SAGA FRONTIER MAFIA (GAME END)

[Klingoncelt]

So we have a Miller AND a Third Party we are obligated to use lynches on?

I think there's literally zero chance of you making it out of today alive TCC. Best you can get out of this is to try and leave behind good reasoning about who is scum and why and show that you will play town friendly as a neutral. Nobody is going to listen to me.

Not necessarily.

If Sensei and Zulfy die/stump there won't be any need to lynch the Miller.

The 3rd Party must die before Lylo.

lynch it with fire lynch it with fire LYNCH IT WITH FIRE DUM DE DAH!!!

Shut up, or at least quit acting like such an idiot.

[Klingoncelt]

So we have a Miller AND a Third Party we are obligated to use lynches on?

I think there's literally zero chance of you making it out of today alive TCC. Best you can get out of this is to try and leave behind good reasoning about who is scum and why and show that you will play town friendly as a neutral. Nobody is going to listen to me.

Not necessarily.

If Sensei and Zulfy die/stump there won't be any need to lynch the Miller.

The 3rd Party must die before Lylo.

lynch it with fire lynch it with fire LYNCH IT WITH FIRE DUM DE DAH!!!

I agree.

Are you drunk, Titus? Read. Pay attention.

[Klingoncelt]

They will flip when stumped. If a Townie is stumped, why would you not trust them?

Never even slightly implied that I wouldn't trust a modconfirmed town voice.
Are you just posting for the sake of posting or is reading comprehension just difficult for you?

I must have misread. You didn't trust someone, I thought you meant Stumped Town. Sorry.

[Klingoncelt]

I think some players need to be reminded that I come on here late.

In this particular game there are quite a few posts to get through.

I reply to posts as I get to them.

Sometimes that creates a sort of lag between my reply to a post, and another player's (one who's all caught up) reply to me, and my subsequent reply to that player.

Get used to it.

[Klingoncelt]

It's late and I haven't had breakfast yet.

Back in a while...

[Yosarian2]

And if we're going to lynch them eventually, we're much better off if we do it now, before they murder any more townies

While I get where your mindset is coming from in the now rather than later, why don't you just want to leave them alive and control their stump? I think we can get a bit of utility out of this, or at least we can look in other directions for now while we mull it over.

I think the odds of us "controlling their stump" are low. I think if we try, tommorow they'll have killed someone else and they'll say "lol I thought that guy was scum" or "Ok ok but that was the last vig so I'll be good from now on i swear" or whatever and then people will probably let them go again anyway.

The idea of keeping them role-blocked forever isn't a great one either; I mean, if we really aren't going to lynch them, then yeah we should have Zulfy or Sky block them, but tying up one of our roleblocks forever isn't a great use of resources, and then are we going to lynch CC when our roleblockers die? Again, why not just do it now?

[Skybird]

Oooh, actually, I just had a thought! Since I realized the idea of having skybird RB us is meh if you don't think she's town(which pretty much nobody should think), How about on the nights when you don't want us to shoot anyone, we attempt to shoot skybird, and skybird roleblocks us. If anyone gets stumped other than her, then you know we betrayed you and lynch us, and it ensures she doesn't use her roleblock to stop anything else that's going on unless she wants to die herself.

That's if you don't trust skybird only, ofc.

-Cerb

pedit:

That leaves us to wonder about Zulfy.

Wasn't there a plan to have Skybird block him tonight?

There was a suggestion that skybird block me? I think it would be better if zulfy does it because it's testable then, just a superior play.

-Cerb

If I read correctly, your treestump goes through regardless of role blocks.

Changes in attitude on 3rd parties is going to take time. I for one will need to see some 3rd parties flip that definitely state they can win with town before I start believing it.

VOTE: The Cool Cucumbers

[The Cool Cucumbers]

Yosarian that's crumpets. If we shoot tonight you just lynch us then instead of now, we cannot win with one kill.
There will be no "oops", as if we do you simply lynch us. Period
¬wgeurts

[The Cool Cucumbers]

And we definitely don't go through roleblocks, we were blocked night 1.
Also to everyone that ignore the people they want dead, I absolutely despise that aspect of your play. This isn't just me saying this as a third-party, it harms everyone.

[Yosarian2]

Yosarian that's crumpets. If we shoot tonight you just lynch us then instead of now, we cannot win with one kill.
There will be no "oops", as if we do you simply lynch us. Period
¬wgeurts

You really telling me that you wouldn't try if you decided there was a vig left and you were pretty sure you knew who it was? Or maybe if you thought you could kill someone you think is a scum and maybe get some town cred?

I don't see any reason to trust that you'll hold your fire. I expect you to act towards your win condition, and then talk your way out of it later.

[wgeurts]

Yosarian that's crumpets. If we shoot tonight you just lynch us then instead of now, we cannot win with one kill.
There will be no "oops", as if we do you simply lynch us. Period
¬wgeurts

You really telling me that you wouldn't try if you decided there was a vig left and you were pretty sure you knew who it was? Or maybe if you thought you could kill someone you think is a scum and maybe get some town cred?

I don't see any reason to trust that you'll hold your fire. I expect you to act towards your win condition, and then talk your way out of it later.

If we try; we die.
No, I'd hope for scum to kill the vig off by accident. It's a really slim chance of winning but it's better than being dead.

[wgeurts]

This is acting to our win-condition.
Being dead is an automatic loss for us. So any slim chance of victory is playing to our win-condition.

[Yosarian2]

Sure, maybe you'll be cautious and wait until the town can't afford to kill you to go on a killing spree. It's possible. But either way, you are going to be playing counter to the town win condition. You don't even want the town to win "too soon" and will be working to sabatoge that, both at night and during the day. Just like you have all game.

[Lowkey]

Sure, maybe you'll be cautious and wait until the town can't afford to kill you to go on a killing spree. It's possible. But either way, you are going to be playing counter to the town win condition. You don't even want the town to win "too soon" and will be working to sabatoge that, both at night and during the day. Just like you have all game.

Lowell here, checking in. I agree with this. I feel like cc's PT right now probably reads something like this: "bwhahahahahahhahaha I can't believe they're actually going to keep us alive after WE CLAIMED THIRD PARTY lolololooloolololol."

Also but seriously yos is also probably scum. I feel like reading him in iso he's trying to be the town's den mother, which bugs me. And yes I realize the irony in agreeing with a scum concern about a third party player as a pro-town motivation for killing him. I'm okay with it if you are.

[Yosarian2]

I feel like reading him in iso he's trying to be the town's den mother, which bugs me.

Shh. It's ok. Have some milk and cookies, you'll feel better.

Seriously, I really think there's just something in my normal playstyle that you just always read as scum. Yeah, I tend to lead the town in general; that's just my personality.

[The Cool Cucumbers]

Stop with the fearmongering yosarian. You KNOW it's suicide for us to take a shot without approval, so why do you keep suggesting we would? That would be blatantly playing against our win con. Deliberately taking an action which will result in our immediate death is not exactly the best way to win with our role.

Also, skybird, you just voted because of a complete misunderstanding of our actual role. How can anyone even consider going along with this crap when it's being helped along by blatant misinterpretation of our abilities?

-Cerb

[The Cool Cucumbers]

Sure, maybe you'll be cautious and wait until the town can't afford to kill you to go on a killing spree. It's possible. But either way, you are going to be playing counter to the town win condition. You don't even want the town to win "too soon" and will be working to sabatoge that, both at night and during the day.

Just like you have all game.

What the hell have we done that's been playing counter to the towns win condition? I also already told you to just fucking kill us before "town can't afford to". Town is so fucking far ahead you have TIME to just win the game long before we'd be considered a threat, and you're just trying to ram this through when it does NOTHING to help you win, all it fucking does is ease your mind and remove utility.

As far as not wanting the town to win too soon: I am pretty damn sure there are no vigs left. If there are indeed vigs left, then we're going to lose no matter what at this point. Living, not shooting, and hoping there are no vigs left gives us a chance at winning. Getting lynched right now, or getting lynched for taking a shot we weren't supposed to, gives us no chance of winning.

It should be pretty obvious what path we're going to take.

mollie: you said you are usually pro indies but didn't answer me when I asked why you were so anti indies this time. Mind answering that?

-Cerb

[The Cool Cucumbers]

Yosarian that's crumpets. If we shoot tonight you just lynch us then instead of now, we cannot win with one kill.
There will be no "oops", as if we do you simply lynch us. Period
¬wgeurts

You really telling me that you wouldn't try if you decided there was a vig left and you were pretty sure you knew who it was? Or maybe if you thought you could kill someone you think is a scum and maybe get some town cred?

I don't see any reason to trust that you'll hold your fire. I expect you to act towards your win condition, and then talk your way out of it later.

If we try; we die.
No, I'd hope for scum to kill the vig off by accident. It's a really slim chance of winning but it's better than being dead.

This is acting to our win-condition.
Being dead is an automatic loss for us. So any slim chance of victory is playing to our win-condition.

Hydra pickup.

Also skybird check drixx's friggin iso. He linked to a VARSOON game where he had a 3p that won with town from not long ago, and an even more recent dramonic game with a 3p with a variable win con, depending on which faction targeted him first.

There are two flips right there, one from this moderator if you care about that sort of thing, of 3p that can win with town.

-Cerb

[The Cool Cucumbers]

Also, I'm not going to be able to sit here and spar with people all day long like yesterday, I have a greater workload planned. Just don't expect swift answers to anything until I get home from work.

Before I go, let me say this one last time: If you do not believe our claim, and have reasons for doing so which you have actually expressed to me, and I have not addressed....then lynch us. If you do believe our claim, it doesn't make any sense to lynch us.

And in both of those situations, it doesn't *hurt* in any way to give us the chance to catch scum today and tomorrow without shooting and just win when you do.

-Cerb

[Varsoon]

I suppose I'll do a small series of game exploits/glitches in SaGa Frontier.
You can get infinite money in Koorong. All you need to do is travel to Nelson, buy at least 12 Gold Ingots, then go to Koorong to sell them.
Every time you attempt to sell a Gold Ingot in Koorong, the price for the next Ingot sold will be lower. However, this doesn't dip into the negatives, so if you click the down button enough in the preview screen, you'll be 'selling' ingots at 0 gold. The exploit comes in when you click the up button to take back the ingots you've previewed as sold. Every Ingot you take back will increase the price of ingots, starting with the first, so you can take them all back and then sell at profits!

[Varsoon]

Asellus' ending changes depending on if you use your Mystic abilities a whole bunch.
Actually, this only apparently matters if you use the abilities tied to your Mystic Boots.
I haven't tried this one out, but this is what people say.

[Varsoon]

Time Magic's Gift allows learning Overdrive, a powerful move that lets the caster take multiple turns in a row at the expense of all of his mana.
Rune Magic's Gift allows learning Stasis Rune, a practically worthless spell that traps both the caster and their target in stasis for several turns where neither can be affected by anything but also can't take any actions.
Using Stasis Rune while in Overdrive produces an amusing effect; when the caster comes out of stasis, they will receive multiple turns every time it is their turn!

This trick can only be done by Time Lord and Blue, however, as no other character gains access to the gift for Time Magic.

[Varsoon]

Having some trouble early on in SaGa Frontier? Need better equipment?
Go to Scrap. There's a junk shop there that is run by two lizards. The way it works is that you pay money to go take three items from various junk boxes. You could get a useful item or... a repair kit, broken bumper, or junk.
However, if you pay the money, take the items, then tell the lizards you are selling them a Hyperion Bazooka (even if you don't have one!), they'll let you take seven more items. You can keep 'selling' Hyperion Bazookas to keep taking free items!
But catch this--if you actually sell them some of those repair kits you've been accumulating, the quality of all the items you can receive will increase.

This is not just a great way to get good starting gear, but also a fantastic way to get money, since most of these items can be sold at other locations.

[Varsoon]

Still having trouble early on in SaGa Frontier?
Go to Devin and start BOTH the Rune and Arcane quests. So long as you haven't collected any single Arcane Tarot or Rune, you can recruit any character that normally only joins on one quest or the other!

[Varsoon]

This last one isn't really a glitch or exploit, but if you've already gotten the gift for one type of magic (or if you're Riki or T260G), you can have all your other party members receive the opposing gift for free by simply visiting the correct location.
This only works with Light, Shadow, and Mind magic, though.