@Nacho -
Okay, finally had time to sit down and read through
Post 1088, I'm not going to go into a quoting frenzy with you so I'll try and keep my points fairly concise (I lied, it's not concise). I think points 1)/2) are fairly weak so if you want to respond mainly to 3)-6) that's fine, 3 and 6 are the main ones.
1) The logic of "While scum might feel up against it they're unlikely to take risks straight out of the gate in practice" is something I strongly disagree with; I know several of my off-site scum games where I've played in that manner and won by doing it -- I've seen similar things on and off site by others too.
2) I don't think him "breaking the mould" and joke claiming sccm is a town-tell at all, I think he felt compelled to respond to RBD's accusation and thought that covering it off as a joke would be best to do that -- it's the tone and manner he did that read very mildly scummy.
3) a) I don't disagree that it's very plausible he was holding us to a higher standard than he probably should have been and thus legitimately disliked some of our points, I can agree that him attacking our Bork read strength is slightly understandable via expecting more from us / me to know Bork.
b) I strongly disagree with your point on Yuriko here, it was never a case of "Yuriko being wrong = scum" and you you should know this and he should have too if he was reading our posts, him attempting to push it down to something like that and belittle our scum-read on Yuriko there makes a lot of sense if they're partners and he wants to de-credit us. Our (Well my) issue with Yuriko was several things A) Her spending more time on setup-discussion than scumhunting, B) Her using setup discussion to cover up for stating reads in a way that had scum-motivation and her reasoning behind "being confused" reading as fake and C) It wasn't the final stance of hers (Scum sided being wrong = scum) that I had an issue with it's the fact there was a disconnect, a contradiction in her post. In other words via her own logic she should have had X (Town sided) conclusion but picked Y (Scum sided) - which matches with the common scum-tell that I noticed back at EM that scum always pretend that town are "boned" more than they really are to seem town.
c) I also disagree that I used "strong" language when voting Pie, I can understand being annoyed and frustrated by the "online/activity" tell being used but I don't think she could have read the thread and objectively thought that our push was us being confident or attempting to mslynch him which is essentially what he's claiming to be the case then -- again this is a key point and what I want you to respond to; his reaction reads as very exaggerated because I think anyone reading the thread properly, noticing it was only page 4 and noticing that we only had 2 minuscule posts about him would have realized it wasn't a "strong" vote or an attempt lynch him but moreso just a pressure-vote, the over-reaction does have scum motivation moreso with Yuriko!Scum.
4) The point about her stating please hold being her exciting to "bury scum" is something I may have partially agreed with but for
Post 132, I think him copying someone elses posts shows less him getting caught up in the heat of the moment as town and more him fabricating and drafting a scum-push to be read as town (The point Muffin had re; Pie taking quite some time to make those posts holds some weight here).
5) Find it really hard to respond to your points of "He's not capable of doing this stuff as scum and it'd require him to up his game an unbelievable level given the situation" (Take for instance his
Post 266) because I don't know him how his mind and scum game works enough to make a legitimate comment and sadly I also don't trust your ability to meta-read him convincinly too (I've gone into this before but there's very few peoples meta reads on a certain few other people that I'd actually take weight in, I've seen too many incorrect meta reads lose town games within the last year).
6) Since I think you want this to have it's own point you're essentially saying you think Pies
Post 784 is too much emotional-manipulation to come from scum; I don't agree, I'm not sure how used you are to EM/chat mafia ect. but the degree of emotional manipulation that's used to buddy people and seem town is extreme and it's not something I consider unfakeable at all, I'll be the first to admit it the more that I want to win a particular game as scum the further I'm willing to go to "break meta" and "use emotion to manipulate people" and I don't see why Pie would be any different, I know for instance if I drew scum in a playerlist like this my first instinct would be resignation and a lack of motivation but when that passed I'd have gone an "all or nothing" strategy to fake something that people would never consider me faking to get town-read and then try and coast of that.
