NY 186: Mafia In Japan - Mafia Victory!

[Dessew]

NC: what happened to your ika read?

[Nero Cain]

changed my mind.

Where are ANY of your reads?

[Kaboose]

dessew is doing his best to look busy imo

[ConManMick]

@everyone not named Nero, kaboose, and xtoxm, why no vote? Where are you leaning?

I'm having a look at the vote counts and slightly confusing myself. Anywho, few more ISOs and I might have a reason to cast a vote.

[ConManMick]

Would it make sense for scum to have a role cop in this set up, or would that be too scum sided?

[Kitty Galore]

No ika is either a VT or a Goon

ok well. We should lynch him?

I can't be scum, I didn't get a PT
What are the possible.roles currently alive in the game? If we can afford it, I'd be willing to go with that.

So rolecop would get investigation immune traitor as a result?

Kaboose is scum, then.

VOTE: Kaboose

Ok quoting some posts that twig me, I am curious about the Kaboose thing, is he confirmed cop at all?

And why would ConManNick be asking what possible roles are currently alive in the game, is there a list somewhere? Or are you pushing for a mass claim?

And is anyone questioning the huge push that Nero made day one on Town KlingonCelt to get her lynched, is there some reason that has just been pushed aside?

I am trying to catch up, but time is short for me right now, so I am looking at the things that caught my eye while skimming, so far.

[Xtoxm]

What exactly is the case on Dessew

And why are people ignoring Kaboose

[Kaboose]

Because I'm town.

[ika]

What exactly is the case on Dessew

And why are people ignoring Kaboose

we havent we dicussed it already

Because I'm town.

mayeb

[Nero Cain]

And is anyone questioning the huge push that Nero made day one on Town KlingonCelt to get her lynched, is there some reason that has just been pushed aside?

Why do you think my push on KC was scummy?

[ConManMick]

@kitty,

My reason for speculating was the post in which it was declared that ika was either VT or goon. Depending on the number of town aligned roles still alive, we either can / can't afford to lynch him for a flip. What I was wondering is, how many scum roles are usually in a game this this size? 3-4?

[I Am Innocent]

What exactly is the case on Dessew

This whole game, Dessew has made TWO votes...both on players who haved flipped town:

VOTE: KlingonCelt
Obey the Cain.
Actually, she seems reluctant to discuss nearly (might be an understatement) anything game-related, such as her own vote or NC's case on her, as he has pointed it out before.

@PM:

hey there! Could you, please do me a favour, & post at least twice a day? Those posts don't have to be particularly insightful, just have them have content. Thank you.

Day 1 vote, was the 7th on the wagon (L-3).

Is everyone done for today? I intend to iso Kaboose, but it's not urgent. Actually, let's end this day, there's no point in making it any longer.
VOTE: Boonskiies

This is L-1, I believe.

Hardly to blame for this vote with all the antics Boon pulled D2.

But that's it. 0 for 2 on scum votes this whole game.

And D3 when the Tere wagon happened, this is all we got:

I've slacked off pretty vadly recently.
So Tere is anti-town. A lynch would be fine by me in the not too distant future, but not just now, first I'd like to lokk into this & that, & see if I can say anything that's worth mentioning.

Despite being anti-town, refuses to vote Tere. Doesn't want to end the day, but when he put Boon at L-1 (for also what I would consider being anti-town), Dessew had no problem suggesting "Actually, let's end this day, there's no point in making it any longer"

Did scum figure out by D3 that Tere was the traitor. Possibly. The one game I played in where I was a traitor, scum had figured out by D3 who the traitor was. If this scum group did as well, this does not bode well for a player who had no problem joining the hottest two wagons D1 & D2 but avoiding the scum one D3.

But the deciding post for drawing my vote was this:

Okay, so if there is an established norm for multiball, then consider this:
The NKs can be groupped like this:
Grayfox, Espe & Radja
Constantine, Sala & DGB
Now, we could argue over the quality of the plays & a million other things, but the first three players could be as potential (mis)lynch targets at the time of submitting the relevant NKs, while the deaths of the second three could be considered to be a detriment to us. What I'm saying is that every night so far there has been a kill clearly made by the mafia, but the other deaths seem to be vig-kills. My conclusion is that there is only one mafia faction, so based on Tere's interactions with Kaboose, he is innocent. (I hope it's not redundant, I'm pretty sure that role cop used to be a scummy role.)

While I see a big difference in the N2 & N3 targets (two players had shady vote histories, while the other two were a confirmed ascetic crier and un-counterclaimed Mason), the N1 involved two players,

neither of which had a vote cast against them this game

. And on gut, I would have considered Grayfox as the one who seemed to be under more scrutiny D1. Yet Dessew seems sure that Grayfox is in the group of "potential (mis)lynch targets" while Constantine is in the group of kills "considered to be a detriment to us." Was hoping someone else saw this, but apparently I'm in the minority on this one? To me is sounds like a scum slip on someone who has inside information.

That coupled with the votes/non-cast votes on D1-D3 makes Dessew my #1 suspect.

[I Am Innocent]

And why are people ignoring Kaboose

Haven't ignored it, remember I was the guy who laughed at tere for claiming cop saying that putting a cop + 3 masons + IC would be to crazy for the mod to do.

town rolecop, little less so but has me wary too. Still the play between tere and kaboose does not line up to them being teammates, and Kaboose has been one of the more active players this game. Rolecops cannot detect goons, and doesn't look like he would've been able to detect an investigation immune traitor either, so that does limit the power of such a role.

At this point I'd rather leave him one more night and see what he comes up with. If he is still alive tomorrow, I'm willing to talk some more.

[Dessew]

changed my mind.

Where are ANY of your reads?

Why?
They are in the making. My scumpool is you, ika, pacman, kitty & mick. As you can see, that's one too many, so I'm reading these ISOs & certain key moments for a short time daily & try to have only 4 people there or find a decent case on one of you.

What exactly is the case on Dessew

This whole game, Dessew has made TWO votes...both on players who haved flipped town:

VOTE: KlingonCelt
Obey the Cain.
Actually, she seems reluctant to discuss nearly (might be an understatement) anything game-related, such as her own vote or NC's case on her, as he has pointed it out before.

@PM:

hey there! Could you, please do me a favour, & post at least twice a day? Those posts don't have to be particularly insightful, just have them have content. Thank you.

Day 1 vote, was the 7th on the wagon (L-3).

That's when I replaced and caught up. I could be 7th, 8th, 9th or 10th.

Is everyone done for today? I intend to iso Kaboose, but it's not urgent. Actually, let's end this day, there's no point in making it any longer.
VOTE: Boonskiies

This is L-1, I believe.

Hardly to blame for this vote with all the antics Boon pulled D2.

But that's it. 0 for 2 on scum votes this whole game.

And D3 when the Tere wagon happened, this is all we got:

I've slacked off pretty vadly recently.
So Tere is anti-town. A lynch would be fine by me in the not too distant future, but not just now, first I'd like to lokk into this & that, & see if I can say anything that's worth mentioning.

Despite being anti-town, refuses to vote Tere. Doesn't want to end the day, but when he put Boon at L-1 (for also what I would consider being anti-town), Dessew had no problem suggesting "Actually, let's end this day, there's no point in making it any longer"

Fair enough. What else did you want to do on D2? What I saw was Espe lamenting whether Boon could've been mason in a separate group from PM & Q while still being together with greyfox & other shenanigans, I didn't need more day time & I especially didn't want any nonsense to catch on.

Did scum figure out by D3 that Tere was the traitor. Possibly. The one game I played in where I was a traitor, scum had figured out by D3 who the traitor was. If this scum group did as well, this does not bode well for a player who had no problem joining the hottest two wagons D1 & D2 but avoiding the scum one D3.

Tere was pretty much lynched by that point, so I can't see why scum wouldn't have wanted to vote her, if you could walk me through or something. Also, what's really the difference between voting & not voting but calling a player scum & stating that I was fine with her lynch?

But the deciding post for drawing my vote was this:

Okay, so if there is an established norm for multiball, then consider this:
The NKs can be groupped like this:
Grayfox, Espe & Radja
Constantine, Sala & DGB
Now, we could argue over the quality of the plays & a million other things, but the first three players could be as potential (mis)lynch targets at the time of submitting the relevant NKs, while the deaths of the second three could be considered to be a detriment to us. What I'm saying is that every night so far there has been a kill clearly made by the mafia, but the other deaths seem to be vig-kills. My conclusion is that there is only one mafia faction, so based on Tere's interactions with Kaboose, he is innocent. (I hope it's not redundant, I'm pretty sure that role cop used to be a scummy role.)

While I see a big difference in the N2 & N3 targets (two players had shady vote histories, while the other two were a confirmed ascetic crier and un-counterclaimed Mason), the N1 involved two players,

neither of which had a vote cast against them this game

. And on gut, I would have considered Grayfox as the one who seemed to be under more scrutiny D1. Yet Dessew seems sure that Grayfox is in the group of "potential (mis)lynch targets" while Constantine is in the group of kills "considered to be a detriment to us." Was hoping someone else saw this, but apparently I'm in the minority on this one? To me is sounds like a scum slip on someone who has inside information.

That coupled with the votes/non-cast votes on D1-D3 makes Dessew my #1 suspect.

This is actually a fair point. To be honest, I didn't look back at the actualy plays, I only checked the deaths & deduced based on the little impression I had. Looking back at their actual posts, I still think that the Greyfox kill could've been made out of town intentions & the hermit kill out of scum intentions, but it could've been the other way around (or both scum intentions, or both town intentions, but the later kills don't correlate with those two hypothesises.)
I can bring up two points right now, assuming that apparently you believe that there just one scum team (I guess? Given that you think I've given out inside info), & that general consensus on greyfox & constantine is the opposite of mine. Firstly, if I were scum, I'd have 2 or more likely 3 buddies, who either thought what I think or didn't vocalize their disaggreement. There is daychat, so I believe that'd be unlikely. Secondly, I suppose it'd have been much easier for me as scum to push Kaboose instead of townreading him, since I've already mentioned my concerns about his interaction with Boon on D2.

[OhGodMyLife]

I'm gonna iso tere and figure out who the scum is, get ready to sheep me once I'm done

[Kitty Galore]

And is anyone questioning the huge push that Nero made day one on Town KlingonCelt to get her lynched, is there some reason that has just been pushed aside?

Why do you think my push on KC was scummy?

Well, she was town, who had RL issues, seems like an easy push. IIRC you said you thought she was scum because of the way she was/was not responding to you? What response were you looking for, as far as being town goes? I didn't see her do anything that was scummy, that didn't have anything to do with your previous experience with her. Am I missing something?

@kitty,

My reason for speculating was the post in which it was declared that ika was either VT or goon. Depending on the number of town aligned roles still alive, we either can / can't afford to lynch him for a flip.

What I was wondering is, how many scum roles are usually in a game this this size? 3-4?

Ok, I am just curious why you phrased your question the way you did, the one above quoted seems more simple to understand and answer.

[evilpacman18]

Alright I'm finally gonna stop coasting in this game this weekend.

[Dessew]

FYI, it's 33 °C here, it's too hot to think, so I'll post later during the weekend, but not now.

[OhGodMyLife]

OK, have a brain dump.

Wow, you guys are quite salty! Lots of policy lynch talk. I gather a fair few of you have played together before and there may be some grudges, let's try to keep friendly, eh?

By the looks of things the play is Klingon, Nero with a side order of very possibly Espeonage. So I bore that in mind when reading through.

Klingon and Nero have been tunnelling on each other since just out of RVS (38/39). Klingon starts as a style read at 49. I didn't like Klingon's mislynch post at 95 one bit. Thought Nero's pick up of ika's edit at 115 looked towny. 169 looked towny too - I can see where he is coming from here. A bit abrasive yes, but this seems to be town mindset. Far more likely to be town than scum.

I do think Klingon looks rather vague. Didn't much like her deciding Salamance was scum in 212 because he supported Nero regardless of claim. OMGUS at 361. I really feel for her personal situation and wish her son a perfect recovery but the scum vibes I am getting started well before the family emergency. This is where my vote is going I think.

Espeonage - well. It's barely a wagon. I do see and agree with Woody's post at 494 about going with the flow and I guess I could get with this but to be honest I'm in a similar headspace a little right now myself in that I need to dial my natural town tryhard tendencies back quite a bit for RL reasons. So I have empathy. I don't want to lynch based on something like that today.

Out of those three it's Klingoncelt for me VOTE: Klingoncelt. It also feels like the game is stalling and people are getting demotivated. That's L-1.

Assorted commentary on other folk, more geared to the start as I started skimming:

Townish:

Salamence20 replacing waxing and waning. Claim of ascetic right out of the gate and clarifies as a D2 ascetic IC (wut? really?) in 179. Would a scum do that? It really seems like unnecessary attention, plus we will know D2 anyway. Wish he'd come back to the game though - seems like he's checked out because outed. Would rather see independent thought than sheeping nero.
Kaboose - softing something role check related? Scum wouldn't put their necks on the line like this surely. Had a wagon for a bit but I don't see this.
Greyfoxx - I really liked their entry and reading through their body of work looks good.
pisscop - As scum I was in Horses mafia with him on an alt as town and this is reading really similar to me.
Woody - like his 269 - felt very genuine
IamInnocent - don't agree with outcome of 332 but liked the thought processes behind it.
conmanmick - probtown too - just kept on nodding along, felt like similar thought processes when reading thread.

Everyone else:

ika - lolhammer central, he has been doing something but it's as trolly as fuck, so trolly I went to the wiki to check if Lynchers are allowed in Normal games (they aren't BTW). ika, where do you stand on people other than nero? Nero calls him out for not being trollsy town in 102, so is he giving him what he wants? I hated the editing in 115 and Nero was right to call him on it. Unsure about ika. Need to see more. I see you've said you want to die so you can read the spectator board, if you feel that way why not replace out? It's not fair on the other players if you are trying to get lynched so you can afk.

everyone else hasn't really registered.

boon - does policy lynches apparently - and lolhammers I think from reading something? Can't remember what though for the life of me. might not do so later on. Mainly for own notes so I don't forget, not a read per se.

I got scumvibes from radja from 277 read list. Agree with Quaroth on that. Felt like too much policy going on.
Didn't like PM's 272 much. Why just a FOS but no vote?

Quoting this here so I can come back and dive into it after this shift I'm working tonight. This is the biggest gift of a post a dead scum could ever leave behind. Everyone should try to analyze this post for themselves tbh and see what they think it points to. This game is too dead anyway maybe if everyone gave thoughts from this we could get a head of steam going again. I think at least one scum is going to be in the group of people not even named, as in the "everyone else hasn't really registered," but I haven't gone and compared the post to the playerlist just yet to narrow that down.

[RadiantCowbells]

Votecount #4.3

Dessew

(3): Nero Cain, Kaboose, I am Innocent

Kaboose

(1): Xtoxm

Nero Cain

I Am Innocent

OhGodMyLife

ika

evilpacman18

Kitty Galore

ConManMick

Xtoxm

Not Voting

(6): ika, OhGodMyLife, Kitty Galore, Dessew, ConManMick, evilpacman18

With

10

alive it's

6

to lynch.

Night will fall in (expired on 2015-08-15 11:00:00).

Prods were sent out following this post.

[ika]

in be pm is sent

[ika]

damn it...

got ninjaed

[ika]

funny thing is i forgot about this game for a while

[Xtoxm]

VOTE: Dessew

[ConManMick]

V/LA until tomorrow night