Newbie 1770: Water Game Over

[Fykus]

Morning everyone

[Fykus]

VOTE: TierShift

Partially cause he voted for me, and partially because i dont think there would be 2 inexperienced scums on their first game (thered be 1 experienced person there to guide the other newbie).

[Fykus]

My apologies for jumping to conclusions tier, but you have to agree my logic was sound :p

[Fykus]

I guess I considered the IC the most experienced plus it was a 1 in 3 chance to be right (if my theory was correct).

As for voting for you cause you voted for me I figured why not? From looking at other game threads people seem to just vote for randoms on day 1 so i thought itd be appropriate to do the same.

[Fykus]

Ive got no idea who to change it to. Any suggestions?

[Fykus]

Sorry I havent been posting much, not much to say on the first day by the go of it.

[Fykus]

Fykus what's your take on FormerFish's aggressiveness and questioning?

Actually afer re-reading the thread again I cant really see much aggression from him at all. If anything I think TS was a bit aggressive towards me after I voted for him but I guess it could just be him defending himself. Being my first game ive got no idea how scum will generally act on day 1 so I dont have much to go off unfortunately.

[Fykus]

UNVOTE: TierShift

Undoing my vote on TS for now, just because some coherent arguments for some other people here are starting to appear. I'll withhold my vote for now.

Also as a question to the experienced players here - generally when does a lynch end up being decided? Do people tend to jump on the bandwagon right at the end of the day or can people just stacks on someone half way through and cut the day short?

[Fykus]

I unvoted you since people are making good arguments for other people. Id like to keep my vote open so that if someone convincingly seems to be scum i can help to lynch them rather than waste it on you. As for making my own arguments, ive got nothing to go on considering its day 1 and this is my first ever game so ive got no idea on what to look for yet.

[Fykus]

I'd like to hear some more from Toto. Hes been very quiet for the last couple days and that seems suspicious to me. In a game like this it seems as if scum would like to coast along staying out of the limelight and he seems like hes been doing that. Does anyone else agree with that sentiment?

[Fykus]

alright my vote goes to toto

VOTE: toto

[Fykus]

You'd think itd kind of make sense, since they have to collude together each night to pick a target to kill. TS said its not the case though, but i think im justified in my original reasoning.

[Fykus]

Last time you saw what happening? The newbie accusing the IC of being scum to help a newbie scum?

[Fykus]

Ah, that makes sense. I can see why you're making the assumption about me then. Honestly though, i still think TS might be scum with the way hes constantly hammering questions at me. Unless ofcourse hes just trying to get it into my muscle memory to explain myself better when making accusations (thus making me a better player someday or something).

Who knows~

[Fykus]

Can you explain the term for me please?

[Fykus]

But im not, ive suggested theories a couple times now.
Isnt the whole point of the game formulating theories (that hopefully turn out correct) and convincing everyone else to believe you so you can (hopefully) lynch the scum?

[Fykus]

Thatd depend on the theory and how plausible it sounded.

[Fykus]

Sorry for the late reply to the thread everybody. Moogin, as for why I never mentioned anything about your vote on me I figured you had just jumped on the bandwagon because of TS calling me out on voting for him so I didnt feel the need to make a post to you.

[Fykus]

I apologize (again) for the lack of activity over the last 2 days, ive just started back at work again so I can only really post of an afternoon in Australia time. After following the thread but not posting I think toto's behaviour is way over the top. My vote is staying where it is. I've got no idea why everyone has got a hardon for lynching me though since im just a VT.

Anyways...

Looking through, fykus voted for Toto after toto voted for fykus. This is the second time that fykus has done this. I don't know if it is suspicious, but I have a feeling it is. My vote for fykus stands.

I would find it suspicious because instead of saying why he's not suspicious he immediately goes into reasons why another person is more suspicious. The lack of defense tells me there is no defense, and that he is scum.

I originally voted for Toto because he was barely posting anything a few days back, after doing so he rushed into the game and started ranting and raving like a lunatic so I've kept the vote where it is and it looks like a good decision tbh. Also I still have a sneaking suspicion that TS might be scum also but I guess I'll save those accusations for another day.

[Fykus]

Like I said in my previous post Moogin I originally voted on Toto because he wasnt posting anything so it was meant as a prod to get him active. It worked and my vote stayed where it was.

[Fykus]

For now yes.

[Fykus]

For now yes.

Why?
This + the complete absence of any reasons for his vote in his ISO is making me feel bad about the slot. Feels like he might be opportunistic scum who is hoping my lynch still goes through.
I wasn't sure I bought the 'raving like a lunatic' excuse the first time but him just leaving that vote down with no reasoning feels really shitty.
I am going to put this back down.

VOTE: Fykus

Toto was acting scummy as fuck, fish and others called him out on it and he almost gets lynched. Then I think Moogin asked me why my vote was still on him after a few people jumped off and I explained my reasons for that. Then in the next post he just up and ragequits. Like, if thats not Toto admitting he fucked up trying to pretend hes not scum then I dont know what is.

[Fykus]

Forgive me for my posts being so bare but like what are you meant to go off on day 1 really? It seems to go like: shitpost and vote on randoms until one of them cracks and then pressure the fuck out of them to see if theyll crack even more and then try to deduce from that who is "acting scummy". Is that about right? Seems to me itll be way way way easier on day 2 because youll see if your potential scum flips mafia and who gets killed during the night. Like ive got a few suspicions on people but its just a "feeling" which cant really be put into words or easily explained why i have said feeling. Whats a player meant to do if thats the case? And like what if i agree with someones points on other people as to why they're scummy; like, am i allowed to agree with them or is it scummy to agree with someone elses opinions?
Also am i meant to be posting small sentences again and again after myself to increase my post count so it looks like im active or what?

[Fykus]

VOTE: unvote

[Fykus]

Alright so i just (exhaustingly) went through the entire thread again, this time making notes of every post of TS's because ive been getting a scum feeling of him since the beginning of the game. Heres a summary:

1 - introduction, votes for fykus
2 - saying hello
3 and 4 - correcting my logic, asks why i voted him
5 - "answer my question"
6 - game info
7 - "why vote for me?"
8 - vote jin
9 - game info
10 - game theory
11 - "why arent you voting" to pep
12 - game info, questioning reason for voting him
13 - questioning something i said about agreeing with other peoples arguments
14 - doesnt want to give out reads because newbies might take it as gospel, wants to see if there are any good thought processes he might be able to apply to his own meta
15 - game theory
16 - questioning 3 people
17 - questioning someone
18 - game theory, questioning
19 - talk of previous game vs this game
20 - reprimanding toto
21 - question
22 - question
23 - votes moogin
24 - question, tells toto and fish to stop arguing
25 - answers question about previous game, answers a question about toto
26 - game info, possibly trying to get toto out of a tight spot
27 - "drop it for today toto"
28 - "we can lynch fykus if you want"
29 - game info
30 - question
31 - game theory, question
32 - defending toto defense
33 - vote fykus
34 - "just be glad someone is on your side" to toto
35 - question
36 - question
37 - defending toto
38 - answered a question in 2 words
39 - game theory
40 - question
41 - question
42 - question
43 - unvote
44 - question
45 - question
46 - vote moogin
47 - no substance, answers question
48 - no substance
49 - question
50 - reason for asking question
51 - trying to refute ny's claim
52 - game info
53 - reasons for voting
54 - question
55 - game info


As you can see, his posts up until this point have absolutely 0 substance (except for a few times where he possibly tried to get toto out of trouble, but that could of just been his IC instincts kicking in and trying to fix the game for us newbies). Is this not how a scum plays the game? Hiding in plain sight by "posting but not posting" at the same time if you get my drift? Anywho, for now my vote is going back to TS.

VOTE: TierShift

Also a little bonus tidbit i found on my return to the start of the game:

@MOD- I didn't see anywhere in the OP about scum daytalk. Is no daytalk standard for newbie games?

Does this seem fishy to anyone else? (pun intended)
Why would a townie need to ask about the existence of day talk between scum members? Ofcourse youd want to know this if you were scum, but you wouldnt want to seem scummy by asking about it so youd phrase it this exact way by mentioning the OP.

In conclusion, lynch me if you like but youll see ill bleed green.

[Fykus]

Now i feel bad for my post about him.

[Fykus]

p.s why isnt jin back yet? hes like 2 days late

[Fykus]

Good to see we've finally got another slot up and talking, now we can take actions if need be.

[Fykus]

By which I mean now we can try to figure out if that slot is scum or not, like you cant interrogate someone that isnt here

[Fykus]

I've gone back to leaning town on Fykus so that's a no go. I can tentatively support Jack though, so you should go over there.

This is the same type of stuff that FF accused TS of saying to Toto way back when, saying that TS was trying to get Toto out of the shit.

Now what I'm confused about is how both fykus and jack are saying "hang me if you want you'll see you're wrong." That seems super suspicious? If you're town I feel like you shouldn't be so ready to hang, you should be fighting and trying to find someone who actually is scum in order to help the town win. If you're town and you just let yourself die, who does that help?

Its the truth though, if I hang you'll see that Im green. From what I can tell, town has the ability to maybe mislynch 1 or 2 people without throwing away their chances of winning the game, so im trying to say if you want to waste that one chance on me then go ahead. Im sure once day 2 rolls around itll be alot easier to assess who is actually scum and who isnt by the type of stuff they were posting today. Right now it seems the game is just a bunch of he said/she said and trying to convince everybody else that your opinion is the right one to follow.

[Fykus]

Can Formerfish get prodded please

[Fykus]

VOTE: Moogin

[Fykus]

Sorry Moogs, you know i love you. Its just that I read through the entirety of one of Tiers newbie previous games yesterday and it seems the general meta is to vote for people on the first day trying to get close to lynch to put some pressure/get some info out of the person so Im just trying to emulate that. I dont get a very scummy read from you but i could be wrong nonetheless. Plus with only a few days left of day 1 it seems like we need to pull our fingers out and make a decision on who to lynch. I know its a shitty reason/explanation but its our first game after all.

[Fykus]

also

mhsmith

the 25th is actually wednesday not monday.

[Fykus]

apologies, i meant i read through one of greys newbie games**
got em mixed up

[Fykus]

MooginSoosy

nydushermain

Pepchoninga

JackChaos

Formerfish

TierShift

Grey

RC

[Fykus]

note that those arent in order within the colours (forgot to do that)

[Fykus]

Can either of you explain to me how im being anti town please?

[Fykus]

Fair points, ive made myself look retarded.

VOTE: unvote

[Fykus]

Resigned scum? As if, if i was scum id be trying to pull all sorts of shit out of my ass trying to get this wagon off of me, but i would of been acting entirely different for the entire game so i wouldnt have this issue right now. Frankly i didnt pick apart your post because there isnt much to pick apart except for maybe 1 or two parts of it when you said i was "scummy shade casting".

MooginSoosy

nydushermain

Pepchoninga

JackChaos

Formerfish

TierShift

Grey

RC

Is this a read list? Cuz to me it seems like you are listing us from least experienced to most experienced

That seems like a noob town, desperately trying to get the big guns out of the way.

Basically i copied the player list from page 1 and colour coded the people i thought were scummy but forgot to put them in towniest to scummiest order. You say its noob town (which is correct) but then you vote for me anyway?

Fair points, ive made myself look retarded.

VOTE: unvote

This is scum trying to water the situation.

No, its a new player admitting he made a fool of himself and withholding his vote for a while. But anyways if youd like me to vote on somebody ill go back to my original opinion re: toto.

VOTE: Grey

[Fykus]

Sorry, got grey and rc mixed up.

VOTE: RC

[Fykus]

[Fykus]

Fykus was voting his top townread, for Christ's sake.

You want a guilty before you Lynch scum? Fine.

I claim a daycop guilty on Fykus

You're full of shit. How do i know that? Because you cant get a daycop reading on me because im a fucking townie.

VOTE: unvote
VOTE: Grey[/unvote]

[Fykus]

VOTE: grey

[Fykus]

VOTE: TS

Also shes probably ranked lowest of my town reads tbh.

[Fykus]

And mafia doesnt admit to voting on their "townreads" either.

[Fykus]

Why would a scum be admitting their mistakes and trying to rectify them in new posts and by changing their actions? It seems to me that you've either got tunnel vision on me for some silly reason or your scum trying to get an easy lynch (possibly because that person is right about you and your partner.

Youre an experienced player so i dont see you making the mistake of seeing retarded newbie town moves as scummy. Ill make a proper post about this later when im not at work on my phone

[Fykus]

Also could someone clarify what mylo is?

[Fykus]

These last 10 pages or so it really seems like Grey is desperate to steer the game away from himself/RC/TS and onto an easy target such as my self. I've been called out on some dumb shit that ive done, i admit. But atleast i can own up to my mistakes and make moves to rectify them. After all this is a newbie game isnt it? We're meant to make mistakes and learn from them yeah? Go back and read my posting history on here and youll notice ive gone from posting very vague statements to trying to fledge out and explain my reasoning when i vote/when i post.

I sincerely doubt that a mafia player would be owning up to half of the shit that ive been owning up to, especially Greys be all end all "proof fykus is scum" of voting for someone i considered townie. Like surely in the history of mafia no newbie has been so bad as to say that theyre voting for someone they "consider to be town" since theyd know exactly who is town and who isnt. In the time its taken for this first day to take place ive participated in 2 bastard mafia games elsewhere (both on scumteams) and I can tell you that id be acting ALOT differently than i am now if i was scum. This is literally my first time playing as town, cut me some slack.

From here on out im just going to stop explaining myself because according to the wiki you're better off to just continue scum hunting than trying to defend yourself when you're under fire. If i do get lynched at the end of the day and i flip town then i hope everybody will turn their big eyes of investigation to grey for pushing this terrible lynch so hard.

And just for some further proof im town, heres my "paraphrased" role message:

I am a Vanilla Townie.
I have no special abilities.
I win when all threats to the town are eliminated.

[Fykus]

You honestly think that id purposely make myself a look retarded enough to seem like a lynch target to make myself look town? Im sorry but you're reaching pretty hard here.

[Fykus]

VOTE: RC

[Fykus]

Rc is at l-1 hammer her moogs

[Fykus]

Im beginning to suspect a moogs/rc scumship. Ill post properly in an hour when i get home from work.

[Fykus]

Im beginning to suspect a moogs/rc scumship. Ill post properly in an hour when i get home from work.

Wrong.

If RC was scum with Moogs, he had zero incentive to derail the Lynch on Jack.

The ONLY way RC is scum is if Jack is his partner. A Jack town flip also clears RC and scum wouldn't want that if Jack is town.

Jack is the ideal lynch today any way you slice it.

What about this one:

Grey and RC are scumbuddies. Grey makes all of these if-then statements about RC's loyalties because he knows that Jack will flip town, thus "clearing" RC of being scum. Why not lynch RC and and if she turns out to be town then Jack is cleared, why does it have to be jack who gets the lynch?

Literally, fykus has put a vote on RC which is fine but he didn't anything but was CLEARLY following the thread throughout the entire argument because the moment moogin showed up, he pretended that RC was at L-1 to, I assume, provoke a reaction test. This means that fykus read me and TS asking him to talk? But he's ignoring it?

I actually thought RC was at L-2 when i voted. You voted RC, then RC voted herself, then Grey jumped on the wagon being a smartass so then i figured if i jumped on too itd leave her on L-1 so a quick hammer would teach her a lesson in humility and possibly get one half of our scum team out of the game. Moogs came along and posted (and noone had noticed the L-1 i thought was there) so i told her to hammer it in but that didnt eventuate. I could of been wrong about these events cause i was only having a quick skim every 10 or so minutes since i was still at work on my mobile.

[Fykus]

also could someone explain how the lynch didnt go through on jack earlier? until everyone kept posting and voting on other people i figured that the lynch succeeded and we were in twilight?

[Fykus]

scratch that i see now. RC voted twice.

[Fykus]

Grey and RC are scumbuddies.

Damn. You got us.

RC and I are scum, and RC derailed a lynch wagon that was on town because... wait, why did he do that, Fykus?

maybe it was to create an opportunity for this If-Then situation. Like i said before, why not lynch RC instead of jack and if he flips town then jack is also innocent?

[Fykus]

Whats your case on jack if you dont mind explaining it

[Fykus]

But when i mentioned ff asking if there was daychat for scum you brushed it off?

[Fykus]

Im with jack. VOTE: grey

[Fykus]

This should be interesting.

[Fykus]

Its my first flip. The outcome of which will determine the flow of tomorrow. Thus interesting

[Fykus]

VOTE: Grey

He led us astray with that lynch on Jack who turned out to be townie.

[Fykus]

Thats all well and good but pushing the wrong wagon too many times will get us all killed. From my understanding 2 consecutive lynches on town will result in LyLo right? We've gotta be careful today if thats the case.

[Fykus]

Id say its a world where that person and their said "hard town" may both possibly scum trying to make themselves look like non-targets

[Fykus]

Come on people, start participating.

[Fykus]

VOTE: Moogin

I'd like to hear some more from you. (No shes not my top read anymore so calm your tits guys)

[Fykus]

Id say thats cool cause im starting to somewhat town read you also.
What are your thoughts on there being no mafia kills last night? Do you think that a player was jailed (either scum or their target) or do you think that scum would forgo a kill to make it harder for town to pick out potential scum? I'm leaning more towards a jailer being here which makes me wonder if someone (the jailer) will know who a scum is due to that fact (if you get what I mean). By no means am I suggesting the Jailer out themselves to get a scum lynched (since they'd probably die that next night) but its something to ponder none the less.

[Fykus]

Another theory could be that the scum went awol (pep? maybe) but this wouldnt explain why the other scum didnt just go for a kill in their place instead.

Anyway, none of this really matters since we don't want this potential person to out their role and become a target themselves. Atleast it gives us an extra "incorrect lynch" before we hit LyLo i guess. So what do we do now? Wait for peps replacement to come in and catch up or start going back through posts and trying to find potential scum reads we might have missed? Me personally, I'd like to hear a bit more from Moogs, as stated before. Maybe a bit more TS and fish too.

[Fykus]

I've just got a gut feeling but I'm not entirely sure on why though. In a way she seems very standoffish, whereas earlier day 1 she was all into the discussion and very agreeable with stuff that was said. I'd just like to hear some more from her so I can discern whether what I'm feeling has merit or not. Apologies for the skimpy on detail replies but I'm about to head to bed. Will post some more detailed stuff tomorrow (hopefully there will be more discussion and input from other people who aren't very active atm).

[Fykus]

I think theyre suggesting pep wasnt around and thus tracked noone

[Fykus]

Alright moogs whod you track

[Fykus]

Unfortunately im just a vanilla townie. Had i been cop i would have tracked grey. So if you jailed nydus that means hes either scum or a target of scum or maybe mafia had a roleblocker that used their action and maybe pep never sent in a kill?

[Fykus]

VOTE: grey

Sorry mate but for nlw my vote needs to sit here. I cant contribute much atm since im at work but ill look every now and then

[Fykus]

VOTE: ville

[Fykus]

What do you mean? Ville wasnt l-1 were they?

[Fykus]

VOTE: grey

[Fykus]

More likely than not grey. Maybe nydus

[Fykus]

bussing him

This is scum's! RC.

Lynch him tomorrow, because there is no way in hell he says this as town.

He knows for a fact that I don't bus.

Ok

[Fykus]

bussing him

This is scum!RC.

Lynch him tomorrow, because there is no way in hell he says this as town.

He knows for a fact that I don't bus.

This is all I have to say for the test of the day.

Go ahead and lynch me, idc, because my green flip will just show that this post right here is true.

Remember when you said to me and jack that saying this sorta thing is scummy? The ironing is delicious.

[Fykus]

If you flip town how many more days to lylo?

[Fykus]

Ok so you today rc tomorrow if its not gg

[Fykus]

Should vote for yourself as a show of good faith

[Fykus]

Maybe ts has another concussion

[Fykus]

I wish moogs was still around. Atleast she was active

[Fykus]

Whyd you have to kill her grey

[Fykus]

Are you two retarded?

[Fykus]

Ill get on my pc in a few minutes and ill explain my feelings towards this situation

[Fykus]

Right. So one of you two are town. We're "this close" to finishing the game up and all signs are pointing to either of you, yet you want to take the risk of me flipping town and putting everyone onto mylo for no reason other than me shitposting while we wait for more people to come on and get this lynch over and done with. Why on earth are you wanting to drag this game on for another week or longer just to get in a quick "fuck you fykus" before we're done?

I appeal to the other townies. Lets lynch one of these two and that way we can be certain that either today or tomorrow we can win this game and move on with our lives.

[Fykus]

Killing me means youll only have 1 more chance at a lynch since ill flip town.

[Fykus]

except for the entirety of today where he pointed out that you're 90% likely to be scum

[Fykus]

Maybe ts has another concussion

Or maybe I don't play when it's 5am for me

sorry, no need to be cranky

[Fykus]

VOTE: ville

What do you mean? Ville wasnt l-1 were they?

This is everywhere he mentioned Ville in his ISO.

lol, that happened because i was on my phone and didnt take notice of the new vote requirement to lynch. but anyway, it all worked out for the best because ville turned out to be scum.

[Fykus]

a few days? just vote grey and if he flips town then rc is scum. gg no re

[Fykus]

I didn't really care about whether the slot was empty or not because I thought that it was scum. I 'claim' that I would have waited to scumread the replacement for what they DID because I like to have a solid case on my partner when I bus which I definitely did not during this game but *shrug*. I question whether Fykus would have coached that Tracker claim, which feels coached.

I think we both know that I wouldn't of been smart enough to pull something like that off in my first game. Hell, if I were scum I'd have killed grey the first chance I could. I didn't even notice FF's PR claim on day one until someone pointed it out. Even then, I still would have killed grey n1 because hes been a dick to me this entire game. Going for the PR n1 is most definitely an experienced players move i.e grey. Seriously, go back and reread all my posts and try to tell me I somehow masterminded this entire game and somehow "framed" grey into looking like confscum on the 2nd day.

[Fykus]

I didn't catch you being scum it was RC who did that. In the beginning it was your shitty attitude that rang alarm bells for me.

[Fykus]

Wheres nydus

[Fykus]

If you lynch me then there is only 1 more chance to win the game after that. Dont waste it on me.

[Fykus]

Scum is either grey or rc, i dont know where you got ts from in that calculation.
As for greys evidence, look at all of rc's posts with evidence on grey at the end of day 2 and then look at greys posts earlier today when he thought he was about to be lynched. The dude was squealing like a pig caught in a trap. He even started the age old "fine then, lynch me see what I care" even though back on day 1 when both me and jack said it when we had wagons on us he told us that saying something like that is scummy as fuck.

As for RC's evidence, its a bit more convoluted but its there. Give me an hour or so though cause i gotta go get breakfast and whatnot first because its going to be a very long post. In the meantime explain your TS read for me.

[Fykus]

My drama? What about the way you carried on for about 5 pages after this day started until you found a post I made that you could cling to and try to twist your way out of getting lynched?

[Fykus]

theres nothing left to solve grey. you're the only scum left and thats that.

[Fykus]

For what its worth (inb4 "this makes fykus undoubtably scum lets lynch him today") this was villes first/second mafia game. Me and em are both on another website which has forum games of bastard mafia. During that game e joined this game and ended up flipping town. They were townie on the other game so I find it highly unlikely e knew to claim one of the PRs on here. E was definitely coached.

[Fykus]

What makes you think tier is scum

[Fykus]

ALSo, I read a lot on my phone, please refrain from walls of meaningless text so I can actually read things without being at risk of carpal tunnel

Pretty sure we've come to the conclusion that ville was coached.

[Fykus]

Not sure if theres any relevance but nydus was jailed on n1 by moogs.

[Fykus]

Fish where art thou?

[Fykus]

I cant see TS coming on anytime soon so fuck it. We're gonna have some investigating yomoz if this flips green.

VOTE: nydus

[Fykus]

Gg guys. I seriously thought that grey had to be scum. Failing that i would have went for rc. Just goes to show that ive got a shitload to learn about the game.

Any tips for me going forward?

[Fykus]

All the stuff you pointed out about grey seemed legit buthen on the flip side i thought you could of orchestrated the day 2 lynch to make yourself town or something lol.

[Fykus]

Ill admit that i never once considered pep or nydus as scummy. I guess they just seemed really neutral to me whereas rc and grey stood out the most because of their attitudes (grey especially). Thats something ill definately work on from now on.

[Fykus]

Yeah it could have been a combination of both. I remember on day 1 i was convinced ts was scum because of his constant questions and lack on information.

[Fykus]

Any chance of the mafia thread being posted?

[Fykus]

thanks