STEVEN UNIVERSE 2 - GAME OVER

[DrippingGoofball]

@Mastina, My biggest issue with Drixx is tonally he reads like really town here. I'd rather do CoolDog or Klingoncelt than RR. I'm not saying RR is town but I do have minor hesitations here.

KC is town, I would compromise on CDog.

[Obi-Wan Kenobi]

Drixx, sometimes town are idiots. That's why I curse like that. I play mafia because people aren't insanely rational. It's generally frustrating to us who perceive ourselves as playing rationally. Plus, a comment Pirate Mollie told me when we played this. People play towards their own special snowflakes. There are things we don't know. We have to get those things out in a constructively. I agree there's a lot to get done, but just running out of the thread, no matter how dumb town is being doesn't help anyone.

Help me. You have no problem telling me when I'm dumb. That's what I love about you.

~Titus

[DrippingGoofball]

I feel for RR here.

[Obi-Wan Kenobi]

@Mastina, My biggest issue with Drixx is tonally he reads like really town here. I'd rather do CoolDog or Klingoncelt than RR. I'm not saying RR is town but I do have minor hesitations here.

KC is town, I would compromise on CDog.

Why is KC town?

[DrippingGoofball]

Because of our interactions in the PT.

[Reasonably Rational]

I was not sarcastic at all!

Regarding Yume, Yume lurks and drops out of almost every game. Other than that I have nothing against him.

The way Yume has been treated by so many different people on this site

Well thank you DGB. Perhaps if you really think that I should persist, you can talk to me after game. I try my very best to always stay active, to treat people kindly, to never get nasty with someone unless they have been repeatedly nasty with me (and I don't carry it on beyond a single game), and yet there are people on site who get away with being absolutely the worst level of nasty on the internet (which is saying something) on a regular basis. It has been a long standing frustration of mine. Especially because I've been chewed out behind the scenes for slipping and using internet slang, after which I immediately apologized (because I'm physically disabled, so I would never use handicapped slurs), and I've been blacklisted from playing games run by a mod who I enjoyed playing their games because someone else was in the "cool" club, and I wasn't. They were allowed to be absurdly abusive to me, and I got blacklisted by the mod for saying that I genuinely thought they should take a break and calm down because the guy spent like a solid hour raging at me over nothing.

Mastin bashing my play implicitly all game is just sort of the straw that broke the camel's back. This has been a long time coming.

~D

[Obi-Wan Kenobi]

Because of our interactions in the PT.

What things in the PT?

[Reasonably Rational]

Because of our interactions in the PT.

You claimed to be a traitor. There is no way a town!KC responds to that in any way other than going after you until you are dead. Please explain why KC would just be passive after you claimed that.

If you say it was a reaction test, then the question becomes why would you think the game should have a traitor, when I don't recall Varsoon using one before (although I haven't played EVERY Varsoon game so I could have missed it somewhere), and how could you convince KC that it was a reaction test and you weren't genuinely claiming in the belief that she was scum and could recruit you?

KC just doesn't make sense as town given what we know.

~D

[DrippingGoofball]

I'm sorry to hear that. I try to be nice too though sometimes I succumb to the temptation of calling people scums and their isos "filthy rubbish."

[Not Chara]

i admit that Rational's recent posting might be preventing me from voting them out of the gate. does Rational have any reads from today i could look at? (reads that they've stated have carried over from day 1 are also fine)

Because of our interactions in the PT.

there was someone in this game who said that scum specialize in looking town in private topics they have with town. who was it that said that?

because this is the third time (that i remember) that someone has said a player is town because of neighbourhood interactions that the other players don't get to see. and farside's in particular proved to be false.
i'm not saying that the other PT townreads must automatically be false by association, but i would appreciate someone's theory on this topic.

[Obi-Wan Kenobi]

They stated some in the early going of the day.

I started that on RR. Others then claimed it. The catch is I justified it.

[DrippingGoofball]

You claimed to be a traitor. There is no way a town!KC responds to that in any way other than going after you until you are dead. Please explain why KC would just be passive after you claimed that.

Everyone knows I love a fakeclaim... there have been multiple precedents.

If she was scum, she'd be happy to find an extra scumteam member, I really tried to get her to spill the whole scum team LOL.

[DrippingGoofball]

On the flipside, she might have been suspicious of my fakeclaim as scum precisely for the same reason that I do fakeclaim a lot. I concede that.

[Obi-Wan Kenobi]

Drixx, you think that Mastina's team is wrong. What did you think of mine?

[Not Chara]

@Mastin - You have played with Cerberus before right? I'm just checking because you're saying something he does

all the time

was fake. And the underlying implications to that don't make sense.

And for the idiot ball comments: Idiot Ball = literary device. It refers to when an otherwise very intelligent character makes an absurd mistake. It's kind of like a deus ex machina, and it fits in really when people aren't engaging their brains.

@Grapes - Farside, Foxbird, DGB, Grapes, KC are the people I am looking at for scum at the moment.


Farside - Super anti-town play yesterday with what she did. If you think about the implications of it and how it could have been leveraged for maximum utility, her blowing up that event was the most anti-town thing I've ever seen on the site.
Foxbird - Read the ISO. Self-explanatory.
DGB - The whole Traitor thing. Makes zero sense. DGB also moved us to firm town late yesterday but then just voted us today. Back to the traitor thing: what would make DGB think there's a traitor unless she is one? It's not a thing I remember Varsoon using before and I don't see anything in the info we have to suggest one is present. Only way DGB is town is if it was a reaction test, but if that's the case, why isn't DGB engage din the main thread doing things like that?
KC - Something was off about the response to the DGB thing. If I were KC, there's no way someone could claim to be a scum to me and live. KC barely pushed it. That isn't a town response, imo.
You - Gut. You're too smart to actually think we're scum and you are also too smart to join in on an ego push, yet you seem to be doing both.

~Drixx

okay, here it is. thank you Titus.

Drixx: i can see your points for most of these. i disagree with farside as scum, but her play was not fantastic there. the only other read i have issue with is the grapes read. (is the ego push on you?) i dislike this 'you're too smart to think this' attitude. it's one of the reasons i was very strongly scumreading grapes during that point of day 1. i thought they if they read me so correctly in my first newbie game (which has been completed, so i can

finally

talk about it), then the fact that they were so wrong here had to mean something was different. this game is difficult and it's incredibly easy to be wrong when new situations come up, i've learned. don't take this to mean i'm lecturing you, my inexperience in the face of your amount of games is very obvious to me.

[Klingoncelt]

The "best townies" categories exclude Yume, so Yume was probably bus'ing or maybe even trolling.

Yume's like Masons with Mastin. Not Scum.

[Klingoncelt]

I was waiting for you, Titus. What did you mean by your last two posts in the last day?

I meant that if you had a neighborhood spy ability, that you'd tell me by the first words in your post. It kinda doesn't matter now since I don't have a hood.

If DGB is town, scum fucked with the alliance meaning scum intend to kill me. That's the logical explanation. Otherwise, DGB is scum.

Did I mention that DGB said she was a Traitor?

[Klingoncelt]

Cooldog, RR, and Klingoncelt are the names I'd support lynching today.

You don't want me lynched. You know I'm Town.

[Not Chara]

Cooldog, RR, and Klingoncelt are the names I'd support lynching today.

You don't want me lynched. You know I'm Town.

"i am not the scum you're looking for. you will let me go about my business. move along."

[mastin2]

@Mastina, My biggest issue with Drixx is tonally he reads like really town here.

Not to me.
I see two tones Drixx is presenting:
Tones for things unrelated to the game, and tones for things related to the game.
The tones for the things unrelated to the game are by their very nature, unrelated to the game. Null.
The tone for things that are related to the game come across as scum.

I mean, it's pretty much a given that were I somehow wrong I'd inherently be giving my consent to be placed in the hall of shame that is RR's sig.
But I don't see anything from them that is indicative of town.

The only one's who have deigned to speak with us aren't even considering reevaluating, to the point where we tell them about an ability we have and they assume we're lying, rather than considering if that information is possibly true and what it would mean.

Not so! 'Least, not on my end. I fully believe every piece of role-related information you've given.

But the idea that the information means anything is false.
It's information.
But it's also meaningless information.

And that's all the content I've seen from your slot.

You haven't given anything which has been actually meaningful to the game.

And that's why you're being lynched.

[mastin2]

[There's literally someone who is declaring intent to unilaterally END the day after less than 24 hours, and I'm practically begging people to work on the big problem coming for the finale.

And the thing is.
While I acknowledge that this scum event is indeed a threat.
While I acknowledge that a scum event like this is something ideally dealt with.

It's still mechanics.
And I know what Varsoon thinks about game mechanics, because I know what (almost) every moderator thinks of mechanics, him included:
They're meant to enhance the play of the game.

Not replace it.

What you're doing is an appeal to fear. "Ooh, this big scary mechanics thing is a huge threat". No doubt it is indeed a threat.
But you're missing the picture.
It's still not scumhunting.
It's not the part of the game, which is actually a fundamental part of the game.

So that's why you got so many votes.
Mechanics aren't at the center of this game. Scumhunting is. And they are scumhunting you.
Any time we spend on mechanics is extra, is time we spend using the extras we've been given, to counter the extras scum were given.
It's a luxury, not a necessity. One day, ten days, makes no difference.

[Klingoncelt]

~Drixx

P.S. - Dealing with a healing Stage 2 Decubitus Ulcer (google at your own risk) and had the pleasure of seeing my town jail while day one was coming to a close, which is why I suddenly disappeared and didn't say anything.

I'm familiar with the term. Feel better soon, Drixx.

[Reasonably Rational]

Mastin, you're wrong.

I don't care about the mechanical discussion. I care about the fact that discussions about evaluating and/or reevaluating our play yesterday, NOT TODAY (which has obviously been WHOLLY focused on defending ourselves, because I got drawn in and used up all the energy I would have spent doing something productive ) have all been stonewalled.

That's what I mean when I say there's no attempt being made to think.

-Cerb

[mastin2]

Mastin bashing my play implicitly all game is just sort of the straw that broke the camel's back.

Oh I don't have anything against your play at all.

Contrary to your apparent perception, this is no vendetta. I'm not bashing your play. I hold it in the highest regard.

I just so happen to think this is your scum game.

You bring up all my failures, but I learn from them: I evolve, try to get better. So bringing them up doesn't invoke feelings of doubt from me. They invoke feelings that you look desperate because you wouldn't feel the need to bring up those failures otherwise. That might not be true, might not be how you see it. But that's what they look like, and one thing has always been consistent in MY play: I will always tell things as I see them, and that just so happens to be how I see it.

I think you're scum.
It's not that complex. Nothing more. Nothing less. Just a simple read, no different from any number of hundreds of previous reads of mine.

[Klingoncelt]

Last night notes:

(God, paraphrasing this took forever.)

...

Klingoncelt as town is capable of doing stuff, even early-on. I've seen it before. It might not necessarily be the best, usually some basic-level stuff. And, yes, her timezone means that the stuff she gives is usually later than what most give, with her constantly catching up. But she's still DOING STUFF.
And here, she...hasn't.

She's posted plenty!
But her posting's done literally nothing. At all.

Empty words have been thrown around. She'll give random things. She's rather defensive in what she'll share. But on the offense, there's nothing of substance. She's shown a high level of play that is entirely revolved around herself. Not the "me" type (see farside above) which is town, the "I care about nobody except myself", survivoresque type. Most of her content is in things regarding directly to her. The few instances which aren't are scattered throughout her iso and amount to nothing coherent. Things she says, she then does nothing about. No belief, no conviction, no push, no drive at all. Sitting around, actively lurking, and making no effort to further the gamestate. She's skating by.

In this case, when I isoed her, it's not that I couldn't give examples.
It's that I couldn't give an example of where it WASN'T. Seriously, iso her, see for yourself.

644 was content meant to look helpful doing nothing. 1542 is the first instance of anything which is anything, and yet it still amounts to nothing in the long-run. Just a vote on grapes for a bad reason, using a tone that sounded empty, flat, hollow, and artificial when asking to be sheeped. 1890 (which she only gave after she was pressured, mind you) is an insult to readslists everywhere because it's nothing of the sort. Then we get things like the ridiculous 2201, where Klingoncelt calls the attacks by Titus (Titus, who is using

the same logic

I

am

) to be harassment when they quite clearly aren't:
They're simply Titus sharing my opinion on Klingoncelt, that she is better than this as town. If you're generous, you can count 2205 as content...if you consider discrediting Titus as content. (Hey, not all content is good!) 2482 is another empty push. She's not doing anything to seriously push DGB.

Overall, there's a huge fucking difference between "I hit my stride on D3", a believable, reasonable stance to hold...
...And, "I do literally fuckall of nothing untill D3", what Klingoncelt is

claiming

she does as town. She's doing it, alright, but again: bullshit. The former is the actual truth.

...

I also typed up an explanation for why Firebringer is town, but it's not really relevant anymore, since his death is self-evident proof of that fact.

You forgot to mention that you were given proof that I'm Town.

If you're Town, that mean you're game-throwing.

If you're Town.


As for Firebringer, in the other SU game, where I replaced in for CoolDog, the Gems could "bubble" a player, removing the player from the game, BUT NOT NECESSARILY KILLING THE PLAYER.


If Mastin claims proof that FB is dead, why does she not claim proof that I'm Town? Curious.


On the subject of CoolDog, I replaced in for him in that other SU game. His ISO was the worst I'd ever seen - to the point which I was constantly checking my Role PM to make sure the slot was supposed to be Town. I can't believe he wasn't lynched, the play was worse than awful, so indescribably Scummy. The slot was Town Odd-Night Cop.

So in this game I have him at dead Null, I don't know what to think of him.