Newbie 1759 (Game Over)

[Nobita]

Answer me gigabyteTroubadour why do you think Random Vote (RVS) would be good idea to start off the game?

RVS is a good way to start the game because it gives town something to discuss and gets the game moving. We've been doing it here on this site for years and it works for us.

Heck, look where it's gotten us. We now have a serious wagon forming on rXJr, which regardless of people's reads on him, is a useful discussion topic that will help us find scum.

What do you propose as an alternative? If we don't start

somewhere

, can we really ever go anywhere?

Nobita, don't you think that scum caught on page 2 would be MORE inclined to defend themselves the way the lynchmob wants them to? A D1 scum lynch significantly increases town's chances of victory and I think rXJr has played enough games to know that.

I will judge rJXr by my own judgment, i will wait his next posts to further analyze him.

Alright gigabyteTroubadour
Do you realise we have a 14 days day phase approximately 2 week in this game?

Game Timeline
Day phases will last two weeks.
Night phases will last two days.

why you being hesitate on RVS sheep idea?
aren't you realize you are using "advantage" at this point, making excuse because this is what "we do in this site" are not helping you at all, you could be a town who lead the sheep or an experienced mafia player who lead the sheep thanks for your knowledge.
I believe Frederick came same thought with me on this one.

[Nobita]

Correction i meant haste not hesitate

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Alright gigabyteTroubadour
Do you realise we have a 14 days day phase approximately 2 week in this game?

Yes, which is why I'm going to use as much as I need to sort this playerlist. Why bring this up?

why you being hesitate on RVS sheep idea?

Thank you for the clarification

RVS wagons generally do not end in a lynch. This is because eventually people will find posts that they can scrutinize and get reads from. Obviously, you shouldn't assume that you're never going to get lynched early into D1, but there's a serious lack of pressure behind each vote, so someone hammering an RVS wagon is going to be heavily scrutinized regardless of the flip.

When I push an RVS wagon, I want to see who decides to hop on (and more importantly, how), who ignores it, who panicks, who acknowledges it but decides to vote elsewhere, etc. This is useful information for me.

aren't you realize you are using "advantage" at this point

Smart play is just smart play. rXJr is towntelling (saying/doing things that town is more likely to do) because a player in a scum mindset isn't going to outright refuse to work with town when he's already at L-2. He needs to at least try to live.

making excuse because this is what "we do in this site" are not helping you at all

I don't see how I was using that as an excuse? You asked me why I think RVS is a good thing, and I explained why. There's a reason typical games on this site start with a random voting stage.

you could be a town who lead the sheep or an experienced mafia player who lead the sheep thanks for your knowledge.

Well, what do you think?

also for the record i'm actually not that experienced contrary to what being an SE might imply. i'm here to learn just like you guys

I believe Frederick came same thought with me on this one.

Why do you think Frederick is agreeing with you?

[gigabyteTroubadour]

Sorry, Nobita, you forgot to answer my question from earlier:

What's your alternative to RVS?

[Fredrick E Campbell]

...

VOTE: gigabyteTroubadour

Are you kidding me? You wanna tell me I can change whatever I said later on if I catch suspicion? Yeah right..

Oh and friend, please try harder.

You need to do better than this to defend yourself, rJXr.
VOTE: rJXr

What made you vote me, but then change your vote to rJXr within this timeframe? Since these two posts are consecutive, there was no new content to make you want to move your vote over (unless you voted, read the game, then changed? in that case i'd like to explain your vote on me).
...

You initiated the wagon. That's what made me vote you.

Do you believe that starting an RVS wagon is scummy, or was it just an RVS vote?
...

I believe that asking people to participate in a wagon is scummy.

...

I'm just using rJXr's logic that Fredrick Campbell/Friend Computer in rJXr's wagon is likely to be scum. Ask rJXr for details of this logic.

But the two wagons aren't the same. One wagon had completely baseless votes, while the other had votes with accusations behind them - meaning that they can be scrutinized for sincerity. Why use logic you don't believe in, anyway?
...

Though it may appear so, I'm not actually using the logic. I just mentioned it to show my disapproval of it.

...

I would say both of you have a horrible sense of humor.

I never said I found it funny. Playing along just means that I was in an RVS mindset at the time, where I generally like to push wagons for the sake of bloodlust.

What is it that makes your vote so?

Not really a fan of how he's just egging on the wagon without really adding pressure of his own. Scum generally will want to blend in with whatever mislynch town decides to push rather than put themselves on the forefront.
...

You've got a point there. I will have a look at his isolated posts later and say whatever I think of this.

...

This is why I really shouldn't be doing programming while I play mafia. I do very illogical things like that.

I feel that man

Also nice to see another coder here
...

Nice to meet another as well

...

Nobita, don't you think that scum caught on page 2 would be MORE inclined to defend themselves the way the lynchmob wants them to? A D1 scum lynch significantly increases town's chances of victory and I think rXJr has played enough games to know that.

My actual thoughts, now that my mind is cleared up, is that rJXr was unable to explain how funny his joke was. So, he decided to avoid answering the question.

I'm getting the sense that he doesn't feel the need to answer it because he feels it should be self-explanatory, not because he can't.

No way to know if this is true.

[gigabyteTroubadour]

I believe that asking people to participate in a wagon is scummy.

I disagree with this, at least during RVS. I think wagons are a good way to get discussions started early in the game, and I'd argue it helped form the current group dynamic we have right now.

Why do you feel that way, by the way?

also the discussion about rvs is just reminding me that we really need an IC wall up in here ... rvs is great guys and if you stick around you're going to see it all the time

Though it may appear so, I'm not actually using the logic. I just mentioned it to show my disapproval of it.

missed the sarcasm, then. it happens!

It looks like we actually agree on that point then.

No way to know if this is true.

No, there isn't a way to know for sure. But it's what I believe based on how rXJr's reaction and tone. He definitely needs to explain himself, though.

[Selynee]

rJXr, I don't think this would be "the worst scumplay ever". The fact you've stated you want to lynch someone before his replacement, that you want a page 2 lynching pretty much eliminates IMO this option.
I think you were either joking the entire time or planning to use the whole “reverse psychology” concept the entire time.

[SugarNips]

Sorry about the delay chaps, I'm here at last

[Fredrick E Campbell]

rJXr, I don't think this would be "the worst scumplay ever". The fact you've stated you want to lynch someone before his replacement, that you want a page 2 lynching pretty much eliminates IMO this option.
I think you were either joking the entire time or planning to use the whole “reverse psychology” concept the entire time.

Exactly what I was thinking.

[Friend Computer]

minor FOS Frederick

Acting a bit odd.

[Zaicon]

Prodding Papa Zito.

[Nobita]

Yes, which is why I'm going to use as much as I need to sort this playerlist. Why bring this up?

These are the point for my last question :
why you being haste on RVS sheep idea?
To translate my question "why you was being haste on RVS sheep idea while we have 14 days dayphase to think and figure out the scum rather go with desperate RVS" and you had answered my question in your last post.

I don't see how I was using that as an excuse? You asked me why I think RVS is a good thing, and I explained why. There's a reason typical games on this site start with a random voting stage.

Really? you sounded very lingering to use that reason to encourage your RVS sheep idea?
To precise very dependent with that reason.
how i have to picture it like a man come to house because he bring his police identity the owners just let him in without know that man true motive.

Well, what do you think?

also for the record i'm actually not that experienced contrary to what being an SE might imply. i'm here to learn just like you guys

Honestly, I am inclined to scum lean to you.

Why do you think Frederick is agreeing with you?

Nothing, i just thought he would be because you asked why him voted you in previous post.

Sorry, Nobita, you forgot to answer my question from earlier:

What's your alternative to RVS?

Unfortunately you are my alternative choice
You and rJXr shown the most scum read for me so far.
That to being said if i change my vote i from rJx then i would vote you.

Frederick and FC are appears townreads for me, i don't know about the others yet, i will wait for a little while again to wait everyone posts to judges them into my reads.

[Papa Zito]

Hello I am back from V/LA and ready to read things.

I see we have someone named SugarNips in this game, I'm pretty excited.

[Papa Zito]

Oh have a standard "what the hell is an IC" blurb while I'm reading:

As an IC I have a kind of double role in this game. First I'm a player like everyone else, so I'll be playing to my win condition (town BTW) just like everyone else. I'll be up to the rest of you to decide if I'm evil manipulative lying scum or not. But my other role is as sort of a mentor, and here I am bound by Being a Good IC. Feel free to ask questions about game mechanics, how things work, what things mean, and so forth and rest assured that I won't lead you astray on these topics. In that vein I suggest everyone read Commonly Used Abbreviations to get up-to-date on the lingo. I also recommend everyone read the rules carefully in any game you play, as each mod tends to have his/her own ruleset.

[Papa Zito]

Boo.

VOTE: SugarNips

Of course the best name in the game would be scum. :/

[rJXr]

Pickin' up serious scum vibes from rJXr

VOTE: rJXr

1. Voting for someone who hasn't posted yet, just because they will prob be replaced.
2. Defending himself by saying that Day 1 is often a mislynch. It's true, but let's not encourage it.
3. Says it's "less interesting" to wait for a defense.

Ok I'm starting to answer to the so called "reasons for a scumread":

1. Didn't do that. RVS vote is RVS vote.

2. That wasn't a defense, just added up to the discussion about a first page/second page lynch.

3. It obviously is?! I never said its a good thing to do.

Let's see what's next up, posting from phone so this will take some time.

[rJXr]

I don't even know where to start. First, stop editing quotes, that can cause a lot of trouble. Second there are no actions to explain since we were more likely still are in rvs and all that was happening was trolling at high level,...

First, I didn't put words in anyone's mouth by editing quotes. Second, Nobita, Friendly Computer, and I have been pushing this game out of RVS by questioning you. Votes on you are because of a scum read.

... if you like to lynch me based on jokes I'm concerned you guys need to fix your town play....

Your votes clearly show that you did have that intent and it was more than a joke. Also, if it were a joke, you should have just said so when Friend Computer made a clearly serious case against you in post 25.

...Nobitas wagon? You mean those first page rvs votes ( please go and look up rvs if you have no clue )? Those votes were 100% NAI, at least if you can't read minds.

Similarly, our votes on you should also be 100% NAI. Meanwhile, I'm getting scumreads on you on other factors I've mentioned in my posts.

...
You guys seem very eager to hunt scum, please at least do it right.

Tell me what I'm doing wrong.[/quote]

1. No you didn't, but I can't be fucked to double check your quotes cause you might do. It doesn't matter if you pushed out of rvs by now (which you didn't do for everyone, zito just gave his rvs vote) because everything you voted me for happened in rvs.

2. Omfg. Again stop taking rvs more serious than it is. Btw this is obviously not about my vote on computer, so not votes but vote. This is about the rvs vote and rvs talk, not what I concluded after you guys jumping me. You're hanging up too much on the word "joke". Let's rather call it trolling/randomly posting, maybe that helps you get off your paranoia.

3. You can always argue about anything being NAI or not, but rvs vote are most of the time (they're meant to get discussion rolling). Yes, and these factors are directly connected to my rvs vote. Just admit already that your so called scum read on me is way weaker than you yourself think man. Makes it easier.

4. I just did.

[rJXr]

*your vote

I heavily suggest we lynch you. Your vote is not reasonable and you overdo reading into jokes from rvs....

Friend Computer's vote clearly wasn't RVS as he made a clearly serious case against you.

... Nice try to pretend scumhunting for a scum.

Just look at that accusation against you in post 25. He clearly wasn't pretending to hunt for scum. Oh wait, you actually know that already as shown below.

I'm not going to repeat myself again. You already stated those things, I have no reason to defend since there is no reasonable scumread on me.

You're saying Friend Computer's scumread is unreasonable because whatever you said in page 1 was a joke. I suggest you explain how that joke of yours is one. Otherwise, there's no reason to take it as one.

Again that word "joke" is making you go crazy.

Ofc friends vote wasn't rvs ffs, I never even said that, so for you: IM TALKING ABOUT MY RVS VOTE. There's a difference between rvs and actually voting someone for reasons, in this case, weak ones, but reasons.

So you're telling me you for sure know that he is not pretending to scumhunt? Are you scum and know he's town? I'm just saying I feel like he is scum trying to make an easy case on me (that's because it's a really bad one) thus pretends to scumhunt on a townie to make himself look like one. Got it yet? Jesus.

There is a reason to take it as a joke/random talk/trolling because it's fucking rvs. Dude, please go read other games rvs on this forum and you'll see.

[rJXr]

rJXr, I don't think this would be "the worst scumplay ever". The fact you've stated you want to lynch someone before his replacement, that you want a page 2 lynching pretty much eliminates IMO this option.
I think you were either joking the entire time or planning to use the whole “reverse psychology” concept the entire time.

Scum coming up with that play from the beginning sure needs balls, but I agree, you could actually play it on purpose. I rather like to act on impulse and depending on situations tho.

[rJXr]

I'm gonna give a slight readlist after reading everything again.

Towniest

Nobita
Selynee (mostly gut)
Giga
Friend
Zito, PP, Nips
Fredrick

Scummiest

Based on the whole on going discussion I see him as most suspicious. Kinda for the same reasons as computer, but he's furthermore agreeing way too much to others. I feel like he's trying to push a misslynch on me without giving his own reasons. He argues about computers reasons and sheeps them, but his post lack content besides that and tend to repeat the same over and over. Computer on the other hand started the wagon on me on his own. I actually like him for doing so even tho his reasons are not good. Feels more like town trying to get this going.

[rJXr]

VOTE: Fredrick

I make this vote based on that I am still thinking there's at least 1 scum at my wagon.

[Papa Zito]

holy crap

[Friend Computer]

Mr. Zito, it appears you have not posted any game related content. This may, under the right circumstances, be treason.

Treason is punishable by death.

Small FOS, but if you don't do anything useful, I will get more suspicious.

(POST A VOTE COUNT ALREADY)

[Friend Computer]

Also, I am suspicious of Frederick. rJXr is scummy on my list, but I do agree with his reasoning regarding Fred.

FOS: Frederick

[Nobita]

Alright, a fine defense rJXr
UNVOTE: rJXr
VOTE: gigabyteTroubadour