Mini 1730: Suikoden U-Pick GAME OVER

[Jeanne11]

Well, since you can't provide it, I will scum-read you till you provide it.

[LicketyQuickety]

Hi everyone! Nice to see some familiar faces. For those who do not know us, we are Yukari, the 4-tulpa pseudo-hydra, and we look forward to playing with all of you.
http://wiki.tulpa.info/Official/WhatIsATulpa

I can across something similar in another game I was in. A player said they needed 5 votes for something to trigger. I forgot a lot about it including what was triggered and even if it was true or not. IDK though, it seems a tad "out there" for there to be a role like that in this game. I want to believe Elb is just joking...

This is a Varsoon game, anything could happen.. =p
VOTE: Varsoon

OK, I'm rereading the thread and this is the first post that pings me that I haven't addressed before.

[Klingoncelt]

Well, I need proof that you're town. And I mean solid proof, not just wishy-washy argument heavily influenced by you.

Jeanne, this is awful.

The only way anyone can prove anything is by mod confirmation or flip.

Exactly what proof have you provided that you are Town?

[Jeanne11]

It may be awful, but I will not be tricked again, get it?

Also, the proof I am town is that I wouldn't be voting LQ if I am scum.

[Jeanne11]

Believing wishy-washy argument caused the town to lose last time, so I am not taking any chances.

[Jeanne11]

If you are that desperate for town to lose again, continue believing possible lies, but I will not.

[LicketyQuickety]

Eight pages in one day, that seems like a lot.

Catch Up post~

Cuz he's scum?
How do you know?

Beat me to it. It was the first thing I thought when I was reading that right now...

All the fruit conversation looks like more the small talk to me. I have never seems casual small talk in a mafia game on mafiascum before. However, once a mafia partner and I had an elaborate code where everyone was food names although we never used it much. Honestly that is the first thing that I think about when I see this. I wonder if there is more going on, they both mentioned elderberries which seem like an odd choice to me.

SO yeah, Suzune, what are you afraid of seeing happen if we lynch elbirn as he has requested?

Well my gut feeling, although they are less common on mafia scum was jester. My second thought is one Lickey mentioned was that some power would unlock being close to death. This is based on a video game so I think the idea is not terribly far fetched.

This is a misrep of me unless you click on the post. it is actually comprised of 2 quotes: one where Elb says "because he's Scum?" and me responding "How do you know?"

I am really disappointed in you Suzune, like really. Why do this?

[LicketyQuickety]

Here ya go Titus:

Blackest Magick (Xtoxm & Pokerface) - 5 posts, 1's RVS, 1's fluff. I can see this sort of thing from Pokerface, but where is Xtoxm?

Brantz - 3 posts, only 1 with any (minimal) level of content.

Bright - WTF???

Elbirn - Is Titus right about him being a wagon sensor? (post 413) What is his connection with Titus? Why isn't he scumreading Jeanne?

FireKari - (post 162) - Are they claiming Oracle? What is AUA? Where's FireBringer?

Jeanne11 - Wants players to prove that they aren't Scum? How the hell is that supposed to happen?

LQ - Weirdly paranoid. Where's the self-confidence?

Pistachi0n - 3 posts, not exactly fluff, but still... it looks like he's trying to make it look like he cares.

Ranger - That "marked" thing bugs me, what is it? And Ranger claims that Wgeurts confirmed it?

Reasonably Rational - Holy cats, the hydra really is reasonably rational! They're the only sane player so far. The posts have content and make sense... Lean Town

Suzune - Seems to be as lost as I am.

Titus - Possibly outs an Oracle and a Sensor, then gets on LQ for rolefishing. Really bad. Then there's the fruit code thing with Elbirn. Are they masons? Neighbors? Lovers? Scum?

Wgeurts - Supposedly confirmed Ranger's "mark" by asking about it, even though Titus and I asked about it too... Otherwise nothing at all... Lean Scum.

I lean Town on Kling for this post cuz its the first time I have ever seen them make a reads list and all I've seen of them is Scum.

[LicketyQuickety]

Okay, well Titus is actually probably Town in this.

I hate to call it so early with Titus cause last time I called it early for her she was scum (the flashbacks of LOTH II creep up)

This feels town her.

But I have been wrong about that before.

@Titus you see what you do to me?

-Fire

Second post I don't like from this hydra.

[LicketyQuickety]

Blackest Magick (Xtoxm & Pokerface) From not voting to Titus(and made the vote earlier than I did, and I made the vote like 9 hours ago). Similarly, we know wgeurts made his vote sometime between when I did and now.
FireKari (Firebringer & Yukari) No change
Klingoncelt Not voting > Ranger
Ranger No change
Elbirn No change
Reasonably Rational (Drixx & Cerberus v666) Not voting > Titus
wgeurts klingon > Titus
Jeanne11 No change
Titus LQ to unvoting
BRantz No change
LicketyQuickety No change
pistachi0n Elbirn > Jeanne
Suzune No change.

-Cerb

VOTE: Reasonably Rational
Catching up on thread then will share more thoughts.
~Yukari

Want to know what exactly this vote is based on.

Go ahead fire, I'm ready for you're witty remark.

[LicketyQuickety]

I really don't like how Titus is turning this thread into a he said she said game and that goes for Jeanne11 as well.

[wgeurts]

So, my actual reads after rereading the game.

BlackestMagic -

Null-Town

So far there has been very little content from this slot and there posts feel rather disconnected at the moment. There's a lot of commenting here and there but not a lot of bite, and definitely no scum hunting at the moment. Despite all this there's nothing really scummy in their posts as of now, if this continues all game however I may have to rethink.

Questions:

Have you finished catching up?
What are your thoughts on LQ?
What made you possibly scum read titus in post 356?

FireKari -

Light-Scum

This slot has really just been posting fluff right from the start and I still haven't figured if yukari is a clever troll or is serious about all this weird confusing gibberish they post. Not to mention in post 134 they were town reading LQ and then later in post 189 they just naked vote him opportunistically with the reasoning consisting of "die scum". They have parked there ever since and have yet to provide reasoning, one of those that could be scum on a possible LQ town "anon"-wagon.

Questions

Why were you originally town-reading LQ and what caused the change?
What are your thoughts on matters right now?

Klingoncelt -

Null-Scum

So her first post (98) was already weird as not only is it contradictory it also feels really distanced, I fail to see why town would make that post. He just coasts-by until his reads list in post 452. It's really easily flung together, what makes it worse is that she doesn't actually vote any of the two scum reads she states in it. This lax, go with the flow attitude is not looking good in my eyes. The only thing that raises doubts with me is that she's probably over-extended in too many games. 8-12! That's way too many for me to manage so it may be affecting his play as well.

Questions

Why are you not voting anybody despite having stated scum-reads?
What are your reads after recent events?

Ranger -

Light-Scum

So let's start with Ranger, he comes in marks me with some unexplained thing and votes Brantz. His next post 125 and 126 he votes LQ without any reason what so ever, it feels a little opportunistic as LQ was under quite a bit of pressure around then. His scum read on Brantz is also complete crumpets as that slot hasn't actually really produced any content worth pushing yet. Apparently his "felt forced", go check post 9 to see why this really is rather far-fetched.
He then tunnels LQ while the pressure remains to exist on him. All the way up to post 748 where he suddenly creates a reads-list identical to titus' containing no reasoning for the reads at all. His 768 is also horrifically scummy, it looks likes he's setting himself up to vote whoever the town ends up deciding to lynch. He's not pushing, he's not making his own reasons and he's definitely not explaining any of his actions. I also call complete bollux that he was scum reading me early game and thus marked me, he stated all other scum reads but happened to leave me unmenioned?

Questions

Could you explain in your own words how everyone you listed as scum is actually scum in your eyes?
Why did you originally scum read LQ?
What do you think or Brantz now? He's not changed anything since you last scum read him but he's suddenly null.
Why where you originally scum reading me?
What does the mark do!? You may have fucked over town with a role that you could have used better.

Elibern -

Town

So I'm still a little confused about what he was doing early game. Was it some sort of gambit to try and catch scum? If so what conclusions did you draw?
Anyway, I like his play and he's been scum hunting. His thought process seems clear and natural so he can sit in my town pile for now.

Questions

Can you explain to me what on earth you were doing early-game and what results it gave you?

Jeanne -

Light-Town

Honestly, I don't know really know what to make of this slot. However after my reread I'm left with the feeling that it's town, for some weird gut reason. The whole lunatic fruit thing now makes sense so that's no longer an issue for me. I'm going to come back to this slot later as I want to sort it more firmly.

Titus -

Scum

So titus' first push on LQ is crumpets and right now she is using faulty logic to justify reads made by the wacky gambit thing she pulled off while disrepping the person speaking out against her reasoning she's applied to it. Then we have her pushing too much to look town. I had originally waved away my initial suspicions and RR does have a strong point against her. I've made up my mind, this isn't the town titus I know and I see the similarities to her scum game. Unless her town play has changed dramatically it's not this, it feels off and just like the last game I was right I'm going to trust my instinct and gut.

Reasonably Rational -

Light-Town

Their early game play was a bit lacking however their recent posts are looking a lot better and their logic is good. There's also drixx being his bitter self which tends to point to him being town, I could go on and give examples of why I think they're town if you want but I've summarised it here.

Brantz -

Null

Almost no content and almost nothing alignment indicative from this slot with a total of 3 posts. Null.

LQ -

Light-Town

Explained before. Hasn't changed.

Pistach -

Null-Town

This slot doesn't have a lot of content and I'd like to see more posts from them but they're leaning town for me.

Suzune -

Town

Suzune's early scepticism of Elibern's weirdness was pretty towny and her thoughts throughout the game seem natural. I can see a town-motivation in her posts.

Honestly my detail has become less throughout this post as I've gotten bored of making it so just ask me on things I'm missing/you want to know.

[LicketyQuickety]

Why are people saying Elb is obvTown?

Wreugets, could you point me to like 3 or so posts by Elb that you like?

Elb plays a very conservative Scum game. How's he not doing this as the game has progressed?

[Jeanne11]

So people who read other people town won't even care if those people turn out as scum. They'll be like 'but I read them as town.....'. Same goes for vice versa.

I am done with this. In the last game I played, town let themselves be manipulated far too easily, and same thing is happening in this one. >.>

[LicketyQuickety]

Why are people saying Elb is obvTown?

Wgeurts, could you point me to like 3 or so posts by Elb that you like?

Elb plays a very conservative Scum game. How's he not doing this as the game has progressed?

EBWOP. Sorry, confusing name.

[LicketyQuickety]

@Jeanne11, who do you see as Scum besides me?

[wgeurts]

So people who read other people town won't even care if those people turn out as scum. They'll be like 'but I read them as town.....'. Same goes for vice versa.

I am done with this. In the last game I played, town let themselves be manipulated far too easily, and same thing is happening in this one. >.>

If they flip scum I'll do some VCA, hunt for some possible associatives and if it's end-game; reread.
What's going wrong?
Also trust wins games, if town don't take a leap of faith at times it's hard for them to win and they will kill themselves.

[Jeanne11]

wgeurts and possibly Titus.

Trust? I put my trust in a player in the last game and they turned out to be scum. Trust can be detrimental if you trust the wrong player. I've been trying to tell you this all along, but you refuse to consider the possibility that you could be trusting the wrong player for the sake of blind trust.

[wgeurts]

LQ, his thoughts don't seem false and the whole early game gambit was pretty good.
Also Jeanne, who do you think is scum?
What do you think of me?
I want to sort you and I think conversing with you will help

[wgeurts]

Well nevermind what you think of me
And yes, trust can backfire. Hence it's called a "leap of faith", you're not certain and we all make mistakes at times. Doesn't mean we should never try, it's like having a car crash once and never driving again. Town blocs win games, sometime's they will backfire but those other times...

[wgeurts]

Why are you scum reading me?

[Jeanne11]

Because you're trusting LQ blindly and refuse to even think he could be scum under any circumstances.

[LicketyQuickety]

@Wgerts,

About your town read on Suzune. They haven't really done a whole lot this game. Maybe their posts have a Town feel... I'll be the first to admit its really hard to tonally read her because she always seems so composed. I am seeing that she hasn't really had a whole lot to say and hasn't made stances on people. Especially no strong stances to speak of. They are currently voting for me and I don't know that the reasoning is justified on that end. Again iirc, its all just feelsies at this point and just looks like they are following people on their Scum read of me. Their first RVS vote was for me and they haven't really moved away from that or seen anyone else as Scummy really I think.

@Suzune, why have you not seen the Town points I have made? What made you satisfied with keeping a vote on us for so long since the beginning of the game? On the one hand I feel the vote on me is really oportunistic and on the other hand I feel you wouldn't be that obvious as Scum. Help me out here. Why are you nonchalantly voting me?

[LicketyQuickety]

Because you're trusting LQ blindly and refuse to even think he could be scum under any circumstances.

This is just plain old not true. they have me as light town or something not a strong town read.

[Jeanne11]

My point still stands.