2016 US Presidential Election Thread

[Untrod Tripod]

sometimes they create a sense of community.

wow that's completely useless!

[zoraster]

If you say so.

[Psyche]

helps the school's financial sustainability
the sense of community i mean

[Rhinox]

College sports are not an "extracurricular" for most actual students. they're just a thing you CAN spectate and are forced to spend hundreds of dollars on every semester.

they're an exclusive club for a very tiny group of students that does nothing to further the actual mission of a university

Again, there's a lot more to "college sports" than the big D1 programs.

D2 and D3 level sports are a lot more inclusive, and generally don't cost other students anything to spectate. Many of the students playing sports at these levels are also achieving academic honors. Lots of the bigger schools have student led club teams and compete against other schools' club teams.

The big D1 programs are also a draw for admissions, which I'm guessing isn't taken into account when deciding if a program is operating in the red. I'd bet that 30 full athletic scholarships to run a successful D1 program gets more students enrolled than giving the equivalent in academic scholarships. And if you hypothetically discontinue a big program like a D1 football program because its operating in the red, and you lose a ton of admissions because students no longer want to go there, that's even less money coming in to spend on the actual mission of a university. And considering a lot of these schools are state schools, loosing admissions likely means losing state money as well. And like, the ohio state marching band likely wouldn't exist in its current state if the ohio state football team didn't exist in its current state.

[Brandi]

So does the Illuminati

I heard the illuminati was full of p good guys

[Yosarian2]

Yeah; I have no problem with extra-curricular activities that are actually for students, but college football (and basketball, and some other major college sports) are basically just unpaid minor-league teams that are loosely associated with collages. For the most part they're huge money-sinks, and totally distract from the main mission of the colleges, and the way the athletes are treated is unethical.

You are aware that college football pays for all the other sports in most schools right?

A few colleges make money on their football teams, but only a few. Most college football teems lose a ton of money.

http://www.al.com/sports/index.ssf/2014 ... 20_fb.html

The report found that expenses exceeded revenue at all but 20 schools in the Football Bowl Subdivision. The average loss among the Power 5 conferences was $2.3 million. At all other FBS schools, it was $17.6 million.

And this was a study conducted by the NCAA itself.

[Untrod Tripod]

D2 and D3 level sports are a lot more inclusive

I went to a D3 school and this was not my experience when I tried to participate with our soccer team. they still recruit their talent, not pick it up from students who would have gone to the school anyway

also you pay an "athletics" fee every semester at most schools regardless of whether you go see them or not. I paid my school more for athletics than for anything else. that includes tech, transportation, and the student health center. I will shell out about 900 dollars this year to Athletics out of pocket despite the fact that as a TA I get a tuition waiver. Just the athletics fee comes out to about 10% of my yearly paycheck.

it's absolute fucking horseshit

[Rhinox]

I went to a D3 school and this was not my experience when I tried to participate with our soccer team. they still recruit their talent, not pick it up from students who would have gone to the school anyway

I also went to a D3 school, and played football. While I was "recruited", it was more like talking to some coaches on the phone a couple times and them trying to convince me to go there, as D3 schools can not give out athletic scholarships. There were over 100 freshmen that showed up at camp tho every year and not all were "recruited". Many were dropouts, but nobody was forced off the team. I also joined the track and field team as a thrower (non-recruited, just showed up basically), and joined the XC team one year and finished last in every race. Was never told I could not participate in any of the sports I wanted to play.

I did forget about the athletic fee tho. At that point in my life I wasn't smart enough to look at what I was paying for, just kept signing the promissory notes. In your situation I can understand why it would bother you. For me, it was just a tiny drop in an already very big bucket. I was more concerned with figuring out how to come up with the ~$1,000 per semester for textbooks.

[sthar8]

helps the school's financial sustainability
the sense of community i mean

College sports are not an "extracurricular" for most actual students. they're just a thing you CAN spectate and are forced to spend hundreds of dollars on every semester.

they're an exclusive club for a very tiny group of students that does nothing to further the actual mission of a university

Again, there's a lot more to "college sports" than the big D1 programs.

D2 and D3 level sports are a lot more inclusive, and generally don't cost other students anything to spectate. Many of the students playing sports at these levels are also achieving academic honors. Lots of the bigger schools have student led club teams and compete against other schools' club teams.

The big D1 programs are also a draw for admissions, which I'm guessing isn't taken into account when deciding if a program is operating in the red. I'd bet that 30 full athletic scholarships to run a successful D1 program gets more students enrolled than giving the equivalent in academic scholarships. And if you hypothetically discontinue a big program like a D1 football program because its operating in the red, and you lose a ton of admissions because students no longer want to go there, that's even less money coming in to spend on the actual mission of a university. And considering a lot of these schools are state schools, loosing admissions likely means losing state money as well. And like, the ohio state marching band likely wouldn't exist in its current state if the ohio state football team didn't exist in its current state.

Did you read the first article I linked? Enrollment bump affects a very small percentage of schools.

Further, the expenditures are much higher than just the players' scholarships. What about the multimillion dollar coach salaries or university subsidies?

And even more, if you are correct, spending that money attracts

students who are already college bound

. These kids are going to school somewhere, it's not like they're going to forgo continuing education because they can't find a school with a football team they like. Spending that money on tuition assistance instead could benefit students who would otherwise be unable to attend at all.

[Untrod Tripod]

I also went to a D3 school, and played football. While I was "recruited", it was more like talking to some coaches on the phone a couple times and them trying to convince me to go there, as D3 schools can not give out athletic scholarships. There were over 100 freshmen that showed up at camp tho every year and not all were "recruited". Many were dropouts, but nobody was forced off the team. I also joined the track and field team as a thrower (non-recruited, just showed up basically), and joined the XC team one year and finished last in every race. Was never told I could not participate in any of the sports I wanted to play.

well that must have been nice.

the soccer coach at my undergrad literally sent me to an empty field to "join them for practice" after I had a meeting with him to talk about the possibility of me doing tryouts next year. then he totally ignored my attempt to contact him via email afterwords to see if there had been a mixup.

so

[Psyche]

lol

[Untrod Tripod]

yeah it was hilarious

[Psyche]

i mean
i can totally imagine it as a comedy plotpoint

[Yosarian2]

Dropping the subject of sports for a second I get pretty nervous when people start talking about cutting academic funding for colleges. The US still has a world class college education system and we can't afford to screw that up. Yeah the expense is becoming a problem but still, if we screw up our higher education system we've got no chance at being economically competitive.

[sthar8]

academia is a massive parasite and would benefit from being entirely socialized.

[Kublai Khan]

College sports are not an "extracurricular" for most actual students. they're just a thing you CAN spectate and are forced to spend hundreds of dollars on every semester.

they're an exclusive club for a very tiny group of students that does nothing to further the actual mission of a university

Again, there's a lot more to "college sports" than the big D1 programs.

D2 and D3 level sports are a lot more inclusive, and generally don't cost other students anything to spectate. Many of the students playing sports at these levels are also achieving academic honors. Lots of the bigger schools have student led club teams and compete against other schools' club teams.

The big D1 programs are also a draw for admissions, which I'm guessing isn't taken into account when deciding if a program is operating in the red. I'd bet that 30 full athletic scholarships to run a successful D1 program gets more students enrolled than giving the equivalent in academic scholarships. And if you hypothetically discontinue a big program like a D1 football program because its operating in the red, and you lose a ton of admissions because students no longer want to go there, that's even less money coming in to spend on the actual mission of a university. And considering a lot of these schools are state schools,

loosing

admissions likely means losing state money as well. And like, the ohio state marching band likely wouldn't exist in its current state if the ohio state football team didn't exist in its current state.

Your point is invalid, bruh.

Seriously though, do colleges make up those operating costs (and beyond) in alumni contributions? I always thought that keeping boosters and donors happy was the number one reason that athletic programs are given such prominence. More so than admissions.

[quadz08]

they keep boosters and donors happy and those boosters and donors contribute directly back to the athletic program, for the most part

[Espeonage]

Serious question, how bad could Kanye be as president?

[Psyche]

his term would end early
because usa would dissolve as a concept

[Kublai Khan]

Serious question, how bad could Kanye be as president?

Depends entirely on how well he chooses his advisers and how well he listens to them.

Left on his own devices he does stuff like saying "George W. Bush does not care about black people" during a very public charity fundraiser.

[Untrod Tripod]

Serious question, how bad could Kanye be as president?

I honestly don't know how much he would really be able to get done. I doubt he has a firm grasp on what exactly the President DOES

[T S O]

Are we actually debating the merits of Kanye in the White House?

[SilverWolf]

Serious question, how bad could Kanye be as president?

How can this possibly be a serious question?

[SleepyKrew]

He'd probably be better than the current Republican frontrunner.

[Katsuki]

Probably better than the Democratic one too.