Mini Normal 1707 - Frog Mafia! - GAME OVER - TOWN WIN!

[zakk]

VOTE: Maxwell

I'm ready when y'all are

L-1 btw. Declare intent before hammering

[zakk]

Also, you should claim now Maxwell


Btw mala I play extremely hypocritically as either alignment so me thinking notscience is scum for things that I'm doing is just par for the course. If you're feeling agreeable I'm sure you'll understand

Anyone have any other questions for me, make it short and sweet so I can see and answer them easily

[AxleGreaser]

o if me, axle, shiro, singer, notscience, and mala are all town

Well that would be true except you are scum.

I notice that you have not actually addressed why Max is scum.

AT all.

So one of the townies voting max REALLY SHOULD UNVOTE RIGHT NOW

otherwise one of his buddies might just end the day.

[AxleGreaser]

Btw mala I play extremely hypocritically as either alignment

So you claim to play the way you know is anti town, as both alignments.

The way you want to lynch people for playing, and you call THAT OBJECTIVELY SCUMMY.

and you do not compare for them whether or not they are playing just like they do.


Yeahhh.... that is about as hypocritical and scummy as it can get.

So will someone unvote Max and vote this scummy as guy.


Please.

Pretty Please even.

[Shiro]

unvote

Soly because I want to wait till he answers my question and I don't want to risk anyone hammering while I am asleep before I have said answer

[AxleGreaser]

unvote

Soly because I want to wait till he answers my question and I don't want to risk anyone hammering while I am asleep before I have said answer

Way to go girl(?) BTW IKA does sometime just hammer. So I really needed that. Ta for being town. You had me little worried I was wrong for a while there.

[AxleGreaser]

oh and one more thing:

I'd lynch MS Mala.

but your leading the wagon on VeeGee, and sytill havent explained why he scum and not just useless.

BBT associate useless with scum and if they are town he just goes *well they were useless*

how is this bad in any way?

did i ever say it was bad and did i ever say you were supicious?

Well actually is there is lot you didnt say.

So while as far as I know lynching people for bad, instead of for getting a scum PM, is universally accepted as bad itself.

There is the problem that you may have to lynch them as people who play bad enough are reasonably unreabale, as they just dont do anything as either alignment.
But thats may have to, not prioritise lynching useless weak players for being who they are.

As you have pointed out what you have not said.

What are your views on BBT and Zakk?

[AxleGreaser]

unvote

Soly because I want to wait till he answers my question and I don't want to risk anyone hammering while I am asleep before I have said answer

I am glad you want your question answered but you do remember he was not

go out of his(max's) way to defend him(zakk).

pushing Zakk as town but just responding with his read.

and he did indicate where and why that read developed?

I am pretty sure zakk was not as overtly anti town in your game, with him.

We are up to zakk playing quite bit differently.

and while he had plenty to say about other people the guy he just put at L-1 not so much....

I am kinda amazed by what it seems to be taking to get third vote on Zakk. (maybe its that third vote thing?)

[AxleGreaser]

Anyone have any other questions for me, make it short and sweet so I can see and answer them easily

You could start with answering my ones that you have been dodging all game.

[AxleGreaser]

Here are 4 interesting ones.

@Axle: I'm sorry for being unhelpful before. I'll try to change that.

Why were you?
Your Intention was?

What on earth was shiny about that RVS vote. 18

Why anything but engage?

[AxleGreaser]

you're pretty useless yourself,

ur funny.

[Shiro]

Axl most importantly I want to see what made him go from likely scum to top of the town reads

I can see how someone with meta on him can justify a town read, but soly from this game and at the the top of the town reads ? I find it impropable.

I want Max to say

I was scum reading zach and then

this and this happened and changed my mind. With this and this being something valid. He did bring the fact that, why zakk would play anti-town knowing it is anti town play if he was scum but that is wifom and hardly enough to put someone at the top of your town reads.

[AxleGreaser]

ATTENTION

@VeeGee

A number of my posts address statement as being about

you

rather than your play. I abjectly apologise. But I am defending you (by making sure any wagon on you has reasons) as succinctly as possible, which unfortunately happens by referring to you rather than your play. Soory/oops and or whatever.

There is the problem that you may have to lynch them as people who play bad enough are reasonably unreabale, as they just dont do anything as either alignment.
But thats may have to, not prioritise lynching useless weak players for being who they are.

[AxleGreaser]

Axl most importantly I want to see what made him go from likely scum to top of the town reads

I can see how someone with meta on him can justify a town read, but soly from this game and at the the top of the town reads ? I find it impropable.

Yeah Ok. {

B

l

u

s

h

} I missed thinking about how big that is. (Why red stripes? Flaggelation)

One tricky thing will be him remembering the context, how it seemed at that time,
if all my banging on about zakk has since changed his mind back at all.

but yeah i could do with hearing that. Not sure its claim worthy, considering my lovely shiny self proclaimed anti town playing wagon.

I want Max to say

I was scum reading zach and then

this and this happened and changed my mind. With this and this being something valid. He did bring the fact that,

I am not sure but need to check if it was at that time clear, in the thread, just how bad 193 was.

why zakk would play anti-town knowing it is anti town play if he was scum but that is wifom and hardly enough to put someone at the top of your town reads.

[MaxwellPuckett]

Max have you played with zakk before? Alternatively have you read his games?

--irrelevant bits not relating to the question--

Which brings me back to max and my question. If he has no knowledge of zakk (

which seems to be the case

) I find his defense of him to be awful and one of two things.

1. Scum trying to defend partner and incase he gets lynched give Wifom of none would blatantly defend his partner so obviously.

Now I believe zakk is town which brings us to
2. Scum who is defending zakk so when zakk dies/gets lynched he can get told you so cred.

Is it impossible to be town defending a real town read? No but it is more unlike it in my opinion.

No, I haven't played with zakk before, or read his games.

This post is terrible. Like.. really bad. You said, literally, right there... that you were TOWNREADING zakk. So why is it strange that I would be townreading him????

You had a slight townread from me before because I remember liking one of your few posts, but your conclusion here is just ridiculous. I'm kind of baffled that no one but Axle brought up this post, and even then he didn't really seem to have a problem with it.

Zakk is probably town, and besides that, I was getting kind of pissed at him being called a VI, or his posting style being called bad or useless, when that wasn't what I was seeing in his later play. It's kind of a thing for me, I don't like seeing people get insulted.

The only thing that gives me pause is that you unvoted to hear me out, but your original question breaks down if you look at it critically. Like at all. You've set up a scenario where my answer to this one question will determine your vote, proven by what you said when you unvoted me. Putting aside the fact that you don't seem to have anything to say about my play besides your one stretched assumption, if you were actually trying to figure out my alignment, you wouldn't have asked this question. You already know the answer, I bolded it.

Your unvote was an attempt to look towny while you waited for my answer. I'm sure, after this, you will say, 'okay, I was right, bringing Max up to L-1'.

VOTE: Shiro

VeeGee isn't priority, considering his play's usually like this. Backburner I guess, and I don't like leaving players like this to late-game, but.. eh.

Metal Sonic is a better lynch, I'm still waiting for him to weigh in on.. everything. A better lynch than Sonic, but a worse lynch than Shiro, is Malakittens. I'm also liking BBT less as the day goes on. AxleGreaser is very probably town, as is zakk. Singersigner remains one of the few people on my wagon whose vote actually feels legitimate, so I'm forced to reevaluate how I was reading her.

And finally:
I'm a VT.

PEDIT: While writing this, I saw that Shiro actually, *gasp* posted something about me that isn't this post. I'll check it out.

[Malakittens]

Why am I a decent lynch? >.>

[Shiro]

that you were TOWNREADING zakk. So why is it strange that I would be townreading him????

Based soly on meta not his play in this game and I have made that perfectly clear. I find it strange that you can townread him based on his play in this game alone.

Had I not finished a game with him a few days ago I would be pushing his lynch right now.

Zakk is probably town, and besides that, I was getting kind of pissed at him being called a VI, or his posting style being called bad or useless, when that wasn't what I was seeing in his later play. It's kind of a thing for me, I don't like seeing people get insulted.

Then tell me how you have found his posts useful and how you came to the conclusion that he is town.

[AxleGreaser]

@Singer.

Hi, Singer. (if you are at all confused, it might be worth looking up every time(pretty much?) i ever start post with Hi and what its intent is.)

I, I, I, blub blub (picture me blowing bubbles) ....

but zip it. me speaking right now would be bad. So dont ask..
but I'll be back.

Ok so I am back to talk about my bubbles.
So I approve of the existence of a wagon and of pressure to see if anything pops. So I was "zip it".

but i really dont agree with some of your reasoning ... quite a bit.
I could just have a go at it. BUT
Max is currently talking to Shiro
and id prefer to discuss it with you, as with what i understand of your reasoning, I am little surprised that you agree with your reasoning,
and thus I want to give you space to clarify or modify it.

I must have some kinda town read on you eh.

[AxleGreaser]

Zakk is probably town, and besides that, I was getting kind of pissed at him being called a VI, or his posting style being called bad or useless, when that wasn't what I was seeing in his later play. It's kind of a thing for me, I don't like seeing people get insulted.

Ok go through his later play and tell me which bits you liked please.

[ika]

i forget about this gaem fast....

@vee: post 42, i dont see some unknown player jsut saying that out of the blue unless they know me

@axle: i gave my view on zakk already andfor BBT i am jsut kinda ignoring him cus in every game i have played i have scum read him so im jsut putting it on ignore for now

[MaxwellPuckett]

One: Zakk playing in an anti-town way at the beginning is not a reason for my townread. Though, now that I think about what you were saying in 461, that's like.. really, really shit WiFom to perform as scum. Who comes up with a plan for themselves to purposely play badly and then not play badly, hoping that someone will say what I'm saying? Also, you lose points for dismissing something as 'wifom' because that's a lazy as hell way to try and win and argument. This whole game is wifom, with the exception of PRs. Deal.

Zakk gets a townread from me because... holy shit read his posts?? Like the notscience case and read are bad but beyond that, he makes cases, tries to figure things out, blah blah blah generic shit. I can't believe I'm sitting here making a town-case on zakk for scum(Shiro) but I'll do it because Axle wants an answer too, and because I'm sick of zakk scumreads in this game.

-168, I like the trying to get sonic to do things without just dismissing him as scum right off the bat. (This was before sonic continued to Not Do Things, and fell into the scum pile)
-i like that they saw a notscience lynch wasn't going to happen, and instead of continuing to push it, decided to look for other scum instead. 210
-evidence of reads changing as things happen instead of forced reads
-i like their posts, they are thinking. i like their posts??? they go digging for shit and they ENGAGE with people and gggghhhhsgdah
-i like 429, it seems very honest with how he's feeling about Mala

i can go get more. I'm honestly just surprised that you, Axle, aren't liking his play. Besides his earlier play, what do you not like about his recent posts?

[singersigner]

@Singer.

Hi, Singer. (if you are at all confused, it might be worth looking up every time(pretty much?) i ever start post with Hi and what its intent is.)

I, I, I, blub blub (picture me blowing bubbles) ....

but zip it. me speaking right now would be bad. So dont ask..
but I'll be back.

Ok so I am back to talk about my bubbles.
So I approve of the existence of a wagon and of pressure to see if anything pops. So I was "zip it".

but i really dont agree with some of your reasoning ... quite a bit.
I could just have a go at it. BUT
Max is currently talking to Shiro
and id prefer to discuss it with you, as with what i understand of your reasoning, I am little surprised that you agree with your reasoning,
and thus I want to give you space to clarify or modify it.

I must have some kinda town read on you eh.

...wut.

[AxleGreaser]

@axle: i gave my view on zakk already

Yeah and I found what said di not indicate your view of his alignment

You read his iso and tell me how is not a setup of a VI.

did i ever say you were supicious?

Are you saying he is a VI so he cant be scum?

He claims his play is

Btw mala I play extremely hypocritically as either alignment so me thinking notscience is scum for things that I'm doing is just par for the course.

par for the course.

I claim he is dodging stuff and he is.

Thats not just being a VI. (using what i understand to be your definition of that word)

[Shiro]

168 is superficious plus he does have him on his scum list if I am not mistaken.

Continuing to press notscience case was practically suicide as either alignment like. There is nothing town about it. Just sane play

3rd Not alignment indicative tbh

I can give you the 4th point it seems kind of honest but I do not see how it can be a top town read material indication.


Btw that not what I said.

You said it makes no sense for scum to play badly and then admit to knowing this is anti town.
I said that for all intents and purpuses he may have realised he was playing badly and then said something to cover it up. Your line of thought was shaky and wifomish. Plus again hardly something for anyone to draw a top town read from.

i forget about this gaem fast....

Then stop forgetting. We played a game together before. You can do far better than that.


P.S If I suddenly stop replying it is 5:16 am (cause yay mafia is keeping me awake) and I might just fall asleep out of nowhere

[MaxwellPuckett]

Shiro, you're so hung up on the fact that zakk is a top townread of mine.

-About 168, he DOES have sonic on his scumlist now.

-Notscience case. Fair enough.

-third point. i assume you mean 'zakk's reads changing'? How is that not alignment indicative? Scum make up their reads, town thinks about them. Your arguments continually do not make sense.

-holy shit, 5am?

Once AGAIN, zakk's early bad play and what alignment that may or may not have indicated DOES NOT HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH MY TOWNREAD OF HIM. You and Axle gave reasons for why scum would play in this way. I gave a reason for why town would play in this way to explain how zakk's early play does not definitely make him scum. I'm taking it as null. Holy fried fucking chicken fingers, it's not the reason for my townread.