Mini 1801 - Undertale: Kill or Be Killed Mafia [Game Over!]

[frog]

Votecount 3.11

Titus (3)

- frog, Parama, Creature

[L-2]

frog (2)

- Titus, thenewearth

[L-3]

Not Voting (3)

- grapes, GuiltyLion, Dunnstral

With 8 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.

Deadline for Day 3 is Friday, August 5th at 9PM EST.

Mod Notes

None!

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i do wish frog was actually around and posting more though, especially since he's posted on-site elsewhere since his last post here

Sorry, was a little busy yesterday and only had time for a small post elsewhere. As you say, thenewearth, Titus, and I 'all can't even care' since we each know the other(s) is/are scum. I'm not about to come in here and out-of-hand dismiss one half of what people are discussing whilst proclaiming the other half for truth, since it is pretty obvious what my perspective would be. What I can offer at this point is limited.

Okay so first point of order is my inventory that I received last night was two slots of Dog Residue, so I did not get a MTT Steak. Someone (Creature) needs to claim if they gave me 1 or both of those.

Next I think frog's post is outed scum basically giving up, it doesn't sound like he genuinely believes that the lovers are scum.

How did you get that reading from my posts? What happened after GreyICE flipped was pretty monumental for the gamestate, and caused a rethink in every player in this game. A little confusion is to be expected; consider that you avoided that by coming into Day 3 a little later, after everybody had collected their thoughts. Either way, if I was 'outed scum basically giving up', why didn't I self-hammer at L-1? The truth of the matter is that I am actually

not

outed scum, nor am I willing to just let my latent ability go unused after I tried to preserve knowledge of it yesterday. I have a chance to kill a member of the mafia tonight, and if I don't do that then I can confirm a player as town. Mislynching that is clearly not optimal, and the least I want before a lynch was for everyone to have at least considered other possibilities in the event a Day 4 happened. Go back and reread; does it still look like 'outed scum giving up' to you?

Regarding the back-and-forth between Parama and Titus: it's quite apparent from even a cursory glance at his recent posts that Parama is considering a variety of alternatives, with me as scum and others as my partner(s), and with Titus and thenewearth as scum and a potential third mafia. The former would surely fit into Titus' own definition of useful discussion, so I can't see why he's dismissing the entire thing as 'word vomit'. This is with his most recent post asking us to take our time and make things clear, which will only happen with discussion. Thenewearth hasn't written much and hasn't answered questions regarding her assumptions, but has seemed to expand her lynch pool in posts #1995 and #2005, something Titus would have an issue with according to his #2118. Neither of them are really exploring even though, logically, they should be searching for my partner. My perspective is already known, but I imagine this would look like scummy behaviour from the outside.

[grapes]

So you're a vig?

[frog]

If I target scum, I am a vig, if I target town, I am a doc (and, by extension, a cop).

[grapes]

Oh a deathkeeper actually, nevermind.

pedit: yea i just reread your claim

[grapes]

Don't think town has one of those.
Plus a watcher.
Plus whatever greyice was.

[frog]

The conclusion that it isn't balanced can't be made as readily as you think, especially not from other perspectives. If you're to be believed, then scum have a roleblocker, which would even things out, and the preponderance of fruit vendors lessens the utility of watcher anyway. If you're not to be believed, then town doesn't have a watcher and scum may or may not have other roles. Regardless of other scenarios, GreyICE's role is clearly rather 'swingy' and JaeReed's role was weak. Also keep in mind that I only get to use this ability once, and consider further that there could be two or three scum. So, whatever assumptions you make or other claims you believe, it is plausible. Think about the converse, though; with a weak role, lots of fruit vendors, a limited self-watcher, and a neutered watcher, how likely is it that town have lovers on top of that?

Speaking of claims, GuiltyLion is, I think, the only player who has not yet claimed their character or role. Would it be worth him claiming? If it is MyLo then there's no reason for him not to, and if it isn't, it will be soon enough that it can't hurt.

[Dunnstral]

by the way if frog really is town grapes needs to be watching frog

most likely scenario there is that grapes is nightkilled and frog is roleblocked but if we have a doc role that'd be cool

Of course I'm getting ahead of myself without figuring out which side is town/scum

[Titus]

Hey Dunn, You said I didn't respond to Para. What of his is worth responding to?

@Frog, Can you rank your reads with reasons? I want you locked into giving associative tells.

@Grapes, What's a death keeper?

[Parama]

Don't think town has one of those.
Plus a watcher.
Plus whatever greyice was.

Yup, the watcher is scum too, nice job.

[Creature]

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

[Creature]

frog wouldn't lie about being fruit vendor, specially when mettaton could be anything else.

[Parama]

Like how did you think that was gonna turn out. That's not an argument against frog in the slightest as long as grapes is still alive and not alignment-confirmed.

[Titus]

Don't think town has one of those.
Plus a watcher.
Plus whatever greyice was.

Yup, the watcher is scum too, nice job.

Or Frog is and you're just steadfastly refusing to lynch your buddy. Here's another implicit defense of Frog.

[Titus]

If I target scum, I am a vig, if I target town, I am a doc (and, by extension, a cop).

Then where are your results?

[Parama]

Don't think town has one of those.
Plus a watcher.
Plus whatever greyice was.

Yup, the watcher is scum too, nice job.

Or Frog is and you're just steadfastly refusing to lynch your buddy. Here's another implicit defense of Frog.

yes, TNE literally did the exact same thing towards grapes. yet I'm the one who's scummy for it. Nice one.

[Parama]

I also have a latent ability

that activates today

(hence the reluctance to claim yesterday). If I am alive Day 3, I transform into Mettaton EX and become able to target a player at night: if they are town, they are protected from kills, but if they are not town, they die. This ability, however, is only one-shot, and if by some miracle you don't mislynch me today I will state who I will be targeting before Night 3 sets in so we at least get a confirmed townie, if not a dead mafia member.

reading comprehension: not titus' strong suit.
this was posted after you joined, ftr, so you don't even have the excuse of not reading the thread

[frog]

Hey Dunn, You said I didn't respond to Para. What of his is worth responding to?

@Frog, Can you rank your reads with reasons? I want you locked into giving associative tells.

Well, considering I think it's likely two scum, that puts you and thenewearth firmly in the scum pile and everybody else in the town pile for quite self-evident reasons, wouldn't you think?

If I target scum, I am a vig, if I target town, I am a doc (and, by extension, a cop).

Then where are your results?

So I understand not having read all of the game up to this point, but are you telling me here that you haven't even read today's posts?

[Parama]

i doubt there's only two scum if the lovers are scum, even though they're probably not lovers

[frog]

Well, if there is a third scum, then my current guess would be either grapes or GuiltyLion. That's largely based on their unwillingness to poke around though, and I don't feel like I've yet heard enough from everybody today. A more concrete statement will have to come later (especially if GuiltyLion claims).

[Creature]

You could target GuiltyLion.

[GuiltyLion]

frog, why would it be protown for me to claim right now?

[frog]

Because it is potentially MyLo, and because this would give the rest of us the final bit of information necessary for a full discussion of which roles make sense as which alignment based on game balance?

If you feel like it isn't in our best interest for you to claim, then don't. I just think it could be beneficial, I can't think of any reasons why it could hurt, and there's certainly not going to be a

better

time to claim.

[Parama]

frog, if guilty was scum, he could've easily lied about his inventory to frame you, so I find it unlikely, and certainly far less likely than grapes

[Parama]

for the record frog should target grapes. If grapes is town, then that's a doc on the watcher. If grapes is scum, there is probably no scum RB and grapes will die.

[Titus]

@Parama, When you're spamming so much, it's hard to read anything. I'm familiar with the tactic. I am a master of it.