situation requires them to do one or the other. Simply opting out of taking a stance on the 1 v 1 allows scum to avoid bussing or defending, while allowing to see how the situation develops (and potentially jumping on at the right moment, in either direction, depending on how the situation develops).

[Shinobi]

As a default, scum are disinclined to bus or defend a buddy. A 1 v 1 situation requires them to do one or the other. Simply opting out of taking a stance on the 1 v 1 allows scum to avoid bussing or defending, while allowing to see how the situation develops (and potentially jumping on at the right moment, in either direction, depending on how the situation develops).

Wtf are you talking about?

This is, like, mega convoluted.

[Green Crayons]

It's pretty basic.

[Green Crayons]

"What is preferred scum play in this scenario."

[Shinobi]

I don't really think so, but to each their own I suppose.

Regardless, what's the difference between "scum doing whatever it is you're talking about" and town?

[dragonspawn]

Uh, thoughts, so I put some effort into this game.

I personally think Shin is the best vote. He just sat on the sidelines in the TSO/Oz debate, which was probably the safest place for scum. Nobody appears to agree with this, so whatev.

I think GM is the most town person playing. I liked the PT he shared with SW. Plus I don't think a scum-neighborizer picked the town who was already neighbored to a scum neighbor. I'm therefore willing to sheep GM because he has a wider grasp on the game than I do.

I was the counterwagon to scum on day 5.

How the fuck is my "sidelines" on day 6, which I completely explained, scummy?

being a counter wagon doesn't make you town. Last scum game I played we deliberately set up a scum v scum wagon to give one of then town cred when they flipped. You may have missed that since we did get you flashlynched the day before.

[dragonspawn]

I'm finally getting over my cold. So sorry I haven't been very useful this past week.

I'm still pretty much leaning to marquis or kilz. But other than GC I'm not a all certain of my reads. Getting pretty paranoid about it.

[Shinobi]

Uh, thoughts, so I put some effort into this game.

I personally think Shin is the best vote. He just sat on the sidelines in the TSO/Oz debate, which was probably the safest place for scum. Nobody appears to agree with this, so whatev.

I think GM is the most town person playing. I liked the PT he shared with SW. Plus I don't think a scum-neighborizer picked the town who was already neighbored to a scum neighbor. I'm therefore willing to sheep GM because he has a wider grasp on the game than I do.

I was the counterwagon to scum on day 5.

How the fuck is my "sidelines" on day 6, which I completely explained, scummy?

being a counter wagon doesn't make you town. Last scum game I played we deliberately set up a scum v scum wagon to give one of then town cred when they flipped. You may have missed that since we did get you flashlynched the day before.

That game is a terrible example of pretty much anything. The counterwagons were between a guy who claimed a cop guilty on the actual cop and the guilty of the actual cop. Both of them were confirmed mafia and town not lynching them doesn't speak anything of the concept of counterwagons; it just tells you how unbelievably bad town was in the first place.

I know the point you're trying to make but the logic doesn't hold up.

[Green Crayons]

Oh yeah forgot that I read that you said you were a counterwagon on D5.

That's a pretty good trump card.

[goodmorning]

Being a counterwagon doesn't make anyone anything.

[goodmorning]

Large Normals in particular (all wagons with >1 vote, from lynch to least):
NY178: T-T
NY177: T-T-T
NY176: T-T-T
NY175: T-T
NY174: M-M-T
NY173: M-T
NY172: T-T
NY171: T-T
NY170: T-T-T
NY169: T-M-M

So of the last 10 Large Normals, 7 had only wagons on Town at the end of D1.

D1 wagons in the last 10 Large Normals, for a start. I'll do more looking up later.

[Green Crayons]

D1 is its own special bird. Scum usually don't have their claws sunk into the town, if that's going to be a thing that happens.

Competing scum bandwagons late game is probably more rare.

I DON'T KNOW, though. Just shooting from the hip on this bit.

[Shinobi]

GM am I town or scum?

[dragonspawn]

Good question. Are you scum or town?

[Shinobi]

Good question. Are you scum or town?

It'd be funnier if you didn't completely miss the point of the question.

[Green Crayons]

marq, dragon, and GM: how do you feel about the D5 counterwagons in relation to Shin's alignment?

[dragonspawn]

He is prob town but I don't think it's as firm as he does.

[Shinobi]

I think I'm pretty firm tbh.

[goodmorning]

marq, dragon, and GM: how do you feel about the D5 counterwagons in relation to Shin's alignment?

I don't think it's necessarily that relevant unless Kitz is Scum. One Scum on a counterwagon to Scum could be a bus. Two is more likely Town.

GM am I town or scum?

I think you'd be the better person to ask that to.

I do think you lean Town.

D1 is its own special bird.

I don't disagree.

Spoiler: D1 Wagons >1 at Lynch, G>L

NY178: T-T
NY177: T-T-T
NY176: T-T-T
NY175: T-T
NY174: M-M-T
NY173: M-T
NY172: T-T
NY171: T-T
NY170: T-T-T
NY169: T-M-M

Spoiler: D2

NY178: T-T-T
NY177: M
NY176: T
NY175: T-T-M-T
NY174: T-T-T
NY173: T-T
NY172: M-T
NY171: M
NY170: T-M
NY169: T-M-T

Spoiler: D3

NY178: M-T
NY177: T-T-T
NY176: T
NY175: T-SK
NY174: T-T-T-T
NY173: T-T
NY172: M
NY171: M-T
NY170: M-T
NY169: M-T

Spoiler: D4

NY178: M-W
NY177: T-M
NY176: T
NY175: M-T
NY174: M-T
NY173: T-T
NY172: M-T-T
NY171: T-T
NY170: M-M-T
NY169: M-T-T

Spoiler: D5

NY178: W
NY177: T-T
NY176: M
NY175: SK
NY174: T-M
NY173: M
NY171: T-M
NY170: T-M
NY169: M-T

Spoiler: D6

NY178: W
NY177: T
NY176: T
NY175: T-T
NY174: T-M
NY173: T
NY171: M
NY170: M
NY169: T-T

Spoiler: D7

NY178: T
NY175: M
NY174: T-T
NY171: T
NY169: T-M

Spoiler: D8

NY174: T
NY171: T
NY169: T-M

Spoiler: D9

NY171: NL
NY169: M

Spoiler: D10

NY171: T

I'm now utterly astonished at the number of Days that end with only 1 wagon receiving more than 1 vote (slightly over 1/3).
69 lynch vcs sampled
24 single wagon lynch vcs
45 multiwagon lynch vcs
{19 only T
22 T + 1 Scum
4 2 Scum w or w/o T (1 diff factions)}

So 8.89% of Days ending in multiwagons will have multiScumwagons. Not quite as much as I thought it might be but not an insignificant number either.

[Cheetory6]

I already said what I can say, and no one cares about it.
My logic and deduction is not adequate in any shape apparently.

K.
Why are you voting for GM then?
Who are you townreading and who are you scumreading and why?
Why not try to engage people?

[Cheetory6]

I'm not reading 200 pages.

That's the difference between this game and any other game I replace into.

Why wouldn't you use the same level of energy to ISOdive 3-4 players who are still alive? It just seems like there's a discrepancy in effort and this excuse just seems weird. :/
Also, could you link a game that you replaced into where you took a scumslot? If it's not too much trouble.
Also also, I'm not sure if you've answered already, but what're your thoughts on Marquis atm?

I personally think Shin is the best vote. He just sat on the sidelines in the TSO/Oz debate, which was probably the safest place for scum. Nobody appears to agree with this, so whatev.

See, I'd agree with you if it didn't seem like Shin has been being super reserved with his vote like all game.
Like, I feel like getting him to vote someone/anyone at times has been like pulling teeth and iirc it hasn't been just during times when scum has been getting run up. It's come across as more of a playstyle thing.

Oh yeah forgot that I read that you said you were a counterwagon on D5.

That's a pretty good trump card.

Actually, or are you kidding? :/