Mini 1698: MDCXCVIII [C'est fini!]

[Kublai Khan]

I usually keep basic notes, and since I dont read through multiple times unless I have to my notes are perception based and affected by hindsight.

Okay, fair enough. That feels honest.

[spicer1209]

And one more thing for fucks sake Grey can you not post 10 one sentence posts back to back?

@anna This is how I look at pisskop. I really like post 138 from him. It seemed like good scumhunting and willingness to find information. Other than that I went through his ISO and didnt know what to think at the end of it. He could be either or imo.

[GrayFoxxxx]

To me it seems like you were basically saying "Hey guys I was the first one on the Bulb wagon so dont bother looking towards my direction today."

I was...

[GrayFoxxxx]

Also don't ignore his posts about bulb.

I think if there was a busser on bulbs wagon it is Piss

What do you mean a busser on bulb? Bulb flipped town. How can anyone bus a townie?

This post is really telling. I just can't tell what it's saying yet.

??? Really?

That's the towntell post. Scum would know a scum member died but town might be oblivious if they didn't read the modpost closely.

Why suddenly bring this up after he votes you?

So its possible I bussed my scum partner.

But not possible for DS to say that as scum?

This logic hurts my soul.

Straw man alert. Khan has not claimed its not possible for me to say that as scum. In fact, he has been one of the main people pressuring me despite my screw up. And I see no problem with him doing that.

So why don't you tell us why you suddenly bring it up after I voted for you

Tired of going in circles with Boon and KK. It got you to talk to me.

[GrayFoxxxx]

Why me? Why kop
What makes you town reads town.
You've done no explaining anna

I don't like to explain townreads unless there's a particular reason to, like if that player is close to being lynched or something. because most of the time others' townreads are ignored in favor of people's personal views on a player. townreads are more likely to be ignored than scumreads. PARTICULARLY right now, I don't have very much confidence in my reads, so I would like to be a little more passive and wait for things to make more sense for me before asserting my opinion

And the way Foxx has acted after that has seriously not helped the cause at all.

I'm voting KK who seems to be a pretty common scum read. Sorry if that's acting scummy.

see, stuff like this is what makes me doubt my town read on you Gray
also I'm pretty sure like half of the people who initially suspected KK are now looking another direction/starting to think otherwise

You're the towniest player that I see. I don't mind answering any questions you have. Please ask anything, I do want to cooperate with you.

Boon said my actions are scummy. All I have done is bicker with him,and spicer. So I'm guessing he meant my vote on KK. Am I looking at it wrong?

I initially voted KK as an agreement between you and Dom.

But if you guys have a better scum read let me know and we can discuss the best coarse of action.

I guess I'd like to know where you stand on pisskop? just focusing on him, what's your read? right now I'm not interested in voting the other two options you said you were interested in (implosion and KK) but I would really like to get a better idea of what people are thinking on pisskop
actually

hey everyone, if you haven't given an opinion on pisskop, could you show your thoughts there?

to give people a better idea of what I'm thinking right now, pisskop is currently my pick for most likely to be scum... but at the same time, in a vacuum I would place him at essentially null. basically I have too many townreads.

I will re iso pisskop and give a legit read. Something besides "SCUM COULD DO THIS SO HE MUST BE SCUM". (LOOKING AT YOU SPICER AND BOON).

Had a short break I'll be back tonight. Anna, what do you think of Boons/Spicers/KK reasons I must be scum? Are they potentially ignoring other players just to prove a point? Not KK so much as I think he is just sheeping Boon at this point.

Ttyl

[GrayFoxxxx]

Also, KK sorry, you aren't going to force the Idea I'm trying to PL piss.

My vote is on you.

GOOD DAY SIR. (kk stop calling people hostile it's been like twice now for no reason. Maybe a weak scum tactic?)

Ok for real I'm gone now.

[spicer1209]

To me it seems like you were basically saying "Hey guys I was the first one on the Bulb wagon so dont bother looking towards my direction today."

I was...

and you dont think this is scummy?

[dragonspawn]

Also don't ignore his posts about bulb.

I think if there was a busser on bulbs wagon it is Piss

What do you mean a busser on bulb? Bulb flipped town. How can anyone bus a townie?

This post is really telling. I just can't tell what it's saying yet.

??? Really?

That's the towntell post. Scum would know a scum member died but town might be oblivious if they didn't read the modpost closely.

Why suddenly bring this up after he votes you?

So its possible I bussed my scum partner.

But not possible for DS to say that as scum?

This logic hurts my soul.

Straw man alert. Khan has not claimed its not possible for me to say that as scum. In fact, he has been one of the main people pressuring me despite my screw up. And I see no problem with him doing that.

So why don't you tell us why you suddenly bring it up after I voted for you

Tired of going in circles with Boon and KK. It got you to talk to me.

How is a response to my post getting me to talk to you?

And if you want to talk to me just talk.

[TheDominator37]

Also don't ignore his posts about bulb.

I think if there was a busser on bulbs wagon it is Piss

What do you mean a busser on bulb? Bulb flipped town. How can anyone bus a townie?

This post is really telling. I just can't tell what it's saying yet.

??? Really?

That's the towntell post. Scum would know a scum member died but town might be oblivious if they didn't read the modpost closely.

Why suddenly bring this up after he votes you?

So its possible I bussed my scum partner.

But not possible for DS to say that as scum?

This logic hurts my soul.

Straw man alert. Khan has not claimed its not possible for me to say that as scum. In fact, he has been one of the main people pressuring me despite my screw up. And I see no problem with him doing that.

So why don't you tell us why you suddenly bring it up after I voted for you

Tired of going in circles with Boon and KK. It got you to talk to me.

How is a response to my post getting me to talk to you?

And if you want to talk to me just talk.

Sorry I just had to do this

[Sméagol]

V

o

t

e

c

o

u

n

t

GrayFoxxxx [

3

]

:

spicer1209

/

Boonskiies

/

dragonspawn

pisskop [

2

]

:

implosion

/

Annarchy

TheDominator37 [

1

]

:

pisskop

Kublai Khan [

2

]

:

GrayFoxxxx

/

TheDominator37

Abstaining [2]

: Kublai Khan /

future replacement

There are 10 active players.
Absolute majority is

6

.
Majority has

not

been reached.

Previous vote count
Next vote count

Spoiler: Current player list

[01] Bulbazoor -

Mafia

- watcher (variant) - lynched day 1

[02] dragonspawn
[03] GrayFoxxxx

[04] FA_Q2 -

Town

- role cop - killed night 1

[05] implosion
[06] Boonskiies
[07] spicer1209

[08] Shazam -

Town

- vanilla - killed night 1

[09] pisskop
[10] Annarchy
[11] TheDominator37
[12] Kublai Khan
[13]

Searching replacement

Black denotes active players.

Grey denotes dead players.

(

V/LA

) denotes the player currently is on vacation or leave of absence.

Deadline is

09-08-2015 00:00 CEST

.
(expired on 2015-08-09 00:00:00)

[dragonspawn]

Grayfox is voting twice

[Sméagol]

Ah yes, thanks for pointing it out. Copy/pasted the wrong name (link and everything else was correct).

[implosion]

Really fucking tired, but alas.

@kk: yes, my spicer vote was based entirely on NE.

I think gray is town. I think the way he's insisting that he's obvtown is townish. I don't think he'd bus bulb and then have the same degree of arrogant insistence that it makes him clearly town as scum. His arrogance over his own alignment feels genuine to me.

I feel like a hipster when it comes to KK. I kept trying to tell everyone to stop when they were calling him obvtown, and then when there were some things that made me say "yeah, i can see kk town" he got wagoned. And now the wagon is dissolving (or at least it's not the leading wagon anymore) and I think I want to vote him. I don't think I like the way he's interacting with grayfox. Things like 1230 and the last line of 1368 feel like they're making an awkward jump from grayfox's behavior being illogical or overreactive to grayfox being scum.

I don't feel super strong about that but I don't have the energy to read everything closely right now. I actually feel decently confident about grayfox town, though. And 1191 does also give me reservations about KK scum but I think I can see him making that post as scum especially if the game is dragging on from the perspective of kk-scum which could be true if his partner is someone like the woody slot.

I wanna hear more thoughts from anna about kk/how strongly she feels he's town.

[Boonskiies]

Anna, what do you think of Boons/Spicers/KK reasons I must be scum? Are they potentially ignoring other players just to prove a point? Not KK so much as I think he is just sheeping Boon at this point.

Except you weren't the only person I was pushing for? I was completely pushing KK over you before you started pointlessly defending. I also expressed suspicion on the Wackpecker slot, and the potentiality of Spicer being scum, although I feel a far less chance than one of KK/Pecker slot. I also talked about Pisskop having a scum/scum association with you. I seriously don't get what you are even saying with this post.

[Annarchy]

something to note about GrayFox: most people are scumreading him for trying to call himself obvious town. I just went through his meta to see if this had happened before. read his ISO in this game - he does pretty much the exact same thing as town. that makes me think his recent actions are more null than anything

Anna, what do you think of Boons/Spicers/KK reasons I must be scum? Are they potentially ignoring other players just to prove a point? Not KK so much as I think he is just sheeping Boon at this point.

oops just answered part of this. but I'm looking through a triple ISO of the three of them.

KK's first reads list had you (GrayFox) as town, saying you "towntold pretty hard" early on. I agree with this, but I've also had doubts of whether I was right there, so I'm not sure if that's inconsistency by KK or just second-guessing himself
in fact the more I read KK, the more I think he's town and I'm just paranoid that he's some super strong scum just because he joined in '08 and has a colorful name. his reads on pisskop, GrayFox and Boon flow pretty naturally, how I would expect them to go from town
I don't like spicer's reasoning. it's like the discussion I had with Shazam on D1. I'll go ahead and quote that

the last eight pages of my read only did two things:
1) reinforce my Woodpecker townread
2) make me start looking at Shazam as a scumread. I started thinking about this when I saw post 523, and while I could have make this observation earlier, I guess it finally clicked when I saw this: Shazam is pushing heavily on the Mario wagon for something that is essentially a weak-player-tell. it's not very appealing play no, but Mario's 10 posts could easily, EASILY be from a new, weak town player. I have ISO'd Shazam and seen his reasoning, and not only do I disagree that Mario's actions are telling, I also think Shazam is claiming far too much confidence in his read on the Mario slot.

So you think that I'm far too confident that Mario is scum from actions that you see as just incorrect, not scummy. And my incorrectness (from your PoV) makes you think I'm scum. Oh the irony. And don't try to pretend that this "far too much confidence" is anything more than you seeing me as incorrect. If you thought I was correct, the confidence would just seem natural to you.

I think the same flaw I had there is what spicer is having here.
and I'm sorry but I'm not even going to try reading into Boon's reasoning. he makes little sense to me. he's town though

I wanna hear more thoughts from anna about kk/how strongly she feels he's town.

I keep kind of answering my next question before I get to it lol
but KK has been moving up in my town reads to the point where I wouldn't be willing to lynch him today. I was originally wary of my reasoning for his "you should lynch me" post being town, but my town read on him is backed up in other places. it's mostly what I said in response to GrayFox, his reads look like they're coming from the mindset of town trying to honestly figure out what people are as opposed to pushing opinions. he seems slightly unsure of his reads atm like I am also. I have five townreads I'd claim good confidence in, and he's the fifth (the other four being you, Boon, dragonspawn, and spicer, in that order).

so you feel confident on GrayFox being town. thoughts on piss/Dom/the Woody slot? do you see any possibility of a scumteam between two of the three of them?
to be honest I'd love to see the Woody slot get vig'd


I know someone wanted more explanation on all my townreads, but that will have to come later. I've already explained quite a few here

[implosion]

@Anna

piss I still have sort of as gut town but I am by no means sold on that read.
Dom I need to look in to more. I don't remember well why I had that slot as town, and atm without looking much I can see it as scum.
The woody slot I can see as scum at this point. I thought woody's play was town of course but I've seen too many people that have given me townreads since then/the read has faded/there's a good chance that a lot of it was moreso a playstyle thing/I haven't yet looked into him vis a vis bulb in depth, iirc (I might have done this but just be forgetting but i don't think so).

In terms of team associations I'm not a big fan of hunting for them between people that are alive (unless it's something like 5 players left with 2 scum). I can speculate if you want though. But that'd be later when I'm not at work.

[Kublai Khan]

KK's first reads list had you (GrayFox) as town, saying you "towntold pretty hard" early on. I agree with this, but I've also had doubts of whether I was right there, so I'm not sure if that's inconsistency by KK or just second-guessing himself

FWIW, the hard towntell from GrayFoxxxx was Post 210. He bolded a post from Necessary Evil saying the word "investigation" to make some point.

My reasoning is that scum would be more likely to note the word privately and not call attention to it publicly.

[TheDominator37]

VOTE: gray
Just ISOed main points is he never really had any substantial reads, constantly went with the flow, and soft read bulb and is pushing for a KK lynch

[GrayFoxxxx]

VOTE: gray
Just ISOed main points is he never really had any substantial reads, constantly went with the flow, and soft read bulb and is pushing for a KK lynch

This makes me sad.

I will be posting asap.

[GrayFoxxxx]

Updated Reads

Town

Anna
DS
Piss/Spice/Imp
Dom
Boon
KK

Scum

[Kublai Khan]

Where's WoodyWoodpecker's slot?

[GrayFoxxxx]

Throw him in null with the other 3

[GrayFoxxxx]

@Anna

Spoiler:

Piss really did bother me lying like he did.ISOing him after some more time has passed, I can't see any thing else that

SCREAMS

scum, like his lying did. I like his recent posts, and I agree with a few of the reads. His progression on his bulb read seems natural. The lie still worries me, but I'm on the fence right now.

[GrayFoxxxx]

@Spicer

Ok dude, look I'm thinking your probably town,and we are just not getting along personally. I can understand how you would call me buddying Anna scummy. Thats way more possible than thinking I concrete bussed my scum partner D1 right out if the gate. But please consider the fact I am town, who really wants people to see how obvious it is. Who else is bothering you at the moment?

[GrayFoxxxx]

Damnit wrong spoiler tag w.e