Newbie 1722 - Horoscopes (Game Over)

[innocentvillager]

Guys this is an odd kill and I think we should at least look into it even though some people think NKA is stupid.

Why not straightforward kill Hargrim or Rach? They are clearly the towniest slots, and Molla was just kinda dicking around in thread. I thought he leaned town, but there were better kills than Molla honestly

Also I wanted to keep playing with Molla I liked that dude

[innocentvillager]

Looks like Molla's general reads were:

Town: Rach, Hargrim, Mav, Ozy
Scummish: Micc/Mala, crabman/Icy
Not sure: Me, Snake

He clearly didn't peg the scumteam since Icy flipped town and Mala is widely light fos'd anyway, and he wasn't the towniest player. I can only guess that scum thought he was PR or something which is tenuous at best, does anyone else see something that I'm not seeing..

[Ozymandias]

VOTE: InnocentVillager

Rach, how confident are you that Mav is Town?

I'm also guessing that, if snake is town, the people who dissolved the wagon this quickly are also town.

Who were you talking about here? i don't think you ever gave names.

Reads:

Town: RachMarie, Hagrim
Townish: Snake
Lean Town: BBMolla
Null: Mav, Ozy (I didn't like Zamb's posting, but Ozy's are better)
Lean Scum: Crabman, Micc (both for not towntelling and lurking)

So, according to your reads, you have three people basically cleared ( you, rach, Hagrim ), one people you believe to be Town and one who you are leaning Town on. So why were you so pessimistic about the flip?

And why you were basically acting as if we lost if Icy was going to flip Town? i mean, you basically have a three man scum-pool now, for example. Even if Molla was not killed, you would have had a 4 players scum pool, with one you were town leaning on and two/three players who replaced in p late but are active, so readable.

that's without even taking into account the possibility of PRs getting results.

on that note, with the two flips, who is scum?

Guys this is an odd kill and I think we should at least look into it even though some people think NKA is stupid.

Why not straightforward kill Hargrim or Rach? They are clearly the towniest slots, and Molla was just kinda dicking around in thread. I thought he leaned town, but there were better kills than Molla honestly

Also I wanted to keep playing with Molla I liked that dude

Didn't Rach's slot claim bulletbroof? Not sure they would have been a good shot. Hargrim yeah, I agree.

As for why BBmolla was killed, it' either that he had good reads, scum believed he was a PR ( dunno how ) or it was a misdirection kill ( which are mostly dumb ).

[Ozymandias]

Would love to have some reads from Mala.

[Ozymandias]

As for why BBmolla was killed, it' either that he had good reads, scum believed he was a PR ( dunno how ) or it was a misdirection kill ( which are mostly dumb ).

it's*

[Ozymandias]

Town: [ me ]
Probs Town: [ rach, Hagrim ]
Lean Town: [ Mav, Snake ]
Scum Lean: [ IV, Mala ]

Would love to have some reads from Mala.

Snake too.

[innocentvillager]

Who were you talking about here? i don't think you ever gave names.

Whoever dissolved the wagon... so if you look back it was Molla and Samaritan.

Reads:

Town: RachMarie, Hagrim
Townish: Snake
Lean Town: BBMolla
Null: Mav, Ozy (I didn't like Zamb's posting, but Ozy's are better)
Lean Scum: Crabman, Micc (both for not towntelling and lurking)

So, according to your reads, you have three people basically cleared ( you, rach, Hagrim ), one people you believe to be Town and one who you are leaning Town on. So why were you so pessimistic about the flip?

And why you were basically acting as if we lost if Icy was going to flip Town? i mean, you basically have a three man scum-pool now, for example. Even if Molla was not killed, you would have had a 4 players scum pool, with one you were town leaning on and two/three players who replaced in p late but are active, so readable.

that's without even taking into account the possibility of PRs getting results.

I actually like this post from you, it reads like genuine town-analysis.

But having played lots of games before, it's usually stuff like this that doesn't go well. Generally I have more strong townreads in other games though. I had a 5-man possible scumpool at the time (molla, mav, you, mala, Icy) which would go to 4 as Icy flipped. I assumed Hargrim or Rach would get shot (this is not a suboptimal strategy because of mylo/even-odd shit), which meant that my scumpool would stay at 4 people. Plus the fact that it looked like suspicion was starting to turn towards me as well so the second mislynch could be me, which mean that we would have to decide a lot of shit on lylo, with still multiple people in the scumpool. Plus there was a lot of lurking going on, which added to the apathy.

Right now, I'm a bit more optimistic as you've begun to towntell and one of my scumpool candidates are gone.

VOTE: Malakittens for now as I want content from this slot.

[innocentvillager]

As for why BBmolla was killed, it' either that he had good reads, scum believed he was a PR ( dunno how ) or it was a misdirection kill ( which are mostly dumb ).

Yeah I think this is probably the best explanation.

If he had that good reads though that would imply that the scum is in {Mala, me, snake} which would be nearly implausible for me, since I don't think snake is scum. So probably either the 2nd or the 3rd one.

[Ozymandias]

Who were you talking about here? i don't think you ever gave names.

Whoever dissolved the wagon... so if you look back it was Molla and Samaritan.

Reads:

Town: RachMarie, Hagrim
Townish: Snake
Lean Town: BBMolla
Null: Mav, Ozy (I didn't like Zamb's posting, but Ozy's are better)
Lean Scum: Crabman, Micc (both for not towntelling and lurking)

So, according to your reads, you have three people basically cleared ( you, rach, Hagrim ), one people you believe to be Town and one who you are leaning Town on. So why were you so pessimistic about the flip?

And why you were basically acting as if we lost if Icy was going to flip Town? i mean, you basically have a three man scum-pool now, for example. Even if Molla was not killed, you would have had a 4 players scum pool, with one you were town leaning on and two/three players who replaced in p late but are active, so readable.

that's without even taking into account the possibility of PRs getting results.

I actually like this post from you, it reads like genuine town-analysis.

But having played lots of games before, it's usually stuff like this that doesn't go well. Generally I have more strong townreads in other games though. I had a 5-man possible scumpool at the time (molla, mav, you, mala, Icy) which would go to 4 as Icy flipped. I assumed Hargrim or Rach would get shot (this is not a suboptimal strategy because of mylo/even-odd shit), which meant that my scumpool would stay at 4 people. Plus the fact that it looked like suspicion was starting to turn towards me as well so the second mislynch could be me, which mean that we would have to decide a lot of shit on lylo, with still multiple people in the scumpool. Plus there was a lot of lurking going on, which added to the apathy.

Right now, I'm a bit more optimistic as you've begun to towntell and one of my scumpool candidates are gone.

VOTE: Malakittens for now as I want content from this slot.

Wasting a shot on a Bulletproof with the PR still alive IS subotimal strategy imo, but that may be just me. You are right that in terms of mislynches it doesn't changes anything.

I think only myself and mav were scumreading you, but I can understand where you are coming from with the second myslynch thing.

How is my last post any better than the ones I made yesterday?

Math analysis of stuff is one of the easiest things to fake as scum imo.

[innocentvillager]

Wasting a shot on a Bulletproof with the PR still alive IS subotimal strategy imo, but that may be just me. You are right that in terms of mislynches it doesn't changes anything.

Rach is still a pretty decent kill because scum could then eliminate a basically confirmed clear. Anyway, whatever it's not productive to continue discussing the merits of a Rach kill, since I'm probably in the minority that would consider killing Rach.

I think only myself and mav were scumreading you, but I can understand where you are coming from with the second myslynch thing.

How is my last post any better than the ones I made yesterday?

Math analysis of stuff is one of the easiest things to fake as scum imo.

Well honestly that could've been enough. I was scared scum were going to take out Hargrim/hit Rach, then use you and mav (or if either of you are scum) to push a mislynch on me. The only other person really taking flak near the end of yesterday was the IC slot, which was super lurky. Even if that slot is scum, I was scared that either D2 or D3 I would be the mislynch bait.

Your posts today are definitely townier. Your D1 was just a lot of responses and stuff that didn't really seem protown to me, so I put you at hard null. I also thought your case on me was too speculative and random. I like your case on me today a lot more, since it looks more thought out and is something I might actually fos someone else for (if I didn't know why that slot was acting the way it was, which I do right now obviously). Of course, I'm not discounting the possibility you thought of this overnight in the scumchat or got coached by Mala or something, but I'm inclined to give you townpoints for this over your D1 posting.

[Maverick1102]

VOTE: villager That post feels so forced.

[Maverick1102]

Bleh, the first post after the flip, totally missed that page.

[Maverick1102]

Yeah, vote still stands. I'm not comfortable with these post-flip posts and arguing that he would consider shooting Rach is a ridiculous attempt at looking VI.

You're better than that, surely?

[Ozymandias]

Wasting a shot on a Bulletproof with the PR still alive IS subotimal strategy imo, but that may be just me. You are right that in terms of mislynches it doesn't changes anything.

Rach is still a pretty decent kill because scum could then eliminate a basically confirmed clear. Anyway, whatever it's not productive to continue discussing the merits of a Rach kill, since I'm probably in the minority that would consider killing Rach.

I think only myself and mav were scumreading you, but I can understand where you are coming from with the second myslynch thing.

How is my last post any better than the ones I made yesterday?

Math analysis of stuff is one of the easiest things to fake as scum imo.

Well honestly that could've been enough. I was scared scum were going to take out Hargrim/hit Rach, then use you and mav (or if either of you are scum) to push a mislynch on me. The only other person really taking flak near the end of yesterday was the IC slot, which was super lurky. Even if that slot is scum, I was scared that either D2 or D3 I would be the mislynch bait.

Your posts today are definitely townier. Your D1 was just a lot of responses and stuff that didn't really seem protown to me, so I put you at hard null. I also thought your case on me was too speculative and random. I like your case on me today a lot more, since it looks more thought out and is something I might actually fos someone else for (if I didn't know why that slot was acting the way it was, which I do right now obviously). Of course, I'm not discounting the possibility you thought of this overnight in the scumchat or got coached by Mala or something, but I'm inclined to give you townpoints for this over your D1 posting.

P sure I barely answered any questions yesterday, so I don't know where you got the responses part from.

If you thought my case on you was too speculative and random, why did you not call me out on it yesterday?

[innocentvillager]

Yeah, vote still stands. I'm not comfortable with these post-flip posts and arguing that he would consider shooting Rach is a ridiculous attempt at looking VI.

You're better than that, surely?

Wow, that VI comment was really unnecessary, dude.

Explain why Rach wouldn't be a good kill.

[innocentvillager]

Bleh, the first post after the flip, totally missed that page.

VOTE: villager That post feels so forced.

Explain to me your thought process here...?

[innocentvillager]

P sure I barely answered any questions yesterday, so I don't know where you got the responses part from.

If you thought my case on you was too speculative and random, why did you not call me out on it yesterday?

I meant that you kinda just went through posts and made some comments on them, tried to add some follow up questions that just looked null to me.

Sorry, idk why I said random (I think I meant like tenuous or something), but I did think it was speculative. Your whole case on me IIRC was "gut he's not trying to solve the game" which is super null, not really scummy or anything. I can't really attack such a speculative accusation either.

[Maverick1102]

I didn't call you VI, I said you were trying to come across as VI by explaining that shooting Rach (a claimed BP) would be on your agenda as scum.

You ought to know better, hence me thinking that you're scum trying to appear as a VI. Don't take offense, it's underhanded flattery if anything because I think you're better than that.

[innocentvillager]

I didn't call you VI, I said you were trying to come across as VI by explaining that shooting Rach (a claimed BP) would be on your agenda as scum.

You ought to know better, hence me thinking that you're scum trying to appear as a VI. Don't take offense, it's underhanded flattery if anything because I think you're better than that.

Dude, I'm town, and I'm fucking serious about killing Rach as scum. I probably would've killed Hargrim over Rach, but Rach would've been consideration number two.

Here's what I would do if I chose to employ the kill Rach strategy. Take two nights to hit Rach, who is basically clear. If my scumpartner and I survived the lynch tomorrow, it would be us two and four other unconfirmed townies (including a tracker or JK, who might reveal themselves) on D3, which would be mylo. That would force the town to mislynch in mylo that way among more candidates, so they wouldn't even get an extra ML. Worst case, town would NL, in which case we just kill off another pretty town person.

It's a real strategy, and you calling me VI for thinking this is just annoying if you can't refute it.

[eagerSnake]

If anyone is a VI right now it is me lol but I guess you can't always be right. I'm not sure about Ozy.. to me he hasn't been active enough and has pretty much been flying under the radar. Mala and Ozy I would also like more activity from you too. I think as town we shouldn't allow an environment where scum can hide in the shadows.

[eagerSnake]

Why would scum kill BBmolla because he had good reads? Wouldn't that be obvious?

[Maverick1102]

Ozy has been in the game for almost 2 weeks less than you and has over half your post count, and has been much more active than you in the days leading up to, and the hours following the lynch. I think you're town eager so I'd rather you didn't throw accusations around so carelessly and hypocritically.

IV if you could stop playing the numbers game for a moment please.

[eagerSnake]

Well what do you suggest then Maverick?

[Maverick1102]

Well, you can analyse the nightkill and who had what to gain from it (although take this with a pinch of salt because it leads to endless WIFOM) or you can analyse reactions to it, you can have a look at Molla's reads and see what they were like now that we can see that Molla is a confirmed townie (albeit, a dead confirmed townie).

But just make sure that what you say is factually correct or at least plausible before you say it. As scum or town, statements as untrue as that aren't useful. Maybe ask Ozy a few questions to spur on the extra activity you seek?

I can agree on the more activity from Mala front, although I believe they're still in V/LA so that may take a while.

[eagerSnake]

Well the question I posted earlier was pretty much for him..

@Ozymandias Why do you think scum killed BBmolla because he had good reads? Wouldn't that be obvious?