Newbie 1676 | Hungarian Nóták | Endgame

[Witch_Hunter]

@

hiplop

: The flu is awful. Get better soon.

Let me ask you the same thing I asked Kim: supposing SMRP's not the right lynch, what would you suggest?

[Plotinus]

Official Vote Count 1.08 Aki a babáját igazán szereti

Aki a babáját igazán szereti,
akármilyen jeges eső esik mégis felkeresi!

Lám én a babámat igazán szeretem,
akármilyen jeges eső esik mégis felkeresem!

Esik a fergeteg ázik a köpönyeg,
eresszél be kedves kis angyalom,
mert megvesz a hideg!

Nem eresztelek be kilenc óra után,
eredj oda huncut Laci betyár ahol eddig voltál!


Sie who loves hir partner,
Regardless of what kind of icy rain is falling, still visits them

Oh, I truly love my partner,
regardless of what kind of icy rain is falling, still I visit them!

The storm is raining, the cloak is drenched,
Let me in my darling little angel,
because the cold will take me!

I don’t let you in after 9 pm,
go there, naughty Laci rascal, to where you were till now!

lynching

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch or no lynch.

Some Random Mafia Player

(L-2):

hiplop,

Smudger, Witch_Hunter, MrCurlyNoodles

Smudger

(L-3): Some Random Mafia Player, Bluebird

Kim

(L-4): Belisarius

Bluebird

(L-5): AzoriusSenate

Belisarius

(L-5): Bluebird

Not voting

(3): Kim, AzoriusSenate, hiplop

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(expired on 2016-01-20 14:00:00)

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[AzoriusSenate]

@

Kim, Bluebird, AzoriuSenate

, what about you? Convinced or not? If convinced, please state intent to hammer, but

don't vote before he has a chance to claim

, please.

I am not convinced SRMP is mafia. He definitely overreacted, yes, but he reads like scrambling town to me.

@

Everyone

, opinions, please. More specifically, either persuade me my case is nonsense or prepare to lend your votes. There are other things deserving investigation, and we still have time to start looking into them before the Day ends, but this is important.

Spoiler: My Opinions

My Reads:

Town

Witch Hunter- Reasonable actions so far and has asked good questions.

Shrugtown

MrCurlyNoodles- Generally amiable, nothing scummy has caught my eye.
hiplop- Same as MrCurlyNoodles.
SMRP- Based on my scumread of Smudger. He may be mafia, but I don't have my eye on him.
Belisarius- I originally put him under Worrying, but I don't have any basis for that other than a gut feeling.

Worrying

Kim- May have tried to buddy with Belisarius, and made the comment about being open with thoughts, which I thought was strange, considering your experience.
AzoriusSenate- For the claim on SMRP's hammer based on the quality of his posts. And I don't like his logic.

Scum

Smudger- His stats on the wiki say he's subbed out of all except one of the games in which he's town. Those are big red alarms to me. And I think, if SMRP really is town, he might be trying to frame for a mislynch.

Spoiler: I Said I'd Post This

This is my offsite game. Also, the second person to post claimed mafia. It was stupid, and he got lynched for it, and he was town, but he did. So there, @

Azorius

. http://forums.intpcomplex.com/showthrea ... ia-5-Day-1

Always look on the bright side of

life!

doo! do doo, doo do doo

do doo do

?

UNVOTE: Belisarius, VOTE: Smudger. If anyone thinks I shouldn't, please tell me why.

He's ASKED to be hammered. Do you understand what that means? If he is truly town why would he ASK to be hammered when his win condition is to kill the mafia. It's shady as hell and frankly even if he is town I don't want someone who is going to surrender that easy later in the game. Obviously I want scum lynched before him if he truly is that bad and is town but what the hell are you thinking when you ask to be hammered.

[hiplop]

@

hiplop

: The flu is awful. Get better soon.

Let me ask you the same thing I asked Kim: supposing SMRP's not the right lynch, what would you suggest?

Currently pondering this question myself. I am having second thoughts about SMRP but I really don't see who else could be scum right now

I'm in a dillemma, witch lol

[hiplop]

SMRP- Based on my scumread of Smudger. He may be mafia, but I don't have my eye on him.

nvm.

VOTE: smrp

Don't hammer without a claim, but yea this slot is scum

[Bluebird]

He's ASKED to be hammered. Do you understand what that means? If he is truly town why would he ASK to be hammered when his win condition is to kill the mafia. It's shady as hell and frankly even if he is town I don't want someone who is going to surrender that easy later in the game. Obviously I want scum lynched before him if he truly is that bad and is town but what the hell are you thinking when you ask to be hammered.

I'm not sure why he's asking to be hammered; asking to be hammered

at all

is going against your win condition. I agree that we don't want someone who's going to surrender easy. I'd like some answers from him before anything happens.

[AzoriusSenate]

He's ASKED to be hammered. Do you understand what that means? If he is truly town why would he ASK to be hammered when his win condition is to kill the mafia. It's shady as hell and frankly even if he is town I don't want someone who is going to surrender that easy later in the game. Obviously I want scum lynched before him if he truly is that bad and is town but what the hell are you thinking when you ask to be hammered.

I'm not sure why he's asking to be hammered; asking to be hammered

at all

is going against your win condition. I agree that we don't want someone who's going to surrender easy. I'd like some answers from him before anything happens.

Why is he not worrying you in your "reads list"? I feel like asking to be hammered shouldn't be "shrugtown".

[Bluebird]

He's ASKED to be hammered. Do you understand what that means? If he is truly town why would he ASK to be hammered when his win condition is to kill the mafia. It's shady as hell and frankly even if he is town I don't want someone who is going to surrender that easy later in the game. Obviously I want scum lynched before him if he truly is that bad and is town but what the hell are you thinking when you ask to be hammered.

I'm not sure why he's asking to be hammered; asking to be hammered

at all

is going against your win condition. I agree that we don't want someone who's going to surrender easy. I'd like some answers from him before anything happens.

Why is he not worrying you in your "reads list"? I feel like asking to be hammered shouldn't be "shrugtown".

He

is

worrying me- just not as much as those I ranked as more scummy. Basically, I put him as "shrugtown" because of the SRMP/Smudger conversation going on before now. I think Smudger is scum. He had an argument with SRMP. I interpreted that as a MvT argument, with the goal of incriminating the town, in this case SRMP. If both flip mafia, that was quite an excellent fake argument. If SRMP flips mafia, I stand corrected- I think his current behavior (asking for hammer notwithstanding) can be contributed to either chat mafia or unfamiliarity with this medium. If Smudger is mafia, he's successfully gotten us close to mislynch. I am not saying SRMP is above suspicion.

[Belisarius]

I withdraw my objection to the SRMP lynch. Town doesn't give up like that. It's not exactly optimal informatiot-denial play for scum in this gamestate either, but scum does sometimes fold faster than Superman on laundry day due to the negative emotional valence of playing the "bad guy."

In my first newbie game on site, both scum employed French battle tactics.

[Smudger]

@ Bluebird I haven't had an argument with SRMP, he has lost his rag at me.

I asked him questions, he over reacted. I explained to him the best way he should construct posts, he stated that advice was scummy?? I then asked him to explain what a scum slip and township were as he used both in a sentence to build this rather poor case against me, he has not done that. I asked him to explain each of the accusations he has made against myself and others, he has not done that. I then asked him to reread what has been said and open his mind to what was being put forward, he has not done that.

On top of this he has referred to my quote on his read list as both a challenge and a random comment. Which I am sure you will agree is a contradiction and he has now given up, without defending himself or claiming. Which he should do at L1. L1 was removed for a short period of time which gave him the chance to respond and his only response was to ask if he could self hammer?

regardless he is not playing to the spirit of the game and if town he is not playing to his win condition or in the interests of town..

[Witch_Hunter]

@

Some Random Mafia Player

, running away helps no one. You're still in the game. Can we have your claim, please?

And, in case we're wrong about you and you flip town, consider sharing anything you think is important. It could be helpful tomorrow.

[Kim]

@hiplop as IC:

What normally happens when the person to be hammered just disappears? I've got a feeling that SRMP won't be back. Is there a time when it's okay to hammer, or should we wait 3 more days to get a sub for him?

[AzoriusSenate]

If SMRP flips town i'm going to be a little miffed that this is his town game.

[Some Random Mafia Player]

@

hiplop

: The flu is awful. Get better soon.

Let me ask you the same thing I asked Kim: supposing SMRP's not the right lynch, what would you suggest?

Currently pondering this question myself. I am having second thoughts about SMRP but I really don't see who else could be scum right now

I'm in a dillemma, witch lol

but I haven't posted anything relevant...

[Some Random Mafia Player]

If SMRP flips town i'm going to be a little miffed that this is his town game.

get ready.

[Some Random Mafia Player]

@ Bluebird I haven't had an argument with SRMP, he has lost his rag at me.

I asked him questions, he over reacted. I explained to him the best way he should construct posts, he stated that advice was scummy?? I then asked him to explain what a scum slip and township were as he used both in a sentence to build this rather poor case against me, he has not done that. I asked him to explain each of the accusations he has made against myself and others, he has not done that. I then asked him to reread what has been said and open his mind to what was being put forward, he has not done that.

On top of this he has referred to my quote on his read list as both a challenge and a random comment. Which I am sure you will agree is a contradiction and he has now given up, without defending himself or claiming. Which he should do at L1. L1 was removed for a short period of time which gave him the chance to respond and his only response was to ask if he could self hammer?

regardless he is not playing to the spirit of the game and if town he is not playing to his win condition or in the interests of town..

you read my post wrong, the advice shows you read my post, but you stated I was tunneling you (yet in 101, which you gave advice on, I stated otherwise)

[Some Random Mafia Player]

He's ASKED to be hammered. Do you understand what that means? If he is truly town why would he ASK to be hammered when his win condition is to kill the mafia. It's shady as hell and frankly even if he is town I don't want someone who is going to surrender that easy later in the game. Obviously I want scum lynched before him if he truly is that bad and is town but what the hell are you thinking when you ask to be hammered.

I'm not sure why he's asking to be hammered; asking to be hammered

at all

is going against your win condition. I agree that we don't want someone who's going to surrender easy. I'd like some answers from him before anything happens.

Why is he not worrying you in your "reads list"? I feel like asking to be hammered shouldn't be "shrugtown".

He

is

worrying me- just not as much as those I ranked as more scummy. Basically, I put him as "shrugtown" because of the SRMP/Smudger conversation going on before now. I think Smudger is scum. He had an argument with SRMP. I interpreted that as a MvT argument, with the goal of incriminating the town, in this case SRMP. If both flip mafia, that was quite an excellent fake argument. If SRMP flips mafia, I stand corrected- I think his current behavior (asking for hammer notwithstanding) can be contributed to either chat mafia or unfamiliarity with this medium. If Smudger is mafia, he's successfully gotten us close to mislynch. I am not saying SRMP is above suspicion.

I want to be hammered because im bored of just getting called scummy for anything I do, but might as well keep playing.

[Some Random Mafia Player]

SMRP- Based on my scumread of Smudger. He may be mafia, but I don't have my eye on him.

nvm.

VOTE: smrp

Don't hammer without a claim, but yea this slot is scum

RIp villy, hammer meh now

[Some Random Mafia Player]

actually, eh i can self hammer, but I don't feel like breaking the rules, just hammer me and let me join other games (stuck with only 1 game is boring af, I would rather get lynched d1 in 10 games at once )

desperately trying to figure out if this is an attempt at AtE (appeal to emotion) or if he actually is just upset

(BTW, sorry for lacklustery posts last day or two. Got a nasty flu )

neither, im bored honestly, and death getting delayed is really annoying as theres no other games I can play atm, but eh

[Some Random Mafia Player]

actually, eh i can self hammer, but I don't feel like breaking the rules, just hammer me and let me join other games (stuck with only 1 game is boring af, I would rather get lynched d1 in 10 games at once )

desperately trying to figure out if this is an attempt at AtE (appeal to emotion) or if he actually is just upset

(BTW, sorry for lacklustery posts last day or two. Got a nasty flu )

If he is town here he should not being giving up so easily. Weak town is not going to help us in the later game either.

I know im dead, I see no point in saving myself, at this point im just trying to scumhunt without giving a shit of the cases on me.

[Some Random Mafia Player]

@

Some Random Mafia Player

, running away helps no one. You're still in the game. Can we have your claim, please?

And, in case we're wrong about you and you flip town, consider sharing anything you think is important. It could be helpful tomorrow.

villy, and wasent running, wasent able to get on.

[Some Random Mafia Player]

@Mod: you state 3 ppl arent voting, but list witch, kim, smudger, and curly.

@

AzoriusSenate

: Welcome!
I like your first post. Lean on information, but seems a legit effort. Interesting read on Bluebird. I'd interpreted her first post as noobtown indignated at being accused and overreacting, but it'd be interesting to see what she has to say for herself.

@

Some Random Mafia Player

:
I also liked your post, at first. Until I got to the end.
It has one

little

thing I don't understand: the conclusion does not follow from the premises. Your case on Bluebird follows on AzoriusSenate's and reinforces it, and most of your post is spent on it. So far, so good. Yet you vote on Kim, saying "havent seen towny things, bu have seen scummy things from this slot. Not the most scummy, but is second behind bluebird", though you only pointed to one post of his.

So, please enlighten me here. What's your case on Kim, and why vote him if he's not your strongest scumread?

As I stated, discussion lynch, and I mostly saw discussion on the ppl interacting with kim, not kim themself. That dident work though because due to doing that people discussed me for trying to start a discussion on kim instead of discussing kim because that was the whole point for the vote everyone sees as scummy in the first place.

Off topic: David Bowie. Rest in peace, man, and thank you for the music.

so your trying to tell me I shouldent try to find scum because its "not a town mindset?"

where do I say that? I am interested to understand why you would produce a read list so early in the game and from 3 pages of interaction? in addition what is your view on the thought is some minds that early read-lists can also be detrimental to a town player?

What I said was note aimed at you.

I would post an early read list because whats the problem with showing your thoughts early? I feel like this is opposed, due to kim doing it and suddenly getting branded scummy (which is not my reason) also addressed this seperately

and I would like you to explain how the second part makes any sense. When are showing your thoughts ever bad for town? if your not posting your thoughts, are we rving all day 1? I dont see it

And since I keep thinking of things. Another thing I want to point out was that I was not planning to stick with the lynch, so if I was bussing, why would I lead a lynch before hopping off the wagon? That would be scummy as fuck and get me lynch easily, then again, thats wifom. Now that i think of it, your assuming I am trying to avoid a bus (I think) if you are, how could I still be bussing? That would mean 3 scum. So do you thnik im bussing or avoiding a bus? Also,

belisaurus, I guess your right, but if you flipped scum I was suspicious of bluebird anyway, it wouldent have made much difference in my reads chart. I probably dident take into account the possibility of your flip coming first because im sure bluebird is dying first due to getting a d1 lynch (unless the sub turns it around)

Also, I am still unhappy smudge hasent really interacted with anyone. He asked me 2 questions, made a decent post, and thats kinda it. The other 13 have not been helpful. Doesn't change my stance on him much though.

witch, its page 3, theres not much to base off of does not contain much, its only page 4, page 3 at that time. The main thing is what Azorius said, which imo makes a lot of sense.

Once again, I could have just pmed my partner my reads if I was scum and just not post anything, since apparently it wouldent help me to do so since I would be branded scummy, so I dont see a reason for scum to post an early readlist. If I am town and doing that, why accuse me as scum when as scum, it doesent do anything but make me scummier to do so? Also, why is me posting a readlist scummy when hiplop did the same thing? Smudger, why are you complaining about my readslist, but not hiplops? (No, this is not a case on hiplop, this is just pointing out faulty logic in an argument, I dont see him as scummy for a readlist since I did the same.)

now that I think about it, What do you guys think about hiplop being the start of 2 wagons (me and belisarius) that both had faulty logic? I guess 1 is fine, but the fact that he started 2 seems scummy, altho I need to check his meta first

Just discussion points/addressing things directed at me.

I question how read lists are bad, if we arent sharing our reads, what are we doing?

I acknowledge that Azorius has pretty much answered this but as it is directed at me I will answer also: providing read list early can be used to manipulate the game later, in particular by scum if the list comes from a town player. you are scum and you see a town player reading you as town, how will you react? conversely as town and you see a player reading you as scum, how would you react and how could scum use that to manipulate the game?

Also, he has 13 useless posts, he made 1 post you agree with and you call him town for the 1 post and ignore the fact he made 13 useless posts?

and you have 14 posts, point out how those posts of mine that have questions in, which Curlynoodles seems to have missed, are useless?

have you questioned him on this? Belisarius is an experienced player, would you suspect him to have a reason for his actions? I often don't react to a vote that is placed on me, for varying reasons. if it is out of the blue then I consider it to see who else jumps onto the wagon, as it may well be a reaction test for other players. If it stays for a while and there is no explanation even after the voter continues posting in thread then of course I will speak up. As for a vote changing without explanation why does it make sense to you for it to be called out? I mean are there reasons someone might do this?

questions here for you curlynooodles...

What I said was note aimed at you

ok, but based on my comment and that of Azorius above do you understand why I questioned your read list. plus you seem defensive and sating a lot of "if I was scum" "is this scummy" etc... I actually find that scummy. That said you continue to make sense. and you are pushing so I lean town on you.

Your post 101 is hard to follow who you are responding to or questioning, can I ask that you do something along the lines of split each question to an individual into a separate post, and/or quote the post you are responding to then comment. or do as I have done here by linking the post. And finally you could bold the name of the person you are interacting with such as

@ Smudger

... thanks

I don't understand, so you acknowledge that you read my post (you said it was formatted badly) but you still try to accuse me of something that I clearly stated in the same post I dident do? I see no motive for a townie to do something like this, but I dont see why scum would do it, since it would be way too obvious. I would say the push came from scum because now that I think about it, theres no way he could have missed when I said I changed my stance on him if he says im pushing him, which I first stated in that post and probably where he got it from. If he got it from my near one liner, then how did he read the post to assume it was sloppy formatting? I cant think of any reason for this besides the fact that hes scum. Explanation needed.

so you read my 101, you acknowledge it, but you say im tunneling you when I clearly say your null? You knew I diden't think you were scum, so i question why you lied and said I was tunneling you when you were a null read at that time?

[Some Random Mafia Player]

I withdraw my objection to the SRMP lynch. Town doesn't give up like that. It's not exactly optimal informatiot-denial play for scum in this gamestate either, but scum does sometimes fold faster than Superman on laundry day due to the negative emotional valence of playing the "bad guy."

In my first newbie game on site, both scum employed French battle tactics.

refer to first post in chain, but then again, I don't care about cases on me. I'm pretty sure I know whos scum just based on my wagon (hiplop never explained anything and doubted the lynch on me when I probably made myself scummier, and smudge because of reasons I stated 10 times, and hes twisting my reasoning for it, I never said I thought advice was scummy, I said it proves you read my 101, and you ignored the contene of it, such as me stating you were still null.)

[Some Random Mafia Player]

I withdraw my objection to the SRMP lynch. Town doesn't give up like that. It's not exactly optimal informatiot-denial play for scum in this gamestate either, but scum does sometimes fold faster than Superman on laundry day due to the negative emotional valence of playing the "bad guy."

In my first newbie game on site, both scum employed French battle tactics.

refer to first post in chain, but then again, I don't care about cases on me. I'm pretty sure I know who my second scumread is just based on this wagon so I am fine with the wagon remaining.(hiplop never explained anything and doubted the lynch on me when I probably made myself scummier by being offline for a day.)

[AzoriusSenate]

VOTE: SRMP

That should be a lynch.