Open 624 Fire and Ice - Fire Mafia Wins

[Aristophanes]

Why are you rushing this we have 9 days.
How about you consolidate?

I'm not rushing, I just hate seeing scrambles at the last minute, and with the activity level here, I'd rather start the process early.

And sure, how would you like me to consolidate?
I'd love for people to vote Masq with me, but if this doesn't happen, who would you prefer I place my vote on?

[Viva La Gloria]

SO was a major wagon at this point.

What are the chances that he just HAPPENS to forget about him in the readslist?

I flat out said I wasn't concerned with him because he was one of the few people not tunneling me.

When was this?

You don't bring him up at all anywhere near that post as far as I can see.

[Masquerade]

Yes, defensiveness is a scum trait.
I feel like the Shinobi-SO interactions are probably not partners, because SO voted Shinobi pretty early on. I'll have to look again but I'm pretty sure scumbuddies wouldn't do this.
Fire, who are your scumreads?
Viva, do you really think Shinobi would be so obvious as to leave his buddy off his readlist? And then you think his buddy would point it out?

Overlord voted Shinobi during RVS. I'm not going to dig up links but I have seen it happening. I'm not going to disregard a scumread just because it was voted by their buddy during freaking RVS. That tell is too well-known to work. Scum can rvs-vote their buddies period

[Masquerade]

Actually, the fact that Overlord called Shinobi out on Shinobi not having a read on Overlord made me read Overlord more towny.

[Something_Smart]

Fire is Ice. (Lol.)
Let's see:
Droog did very little all of day 1. The only vote he placed was an "experiment" which he unvoted later without ever explaining. He only gave out a few reads and only took a strong stance on beeboy.

Aero also did little. He socialized with Silver and pulled out a scumread on Shinobi and Masq based on the first four pages.

Then Fire comes in. He is immediately defensive (612) and immediately starts defending SO (625). He doubtcasts my case on SO in 627 and 629, and tries to get somebody to unvote in 633 and 635. Then he argues with ika for a while, putting out a mild scumread on Silver. All this time he is barely mentioning SO and SO is barely mentioning him.

Silver is killed by the Ice. Fire "knew something was up" (664) and proceeds to be defensive (675) and salty (680) and even claims not to be fire (681). He contributes unsupported scumreads (683), claims not fire again (699), and still has not explained any of his reads.

So yeah, Aristo, that's where your vote should be. I don't have as clear an idea who the Fire is (thinking Snarky or Masq probably), but I'm pretty sure about this.

[Shinobi]

SO was a major wagon at this point.

What are the chances that he just HAPPENS to forget about him in the readslist?

I flat out said I wasn't concerned with him because he was one of the few people not tunneling me.

When was this?

You don't bring him up at all anywhere near that post as far as I can see.

A while beforehand.
I started talking about him again during day 2 but ika hammered him too quickly for me to reassess the slot.

[Shinobi]

Fire is Ice. (Lol.)
Let's see:
Droog did very little all of day 1. The only vote he placed was an "experiment" which he unvoted later without ever explaining. He only gave out a few reads and only took a strong stance on beeboy.

Aero also did little. He socialized with Silver and pulled out a scumread on Shinobi and Masq based on the first four pages.

Then Fire comes in. He is immediately defensive (612) and immediately starts defending SO (625). He doubtcasts my case on SO in 627 and 629, and tries to get somebody to unvote in 633 and 635. Then he argues with ika for a while, putting out a mild scumread on Silver. All this time he is barely mentioning SO and SO is barely mentioning him.

Silver is killed by the Ice. Fire "knew something was up" (664) and proceeds to be defensive (675) and salty (680) and even claims not to be fire (681). He contributes unsupported scumreads (683), claims not fire again (699), and still has not explained any of his reads.

So yeah, Aristo, that's where your vote should be. I don't have as clear an idea who the Fire is (thinking Snarky or Masq probably), but I'm pretty sure about this.

This is not a terrible post.

[Masquerade]

This is not a terrible post.

Tell me why you think that.

[Masquerade]

A while beforehand.
I started talking about him again during day 2 but ika hammered him too quickly for me to reassess the slot.

You NEVER brought up Overlord. Even when he called you out on not including him in your readslist did you not respond to him.
Or else quote the posts that I missed from you that were about or to Overlord.

[Aristophanes]

Alright, I like that SS!
I looked back, and the slot's voting was useless as well. As in, mostly not voting at all.

I would be very alright with this as a lynch with your analysis there.

VOTE: Fire

[Masquerade]

UNVOTE:

I'm doing this because I want to show you that I'm willing to hear you out before lynching you. Again.

Also, if we lynch today, we're going into night with 5 players, if we don't lynch scum, there is a possibility we wake up 1 towny left vs 2 scum. If the game didn't end there already. I want to figure this out as good as I can with the time we have.

[Masquerade]

Eh I don't like Aristo.

Aristo, why aren;t you pushing your own scumreads?

[Masquerade]

(I'm giving my opinion on Somthingsdmarts post after I had a response from Shinobi btw.)

[Shinobi]

This is not a terrible post.

Tell me why you think that.

I'll try to elaborate when I'm not at work.

[Viva La Gloria]

SO was a major wagon at this point.

What are the chances that he just HAPPENS to forget about him in the readslist?

I flat out said I wasn't concerned with him because he was one of the few people not tunneling me.

When was this?

You don't bring him up at all anywhere near that post as far as I can see.

A while beforehand.
I started talking about him again during day 2 but ika hammered him too quickly for me to reassess the slot.

Yeah, no.

[Aristophanes]

Eh I don't like Aristo.

Aristo, why aren;t you pushing your own scumreads?

Because I like this argument. Because I did push and nobody bothered with it. Because the game has stagnated and I'd rather get a wagon with good reasoning going than sit here stubbornly while not progressing the game.

[Masquerade]

You have me as a scumread, why not push me to respond to your case? I haven't done that yet, don't you want me to? Just posting a case and a vote isn;t really pushing a scumread.
You also had this analysis of Snarky's voting. What happened to those thoughts?
How come, if you did such a VCA, you missed the Firebringer-slot? I mean, you did make sure there wouldn't be much confusion on the slots that needed replacing.

[Aristophanes]

You have me as a scumread, why not push me to respond to your case? I haven't done that yet, don't you want me to? Just posting a case and a vote isn;t really pushing a scumread.
You also had this analysis of Snarky's voting. What happened to those thoughts?
How come, if you did such a VCA, you missed the Firebringer-slot? I mean, you did make sure there wouldn't be much confusion on the slots that needed replacing.

I don't know, apathy is probably the correct answer, even if it is a bad one.

In switching the names, I used the "replace all" function in word because I'm lazy. I analyzed it after the fact.
Missed the slot as I was looking at actual votes predominantly, rather than those who were not voting.

There are two scumteam so I am okay with catching one first. There was a good argument against Fire so I am supporting it. I can always revisit my push on you later.

Though, now that you mention it, a response would be cool of course!

[Aristophanes]

Spoiler: Original Masq Case

I feel like masq and Snarky could be last two scum.

Yeah, I'm pretty much sold on Masq being the last Ice goon.

Although being on a wagon with Supreme Overlord is troubling as I have a bad gut feeling about him.

VOTE: Beeboy

Dammit

VOTE: Supreme Overlord.
Eh, still not fully comfortable with ika

especially

given multiball, but beeboy's right.
Not gonna share a wagon with him.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Cobalting

Different scumteams, I'd like Cobalting out first.

Dafuq is the problem sharing a wagon with scum if it is on other scum?! We can only lynch 1 a day you know.

This is one of the worst posts. They voted town, unvoted to vote another town in defense of scum, and rather then giving a reason for the scumread, attacked Cobalt's logic.

Their vote and revote onto Shinobi were both bad and lacked critical thinking, and the unvote is placed in a way that looks like it is there to garner townpoints, not because they actually want to extend the conversation.

They haven't voted since and are just sliding by.

Their mentions of SO are few and far between, and say absolutely nothing about the slot, as if trying to distance themselves there.

This is scum.
VOTE: Masquerade

Oh yeah, this was a decent case!

[Masquerade]

Ok but you have scumreads on Snarky and me, and now you're ok with voting Firebringer.
You do realize there's 2 scum left to catch right?
Oh wait, you do:

VOTE: Firebringer
Probably ice, not sure what Viva was thinking, interactions with SO are terrible.
I'd also probably be ok lynching masq or snarky.

You are scum reading all three players?
Okay...

That's okay. They're probably the last Fire goon anyway.

[Masquerade]

What do you think about Viva's case on Shinobi?

[Something_Smart]

Masq, who are you more sure on? Fire or Shinobi?
Do you think Aristo's case on you is fake? Do you think he is scum?

Pedit: I think Shinobi is not a good lynch today. He's definitely not Fire and he's probably not Ice, since Fire is a lot more likely to be Ice. (Lol I just can't get over this )

[Masquerade]

Ok but you have scumreads on Snarky and me, and now you're ok with voting Firebringer.
You do realize there's 2 scum left to catch right?
Oh wait, you do:

VOTE: Firebringer
Probably ice, not sure what Viva was thinking, interactions with SO are terrible.
I'd also probably be ok lynching masq or snarky.

You are scum reading all three players?
Okay...

That's okay. They're probably the last Fire goon anyway.

Upon a recheck I must admit I made an error. Aristo was talking about Somethingsmart here and not Snarky. I think. I still get confused who people mean when they say SS.

[Aristophanes]

Ok but you have scumreads on Snarky and me, and now you're ok with voting Firebringer.
You do realize there's 2 scum left to catch right?
Oh wait, you do:

VOTE: Firebringer
Probably ice, not sure what Viva was thinking, interactions with SO are terrible.
I'd also probably be ok lynching masq or snarky.

You are scum reading all three players?
Okay...

That's okay. They're probably the last Fire goon anyway.

Of course I do!
I merely got cocky at the start of this phase.
What's wrong with keeping an eye on multiple people?

I have a scumread on Snarky?

Ninja'd

What do you think about Viva's case on Shinobi?

It's not bad, and I didn't like the overdefensiveness after my one small comment. I will have to do a reread of it and get back to you though.

[Masquerade]

Masq, who are you more sure on? Fire or Shinobi?
Do you think Aristo's case on you is fake? Do you think he is scum?

Pedit: I think Shinobi is not a good lynch today. He's definitely not Fire and he's probably not Ice, since Fire is a lot more likely to be Ice. (Lol I just can't get over this )

I'd like to get back to you after Shinobi answers me.

About Aristo: I think his case on me is a huge stretch, trying to discredit me based on a post I made during Day 1. Sure I vote 2 players that are now conftown but he voted one of them as well so yeah, it's a huge stretch. I think he's scum because he's basically been going with the flow this entire game. He tosses up some of his own ideas at times, but he doesn't really push them. Eventually he will just jump the bandwagon. Shadow day 1, Overlord day 2 (and I think that could have very well been a bus) and now he's tested out some theories about his vca (Somethingsmart or Snarky?) and me, those didn't seem to stick so now he jumped on Firebringer.
I could lynch this before Shinobi actually.