SAGA FRONTIER MAFIA (GAME END)

[The Cool Cucumbers]

Who are the flying sharks?
~wgeurts

[Gale Wing Srock]

Will build a case of Flum, would need to dig some Meta on him because his contributions this game has so far been "Sky is scum", "TCC is scum", "Zulfy is troll", "Sensei is town" and his claims have been Non-Miller, Hammer Absorber and Aselius. Which is really not telling me much, but he is pinging me big time with his posts, selective scum hunt, buddying and associative connections.

Do you guys know of games where Flum was scum and when he was town?

PEdit: Cakey <3

Yeah you can call me that, but it might be a distraction in game so I will leave it up to you. I don't understand the Flying Sharks theory, what is it?

And thanks ^_^

[Rylai and Lina]

Flying on fire sharks precisely

~Rylai

[Drixx]

I have no idea what's going on up there, but I have no idea why Drixx refuses to post out here.
If he has good reasons to suspect Cucumber is scum there's no reason to withhold that information.

And we have a nibble. It has to be killing Cerberus that I've voted his slot and he doesn't know what he did to tip me off. From the flipped scum card, it looks like there is daytalk, so I'm tentatively grouping CC and Flum, with Flum here fishing for info while CC lurks. Party knows the reasons I put the vote down.

There is a very good reason I never wanted you in the party Day 1.

Didn't you want them in the party at one point because of the one way mason thing where they can confirm two flavor names?

[Fluminator]

Are you for real right now? I asked for your read on cerb before you even voted for him. I've been scum reading him for a long time and I wanted your opinion because you're familiar with him quite well. The same reason I asked cerb for his read on you. Are you reading this game?

Also VOTE: Gale (In before he tries to discredit the vote as omgus!)
There is no town motive in his last post. He's not trying to figure me out. He's scrambling after I called him out on his weak push.

Also, Mollie, I left a message for you in my hood for post game. I hope you read it when the game is done.

[The Cool Cucumbers]

I'm far from lurking Drixx. I'm literally rereading the entire fudge game and Cerb just gave all my current thoughts which anyone is free to question. Are you seriously using pre-flip associatives?
Also Sensei or ABR you both had a weird "give me a nod if you think I'm thinking what your thinking", if you have a cop innocent or something on us could you please state it now.
~wgeurts

[The Cool Cucumbers]

What cerb gave was accurate, I'm currently reading to try and figure out which of the people in the groups I've made are actually scum.

[The Cool Cucumbers]

Drixx, who do you think is scum and why?
I'm not accepting you not giving explanarion to your reads as that isn't something you do.

[The Cool Cucumbers]

Mollie, although I appreciate the wonderful silence that you give me each time I ask you something I'd appreciate if you answer.
Right now I'm leaning town on ABR yes, though it's one of the main reasons I've decided to reread the game. Your and ABR's alignment is one of the most important factors this game, getting is sorted and out of the way will aid us all.

[The Cool Cucumbers]

I'm not liking how ZZZX has disappeared and I'm tempted to push him for it. His play hasn't been tremendously town until now either.
DGB is someone I wanted to push however I'm waffeling right now whether her play is just bad town getting overwhelmed. She literally admitted twice (once early on and one later) to sleeping her top town read. Although this doesn't make sense to me I could see it as overwhelmed town.
Pip/Flum/Sky/ I need to sort, right now I'm leaning scum or null on them however I need concrete reads there as this nonsense concerning them has lasted too long.
GWS I remember leaning town on, however once again I'll see if this stays so as I reread .
Zuffy us someone I'd gladly lynch right now, however I'm checking none the less to be assured he isn't playing as awful town VI.
Lowkey and Yosarian both seem town to me, as does Klingon who has some really strong interactions with Maxwell that make it unlikely for them to share the same alignment. And with the flip of an SK I doubt that this is multiball.

This is where I am at right now.

[The Cool Cucumbers]

I had made a small wall on DS ready to be posted before pip shot him. Basically I was unsure there as his interactions with Maxwell seemed to indicate them not sharing a favtion, however his play wasn't town.
Guess it makes sense now

[The Cool Cucumbers]

Cerb seems to be rather busy right now however be has been analysing peoples reasons for switching wagons etc. Day 1. He hasn't drawn any strong conclusions just yet but I expect there will be stuff coming from him eventually.

[The Cool Cucumbers]

Now we have a few lurkers right now which isn't helping. We should consider pressuring people like ZZZX to get them posting again.
As far as I'm aware its not uncommon for him to lurk as scum.

[The Cool Cucumbers]

Oh yeah.
R&L and Sensei are town.

[Skybird]

Go ahead and vote me Drixx, you are so out of your mind in this game. The only time you have activated yourself was to lynch fucking Cooldog because DP told you to.

In mafiaception, you listened to me, I felt it. This game, it's the void. Black hole. I don't know what you've done with the real Drixx, bring him back to me goddamit.

Umm... I'm not voting you or calling you scum at the moment. I'm saying that you are turning off potential allies with what your posts are implying.

If I had to bet my life that one specific slot is scum, right this second, it would be CC by a mile. I explained why to the party already ... waiting for them to mull it over and agree.

Why not explain to the rest of us?

[Yosarian2]

I think there are flying ninja roleblocking hated doublevoting

amnesiac

hidden sharks

why are you pple not helping me

.

thank you klingon!

this is from titus.

What the hell are you guys talking about? I was assuming you were joking, but this is like the third time you've brought this up.

[Skybird]

Let me start off by saying good riddance and thanks Itlepip! Well, now I don't think that your claim was bogus. Mega WindBlast and Shadow Servant is something that makes sense wrt flavor and Skybird may have Shadow Servant already or may get it later. But I still have a lingering suspicion on you, because of the discrepancy between your story and Sky's story, which is still not making sense to me. One of you seem to be lying and your Day Vig claim definitely falls in your favor.

So let me ask you this one last time, do you have to get Blue out of the game for you to win with us or you can win along with Blue? I know that you have mentioned that your win condition is the same as everyones, but I just want to make it 100% clear. As my major concern wrt you guys is, I am not able to understand who is lying.

Spoiler: ABR's case on me

He starts off with a FOS on me (5533), which is bs because VI is not related to experience. Neither is it related to Language. It is more of a person's mentality and playstyle. Some even consider ABR as a VI for playing like he does, infact even in my last game there was a moderately experienced player who played like a VI. He gave so many scum tells, that we couldn't relate it to being town.

That said, I have explained my read on Diamond pretty clearly in my posts. And I think ABR didn't read my posts before jumping on me with that 'characterization of Diamond is extremely suspicious' bs is silly. I have said what I have observed and I had said it a long time ago that DS is a slot that we should Vig, its just that I found better targets to scum hunt, and expected scum DS to slip up badly sooner or later. I don't understand what is so difficult to understand in that.

His vote on me is meh. He says that I am trying to break a 'comfortable stalemate' in the Sky-Itlepip thing. Bro, why are you comfortable around them? And why are you believing everything that Itlepip is saying? On one hand he is talking about the hated votes being a problem (5469), and on the other hand he is not open to see that Itlepip could be scum with Flum? That was my question to him really. And why he wasn't scum hunting Flum, as much as he is scum hunting DS or Kling. We have a double lynch remember? So we can very well clear the Sky-Itlepip-Flum set and also lynch one of the lurkers today, so what is the problem here?

If Pip were scum, and had a dayvig, he could justify using it on Skybird saying he is so convinced she is scum that he had no choice.

This statement is not true, as most of the players have already discussed that if one flips town then we will have a scum read on the other. ABR himself implied that Itlepip is not going to get away with a Sky Vig (5176), then why would he even think that it is possible. He is reaching here tbh, and I don't understand why he is so in support of Itlepip.

The major thing that rang the alarm bells for me wrt Itlepip - Sky - Flum set is that, two of them are claiming the Hated votes, and as Yos, R&L and ABR (himself) have said about these votes being insane, and Yos and R&L not being able to make the end game because of these votes is just crazy. Not to forget the FIRE votes which seem to be spreading.

Then on one hand he is suspecting the party and was hinting that Drixx and DS are both scum, (5468, 5478), and on the other hand he is expecting me to not suspect the Sky - Itlepip - Flum relationship. What is this a scum hunting dictatorship?

My question to him was why he was bringing it later in Day 2? I didn't understand his motivation here. At one point he is talking about Hated votes and 4 scum teams having 8 votes and about sparking abilities, and on the other hand he is talking about two scum teams of 3 with lynch resistance, NK and investigation immune. Where is he taking this exactly? That was my point of concern. And why ignore certain players who were equally scummy?

Tbh, his self boasting about the Max push and taking credit for the DS vig push seems a little too much to me. Nothing proves his trustworthiness and if his theory of two scum teams of 3 is to be believed, then what counts him out of the other scum group? DS was an SK so that would mean that there are still 5 scums according to him right? So I am willing to wait and see if he gets us more scums, and until then I am not going to trust him.

Spoiler: ABRs reaction to my questions

I couldn't understand why he is not scum hunting flum, and why he is trusting Itlepip so much and why he is suspecting Drixx. So, I confronted Albert for a discussion (5532).

When he said he has a Null on Flum (5534), I just got mad at him, because it scum pinged me a lot harder than his suspicion on Drixx. Like hello! We are in a game and we need to suspect everyone here, and if you have a null read on someone while you are scum hunting similar players then it is obviously fishy. And I haven't seen any major contribution from Flum this game, like his reads are all bogus (5393); there is no chance that town ABR would null read Flum at this point.

Then he starts justifying his read on me and brings Max into the picture (5538). Like what does Max have anything to do with this? and then he threatens me that I am going to go the way Max did. Hello! Like what does that have anything to do with you not scum hunting Flum?

It was pretty clear to me that I was onto something, so I pushed it a bit further and tried to mock him and insult him but he didn't budge.

So my deduction is this:
- ABR may not be scum, but there is something between ABR and Flum.
- He is hiding something from us and is not being open with why he is suspecting certain players while ignoring certain others who have a similar playstyle.
- And he is paranoid about Multiball and Drixx.
- But is contradicting himself when he says that he is worried about 4 man scum team having double votes and hated votes, but not questioning the people who have claimed those hated votes.
- He is believing Itlepip's claims beyond reason, and this doesn't go well with him being selectively paranoid on others like Drixx.
- He is not scum hunting Flum, who has bogus reads; infact he is null reading Flum, which makes no goddamn sense.

I would like us to do one of these things today:
- Pressure ABR into knowing why this selective scum hunting exists in his play.
- Clear the Sky - Itlepip - Flum mesh to make more sense. Infact, I am willing to let Itlepip be taken out of that equation for now. Because his day vig claim was true and makes sense with his claim earlier in the Day, when he said that he chose Day Vig so Sky must have got a double vote. (Shadow Servant seems like a Double Vote power to me)
- Get one of the lurkers lynched along with one of Sky / Flum.

I have already stated that I did not get any magic last night. Just because Itlepip did, doesn't mean that I did too. I have to go on adventures or hammer someone to gain magic.

I can win with blue if blue is town.

Then no worries as I am town.

Your weak-ass push on me is getting annoying. Actually type up a case instead of saying you "sense" I'm scum and never giving reasons.

Skybird's defense is decent and she did point out that she doesn't have the Double Vote, but what about her Claim?

Link me to the post where you think she had a good defense. Or are you just agreeing to be agreeable?

Also please answer this.

Ha ha, I will get a case on you Flum don't worry about it, but first I want to understand if I am missing something wrt reading you.

And regarding Skybird's defense, it is not pressurized or panicky as you will observe here (5150, 5178, 5180). She is clear about her not having a double vote and is proving it by voting for Itlepip in 5180. Which I think is a decent defense to Itlepip's claim on her having double vote powers, and her claiming that she doesn't have those powers.

But, now after reading about Shadow Servant I have an Idea to clear this Double Vote thing.

Skybird, could you please post these exact words in your next post?

Shadow Servant:Gale Wing Srock

Shadow Servant:Gale Wing Srock

How does being a double voter or not have anything to do with whether she's scum. Literally all the those defenses are some irrelevant tangent on role powers.

Flum, you are taking this out of context. Check out the context below:

Albert, lets discuss Sky - Itlepip - Flum, what do you think about them?

I started the day very aggressive with Skybird, but you know what, I liked her posts and the way she's been defending herself.

Skybird's defense is decent and she did point out that she doesn't have the Double Vote, but what about her Claim? What about her read on Flum and Itlepip? Where do you see this Blue vs Rogue thing leading into?

The discussion about Sky's defense here is not wrt her being town. But wrt Itlepip's claim on her and her reaction to it. Obviously, I have a lot of confusion wrt Sky's alignment. A lot of it depends on Itlepip's read, his claims, Sky's claims and their posts, they are kind of a pair wrt roles and both of them appear scummy to me. But the arguments of one being town and the other being scum, Blue being the villainous role between them, both being 3rd parties with one benign and one malign, both being town, all have some merits to them and cannot be brushed aside. That is why it is a mesh and people were ignoring them, including me. But the hated votes that both of them have claimed seems to be bothering me a lot. I want to find out if Sky's claim of not using the Hated vote is true, and also want to find out if

Itlepip's claim of his hated vote being temporary makes Sky's hated power as temporary too. And if it is temporary, then why didn't she use that power on her most scummiest read?

There is a lot of confusion in my mind wrt them and I want to clear it out. But as of ABR's recent claim, it seems that the hated votes and the FIRE votes would disappear if it were to be true. So I am waiting to see what R&L, Sensei, Drixx and DP decide wrt his claim.

PEdit: Albert what is stopping you from claiming the Rune's name?

No, the mod told me my hated vote stays and is cumulative. I'm not going to use it on someone until I feel pretty sure they are scum. It's too devastating to use and accidentally hit town. And obviously other people besides me and Itlepip have this ability since so many came up hated.

[Skybird]

I think there are flying ninja roleblocking hated doublevoting

amnesiac

hidden sharks

why are you pple not helping me

.

thank you klingon!

this is from titus.

What the hell are you guys talking about? I was assuming you were joking, but this is like the third time you've brought this up.

Yeah, I'd like to know what this is about too.

[The Cool Cucumbers]

I third that motion.
¬wgeurts

[Yosarian2]

On an unrelated note, R&L, could you PLEASE stop making people who are clearly town claim? I still think you are town, but this is the second time you've done this, and it's hurting the town.

[Gale Wing Srock]

Also VOTE: Gale (In before he tries to discredit the vote as omgus!)
There is no town motive in his last post. He's not trying to figure me out. He's scrambling after I called him out on his weak push.

FLUM

! o_0

Bro, I am impressed!

How do people even catch you as scum? Unless a PR finds you guilty or you are vig'd, or POE'd I don't think you will ever get caught.

Like I glanced through your ISOs in Open 600 (Scum Game, Scum PT), Pathfinder (Town Game w/ ABR as scum), and Steven Universe (Scum PT) and I couldn't find a distinction between your scum play and your town play. You are like the Chaos Kass of Survivor: Cagayan. Same face for Happy, Mad, Sad!

Like seriously dude, you need to teach me how to scum hunt you. Like is there a way to differentiate your scum play and your town play?

[Gale Wing Srock]

Flying on fire sharks precisely

~Rylai

Rylai, please explain. Is that a role? and what does Flying Ninja, and Hidden shark mean? And what is Mollie trying to say about it? 'flying ninja roleblocking hated doublevoting amnesiac hidden sharks' Lol I really thought he was blabbering something about ABR here.

---

I have already stated that I did not get any magic last night. Just because Itlepip did, doesn't mean that I did too. I have to go on adventures or hammer someone to gain magic.

I can win with blue if blue is town.

Then no worries as I am town.

Shadow Servant:Gale Wing Srock

No, the mod told me my hated vote stays and is cumulative. I'm not going to use it on someone until I feel pretty sure they are scum. It's too devastating to use and accidentally hit town. And obviously other people besides me and Itlepip have this ability since so many came up hated.

Okay! then the Itlepip and Sky chapter ends here. If both can win with us without taking the other out of the game, then I think we should just ignore that extra power.

What is your present read on Zulfi? And how scummy would you rate Flum in the scale of 1 to 5 now?

---

Itlepip, what do you think of this theory?
You gain powers by neighboring people, and you will get special powers when you are in a successful Blue wagon.

And Sky gains powers by hammering people and she will get special powers when she is in a successful Rogue wagon.

So maybe she will get the double vote power after she successfully hammers someone for the first time. That is the reason it seems like you are more powerful because it is easier for you to gain the powers on your own, but Sky has to convince us to allow her to hammer people.

---

TCC, have you played with Flum before? What is your present read on them?

Klingoncelt, who are the two players you would like to lynch today and why?

[Zulfy]

Zulfy who are your town reads right now?

Sensei, Yosarian, Drixx

[Zulfy]

And rylailina

[Rylai and Lina]

On an unrelated note, R&L, could you PLEASE stop making people who are clearly town claim? I still think you are town, but this is the second time you've done this, and it's hurting the town.

1 - I asked him to say the name of the rune he already claimed "its power" - which he shouldn't have done it in first place if it was real

2 - I never asked anybody to claim anything new. I'm just finding the lies in the claims and ABR lied there

3 - I'm not doing anything hurting the town. If anything is hurting the town its Lying to their faces which ABR already claimed he did 3 or 4 times so far and this new one was just over the boundries

~Rylai