Mini 1869- camn's revenge GAME OVER!

[mastina]

We should hydra after this.

New hydra or attempt to break the curse of Palisade?
(That's a funny story not even Pine knows the full extent of, but which I do. Palisade has been used by five people--including Nacho--in about that number of games. Of them, the only one which went well was the third party game and even there that was only scraping by the skins of our teeth via a fakeclaim D2 even though we were basically outed as nontown long before that for faking a post restriction in a game modded by someone who had an absolute LOATHING of post restrictions which we didn't know about and some other player brought up midway through D1 after we had been using the post restriction. That, being the BEST Palisade game, can give you an idea of how bad the hydra was.)

[TheRealGin-N-Tonic]

so you're here to help, but, we've got to do it alone?

Almost.
Think of it as...being a mentor who knows the answer, and can give it to the student, but who knows that just telling the student won't make them understand. The best way for the student to comprehend is to be given the path, and then work their way through it.

Think of it this way.

As a teacher I could tell you:
X + 1 = 4.
X + 1 - 1 = 4 - 1
X = 3.
This explains the process step by step...but the student might not accept the lesson.
Or, I could tell you:
"X + 1 = 4.
X is 3. Now, how did I know that?"

And suddenly the student is forced to work their way through it and figure that out. One teaches more than the other. And is therefore more useful than the other. So yes. I'm here to help. I will give you the answers. When you struggle, I will even give you clues as to the process. When continuing to struggle, I will make those clues continuously more explicit. But my expectation of you is always that you are meant to figure out the process on your own.

In the context of a mafia game, this is more than just me being an IC in a non-newbie game. It serves a distinct purpose beyond that, but for that, I'll leave it to you to figure out what the motivation behind my actions are. (No, it's not that as scum I'm incapable of generating my own reasoning. I'll tell you that. Now figure out what it actually is.)

You're doing it to improve the playerbase in general, if I'm correct in your logic, I can relate it to a problem I had on my home site(why I left) in which there were about 5-7 players considered power players and the rest didn't do much besides just wait for the power players to say something.

[mastina]

Start pointing out how scummy shit people said

Okay!

"The Fallen" Just my pride
I got tears

Fuck these mind games already

I'm actually going to argue the fact that if both of you are steller scums, he'd make sure both are town purely for the fact that he'd know you'd be at each others throats.

Even if it doesn't end up being mislynches, there will be tonnes of noise created by you two arguing.

Also I'm just going to lay it out there, as soon as ya'll say you're not with Pine, I'm just looking at it like distancing. It doesn't have to be announced that you're not on Pine's team, if town it's self-evident.

Hey Pine, can you do me a flavor?

I want a MyLo/LyLo rematch.

Damn..that's actually a really bad idea.

Hey Pine, you think we would have won the Hunger Games if it wasn't for those two strongmans?

My guess is dreal and SirCakes

ur memz R trash

Nacho/Mastin/Pine/4th scum or no? scum team and Mastin/nacho pulls an epic distancing play at the beginning of the game.

So mastin, what you propose is to not actually scum hunt but bob for apples?

The theory doesn't make sense at all and I don't see why playing the game normal would be less beneficial than this crackpot theory you got going on.

pine made a huge mistake letting nacho and prism team up I think

Did you just say these two were on the same team?

So you're telling me you scum read me for not having any knowledge of the history between Pine and his other compatriots and then also not agreeing with your theory when:
1) From my perspective, by doing this PoE from the start, you allow easy mislynches and disallow people to form reads on players which isn't helpful later game
2) Pine is manipulative and if I can think to make all the player's he's gone way back with as town so they WIFOM lynch each other, I'd do it and I don't doubt he would either.

I just don't think you're thinking clearly here. It doesn't matter who Pine talks to because it's NAI. You have to realize that if Pine could pick the scum team, that means he's picking the players who he thinks could work together as their own unit, regardless if Pine himself was in the game or not.

Prism are you talking about me?

I'll be honest I don't care about speculation at all

ALSO

If I'm this obvscum then why in the fuck would Pine pick me?

No I mean it's just cute that you think I'm scum. When I tell you I got nommed for a scummy award, it's because you wouldn't even think it was possible that I was scum, if I was scum this game. Especially when I haven't played with you as town, when you can't tell the difference, you're pretty much fucked.
I think I deserve a flash wagon

At your request, the scummy shit people have said.

[Pine]

Mastina bb lets redeem Palisade.

-Redhead

[mastina]

So if you do something that looks like your scumgame, that's just your town game? Cool, I'll keep that in mind

What I was saying was pretty clear.
And it was pretty clearly not that.
So no.

This is a fine case of a misrep and one reason why Aeronaut is scum.

Mastin, tell me honestly; do you think that Pine looked at this playerlist and blatantly picked only people were "older" players?

Nope! Quite explicitly, he only chose one older player. We've got three in this game and three only: me, Fate, and Nacho. He didn't choose me. I believe he didn't choose Fate, though it's possible. I think he chose Nacho. Then camn chose Fate. And then he chose two newer players.

Namely: you, and TheRealGin-N-Tonic.

[TheRealGin-N-Tonic]

@Mastin

[Monokuma]

@Mastin

You respond to her joke but not my

very serious accusation

???

[TheRealGin-N-Tonic]

I'm trying to make a thing for Aero but I keep getting distracted

[mastina]

Pine is not trying to help you win, don't you think Pine would intentionally do some non-pine things so that you'd blatantly defend his scum partners?

Funny story that.
I know Pine doesn't take mastina countermeasures.
It seems weird, I know. I know him better than any other player. Yet in the recentish times that he was scum where I was town, he did nothing to stop me even though I basically was a one-woman wrecking crew in Duck Tales among others. (Look at his iso. What in there was an attempt to counter me? Point it out.)

Taking mastina countermeasures is ridiculously hard for Pine to do, for a few reasons.
One, I am a wildcard. A very, very, very strong wildcard. The only thing Pine can predict about me is that I am unpredictable.
Two, even if he takes a countermeasure to a me from a certain time, the very way I think will serve to overcome the countermeasure eventually because I shift my thinking. I continue to change how I go about things, for better or worse, so by laying a countermeasure for me, he leaves himself open to a future-me overcoming him easier.
Three, I am a single player. Pine might know that I am a strong voice who knows him better than the others here...but he knows that to some extent, protecting his scumteam from me leaves himself vulnerable to the REST of the town. Because I think in unusual ways, because I use unorthodox methods, the countermeasures to these would be unusual and unorthodox moves which would be awkward and disjointed...allowing the town to rip his team to shreds.
Four, beyond that: as I have mentioned, Pine has largely stagnated as a player. Sure he's capable of adjusting a little bit to changes in site meta. Sure, he's capable of playing a strong game. But the Pine of now is almost identical to the Pine of six years ago in terms of playing the game. Whereas me? Me, I've continued to change with that time. So Pine attempting to deploy countermeasures to me might entirely miss the mark: he'd end up countering things the past-me would think of, but the current-me would never dream of ever thinking.

The ONLY countermeasures available to Pine that would make him not be vulnerable?
Recruiting me (which I know he didn't)...
...Or an entirely random.org distribution, which...would leave him at a disadvantage, because his three choices (being random) would allow the town to have its strong players, and leave him with only random chance in terms of synchronization. While it's not impossible he would do this, it would be incredibly improbable and time itself would help to demonstrate this.

[mastina]

also in case you were worried I don't stalk you to games, we've just happened to be in a few together

Pfft, amateur.
While I've stalked mods before, and Pine wasn't the first player I stalked, he has been one of the most consistent players for me to gamestalk before.

Embrace your inner stalker. Live it. Be the creep you always knew deep down you were. Freak your target out by your shows of love and affection: consistently tying rope around their necks and repeatedly shooting them. It's the only way to go pro.

[mastina]

So mastin, on a scale of 1 to wrong, how sure are you that I'm scum?

If you started at 50% chance to be scum, you're hanging at a solid 70-80%.

[SirCakez]

Will catch up tomorrow morning

[mastina]

And? I'm pretty sure that's what most of this game thinks, since it's you know, common sense.
Yep, I'm the only one who thinks we shouldn't let a game designed to fuck with us fuck with us, obviously. That's why nacho is the leading wagon, right?

Mafia exercise time.

This is a really fun one, I promise you.

Who here can spot the problematic nature of these two statements being placed back-to-back?

There's something very glaringly obvious in here. I could tell you at any time, but I want you to think for a sec, stretch your minds, and see if you're capable of figuring it out for yourselves.

This actually, is the definition of WIFOM. Pine wouldn't do WIFOM because he thinks we'd think he'd do WIFOM but he wouldn't do that because...etc.

Also a misrep of my point, ignoring all the important bits.
My argument isn't that we should try to play the wifom game.
My argument is that we should assume Pine making the optimal choices for his scumteam.
Because that's what he'd do, without wifom entering the picture.
So without wifom, what are Pine's perfect choices for being scum?

Players he's seen in action recently and knows the skill of, and/or players who're timeless that he knows are great no matter the gap in time.

[mastina]

I'm over it mastina. If you feel like giving any scum reads this game, go ahead!

Oh, I have.
Nacho, you, TheRealGin-N-Tonic.
I've also got a readslist for that matter, but the three scumreads should suffice.

[mastina]

and then doesn't vote me anyway

I've got a better vote, and normally I'd have long-since cast it (day's open and all that with me hating to not be voting), but first I gotta get caught up (since the vote should be the last thing I post in here today), and then I've gotta prepare the vote because what I have in mind is something special which I think will be appreciated when I do in fact cast the vote.

[mastina]

Gin, you have any preliminary reads right now? So far I know that you disagree with mastin's spec, but what else?

Ironically enough this is the closest thing to me having reason to doubt my reads as anything else.

Know why?

This is literally textbook scum-scum interactions.
So damn textbook.

So

damn textbook.
That if anything it'd be evidence that it couldn't be true.

Butyeah. Textbook scum-scum interaction is textbook. Objectively a good lynch if nothing else.

[TheRealGin-N-Tonic]

My semester starts Monday, where can I go buy this textbook and how much is it?

[Monokuma]

mastina no

[mastina]

You respond to her joke but not my

very serious accusation

???

While you're not exactly telling a joke here, I should clarify: neither was I.
You'll note that the posts I quoted? Not TheRealGin-N-Tonic's whole iso. There were some omitted. And of those that I quoted, I often cut out huge swatch of them for only small sections to remain. There was good reason for that. My method might've been a bit tongue-in-cheek, but I was dead serious in saying those were scummy posts.

Now, they're not the

only

scummy posts in the game thread.
Aeronaut has plenty of those, for instance.
But they're all of TheRealGin-N-Tonic's scummy posts. Which happen to be most of his posts.

[Pine]

Hey Mastina? ILY BB, but your reads are a joke. The scumthread and I are cheering you on.

[Pine]

Nacho, where the fuck are you? Post something meaningful in the main thread, please. I was kind of counting on you to counter Mastin. She's kind of blowing up my spot.

[Prism]

If mastina has any good points whatsoever they're being completely lost. I'm pretending the past 5 pages don't exist unless your name is Aeronaut.

[Prism]

That might change when I get some sleep since I've been going for about 48 hours, but right now I'm staring at these posts that appear to be at least 90% nothing and skipping them entirely.

[mastina]

Oh mastina the lumberjane,
Seen by others as utterly insane,
But it seems that as of late,
She is here to wreck Pine's game.

Oh mastina the woodcutter,
From the past she did learn.
She wanted to be a treehugger,
Now Pine'll know the wrath of her.

She knows how to fell a Pine,
With a skill that is almost divine.
When asked of her on how and why,
She said simply "Because it's fun to try".

She says the scum she had named,
Include Gin and Aeronaut, great!
But the first victim of her fury today...
VOTE: Nachomamma8.

[camn]

VOTE COUNT 1 . 3

• Secret Agent Jin ---
  0 ( )
  L- 7
  
  
  BTD6_MAKER ---------
  0 ( )
  L- 7
  
  
  TheRealGin-N-Tonic -
  1 ( Monokuma, )
  L- 6
  
  
  Nachomamma8 --------
  1 ( mastina, )
  L- 6
  
  
  Fate ---------------
  0 ( )
  L- 7
  
  
  drealmerz7 ---------
  2 ( Vaxkiller, pisskop, Pine )
  L- 5
  
  
  Monokuma -----------
  0 ( )
  L- 7
  
  
  mastina ------------
  3 ( drealmerz7, SirCakez, BTD6_MAKER, )
  L- 4
  
  
  Aeronaut -----------
  0 ( )
  L- 7
  
  
  Prism --------------
  0 ( )
  L- 7
  
  
  SirCakez -----------
  2 ( Fate, Aeronaut, )
  L- 5
  
  
  Vaxkiller ----------
  0 ( )
  L- 7
  
  
  pisskop ------------
  0 ( )
  L- 7
  
  
  
  Not Voting -
  4 ( Secret Agent Jin, TheRealGin-N-Tonic, Nachomamma8,
  Prism, )

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to Lynch
Deadline is in (expired on 2017-01-22 18:00:00)