SAGA FRONTIER MAFIA (GAME END)

[Varsoon]

"Have you ever heard of the Gnome spirits? They just love collecting gold."

-Emelia,

Baccarat

VOTECOUNT 3.06

The Cool Cucumbers (5):

FIRE, Rylai and Lina, Yosarian2, DrippingGoofball, Drunken Pirates

DrippingGoofball (3):

ZZZX, Skybird, Lowkey

Skybird (2):

Fluminator, Zulfy

Albert B. Rampage (1):

FIRE

Yosarian2 (1):

FIRE

Rylai and Lina (1):

Albert B. Rampage

Not Voting (4):

Drixx, The Cool Cucumbers, Klingoncelt, Sensei

With 14 Alive, it takes 8 to Lynch.
Deadline

: (expired on 2016-02-18 23:10:00)

The Main Character is

Sensei

The Party is

Albert B. Rampage, Yosarian2, Rylai & Lina, and Drixx.

Spoiler: MC VC

Sensei (6):

Drunken Pirates, The Cool Cucumbers, Sensei, Fluminator, Drixx, Rylai & Lina

Yosarian2 (2):

Yosarian2, Skybird

Zulfy (1):

Zulfy

Drixx (1):

Klingoncelt

Albert B. Rampage (1):

Albert B. Rampage

[Drunken Pirates]

@ZZZX - Man you gotta stop being mad at me about SMITE. I replaced into that with the fake claim gambit already made by the slot. I just did my best with what I had. There's a huge difference between this situation and that one. In SMITE I was scum with a fake claim. I wasn't actually a third party so my play in that game shouldn't color how you view 3rd parties, as long as you can be relatively sure that they are actually third party.

I'm not mad at you. That was great play.

But my trust is harder to get

Mollie explain like I'm 5 what we would gain from lynching cc now instead of say.. Tomorrow?

how about YOU explain to me like I am 5 what we gain from keeping cuke pple alive now instead of say...tomorrow?

the argument will be predicated on trusting them which I don't. so you need to me why exactly you do.

[Drunken Pirates]

@ yoyo - are you going to answer my question? 5th time I am asking you!

What is the question, exactally?

you have been clearing town left and right and shld have a pretty good poe list right about now.

who is scum?

[The Cool Cucumbers]

Yosarian, DP, R&L: If lynching me was off the table, who do you guys lynch today and why?

Question goes out to everyone, but obviously I'm trying to convince the people who are voting for me to stop it.

-Cerb

pedit: Why would the townie EVER BELIEVE ME OVER THE SCUM???????? It doesn't make any sense, and it will be obvious to all the involved parties that a lynch needs to happen. The 3p scenario is still immaterial though, because I won't ever live that long.

Did you miss the part where I said we could go to 8 instead? That actually accounts for an extra kill. How about 10? Why would you NOT just lynch me if pieces of the puzzle that keeps me chained start to die?

The scenario you're positing to force a sense of urgency into our lynch requires that town all go simultaneously brain dead. If the roleblockers that are containing me die, LYNCH ME. How hard is that?

Drixx: My role specifies that I must kill everyone who has access to a killing ability as a function of their role or faction. Techniques do not count. I don't know if Varsoon can actually answer that question satisfactorily without confirming me.

[Yosarian2]

@ yoyo - are you going to answer my question? 5th time I am asking you!

What is the question, exactally?

you have been clearing town left and right and shld have a pretty good poe list right about now.

who is scum?

I answered that question like 10 pages ago. At the time, I was thinking CC and Klingon were likely.

Now, we know CC is anti-town but may or may not be team scum, so we lynch him and see what kind of scum he flips as and then recalibarate.

I still think Klingon is likely scum; SOMEONE on that Albert wagon yesterday has to be. Beyond that, I donno.

[Yosarian2]

Yosarian, DP, R&L: If lynching me was off the table, who do you guys lynch today and why?

Not interested in helping you sidetrack your lynch, CC.

pedit: Why would the townie EVER BELIEVE ME OVER THE SCUM????????

Townie knows that if he helps the scum lynch you, that's a 100% town loss. If he doesn't, it's probably a 95% likely town loss, but still better then 100%. So he doesn't, because play to win.

It doesn't make any sense, and it will be obvious to all the involved parties that a lynch needs to happen. The 3p scenario is still immaterial though, because I won't ever live that long.

You keep saying that, but you're bulletproof, and if we don't lynch you today you probably live until the end of the game. I know that, and you know that, and I know you know that.

Did you miss the part where I said we could go to 8 instead? That actually accounts for an extra kill. How about 10? Why would you NOT just lynch me if pieces of the puzzle that keeps me chained start to die?

It makes no sense for the town to wait and lynch you later in any case; it's better to lynch you early then to waste a later lynch on you.

The scenario you're positing to force a sense of urgency into our lynch requires that town all go simultaneously brain dead. If the roleblockers that are containing me die, LYNCH ME. How hard is that?

It might be quite hard, depending on how the game setup has changed. I think the town is much better off just lynching you now. It's safer all around. Plus, no sense tying up a town roleblocker forever anyway.

[The Cool Cucumbers]

DP: Town doesn't get a whole lot. They potentially end the game a lynch earlier, but if it gets to the point where you have to lynch me anyways, that is null, it just changes when the lynch happens. They get the option to have a strongman kill aimed at whatever they want at any time they choose to use it, and whoever is literally conftown(assuming DP gets to that point/R&L end up flipping and confirming Sensei/Zulfy) gets to tell us where to vote.

They also don't lose a lot. Depending on the method used, they force a suspected scum slot in skybird into roleblocking us(which simultaneously makes us easier to lynch, making it easier to pull off a double lynch so lynching us doesn't actually cost town a lynch), in exchange for not being able to use that roleblock for other actions, or they can just use zulfy's roleblock which can't be used to catch scum anyways, unless scum are down to one member.

Really, seriously, the main thing it does is give us the chance to win with town in the next day phase or two, instead of just dying now and not having any chance to win, for the sake of paranoia.

-Cerb

pedit: Yosarian, I am not fucking anti-town. I am third party. Do not misrepresent me.

[Yosarian2]

Bah, screwed up the quote tags; mod you can delete that last post.

I just fixed it.
Because I don't like deleting posts.

Yosarian, DP, R&L: If lynching me was off the table, who do you guys lynch today and why?

Not interested in helping you sidetrack your lynch, CC.

pedit: Why would the townie EVER BELIEVE ME OVER THE SCUM????????

Townie knows that if he helps the scum lynch you, that's a 100% town loss. If he doesn't, it's probably a 95% likely town loss, but still better then 100%. So he doesn't, because play to win.

It doesn't make any sense, and it will be obvious to all the involved parties that a lynch needs to happen. The 3p scenario is still immaterial though, because I won't ever live that long.

You keep saying that, but you're bulletproof, and if we don't lynch you today you probably live until the end of the game. I know that, and you know that, and I know you know that.

Did you miss the part where I said we could go to 8 instead? That actually accounts for an extra kill. How about 10? Why would you NOT just lynch me if pieces of the puzzle that keeps me chained start to die?

It makes no sense for the town to wait and lynch you later in any case; it's better to lynch you early then to waste a later lynch on you.

The scenario you're positing to force a sense of urgency into our lynch requires that town all go simultaneously brain dead. If the roleblockers that are containing me die, LYNCH ME. How hard is that?

It might be quite hard, depending on how the game setup has changed. I think the town is much better off just lynching you now. It's safer all around. Plus, no sense tying up a town roleblocker forever anyway.

[Yosarian2]

pedit: Yosarian, I am not fucking anti-town. I am third party. Do not misrepresent me.

Your role, as you have claimed it, is extremely anti-town. It's somewhere between a survivor and a SK, both of which are anti-town roles.

[The Cool Cucumbers]

Bah, screwed up the quote tags; mod you can delete that last post.

Yosarian, DP, R&L: If lynching me was off the table, who do you guys lynch today and why?

Not interested in helping you sidetrack your lynch, CC.

pedit: Why would the townie EVER BELIEVE ME OVER THE SCUM????????

Townie knows that if he helps the scum lynch you, that's a 100% town loss. If he doesn't, it's probably a 95% likely town loss, but still better then 100%. So he doesn't, because play to win.

It doesn't make any sense, and it will be obvious to all the involved parties that a lynch needs to happen. The 3p scenario is still immaterial though, because I won't ever live that long.[/quote

You keep saying that, but you're bulletproof, and if we don't lynch you today you probably live until the end of the game. I know that, and you know that, and I know you know that.

Did you miss the part where I said we could go to 8 instead? That actually accounts for an extra kill. How about 10? Why would you NOT just lynch me if pieces of the puzzle that keeps me chained start to die?

It makes no sense for the town to wait and lynch you later in any case; it's better to lynch you early then to waste a later lynch on you.

The scenario you're positing to force a sense of urgency into our lynch requires that town all go simultaneously brain dead. If the roleblockers that are containing me die, LYNCH ME. How hard is that?

It might be quite hard, depending on how the game setup has changed. I think the town is much better off just lynching you now. It's safer all around. Plus, no sense tying up a town roleblocker forever anyway.

Yosarian, in the 3p scenario(which we should probably stop talking about because it doesn't matter), there's no reason why the last town would KNOW the other slot was scum. It's far more likely that I'm scum and i've coasted on this claim till the end game through my hypnotoad powers, than that the other slot is scum. At least, that's how I'd expect any town slot to read that situation....

-Cerb

pedit: yes, EXCEPT I CAN ONLY WIN WITH THE TOWN. That's the critical fucking thing. Survivors get auto lynched because when it comes down to lylo, they claim survivor, tell scum to just pile on and they'll join them, and town auto-loses. SK obviously has to kill everyone. Survivor is quite happy letting scum win, and Sk has to make sure nobody else can win. Me? I have to make sure I do my job before town manages to win. That's it. It's only similar to a survivor in that I must be alive at end game.

[Zulfy]

Should I punch Cerb? Should I kick him in the jaw?

[Rylai and Lina]

Yosarian, DP, R&L: If lynching me was off the table, who do you guys lynch today and why?

I mean I am all for DGB lynch but I do not trust you either CC. Your claim is dodgy. I mean techincaly speaking we could keep you alive and if we feel uneasy have sky roleblock you but is it really worth thr risk ? You did claim a villain and so far villain have flipped scum. I am still a bit sus about the fact your character has nothing to do with black x which is what the other bad gusy so far where but. I dunno.
~Lina

[The Cool Cucumbers]

Actually, let's be real here Yos: Why are you even bothering to engage with me? You seem pretty adamant about lynching me, as do R&L and DP. I'm dumping a buncha time of my life here because you're talking to me, but you're still being just as stubborn as they are.

I'm confused by this. Why are you going to so much trouble to answer me if you're so certain lynching me IMMEDIATELY rather than giving me a chance to win with you is in the towns best interests?

-Cerb

pedit: Shiro, seriously, don't you dare hide behind the flavor claim. Varsoon SAID flavor is not alignment indicative. And how is my claim dodgy? Seriously? What part of it is dodgy?

[Yosarian2]

Actually, let's be real here Yos: Why are you even bothering to engage with me? You seem pretty adamant about lynching me, as do R&L and DP. I'm dumping a buncha time of my life here because you're talking to me, but you're still being just as stubborn as they are.

I'm obviously not expecting to convince you that you should be lynched. I'm taking apart your bogus arguments so the rest of the town can also see that.

And, hey, if you actually had a real reason why it's safer to leave you alive then to kill you, I'd be willing to listen. But "you can lynch me later" makes no sense; lynching you later instead of lynching you now doesn't by the town any extra days or any extra lynches, it doesn't increase the town's odds of victory at all, it just creates an extra risk to the town for not much benifit.

[Rylai and Lina]

Actually, let's be real here Yos: Why are you even bothering to engage with me? You seem pretty adamant about lynching me, as do R&L and DP. I'm dumping a buncha time of my life here because you're talking to me, but you're still being just as stubborn as they are.

I'm confused by this. Why are you going to so much trouble to answer me if you're so certain lynching me IMMEDIATELY rather than giving me a chance to win with you is in the towns best interests?

-Cerb

pedit: Shiro, seriously, don't you dare hide behind the flavor claim. Varsoon SAID flavor is not alignment indicative. And how is my claim dodgy? Seriously? What part of it is dodgy?

Lol I have been flavour specing since start of the game. Now it botheres you xD

Dodgy as in it make no sense for you character to want to do what your win con says. I mean So far powers and characters have been pretty aligned.
~Lina

[Drixx]

So we have a Miller AND a Third Party we are obligated to use lynches on?

I think there's literally zero chance of you making it out of today alive TCC. Best you can get out of this is to try and leave behind good reasoning about who is scum and why and show that you will play town friendly as a neutral. Nobody is going to listen to me.

[The Cool Cucumbers]

Should I punch Cerb? Should I kick him in the jaw?

Actually, let's be real here Yos: Why are you even bothering to engage with me? You seem pretty adamant about lynching me, as do R&L and DP. I'm dumping a buncha time of my life here because you're talking to me, but you're still being just as stubborn as they are.

I'm obviously not expecting to convince you that you should be lynched. I'm taking apart your bogus arguments so the rest of the town can also see that.

And, hey, if you actually had a real reason why it's safer to leave you alive then to kill you, I'd be willing to listen. But "you can lynch me later" makes no sense; lynching you later instead of lynching you now doesn't by the town any extra days or any extra lynches, it doesn't increase the town's odds of victory at all, it just creates an extra risk to the town for not much benifit.

My arguments aren't actually bogus though. Your argument amounts to "it's not worth the risk", while mine amounts to "there is no notable extra risk". Because there isn't. It is, of course possible that I have some sort of weird ability to not be roleblocked and thus you won't be able to stop me, but again, as long as I'm dead before that one extra kill matters, it's irrelevant. Town is in such a strong position that this is one of the only situations where they could actually win the game before any risk I might pose could become realized.

Lynching me later instead of now *does* increase the towns odds of victory, in that you do have access to a strongman kill whenever you want now. There is undeniable utility in having access to that.

Actually, let's be real here Yos: Why are you even bothering to engage with me? You seem pretty adamant about lynching me, as do R&L and DP. I'm dumping a buncha time of my life here because you're talking to me, but you're still being just as stubborn as they are.

I'm confused by this. Why are you going to so much trouble to answer me if you're so certain lynching me IMMEDIATELY rather than giving me a chance to win with you is in the towns best interests?

-Cerb

pedit: Shiro, seriously, don't you dare hide behind the flavor claim. Varsoon SAID flavor is not alignment indicative. And how is my claim dodgy? Seriously? What part of it is dodgy?

Lol I have been flavour specing since start of the game. Now it botheres you xD

Dodgy as in it make no sense for you character to want to do what your win con says. I mean So far powers and characters have been pretty aligned.
~Lina

Flavor speccing is fine, but you haven't used flavor spec as a reason to lynch or clear someone yet, except insofar as your actual claimed role tells you someones flavor is town. There's a difference between flavor speccing and seeing how flavor relates to claimed ability, and using the flavor as a reason to assign an alignment to someone.

And yeah, I don't know how my flavor relates to my win con at all, what I've checked out in the wiki doesn't match up at all. *shrug*

-Cerb

pedit: Drixx, you know how long it takes me to establish reads and properly evaluate things. There is no way I'm going to waste my time doing that if it doesn't give me a chance to win. I get the sentiment of leaving a good impression and all that, but it's really not worth such a large chunk of my life. Also, the miller is going ot get rolecopped. That means you'll see they're a miller, and you are thus no longer *obligated* to use a lynch on them.

[The Cool Cucumbers]

Oh, and that first quote, to zulfy: You should stick around and watch and see who would be optimal to ues your powers on. If I'm not getting lynched today, it's *probably* me.

-Cerb

[The Cool Cucumbers]

Also, umm. At the moment, I think there are just as many people who want to leash me as lynch me.

KC, ZZZX, Drixx are in favor of leashing me.

DP/R&L/Yos are in favor of lynching me. I can't count DGB here because she's just sheeping and hasn't expressed an opinion.

-Cerb

[The Cool Cucumbers]

Oh, and ABR, he's leaning towards leashing I believe? So yeah. It's just that the people who are doing all the talking plus scumfirevote plus sheep dgb are voting for me.

-Cerb

[Drixx]

Scum miller is a thing.

I believe that Yosarian2 scum slipped in the Party PT. I would like votes OFF of TCC temporarily as fast as possible. Do it so the day doesn't get ended prematurely. I will post again when he has satisfied me that it's not a slip, or else the post will out how he slipped and be accompanied by my vote and hopefully a bunch more.

[The Cool Cucumbers]

Scum miller is a thing.

I believe that Yosarian2 scum slipped in the Party PT. I would like votes OFF of TCC temporarily as fast as possible. Do it so the day doesn't get ended prematurely. I will post again when he has satisfied me that it's not a slip, or else the post will out how he slipped and be accompanied by my vote and hopefully a bunch more.

True. Hmm. Yeah, alright, that is a problem. :-/ I can't really figure out how to resolve it.

Also, that is interesting. Didn't ABR also think he had slipped?

-Cerb

[Drunken Pirates]

Scum miller is a thing.

I believe that Yosarian2 scum slipped in the Party PT. I would like votes OFF of TCC temporarily as fast as possible. Do it so the day doesn't get ended prematurely. I will post again when he has satisfied me that it's not a slip, or else the post will out how he slipped and be accompanied by my vote and hopefully a bunch more.

I am not doing a thing until you explain this.

I want to hear what you have to say, we are not gonna monitor the thread to make sure you get your say.

but cuke pple need 3 more votes in order for his lynch to happen so you have a reasonable amount of time.

[Drixx]

There's no reason for me to out it without giving Yosarian the chance to show me somewhere that my logic chain fails.

But ... if my logic chain is sound, it's basically 100% certain that I caught Yosarian in a narrative slip. I don't say that lightly. This has nothing to do with ABR's earlier concern.

[Yosarian2]

Scum miller is a thing.

I believe that Yosarian2 scum slipped in the Party PT. I would like votes OFF of TCC temporarily as fast as possible. Do it so the day doesn't get ended prematurely. I will post again when he has satisfied me that it's not a slip, or else the post will out how he slipped and be accompanied by my vote and hopefully a bunch more.

Oh for fuck's sake.