Titus: Please explain what the hell you were doing asking ME, of all people, for a "gut read" on D1? I don't really give reads D1, period, and if I do give a read, it's not going to be a "gut read", it's going to be a read where I tell you exactly why I feel the way I do about a given slot. Also explain the logical inconsistencies in your play. Drixx mentioned this earlier, and I know you didn't respond in a fashion that had me nodding in agreement. In what universe do scum act in a fashion that exposes themselves, when an ability is activated which they KNOW they didn't activate, and the person who did activate it stated that it was one of their powers? I'm sure we do have information now, that we wouldn't have had otherwise, but your reasoning behind the play is terrible. That, more than anything else, worries me about you. I feel like you're scum Titus who just tried to leverage some power to buy yourself a bunch of town cred and discredit others(since you can interpret the vote movements however you want, really, especially D1...until we get some flips that vote is largely useless). In short, what you are and have been doing does not make sense. Start making sense.
Ranger: The value of analysis of RVS on D1, with no further information, comes from meta knowledge. Do you have knowledge of wgeurts meta such that his 11 and 13 gave you cause to scum read him? If so, link to the games in question, and expand on what said meta knowledge is. In addition, why wouldn't you wait until further information came from the thread to make your move and mark him? It's suboptimal play, in every way. It's strictly superior to wait until later in the day phase to make said mark, unless you expect there to be a vig that might shoot you. You'll get more information, you'll see how more people react who are already invested in conversations, you can note who takes the opportunity to change the subject, etc. The play you made is objectively inferior, even if you do actually have a good reason to scum read someone(which I find highly unlikely).
Jeanne11: You are tinfoil hat crazy right now. Stop it please. The game would be a lot better off if you just stopped responding to wgeurts etc. for, say, 36 hours, so we can start talking about all the other people in this game. I say this even though I am certain you are either scum or incredibly incompetent. There are no other explanations for ruining the plan Titus had set up by jumping the gun. I'm going to advise Drixx to ignore you for the rest of the day, and I'm going to ignore you as well, because you aren't helping the game state at all. You're just spamming the thread.
Those are the first thoughts off the top of my head. I might do some isoing later, I might not, no guarantees, we'll see what happens...but really, guys. look to the people who aren't involved in this huge drama in the middle of the thread for the scum.
@Cerb, Klingon fits your bill. I'm not lynching the dog unless lylo hits. The dog should die if its master does. (Pure logical guess here). The more the dog should talks the more it tells about its owner. I am pretty sure who owns it. Not town reading them they can shape up or ship out.
Reasonably Rational wrote:Ranger: The value of analysis of RVS on D1, with no further information, comes from meta knowledge.
Only for an amateur.
More experienced players can read deeper into the meaning behind posts and pick up on things.
In addition, why wouldn't you wait until further information came from the thread to make your move and mark him?
As stated, marking is bad for the marked, but only if I trigger it. I can always choose not to trigger it. wgeurts was a scumread, and my action is a day-action, so I needed to submit someone, and I figured he was a good choice: someone who was weakly a scumread, but not likely to be lynched.
Furthermore, by marking earlier, discussion about the mark could be had without it distracting from pre-existing things. Marking a player in the middle of the day may have dissolved the LQ wagon, for instance.
AKA, rBree2. Casual tryhard. I've Quite the RANGE. #pluralgang
"Interestingly though, town winrate in Blitzes has been really high."
Reasonably Rational wrote:Ranger: The value of analysis of RVS on D1, with no further information, comes from meta knowledge.
Only for an amateur.
More experienced players can read deeper into the meaning behind posts and pick up on things.
In addition, why wouldn't you wait until further information came from the thread to make your move and mark him?
As stated, marking is bad for the marked, but only if I trigger it. I can always choose not to trigger it. wgeurts was a scumread, and my action is a day-action, so I needed to submit someone, and I figured he was a good choice: someone who was weakly a scumread, but not likely to be lynched.
Furthermore, by marking earlier, discussion about the mark could be had without it distracting from pre-existing things. Marking a player in the middle of the day may have dissolved the LQ wagon, for instance.
Yes, which gives more information that just a conversation about the mark alone gives. Strictly superior to do it later. I feel we're going to disagree on a lot of things though, you have some ideas about the game that I feel are, well, wrong, and so the moves you're making are nonsensical to me.
In post 831, LicketyQuickety wrote:This is a misrep of me unless you click on the post. it is actually comprised of 2 quotes: one where Elb says "because he's Scum?" and me responding "How do you know?"
I am really disappointed in you Suzune, like really. Why do this?
I did not misrepresent you, I only tagged on that I would have asked the same question. I said nothing negative or positive about you really just that I had the same though. All I did was post a thought paragraph afterwards on my opinion about something. Oh second part of it. Is that not what you said to me? That you played a game that someone gained a power after so many votes. If I misunderstood then I apologize, however, I thought that is what you said.
I didn't think you were intending to misrep me. The only qualm I had with it is that you put both our (Elbs and mine) quotes in the same quote and it kinda rubbed me the wrong way and I'm not sure why - I just didn't like it. It seems weird to do and weird things can be scummy. Your reaction is not comforting either. Like I just never expect you to mess up a quote like that and I am just assuming ulterior motives for doing so.
In post 847, LicketyQuickety wrote:@Suzune, why have you not seen the Town points I have made? What made you satisfied with keeping a vote on us for so long since the beginning of the game? On the one hand I feel the vote on me is really oportunistic and on the other hand I feel you wouldn't be that obvious as Scum. Help me out here. Why are you nonchalantly voting me?
That makes me laugh for some reason the thought of someone nonchalantly voting. I am voting for you for a small pool of reasons. The first being that you usually shout town to me, I mean shout it on the top of your lungs, but this time I feel really odd about you and your playing style. That strikes a cord with me. In the early game, all your posts seemed to create ripples and expect more push from you more read from you, but this side of LQ I cannot get a handle on. Usually you are vocal, opinioned on reads, playing hard and fast. You seem out of your element. I have never seen you play as scum before, but you seen quite odd here.
You have been really adamant about I am town because I say I am town. This seems odd to me. I know I have made this arguement before in the past, however you are in no real danger so the fact that it keeps coming up interests me. It almost seems like if I say it enough they will believe it. I see no positive post from you that show your position or how you are reading people. The things you have posted are one liners about not liking their tone or not having a comment. You would also not defend yourself in post 332. Which strikes me as odd. I realise there might not have been enough pressure but I feel like not backing yourself is an odd strategy.
That is kind of a window into what I am thinking.
Long post----being divided here
Believe it or not, I do not play hard and fast every town game I play. Every once in a while I am more in the back seat rather than the driver. I have a lot of games going on right now. This one is not the one I am most interested in at this time, I'm sorry to say. In fact, if you look at all the games I am in right now you will see that I have kinda put on the breaks a bit. I'm going through a rugh patch right now. This is NOT just a ATE thing I am trying to pull. I don't want to go into the details, but lets just call it a heart problem right now. I've been under attack since my first post and I've tried to Scum hunt, I have, but I'm just having difficulty getting reads on people when 55% of the thread is about how I am Scum. I think Jeanne11 is my biggest Scum read right now for obvious reasons which should be well apparent.
I was anything worse than you! Anything worse than you was I!
You was doided teh aposit_tisopa het dedoid saw em.
The game mod is obviously not voting in the game, ergo he had that account activated and gave it to the appropriate player to use.
I'm trying to decide if you actually could possibly believe that a game mod would be voting in his game, or if you were trying to accomplish something with that post.
@Ranger - Like I said before. Wgeurts (dammit that name is shit to spell) is town. Also, stop with the conf bias and insulting. RVS talk
can
be useful, but you trying to stroke your ego is just mastubatory given that the two RVS posts you claim to have gleaned something from were Wgeurts voting Titus and giving the reason that she was scum last game they played together (nothing there that's alignment indicative), and then asking Titus what TV show she was watching (again nothing to glean alignment from).
And if you are going to go after people for preparing posts, why not me? I made a back to back post earlier in which the first post I referenced a post I was going to make which was long and obviously prepared prior to the first post. Lots of us prepare posts in notepad. Cerb and I always ask for a hydra PT to use. Many people on the site (including me) can create PTs and invite people to them (the mods obviously monitor them), so someone could just create a PT for their own notes and never invite someone to it.
You appear to be starting with a conclusion you want people to buy and then trying to bend posts out of shape so they can serve as "evidence" of the viewpoint you started with. That's an invalid way to apply logic.
You haven't done anything to personally insult me lq o.o I meant that as an ingame jab, not a personal thing. I really don't get outofgame personally mad at anyone, I just have a sometimes abrasive, aggressive playstyle. Don't take it personal. But anyway thanks for reminding me to attack you!
I also read Elb and Suzune as a mild scum read. Suzune looks opportunistic and Elb hasn't done anything in a while.
I can't tell if Titus is still working a gambit or if they are just delusional at this point.
RR looks to be null as well as most of the other lurkers.
So this post was shit. I get a scumread for not being her for like 36 hours, over fucking Halloween weekend, and when I took the time to drag myself in here half hungover and half stoned and told you all that I was too fucked up to play with you gaiz. And fuck let's not forget that all of Saturday the thread was locked because titus and Jeanne blew their load early on the gambit. And I've been one of the most active contributors of this game. But nah fuck me I'm "lurking". Which is totallllly a scumtell, or something.
Wreugets, could you point me to like 3 or so posts by Elb that you like?
Elb plays a very conservative Scum game. How's he not doing this as the game has progressed?
How have I played conservatively at all?
Is claiming scum in my first post conservative? Or maybe it was the part where I joined titus and Jeanne in their gambit, that was a p conservative move wasn't it.
Tldr your read on me is shit and it makes me feel that your thoughts aren't real.
In post 923, Jeanne11 wrote:And then there's a fact that you assert that you shouldn't be lynched since you're town, but you are perfectly willing to lynch me who is also town. I don't understand how your brain works, but it's clearly a double standard.
As much as I'd love to lynch obvscum with you, I'm gonna park my vote on his buddy until deadline. I think we'll get more out of seeing who besides me decides to vote lq.
VOTE: Blackest Majick
Who's ready for unfounded bullshit by the way?
So scum-majick is all like "man what the fuck is this bright guy"
"I better find out what this is I bet it's a town double voter or something ROLE FISH ROLE FISH"
"Oh it's just varsoon being an asshole, okay here you go guys"
So her first post (98) was already weird as not only is it contradictory it also feels really distanced, I fail to see why town would make that post. He just coasts-by until his reads list in post 452. It's really easily flung together, what makes it worse is that she doesn't actually vote any of the two scum reads she states in it. This lax, go with the flow attitude is not looking good in my eyes. The only thing that raises doubts with me is that she's probably over-extended in too many games. 8-12! That's way too many for me to manage so it may be affecting his play as well.
Questions
Why are you not voting anybody despite having stated scum-reads?
What are your reads after recent events?
I haven't updated the reads list yet, other than Titus is looking scummy for that weird midnight vote thing.
We have 8 days until deadline. I'll vote later. I want to be sure.
Klingoncelt: "The whole scumteam slipped on page 1. It's the new meta. Sheep me because my reads are so accurate that whoever I name gets mod-converted to scum."
Reasonably Rational wrote:Also, stop with the conf bias and insulting.
There is no confbias. My read on players like wgeurts and yourself is fully open to change, and in fact your recent posting has improved my opinion of you significantly.
Also, sorry about the amateur comment. Believe it or not, that was actually me being self-depreciating and taking a jab at myself. (You wouldn't have reason to know that, though.) Five years ago, when I was a newb, I couldn't scumhunt in the RVS properly, so I tried using meta. It went hilariously badly, but in hindsight makes a good joke.
I actually hold a very strict anti-meta policy now, for a variety of reasons. Mainly, I play on a site where people have so much going on in their lives that they almost never play two games the same way, and when you combine that with me not necessarily knowing them all that well (I haven't played every single one of the games in those five years, taking breaks as life dictated) and with the games also being fairly lighthearted (meaning friendly trolling's common), I simply lack the knowledge to make meta be an effective tool.
But I
am
generally fairly sharp and get good reads when I start to play seriously. I'm the type of player who thrives when reactions happen, players start fighting, and I gather random samples here and there from everything and compile it together into something coherent. Rather than focusing all on one player, or focusing on the general picture, I focus on one or two specific things from players that catch my attention because of one or two specific reasons. (For instance, one or two random votecounts.) I think we're near that point; I just need the right combination of moods to put it into action.
AKA, rBree2. Casual tryhard. I've Quite the RANGE. #pluralgang
"Interestingly though, town winrate in Blitzes has been really high."
In post 901, Jeanne11 wrote:Right now? So I would be at night? The night is in 9 days or so, not 'right now'.
You do realize you're implicating yourself?
Can we lynch this please? There's literally no way to read this and I don't want to be staring at end game and still wondering.
I don't want to lynch her yet.
I want to try and figure her out.
Jeanne11
- could you give us a reads list, please? I know you have everyone as Scum, but could you put down a sentence or two as to why?
Klingoncelt: "The whole scumteam slipped on page 1. It's the new meta. Sheep me because my reads are so accurate that whoever I name gets mod-converted to scum."
In post 948, BRantz wrote:Bleh, sorry everyone, will catch up on this tonight/tomorrow.
You said that 4 days ago.
Klingoncelt: "The whole scumteam slipped on page 1. It's the new meta. Sheep me because my reads are so accurate that whoever I name gets mod-converted to scum."
Klingoncelt: "The whole scumteam slipped on page 1. It's the new meta. Sheep me because my reads are so accurate that whoever I name gets mod-converted to scum."
wgeurts wrote:His reads list was a literal copy of titus'.
*Her.
And actually, free info.
Marking's bad for the marked.
So I had you pegged as anti-town from the beginning. (I wouldn't have marked you otherwise.) LicketyQuickety has been a scumread of mine ever since I read his posting. BRantz was my first vote.
Starting here, I call absolute crumpets that you had formed a read on us from the following posts:
Spoiler:
In post 7, BRantz wrote:VOTE: Titus cause its the right thing to do.
In post 11, wgeurts wrote:So it begins. VOTE: Titus
Because she was scum/Serial Killer in my last game.
In post 60, Elbirn wrote:Nothing, I just really wanna be friends with titus this game. We had a neighborhood last game and that was pretty cool.
Except then she was scum ;_;
Moving on
I'm really disappointed not a single person took my scum claim seriously. Like did no one notice that? I did it twice.
I'M SCUM LYNCH ME
Aye, Aye, Cap'n!
VOTE: Elbirn
There is literally nothing alignment indicative in these posts (besides possibly Brantz second post, but it's so weak it's not enough to "peg someone as scum") so even if you "are not an amateur" there's nothing you can draw from them unless you're psychic which if you are please let me know. You can't see something in nothing, no matter how good you are. Also realise how that your reads were so weak at this point that you fudge marking me has a beyond high chance of being wrong?! If you are town you just made a hideously stupid move, you should have waited a lot longer.
In 126, I said I had my eye on a couple of other players. You were one, Blackest Magic was the other.
Lie.
You said in that post that "they weren't worth pursuing" however you now claim to have had such a strong read on me that I was even worth marking with some "bad thing". Also it's easy to claim "BM" was one of those now, I'll take your words with a grain of salt as it's already clear you're either incapable of thinking how to use a role logically and conf-biased beyond belief or you're scum worming your way out.
Next.
I'll admit the RR suspicion didn't come until 446, but that was the final point of my reads. In short? You were scum since my first post, BRantz was a suspect since my first post, LQ was a scumread in my
Ooooh, a contradiction!
You say I was scum in your first post but not worth pursuing (meaning it's hella weak) but still worth marking because I'm so obviously scum? Thank you for doing my work for me as you've caught yourself in your own words.
second post who I have voted since my third, Blackest Magic in that same post, and RR in 446. My reads haven't changed much since then, aside from BRantz moving to be less likely and you to be more.
I'm sorry there's definitely no "blackest magic" in post 126 and if you're still reading brantz as scum for what he's posted you don't know how to form a proper read. The wgeurts scum read is also bullshit as you said it's not worth pursuing and you even said somewhere I was null.
When it comes to the townreads, you'd have to be blind not to see FireKari and Elbirn at the very minimum as town, with me also seeing Titus, Jeanne, and Suzune as town.
Really?
Just so happens almost half of those are scum reads of mine. Explain why they are town and I'm blind tyvm.
And my weaker townreads? More based off of not seeing anything scum rather than strongly seeing something town.
That's called a null read friend.
Similarity to any other player's reads is therefore purely coincidental, or if anything, an effort on
their
part to copy
me
.
Other's gave reasons for their reads, you haven't so really it wouldn't appear so.
Next post.
You said that 4 days ago.