Open 672: Friends and Enemies and Enemies: Music on a whim

[ThinkBig]

4 more Lowell votes plz.

[ThinkBig]

Lining up lynches: Lowell and then Joey

[Lowell]

Everyone stop listening to TB and calm down. Lowell isn't scum, and I doubt joey is either.

[Superhans]

Lining up lynches: Lowell and then Joey

no don't do that. lining up lynches are never ever ever right.

[Lowell]

Also only now do I realize the perils in outing a mason in this setup. Namely, what if the mason tunnels and is terrible?

So, ironically, I now disagree with my former self.

[Revan]

ThinkBig why is Laud town?

[Big Lungs DK]

It doesn't matter why TB TRs anyone anymore, none of his TRs will be lynched since he's claimed Mason

[Big Lungs DK]

oh shit I forgot about the thing I saw last night before bed

[Big Lungs DK]

Hey everyone!

*winks at Superhans*

1. What's your favorite open setup? Anything multiball!
2. What is your favorite/least favorite role? Favorite: Any town with killing ability. Least favorite: Miller
3. Do you prefer town or scum? Town in a game with one scum faction, scum in a game with two or more scum factions.

Why did you wink at Superhans here?

[cassielle]

Oh, good, so I wasn't the only person who thought Lowell looked like scum there!

I do think it's important to say that town can benefit from helping to coordinate scum NKs in a multiball setup, but I think that it should be considered a scumtell in this case because it only works if town is subtle about it. Lowell practically jumped up and down screeching it there.

@Lowell, your counterargument to my post WRT your Realeo scumread (539) was a transparent deflection and it made you look worse.

1: Transparently calling out for scum NK coordination. Let's say this is NAI for now, because the remaining two are, in my eyes, more damning.
2: "Realeo seems like a smart guy. He's trying to figure out what to do." is blatantly NAI. Town can be smart, Town had better be trying to figure out what to do. In other words: misrepresentation of intelligence and tactical play as AI. Everyone had better be dumb or else they are definitely scum. Catchy, but godawful play.
3: "One of the scumteams ought to kill him." after you voted him suggests you want to waste a town lynch on someone you think is (or should be) an obvious NK target for scum. That is a pro-scum play: wanting to make the only weapon Town has misfire. Even if it hits scum, it's a slot that you think is a goner anyhow, so you should know this is a horrible lynch target.

There's also the gem of 552:

Everyone stop listening to TB and calm down. Lowell isn't scum, and I doubt joey is either.

I can't speak for everyone else, but I personally did not once "listen to" TB. I made my own reads based on my own view of the game without sheeping anyone else's reasoning.
That, the "everybody sheepin' TB!" thing, that was Joey_'s deflection tactic when people were wagoning him.
You're sticking your neck out to save a slot widely considered scummy town. Joey_, the slot whose deflection tactic you just borrowed.

So you've just tied yourself to Joey_.

Your vote sits on Realeo, who you have suggested would best be left to flip by way of NK. Meanwhile you cast shade at anyone examining your slot by implying they are all sheeping TB, and defend a slot who was under little pressure (widely townread despite town agreeing it was incredibly scummy play, in fact), indeed, a slot whose wagon had lost momentum and whose critics had turned their eyes elsewhere.

On top of this you claim that good NAI play is scummy WRT Realeo, transparently talk about coordinating NKs, intend to push a lynch which you claim should get NKed anyway -- which, if it succeeded, would deny town the chance to nail two scum with one lynch -- and have no real defense for your actions except for the aforementioned shade casting/sheepvote implicating.

VOTE: Lowell

[Lowell]

Oh, shit, I'm tied to joey!

[Lowell]

More realeo votes, please. A scumteam is going to rue the day you killed me instead of him.

[ThinkBig]

More Lowell votes please.

[ThinkBig]

Why is real scum?

[Lowell]

Honestly, cass, your case on me is tedious. It feels like you looked around, thought, "hmm, who is a safe bandwagon", then reverse-engineered a ponderous case from nothing. I can't respond to any of it because it is all just too much. My case on realeo is bad so I'm scum. I'm setting up lynches so I'm scum. Something something joey. That's some preponderance of evidence.

[Lowell]

Why is real scum?

Real is scum because of the way he responded to your claim. While others were all "OMG joey is the WORST OMG" or, "meh, I don't know, but actually might not be that bad," realeo stayed out of the fray and had a too-polished response. His post about why outing mason isn't so bad bleeds with frustration.

[Lowell]

And I propose NKing real only because frankly I don't think I have the juice to get him killed today. Yes, obviously I'd rather him die today. And he more or less claimed not mason, so wtf is the harm if I'm wrong.

[Lowell]

I'd also kill cass, though.

[cassielle]

There's those things and the fact you didn't actually respond to my criticism of your read, you deflected. You never responded to anyone who criticized you in fact, you just waved vaguely in the direction of TB and muttered something about sheeping.

There's also the fact that you weren't just "setting up a lynch", you were setting up a lynch on a slot you expect to be killed anyway. Consider: if you trust your reasoning there you know that that slot will flip even if town lynches another slot. Ergo: Town lynching another slot is better, because twice the information and twice the chance of hitting scum. Therefore: Continuing to sit on that slot and push its wagon is denying town a better lynch. QED.

And the fact that you colored "being a good Mafia (as in the game) player" as "being scum". That's a big one there, if anyone buys into it, it makes town distrust anyone who shows good play.

p-edit: If you don't think you can get him killed, you should try to draw AI content out of him or look at another slot. There are four scum in this game, that's three players who (if you are town AND correct) you could be leading a lynch on instead of sitting your vote somewhere functionally pointless by your own admission.

[Revan]

Why wouldn't Laud get lynched?

I winked at Hans because I'm in a game with him right now.

[Lowell]

1- even if I were scum I would still be scumhunting (probably even moreso), so I'm not sure what you're saying with the last point. I have two suspects I like, I'm not going to abandon them without reason.
2- you specifically and deliberately "tied" me to joey. if that's not setting up lynches I don't know what is.
3- realeo being good at mafia means he's less likely to get lynched unless someone (i.e. me) tries to powerlynch him. otherwise we all just sit around limply targetting whoever looks weakest at that moment.

[Big Lungs DK]

More realeo votes, please. A scumteam is going to rue the day you killed me instead of him.

Laud, realeo, cassielle and I aren't getting lynched anytime soon unless TB flips something besides mason, because we're his townreads which makes us possibly masons unless TB flips something besides mason. After all the masons are dead/outed we can lynch in that pool but until then it's not going to happen

[Big Lungs DK]

@mod

- Also it's been 3d21h since nebula posted, not even a prodge to say he'd catch up or anything, can we get a prod on him? I know it's the weekend but he posted in another game and it's been over 72 hrs (a number some mods use as an extended weekend timer, although I just checked and there is no such prod timer extension in this game)

[Laudandus]

Nebula's been prodded at least once already

Realeo, Big Lungs DK, and Superhans I'm pretty confident are town based on the way they reacted to the TB mason claim

I don't know if scum are in Alban/Tenshii/Nebula. I think all 3 are NAI lurking. Assuming all three are scum strikes me as lazy, but I do think it's extremely likely that 1-2 scum are in there

I like Lowell and Joey for scum because they don't seem primarily concerned with not lynching masons, which from a town perspective seems to me by far the strongest tell we have available. Revan is so omega tunneled on me that he actually looks a bit townier than those two.

VOTE: Lowell

[ThinkBig]

2 more votes to make Lowell swing from a tree.