Mini Normal 1716 - Flavourless Mafia - [Game Over]

[Cavane]

I'm here. If the mod desires to replace me I'll be happy to step aside. I just got distracted waiting for the other replacements to arrive and got out of the habit if checking in. I'm at lunch now, but I'll catch up when I get home this afternoon and give my reads/responses.

[Draynth]

I'm happy enough as is, there have been too many replacements this game already.
THE DEADLINE WILL NOW RESUME AS OF THE NEXT VOTECOUNT

[Draynth]

Day 2, Votecount 5

Inanity (4): ChannelDelibird , ConManMick, Vedith, Performer

(L-3)

Cavane (2): Catboi, Inanity

ConManMick (1): Cavane

Evvenomous (1): RadiantCowbells

Vedith (1): Aneninen

Aneninen (0):
Performer (0):
RadiantCowbells(0):
Catboi (0):
ChannelDeliBird (0):

Not Voting (1):

Evvenomous
*

If you notice a mistake in any of the votecounts, please don't hesitate to let me know either in thread or via pm.

With 10 alive it takes 6 to lynch or 6 to no lynch.

Deadline

: Sunday October 4^th, 2015 17:00 PM Irish Time. (UTC)

Countdown to deadline

: (expired on 2015-10-04 17:00:00)

[/area]

[Vedith]

Well 5 days to decide who to vote for now...

@Dray I am voting Muffin as it stands.

[Draynth]

Yep I just finished updating it now.

[Vedith]

Thanks

[Draynth]

I've removed the most recent prods (4 people) as one of the prodded players raised a fair point.

[ConManMick]

Post

[EVvenomous]

@ dray

could you replace me actually I just have 0 time for this rn, sorry for my general absence guys

[Cavane]

102 is massively opportunistic. They just immediately come into the game and their first vote is conveniently on the largest wagon. Justification in 108 is weaksauce, makes no sense whatsoever that bacde saying he's "a powerful player" is aggro/offputting - it's maybe annoying, but the idea it'd be worthy of a vote is ridiculous.

112 adds nothing to the dicussion, it's just a waffly non-opinion on guyett's dumb fakevig. He says it stood out, but then doesn't have an actual read on it, which raises the question of why it actually stood out if he has no opinion.

116 and 151 are both overly questioning. I feel like it's a scum thing to ask too many questions to appear engaged in the game without actually contributing anything. They're also heavily pressuring bacde, in a way that looks a lot more like scum trying to grill someone rather than actual town inquisitiveness. "why behave so unpleasantly?" doesn't even really feel game-relevant, cavane seems to have used it like it's some indicator of scumminess which is ridiculous. "why can't both of us be scum?" is such a ridiculous question to ask and I'm not sure why town would ask it at all. He also asks for bacde'sd reasoning but doesn't seem to care too much, there's no insistence or follow-up at all.

reasoning for voting guyett in 182 I also don't like, statement that "Nothing [Guyett]'s said or done thus far is helpful to the town." is insanely vague and fairly ridiculous. Thought guyett to that point was fairly town, but regardless of that, if you're going to single out someone as being "not helpful" why guyett of all people? There's a million people lurking their asses off, and he's the one being not helpful? Follows it up with saying in 187 that "Guyett's reasoning for trying to prevent the wagon on him is also pretty poor", which is also vague as hell and doesn't actually explain why he thinks it's poor.

Then, he posts essentially nothing but filler until showing up to make an INCREDIBLY CONVENIENT vote for banana in 306. This is blatant, bold-faced opportunism. puts him at L-1 with his only comment being "I am okay with removing banana's slot" wwithout ever exlaining WHY. It's voting on the largest wagon with flimsy reasoning, this vote in and of itself was more or less a scumclaim.

Vote on mick in 345 is similarly terribad, mick was a wagon with some momentum, and all he says is "I'm interested in hearing what he has to say". That's the third time Cavane makes a sheepy wagon vote with a tiny, crappy little reason attached to it. He's made one original vote that was barely justified. He looks a lot like someone who's just going along with lynches because he can.

347 is filler and I don't like the way he laments both deaths being town - it feels like a "look at me I'm so town" type statement, where most people aren't really going to concern themselves too much with the deaths.

And then again, from there, nothing but straight filler.

There's a lot of terrible lurkers in this game, Cavane takse top of the list for me though just because all his votes have been so opportunistic.

Starting with my response to this.

I later admitted that my initial vote on bacde was more due to me disliking his style than actual scumtells. I actually had a pretty good feeling he was town by the end of the day, which is why I backed off of questioning him. I have no clue why you think it was ridiculous to ask why Muffin and I couldn't both be scum. Bacde had repeatedly stated that he felt strongly that one or the other of us was scum. He specifically stated one us two. If he had scumtells on both of us, why would it be one of us two? I felt that was a pretty natural question to ask.

What needs explaining about my statement on Guyett? But since you insist, at the time I made that post, his play had consisted entirely of a trollclaim during RVS and, as you call them, filler posts. Unhelpful. Since you're scumreading me for similar reasons, I'm not sure why you disagree with me there.

As for the banana vote, there's really not much to say. Your predecessor voted just before me based on Banana pretty much ruining his slot for whoever would have replaced him. As stated in my vote post, I agreed with that. I felt we had gained everything of value we were going to out of Day 1, but that we might learn something from banana's death, even if he wasn't scum. Unfortunately that wasn't the case.

Overall, I'm really not buying your case on me. According to you, a town player isn't allowed to bandwagon. I submit that bandwagons are one of the most effective ways of getting information.

[Cavane]

I really like CDB's reads, and not just because he realizes I'm town. The argument about Muffin's interest in PRs is especially valid, I think.

I'm satisfied with Mick getting re-engaged with the game, and at this point I have no room to talk.

I really don't like Anen's claim. I can't be totally certain, but my gut feel is that there aren't masons in this game. I don't have a ton of experience here though, so I may be out to lunch on that. But moreover, I don't understand why he would claim at this point. However, it does basically clear him of being the SK, so there's that.

CDB - I think you were way too fast to vote Vedith based on his assumption of scum having daytalk. Isn't that pretty common?

[catboi]

Extremely good to know you don't buy my case on you,

Cavane

. Knowing you don't believe me when I say you're scum changes my whole worldview. Really makes me think.

Asking someone why both you and muffin couldn't be scum together just reads like a ridiculously unnatural question that doesn't flow from a town thought process at all. It seems utterly unimportant to know why they think you can't be scum together, and it makes no sense for that to be your question when someone expresses suspicion of you.

Guyett's posts were short and trolly but I don't think it was that hard to read town intent into them. It looks like the kind of trollish posting scum frequently latch on to to push a mislynch.

Referring to my predecessor's actions as a defense for your voting banana is exceptionally weak, it's trying to avoid responsibility by laying blame on another slot. Its refusing to own up for a crappy, opportunistic vote.

You claim to have voted to gain information, and that your shameless bandwagoning was supposed to in some way provide information, yet you have absolutely nothing to show for it. What the hell were you supposed to learn from those votes? It's a completely mystery. Pretext of an "information lynch" is a terrifically easy one for scum to hide behind, and you then promptly failed to even attempt any analysis of the wagon. This doesn't look like you're genuinely scumhunting, at all.

Well, at least your wagoning gave

me

information

@Inanity:

God, pretentious alts are the

worst

. Your opening post made essentially no substantial contribution and just latched on to a random lurker wagon. It doesn't come across town motivated whatsoever and adds essentially zero new information to the game.

Further than that, your attempted defense of the replace out is completely ignoring the point I'm trying to get across. You note yourself he's in several games. He didn't replace sitewide, only in this game specifically. He left this game for some reason, without saying anything in-thread, and chose to continue in his others. The most likely conclusion by far is that he couldn't handle being scum, and flaked from this rather than address the wagon on him. That tends to happen with people who don't know how to play scum, who have a guilty conscience about their role. Him being less interested in posting in this game points pretty strongly to him not liking his role.

Well 5 days to decide who to vote for now...

@Dray I am voting Muffin as it stands.

I think you're probably town but I really want to see more from you here

[catboi]

I really don't like Anen's claim. I can't be totally certain, but my gut feel is that there aren't masons in this game. I don't have a ton of experience here though, so I may be out to lunch on that. But moreover, I don't understand why he would claim at this point. However, it does basically clear him of being the SK, so there's that.

LMAO ARE YOU FREAKING KIDDING ME

[Inanity]

Ad hominem is the

worst.

I disagree with your analysis on Muffin's replace-out. From my observation, town newbies flake under pressure at similar rates as scum. In addition, there is no evidence that Muffin was engaged in this game at all. The replace-out is not as damning as you want it to be.

[catboi]

None of that actually addresses the point I'm making lmfao

[RadiantCowbells]

Nothing here addresses how adorable Annie is.

[RadiantCowbells]

Ev's scum 100%.

I find it suspicious as fuck how many people said they wanted an EV lynch but won't vote him with me.

[Inanity]

Fine, I'll spell it out. Maybe Muffin chose to replace out of this particular game

because

he was failing to engage with it, as opposed to others. That is what I find to be most likely, and it is not indicative of alignment.

[catboi]

Ev's scum 100%.

I find it suspicious as fuck how many people said they wanted an EV lynch but won't vote him with me.

As far as I know I'm the only one who said anything about him? At this point in time I sort of just have to be practical with my vote (which means I might move to inanity at some point). You prove the wagon's there, I don't think I'd oppose it.

[Aneninen]

Overall, I'm really not buying your case on me. According to you, a town player isn't allowed to bandwagon. I submit that bandwagons are one of the most effective ways of getting information.

I really don't like Anen's claim. I can't be totally certain, but my gut feel is that there aren't masons in this game. I don't have a ton of experience here though, so I may be out to lunch on that. But moreover, I don't understand why he would claim at this point. However, it does basically clear him of being the SK, so there's that.

Why, oh why did these give me the feeling that Cavane was trying to rolefish here?
Since the Vedith-wagon doesn't seem to move, I could join lynching him.

[catboi]

I've no real interest in lynching Vedith, Anen. Preference would go Cavane first, Inanity second.


BTW, Performer is completely dodging this topic. I probably need to back down my read of that slot. Which means I have approximately infinity scumreads.

[Aneninen]

K
VOTE: Cavane

[catboi]

my muffin theory just got shot to hell unfortunately given he was scum in one of the games he didn't replace out of, which means his flaking here was likely more motivated by being a piece of crap than by alignment

[RadiantCowbells]

If that was your theory, that explains why I'm voting town and you're voting scum.

[RadiantCowbells]

let's just pretend i'm neither drunk nor extremely tired and that post never happened, mmk?