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It says in the rules that only the last groups hammer is an actual hammering vote.
Until each of the three groups has a majority of votes on a player, votes may be changed as desired. This means even if two players vote for someone, they can change their votes.
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Post #98 (isolation #14) » Wed Nov 16, 2016 10:44 am
Postby FrankJaeger »
In post 62, ArcAngel9 wrote:
In general mafia, VT claim is role declaration and usually scum does it early game for hindrance
I am town declaration is usually comes from town motive and scum is always afraid do it.
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Post #104 (isolation #19) » Wed Nov 16, 2016 11:00 am
Postby FrankJaeger »
In post 103, Gamma Emerald wrote:Apparently what Frank said about Howard doesn't apply to him.
If you thought hammers were locked like that why would you even vote?
Also the coin flip seems scummy to me but it might be NAI
Thats exactly what I think. If he voted first I wouldnt have voted at all.
I hate saying reaction test. Because it skews the results.
Do you think town OR scum would have hammered there? So that doesnt really matter.
In post 104, FrankJaeger wrote:
Thats exactly what I think. If he voted first I wouldnt have voted at all.
Sure...
I hate saying reaction test. Because it skews the results.
There's reaction tests and then there's that.
Do you think town OR scum would have hammered there? So that doesnt really matter.
I don't get the question.
If you are town, you have to think there's a chance one of us is scum. Why would you give the opportunity to quickhammer to scum?
My Coin is VT as well.
The fact that you said "coin flip" made it feel like "I could vote either one equally".
Well it got a reaction from everyone but the guy who mattered.
I agree, but I also realize the only person hammering is scum. Scum knows this too.
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Post #113 (isolation #24) » Wed Nov 16, 2016 1:29 pm
Postby FrankJaeger »
In post 110, Secret Agent Jin wrote:Now i am a bit on the fence concerning Power group. I think Frank might be scum and he has a scum read on Dunn and he said maybe also Arc. If Frank turns out to be scum then we can maybe discount his scum read on Dunn and Arc. I dont know who to vote in my group because Arc and Dunn are really good at being scum or they are town, like i think. All i know right now is if i could, i would vote Frank.
I get this logic, but I have 2 suggestions;
1. I'm not scum, but it does not implicate them when I flip green.
2. Dont treat them as town because you think I'm scum.
So if your group is clear, and I am wisdom scum, who is the scum in the last group?
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Post #132 (isolation #30) » Thu Nov 17, 2016 6:54 am
Postby FrankJaeger »
In post 131, HowardRoark wrote:Early going "cases" may not be strong, but its content worth referencing now and later. I knew the rules and they were clarified before my return. What reactions would have given you what reads? An attempted quick hammer would have been a possible tell or could be attempted to be used by scum to place suspicion on the townie who actually knew the mechanics. As town knowing the rules there's no reason not to vote; even if I didn't know the rules that's at best a null.
As scum there's no harm to you voting, knowing or not knowing, with an advantage to knowing.
The contradictory responses don't change my vote. Interaction and following in 113 - 115 noted.
FOS: GuiltyLion
His entrance is soft push on FrankJaeger and possible buddying with Gamma Emerald. Then his most recent appearance is a poor and complete reversal on FrankJaeger with more buddying and echoing others. Group re-read pending DeathByWobbuffet's post since lane0168 has previously been the only active participant.
Re-examining the Power (ArcAngel9, Dunnstral, Secret Agent Jin) group.
No reason not to vote=your reason for voting? Is this pretty much what your saying?
Why didnt you wait?
Can you rephrase the bolded portion?
You calling something contradictory is fine, but I have no idea what youre talking about.
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Post #135 (isolation #32) » Thu Nov 17, 2016 8:56 am
Postby FrankJaeger »
In post 134, HowardRoark wrote:@FrankJaeger: My initial vote, since there was no concern of a quick hammer was purely RVS; thus mocking your "coin flip" decision. My current vote on you is serious.
Poorly worded and not sure if this will be better. If you are scum there is no harm in voting first. If the second vote was placed, you could quickly call that person out as scum for the quick hammer. Then, "oops I didn't understand the rules." (That's the advantage to knowing part.)
Not knowing the mechanics, as you stated, you cannot explain your way out of your failed attempt at a mislynch today. I see no explanation for what you're attempting to pass off as a town gambit. You didn't even un/change vote when calling me scum. If you were really concerned about a scum quick hammer, why provide Gamma Emerald with the chance to do the same. Contradictions. Digging your hole deeper. You grabbed the rope and tied a noose.
So it went from "no reason not to" to "rvs"...
Why would you vote here, so fast, unless you knew gamma was town? You aren't explaining this part.
Me misunderstanding the rules does not discredit my read at all. A town would be more cautious in any case.
Why would I unvote you?
Why call this a gambit?
I wasnt worried about a quick scum hammer at all...Ive made that super clear. I also stated
why
I wasnt worried about it. in fact that goes against my whole point...
Why make that up?
So if thats your "contradiction", thats pretty weak.
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Post #138 (isolation #33) » Thu Nov 17, 2016 9:49 am
Postby FrankJaeger »
In post 136, lane0168 wrote:Frank still hasn't explained clearly enough for me why his vote was ok and Howards was bad. I gotta go back and see if I just wasn't understanding the explanation but I think he's the scum there
vote because I understood the mechanics. So why wouldn't/shouldn't I vote quickly? Or anyone else for that matter. No need to discredit your read, just pointing out your actions and why you are scum.
In post 94, FrankJaeger wrote:Me and Howard are in 2 different positions. My vote was literally random.
I dont think town would have voted at all in his position.
Scum has several reasons they would do what he did.
BUT I was more interested in his reply. Which was what exactly?
(see below for "difference" I guess. *shrug*) What reply/reaction were you expecting and how would it have helped?
In post 103, Gamma Emerald wrote:Apparently what Frank said about Howard doesn't apply to him. If you thought hammers were locked like that why would you even vote?
Thats exactly what I think. If he voted first I wouldnt have voted at all.
I hate saying reaction test. Because it skews the results.
Do you think town OR scum would have hammered there? So that doesnt really matter.
In post 104, FrankJaeger wrote:Do you think town OR scum would have hammered there? So that doesnt really matter.
I don't get the question.
If you are town, you have to think there's a chance one of us is scum. Why would you give the opportunity to quickhammer to scum?
Well it got a reaction from everyone but the guy who mattered.
I agree, but I also realize the only person hammering is scum. Scum knows this too.
How was a reaction going to tell you anything?!?!?
You missed an important mechanic. Tried to be slick. Failed. I'm done with you. Need to focus on the other groups now.
Tried to be slick about what? You keep alluding to this without saying what it is.
Part of your read on me is because I think youre scum and didnt unvote you. Why would I want to unvote you?
You are habitually framing the convo inaccuratly, and asking me empty questions.
My point is clear.
I voted. Town would probably wait and see what happens after that right? Nope howard doesnt even question a thing.
Scum would do EXACTLY as he did.
Your whole reaction to this thing stinks. More reason to not unvote.
So cock sure im scum, you arent even going to question gamma? Smelly.
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Post #146 (isolation #36) » Thu Nov 17, 2016 7:13 pm
Postby FrankJaeger »
In post 142, lane0168 wrote:Frank is full of hot air. He's trying to substantiate his read on Howard but any means necessary. It's pretty bad. So dbw gets lynched, Frank, and arc. That's my votes
His read on me is bad. He hasnt retorted anything ive said about his case.
In post 140, FrankJaeger wrote:Tried to be slick about what? You keep alluding to this without saying what it is.
Part of your read on me is because I think youre scum and didnt unvote you. Why would I want to unvote you?
You are habitually framing the convo inaccuratly, and asking me empty questions.
My point is clear.
I voted. Town would probably wait and see what happens after that right? Nope howard doesnt even question a thing.
Scum would do EXACTLY as he did.
Your whole reaction to this thing stinks. More reason to not unvote.
So cock sure im scum, you arent even going to question gamma? Smelly.
OK let's see
If I was scum I could have quickhammered and locked votes FYPOV.
WHY WOULD YOU RVS IF YOU BELIEVED SCUM COULD QH SO EASILY?
Also nice throwing shade bud.
In post 147, Dunnstral wrote:UNVOTE:
Ok that jump-on was pretty scummy considering you were talking about how she was town
Unvoting because we're at l-1 or whatever and I want to let arc talk and see if saj is scum after all
After you said to look at her posts i ISO'd her and she has a couple posts toward me that make it seem like i am scummy, namely "are you trying to twist my words" and accusing me of buddying. After that she jumps on lane's case about ruining her reaction test and continues to write messages about him. To tell you the truth, i would have never been suspicious of Arc if it wasnt for you asking me to review her posts and voting her. You know i townread her and even said that her posts looked innocent to me. If you had not made me question my read and made me second guess myself then i would have never voted her. Is this your way of making me look suspicious and scummy? Is this how you are going to convince Arc to vote me? Are you town? You know i am newer and inexperienced so you tricked me and made me trust your word that there was something i wasnt catching within Arc's posts. You know i am bad at reading players since i am new to this site and you played me. I am just upset at you for doing that to me, i thought you are suppose to help new players. Ill be back after awhile when i am cooled down.
@Arc I am sorry i voted you, i townread you and he played me into changing my mind. I thought Power group was the all-town group but i dont know anymore about Dunn.
UNVOTE:
VOTE: Dunn
In post 147, Dunnstral wrote:UNVOTE:
Ok that jump-on was pretty scummy considering you were talking about how she was town
Unvoting because we're at l-1 or whatever and I want to let arc talk and see if saj is scum after all
In post 145, Secret Agent Jin wrote:If you look at Arc's posts throughout the game they look like she is suspicious of a few people and trying to pin down scum quickly which is townleaning. When you ISO her though and those posts are all in a row, she looks like she is fairly scummy considering she pointed at multiple people in just 8 posts. She looks too eager to me. I mean, no matter the outcome we HAVE to decide on three lynches.
In post 129, Secret Agent Jin wrote:So, seeing as we both townread Arc, what do you think about me putting my vote on you and letting Arc decide between us since your vote is already on me?
Why would you ask me
VOTE: ArcAngel9
I've changed my mind here though so you should take a second look as well
What the hell is this? You both better have some serious explanation for this. If there is something in what i said makes so sense or look suspicious, you should ask me first? Seriously, I am not understanding what is that you guys are confused about me. Wont you guys let me know justify myself for your accusations? I am not scum reading either of you nor even i town read. So, can we wait and talk a bit and also read others as well. I see some oppurtunist pushes on wagon from someone who is not in our group. I would be questioning them on that and would love to hear their thoughts.
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Post #159 (isolation #41) » Fri Nov 18, 2016 4:40 am
Postby FrankJaeger »
Look.
My initial read was lightened by my rule interpretation.
Im still saying him voting gamma there was scummy.
His reaction was worse. He waited for the rest of the town to form an opinion. Howard then just repeats what someone else said.
When I try to get him to back up his arguement, he runs.
Im appealing more to the town on D2 because my group seems to be stuck on me.
In post 19, Gamma Emerald wrote:Accusations of scumminess based on voting are not applicable currently
I disagree
Can you explain why? When you admitted to overlooking the rule? Why stick with your initial read, when the reason you made the read is wrong? Answer GuiltyLion's question too
When i voted there was no info.
When howard votes, the game has already started.
Now ask your self what would scum do in his shoes.
1. Not vote-most town thing to do
2.vote frank- pretty null
3.vote gamma.- scum
Ding ding he picks 3. Like he doesnt even question me. Just "ok gamma it is"
I push him on it, and I still havent gotten an explanation.
He is just echoing gamma
But your scum read is based off that alone. It said so. He had 3 choices. Voting gamma is scummy according to you. But now you say by itself it isn't? When your own scum is based solely on that. What makes it scummy then?
Scummy doesnt equal scum.
I called him scum because he was scummy to see how he responded.
Now if i could get an answer from him as to why he would jump on gamma and not question me, that would be great. Why didnt he just wait to vote? Why didnt he vote me? Why is he ignoring our whole group now?
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Post #169 (isolation #46) » Fri Nov 18, 2016 6:29 am
Postby FrankJaeger »
In post 165, lane0168 wrote:Is Frank's entire case on Howard that Howard rvs voted, but frank did it first so Howard is the scum? Honestly is that what Frank is trying to push here?
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Post #170 (isolation #47) » Fri Nov 18, 2016 6:32 am
Postby FrankJaeger »
In post 166, lane0168 wrote:He's made no explanation of why only scum would vote gamma. Why the hell not? It's rvs. He had 2 choices to vote. I voted as well
Why are you ignoring my other points.
Him voting gamma was a red flag. I went after it.
Your vote and his vote arent comparable, so idk what your point is.
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Post #181 (isolation #48) » Fri Nov 18, 2016 9:27 am
Postby FrankJaeger »
In post 177, lane0168 wrote:There's nothing wrong with questioning someone's motives. Nobody said that. You're not listening. It's the way you did it that's scummy.
Also youre not listening to Howard either, IN THIS GAME VT and Townie is the same thing. Everyone is town or scum. At least I haven't seen anything that indicates there are power roles. Have you?
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Post #183 (isolation #49) » Fri Nov 18, 2016 9:38 am
Postby FrankJaeger »
In post 178, HowardRoark wrote:@FrankJaeger: I am not ignoring Gamma Emerald, but I also already have you.
Not from what I see
You obviously have not read any of my posts as to why my vote is on you.
This isnt my concern. I know why your vote is on me.
As town, believing that a quick hammer was possible, there is no good explanation for the gambit; do the maths.
What gambit? Literally no one would have lynched there...town or scum. Why are you forcing this?
Another ignorant (not offensive, rather denotation accurate)
no offense taken my amigo
town could have accidentally "lynched" town (66% random probable, 100% knowing my role). Then if in the all town group (33% possible) resulted in the mislynch of the hammering town.
but i dont get your point here? What does this have to do with you voting gamma at all?
Your play and argument only makes sense as scum.
Well it would be nice if you actually acknowledged my arguement.
Since I and others did understand the rules, saying my RV is scummy (159) is what is scummy.
It wasnt an RV though...
I said I am done with you and now I am. If somebody else needs clarification on my explanation I believe they actually want it instead of distracting us from finding the other scum. This is the painful part of the mechanic.
Again, why not question my claim, and vote? Why just jump on gamma? Why are you letting basically every other player in the game argue for you?
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Post #203 (isolation #56) » Fri Nov 18, 2016 11:39 am
Postby FrankJaeger »
In post 199, lane0168 wrote:Im super frustrated with this dbw character. Gets prodded and pops in to say he's reading. Obviously a lie. And now it's been a day and 9 hours since then. I'm not trying to force mod hand or over step my bounds here but in this setup everyone needs to be here at least a little bit. Guilty, where you at?
We know this. And the mod has addressed it.
least towny post from lane. The passion seems forced.
