Mini 1812 | Quolls | Endgame

[Plotinus]

Official Vote Count 1.17 Eastern Quoll

---

Lynching

With 13 votes in play, it takes 7 to lynch.

Nachomamma8

(L-4): MURDERCAT, Dragon of the West, hiplop

Dragon of the West

(L-4): Bellaphant, All In, The_Jester

A Simple Plan

(L-5): Vedith, Raskolnikov

All In

(L-6):

The_Jester,

Shadow_Step

The_Jester

(L-6): Killthestory

hiplop

(L-6): dwlee99

Vedith

(L-7): A Simple Plan

Not Voting

(2): Nachomamma8, A Simple Plan

M

o

d

n

o

t

e

s

:

K

e

e

p

i

t

f

u

n

!

K

i

l

l

t

h

e

s

t

o

r

y

i

s

V

/

L

A

u

n

t

i

l

t

h

e

2

0

t

h

.

M

U

R

D

E

R

C

A

T

i

s

V

/

L

A

u

n

t

i

l

t

h

e

2

2

n

d

.

A

S

i

m

p

l

e

P

l

a

n

i

s

V

/

L

A

u

n

t

i

l

f

u

r

t

h

e

r

n

o

t

i

c

e

.

P

l

o

t

i

n

u

s

i

s

V

/

L

A

u

n

t

i

l

S

u

n

d

a

y

.

D

e

a

d

l

i

n

e

:

(expired on 2016-07-22 14:00:00)

.

[Shadow_step]

3 days to deadline and we are no where near lynching scum All in.

[The_Jester]

If I could just "explain the game" I wouldn't have to make excuses, would I?

[Bellaphant]

shadow, it's a vanity wagon. LEt's consolidate our votes.

[The_Jester]

I think the Nacho wagon leads to nowhere atm

[Raskolnikov]

VOTE: Nacho

Everyone else wasting time is whatever but nacho should know better.
As far as I can tell he's intentionally doing nothing (as opposed to everyone v/la, afk or seemingly unmotivated) and is content mostly answering questions despite him being leading wagon and the day going nowhere this close to deadline. I don't see ANY concern from someone being scumread by his townreads and I can't wrap my head around what he's doing; OTOH as scum he can wait/prepare until near the end to post to save himself and win vs the dragon wagon. But as town unless that is your top scumread you don't wait around like this, it doesn't make any sense.
I've kept holding off to see if he'd reach an "enough is enough" point and try to get things done but he's just pushing the hypo claim business. The only person not a townread of his he reached out or questioned seemed to be bella, but I don't think town nacho would have a scumread at 0 votes (very unlikely to be lynched atm) and like not pursue them while there's a chance but just hold off inexplicably to try to swing it last day.

The hypo claim business itself is even pro-town and a good idea but it's like him doing that replaces actually playing the game (if he's town how is he so focused on the future and not concerned he'd be nightkilled for being a good player or suggesting the hypo claim?) and I know as scum he's nefarious enough to do it for towncred or especially to analyse/pr-hunt through it.

All of that said I don't townread bella either though. Lynchpool is ASP, nacho, bellaphant (maybe dwlee? but he's unlikely scum with any of these). Purely from everyone hating the ASP wagon without anyone townreading him I'd prefer him dead but it looks like that's never happening.

[Raskolnikov]

If this was his only game I wouldn't be able to judge the activity but I see him posting elsewhere...

[Dwlee99]

VOTE: nacho

[Nachomamma8]

As far as I can tell he's intentionally doing nothing (as opposed to everyone v/la, afk or seemingly unmotivated) and is content mostly answering questions despite him being leading wagon and the day going nowhere this close to deadline. I don't see ANY concern from someone being scumread by his townreads and I can't wrap my head around what he's doing; OTOH as scum he can wait/prepare until near the end to post to save himself and win vs the dragon wagon. But as town unless that is your top scumread you don't wait around like this, it doesn't make any sense.

If I can save myself as scum, why can't I save myself as town?

I don't know what concern you expect me to express at townreads pushing me; people are pushing me for lurking while I don't have time and that's it. MURDERCAT's push on me hasn't been updated since I've returned; it's an easy push based on me lurking and I'd love it if he actually tried to expand reasoning past that, but he won't. I have no idea why Dragon is voting me. Hiplop is voting me for shitty reasons based on him thinking he can read me like a book while he cannot, you're voting me because you think I should be guiding the town to glory even though I don't have the capability to do that right now, and Dwlee is probably voting me because he can't really get anything going.

You can tell me that I need to do things early and I need to do things now and you can say "oh, Nacho wouldn't string people along unless he was scum, Nacho wouldn't play suboptimal unless he was scum" but the truth of it all is that I wouldn't play suboptimal unless I wasn't engaged. You're assigning scum motivation where there isn't any; as scum, I'd generally expect that I'd have to put in more work to move the wagon since I couldn't just make engaged genuine posts and so would probably put in work earlier, but, again, I'm playing poorly because I don't have shit for time and I simply can't make the posts that I want to make. Lately, I've been posting so I didn't get prodded + replaced, am not overly sure when I have time but here I am doing my best.

[Nachomamma8]

Nacho's if you're town you know murder and all in just finished townreading you on one-sided/limited meta (I'm sure at least all-in is town) and how wrong it would be since you can fake these posts as scum, so how can you go on to townread hiplop in the same way, admitting it's based on one-sided meta without alarm bells going off?

Murder and All-In both incorrectly scumread me due to thinking that I would lurk as scum but not town.

My townread on hiplop is because I don't think that he would play so lazily and so sloppily as scum; this is based on limited meta because part of it is his commentary on his own scum play and how I've seen him behave in the past, but while I'm not sure he doesn't do it as scum, I don't really see the motivation in copying that aspect of his town meta here (since it often gets him mislynched). Does that make sense?

Why didn't you respond to this post?

[Nachomamma8]

I haven't gotten into my scumreads yet because I haven't had time to form any; at a glance, I dislike KTS's general interactions with me. As fucked up as it is, I very sincerely appreciate the space that he's given me wrt lurking and wrt the plan but it seems like the amount of space that he's given me is unnatural, which is an interaction I'd expect from a scum-KTS who doesn't expect me to get lynched as town. I haven't really remembered anything that he's posted so far, expected him to find something to work with by now if he was town, but am unaware if lurking is AI for him or not.

I think Shadow Step's tunneling on All_In and Vedith looks weird; it looks like he picked their names out of a hat and pushed them. I think that the personal level between him and Vedith makes it seem less like it's coming from scum, but am not horrendously sold on that particular nuance.

I don't understand your case on ASP, but he could be scum based on uninspiring low-volume posting that's seems to be plaguing the game at the moment.

Dragon, see ASP.

Vedith, see Shadow_Step.

MURDERCAT I think is scummy mainly for meta differences but have a very limited meta experience with him and thus have pretty low confidence in voting there.

So, when I have the time to post, I expect that I'll focus on these people and try to see why Shadow is pushing, see what Vedith is doing, try to pick apart some of Dragon's catchup, see what MURDERCAT decides to do at this point in time, revisit your case on ASP and how ASP is responding. Right now, I can't really do any of that. The only thing that I can do is take a shot in the dark that won't really mean jack shit until I've done the work to actually like the vote. So, I'm waiting for me to have time.

[Nachomamma8]

I also don't know what the whole posting elsewhere thing is about; I can't really respond to it because yes I've been posting elsewhere but the fact that raises a red flag for you surprises me.

[Dragon of the West]

Alright, starting my catchup now. Sorry again. VOTE: unvote

Notes from pages 1-3

-Don't like Shadow Steps RVS vote: Naked vote on a person who has not yet posted.
-Shadow Step follows up with a vote on my predecessor when the RVS wagon starts to build. Wondering why he didn't try starting a wagon instead of his naked vote earlier
-Murdercat taking the lead and votes Raskolnikov: good vote.

I need to go right now. I'll finish up on my catchup a bit later.

Why didn't you have a problem with this vote? Granted it wasn't a naked vote, but there is no real reasoning. Specifically why didn't you have a problem with not voting someone who had already posted? He could have also voted to form a wagon but did not, why didn't you have a problem with that?

VOTE: ASP

Tempted with the Jester vote, but I feel there's scum on that wagon.

Content to hammer!

Plus when the wagon on Robb(now All in) started to form

Vedith said this and didn't jump on that Robb wagon.

There is something really weird going on between these two slots.
I'd prefer a All in lynch now cause that attack on me feels like a chainsaw.

VOTE: All in

My vote was before Robb had any votes and my second comment was in regards to the "L1" post from Jester considering it was L5. This was page 1 with 2 people putting a vote on Robb. You really are scratching the walls here.

I don't have any problem with the reasoning here from vedith, because the explanation itself is fine. What I do have a problem with the response itself. The question didn't seem like an attack onto vedith by shadowstep, but rather shadow pointing out inconsistencies in All in's judgement. That being said, vedith seems yucky

VOTE: hiplop
back to this

While it's weird that hiplop refused to engage in that conversation, I'm inclined to say that scum!hiplop would be more eager to refute your point or engage with you. Not totally AI, but I like hippo as a townlean

Okay, this is what I was looking for from Nacho. I only wish he delivered a bit earlier.

You know, Nacho, you have a good point about people looking at you instead of applying pressure themselves. I can only speak for myself, but when I know a good player is in the game, comparing my reads to theirs is something I like to do. Good players who are town don't tend to live long, so matching scumreads are usually an indication for me that I'm on the right track on those reads.

VOTE: Dragon of the west.

Their catchup after coming back from V/LA was very underwhelming.

And the point I made before:

Dragon's comment on the personal attack in his catchup post seems unnecessary and pointless.Especially because nothing in the 70 other posts since his V/LA seem to be noteworthy.

I wouldn't mind lynching this at all.

Meh, the early game was shit and I was busy with another game as well as work. I just wasn't super into it on top of being busy. That being said, I feel like conversation is finally progressing and I have a few days off in a row to be active and share my reads more. More posts on their way

[Dragon of the West]

Actually nacho thinks it's a good point and wonders why he doesn't answer, but comes away with a hiplop townread anyways. Nacho's townread on hiplop in general I don't follow either.

Nacho's if you're town you know murder and all in just finished townreading you on one-sided/limited meta (I'm sure at least all-in is town) and how wrong it would be since you can fake these posts as scum, so how can you go on to townread hiplop in the same way, admitting it's based on one-sided meta without alarm bells going off?

What makes you so sure All-in is town? I didn't get a gut read on him and I haven't seen anything AI. Just trying to understand what you see. Also, Rask's posts around this point feel super towny to me and I like his thoughts. Might have said this before my prod too but I like rask as town a lot

[Raskolnikov]

If I can save myself as scum, why can't I save myself as town?

It's not that you can't its the question of why would you let it get to that point as town. Saving oneself/diverting wagon != lynching a scumread, unless dragon is your top scumread, but as scum letting diverting it doesn't matter where and especially voting in a survival situation can't be analysed or looked into as much as otherwise.

If scum is in danger them holding off and even preparing for diverting later seems viable especially for someone like you who'd be confident in it. You could say "oh I didn't get a chance to lynch my scumread then since I was in that position; here are my first real thoughts" on d2, rather than earlier which would be more commitment and make you look bad on mislynch. OTOH as town there's literally no reason to choose that unless you really don't have a choice.

This the first I'm hearing about you not having time or low motivation; before you said you intentionally came in late and focused on what you did as a reaction test, and then said you didn't want to go into who you leaned scum on purpose as well, and just sounded so calm and fine being secretive you gave off this feeling of being fine with everything and doing what you wanted to be doing. Like you were giving off this "it's all going to plan" vibe which felt BS and none of the concern for the game situation or your personal one which I expected to see until now. You acted (or at least how I read it) like you did have control over what you were doing (as opposed to not having time = not really having resources to do what you wanted) and that made it look like you were intentionally holding out, which is my problem.

Yes this is kind of BoP and if you just don't have the time it's maybe unfair (when literally half the game is afk too) but I also don't know why you can't just be more open and say these things earlier; "hey guys I don't have time to get into my reads please give me some space etc" and even giving a summary or quick post to address things overall isn't a huge time commitment but it's like you were unnecessarily secretive. Like everyone else had at least basic scumhunting impetus or otherwise gave excuses/explanations. I feel like I was forced into this just to get something from you.

Making it out to be a pure lurk-wagon is a misrep too, earlier maybe but the main problem for me and a few others is that you have put content in, but just in the wrong places; the hypo claim talk and some discussion but no vote or anything that felt substantial so it's like what are these priorities.

[Raskolnikov]

Nacho's if you're town you know murder and all in just finished townreading you on one-sided/limited meta (I'm sure at least all-in is town) and how wrong it would be since you can fake these posts as scum, so how can you go on to townread hiplop in the same way, admitting it's based on one-sided meta without alarm bells going off?

Murder and All-In both incorrectly scumread me due to thinking that I would lurk as scum but not town.

My townread on hiplop is because I don't think that he would play so lazily and so sloppily as scum; this is based on limited meta because part of it is his commentary on his own scum play and how I've seen him behave in the past, but while I'm not sure he doesn't do it as scum, I don't really see the motivation in copying that aspect of his town meta here (since it often gets him mislynched). Does that make sense?

Why didn't you respond to this post?

Mixed results.

My point was how murder and all-in talked about you as though "oh he'll just make one of his big posts and obvtown" and started changing read on you when you started posting a bit more around that time. Which I know is careless since scum!you can fake those posts and obviously you know this. Town-you would see this and also know they're wrong/underestimating your scumgame because of incomplete knowledge of meta, so you going on to townread hiplop right aroudn the same time when you don't know his scummeta in a similar way without seeming too worried had my attention. But on revisit it felt too much of a stretch/assumption that you'd necessarily see it that way as town anyways. The read itself makes sense on the basic level I'm familiar with though I'd also expect it to.

[Raskolnikov]

I also don't know what the whole posting elsewhere thing is about; I can't really respond to it because yes I've been posting elsewhere but the fact that raises a red flag for you surprises me.

The more I get into this the more dangerous and/or rule straddling it is.
Basically if you were less active everywhere, you being less active here would be better, although this was more of a "this is just ridiculous" cherry-on-top of everything else than something I hardcore looked into.

[Raskolnikov]

The reads feel good though.

I was hoping to find my own answers. There are no answers.

I feel like I have the most responsibility right now and am likely dying but knowing something must be done isn't helping get it done.

[Dragon of the West]

Points on nacho seem valid in the fact that his "not enough time" explanation and his early under-control public appearance contradict each other. Although him being confident early on doesn't necessarily signify that he has a plethora of scumreads is something to keep in mind. I think the biggest overstep in your thought process is when you start reading into nacho's townread on hiplop which could easily be coincidental

[Raskolnikov]

@Nacho: Dwlee again, bella, also more murder details and how that changed from earlier townread.
@Shadow. are you 'reaction testing' or do you actually believe the things you're saying? If you want vedith/all-in lynched maybe go into it a bit more?
@Vedith any comment on the nacho thing or on the other slots? What is your actual read on shadow?
@Dragon I don't have a problem with you but god help you if you don't finish your catchup or inexplicably vanish tomorrow.
@KTS something, anything
@murder update?
@bella any thoughts on nacho himself this game? go into/give update on dragon read.

[Dragon of the West]

Honestly that was basically my catchup. It was only 2 1/2 pages that I had to go over. If you want me to go address anything directly I can but honestly there just isn't much more standing out to me that I can say anything definitively about. I guess my last thing is I want shadow step to explain his tunnel on All In because I don't really see it

[Raskolnikov]

No scumread? No vote?

[Raskolnikov]

*eye twitches*

[All In]

I wish more people would vote Dragon of the West.

[Plotinus]

N

o

r

t

h

e

r

n

q

u

o

l

l

s

a

r

e

t

h

e

s

m

a

l

l

e

s

t

q

u

o

l

l

s

.

T

h

e

a

d

u

l

t

f

e

m

a

l

e

q

u

o

l

l

s

a

r

e

3

5

0

-

6

9

0

g

a

n

d

t

h

e

a

d

u

l

t

m

a

l

e

q

u

o

l

l

s

a

r

e

5

4

0

-

1

1

2

0

g

.