Mini 1898 - Inception Mafia - The Hub (GAME OVER)

[Not Chara]

i'm glad this ended when it did because i could lose internet for 24 hours tomorrow.

[Neko Tail]

That's something i will explain when I arrive at school (really gotta leave)

Basically we had to adjust the setup because it was unwinnable for scum
It was unfair modifying the setup during the game, and probably a bastard action, but Tbone gave us permission if we believed it made the game unplayable

So we gave scum a 20% perception vig
1shot

[Infinity 324]

Gj gerry, you fooled all of us. Still think the setup was very townsided, if scum was townread that widely in a normal game there's no way town could've won.

[MathBlade]

that might've helped, it was a good environment to slip in as it was.

go town for winning.
i was wrong on all of Mathblade, Hiraki, and gerry. stellar play, Chara.

how'd scum kill BTD?

Factional ability given to us halfway through the game. Pretty much if we left BTD6 alive it was no longer Mafia.

Good eyes on the slip Not Chara. I was kinda hoping you'd forget.

[Not Chara]

like, all of my reads were wrong and i was one of the unviersal townreads. i have to reevaluate for later games. basically, i can't meta math as town just for being disagreeable, i should have realized Hiraki's apology over his mistake was too much and seemed to be damage control, and i shouldn't have let gerry coast just because of an early townread.

that we won besides that does indicate how townsided it was. possibly. though i know other people had better reads than i did. i thought it wasn't but just a small grouping of town completely destroyed it. the only kill scum got off was on someone who no one actually trusted, and was only alive due to their claim.

[MathBlade]

I knew if I killed BTD6 it was a scum claim either way so I stalled for time arguing cop shit when I knew I was going to be checked I was just trying to eat time. The more fighting there was the harder it was to read. Then when I got caught I wanted to make sure you all knew I liked you <3

[MathBlade]

I think if maybe I hadn't have slipped Hiraki and Gerry could have ran it tbh.

[Infinity 324]

I think this setup is a good example of how if the mechanics are too complicated it takes away from the game. Even if it was balanced (which would be very hard to do with a setup this complex), we were focusing too much on mechanics instead of scumhunting. I think we were right to do so, but it just made the game less fun imo.

[MathBlade]

I did the results as a last ditch effort but it was more just stalling at that point.

[Not Chara]

Gj gerry, you fooled all of us. Still think the setup was very townsided, if scum was townread that widely in a normal game there's no way town could've won.

changing the rules midgame to give that poor team a chance also indicates that.
scum would've benefited from factional abilities from the start. especially since the only barrier in front of the cop was perception and a single miller/godfather. and there were a lot of ways to deal with perception.

[MathBlade]

I think this setup is a good example of how if the mechanics are too complicated it takes away from the game. Even if it was balanced (which would be very hard to do with a setup this complex), we were focusing too much on mechanics instead of scumhunting. I think we were right to do so, but it just made the game less fun imo.

Agreed. Honestly I think a cop in the setup broke it.

This would have been great flipless mafia otherwise. Seriously I was telling the truth about all that.

[Not Chara]

I think this setup is a good example of how if the mechanics are too complicated it takes away from the game. Even if it was balanced (which would be very hard to do with a setup this complex), we were focusing too much on mechanics instead of scumhunting. I think we were right to do so, but it just made the game less fun imo.

yeah we spent a lot more time arguing about optimal strategy instead of scumhunting. it was pretty draining.

having us lose if the deadline went through also added a

lot

to the stress. feels a bit like a bandaid to give scum a chance instead of a mechanic?

[MathBlade]

I may mod a hardcore (flipless) VT Heaven game here soon actually. Back to roots I think would be good for MS and would rope in new people.

[Infinity 324]

I think if you maybe took out one of the mechanics (what would it be like if you couldn't kick for example?) and gave scum factional powers I might play this game again. I like the idea of it being difficult but not impossible to get flips.

[Not Chara]

Factional ability given to us halfway through the game. Pretty much if we left BTD6 alive it was no longer Mafia.

Good eyes on the slip Not Chara. I was kinda hoping you'd forget.

i'm surprised no one else picked it up.

i'm not usually an advocate for slips but that one didn't have any other explanation. i think if you'd left it there instead of posting "but if you can, don't post it" i would have been way less confident of it even being a real (or faked) slip.

[MathBlade]

I think this setup is a good example of how if the mechanics are too complicated it takes away from the game. Even if it was balanced (which would be very hard to do with a setup this complex), we were focusing too much on mechanics instead of scumhunting. I think we were right to do so, but it just made the game less fun imo.

yeah we spent a lot more time arguing about optimal strategy instead of scumhunting. it was pretty draining.

having us lose if the deadline went through also added a

lot

to the stress. feels a bit like a bandaid to give scum a chance instead of a mechanic?

I think the game was true to inception as limited time exists in dreams.

If there wasn't a cop I think people would have had to focus on hunting. Which ironically probably would mean Town loss.

[MathBlade]

Factional ability given to us halfway through the game. Pretty much if we left BTD6 alive it was no longer Mafia.

Good eyes on the slip Not Chara. I was kinda hoping you'd forget.

i'm surprised no one else picked it up.

i'm not usually an advocate for slips but that one didn't have any other explanation. i think if you'd left it there instead of posting "but if you can, don't post it" i would have been way less confident of it even being a real (or faked) slip.

I actually came up with an idea namely that I was actually talking with EAP and context was off. It would still be a scum claim but then decided against it and let it run because by then new dream thread when I came up with the idea.

[MathBlade]

Factional ability given to us halfway through the game. Pretty much if we left BTD6 alive it was no longer Mafia.

Good eyes on the slip Not Chara. I was kinda hoping you'd forget.

i'm surprised no one else picked it up.

i'm not usually an advocate for slips but that one didn't have any other explanation. i think if you'd left it there instead of posting "but if you can, don't post it" i would have been way less confident of it even being a real (or faked) slip.

Yeah we were talking out where to go on certain things and I just fucked up.

[MathBlade]

I am okay with releasing scum PT FYI

[Not Chara]

when Hiraki responded the way he did to the slip, it almost discouraged me from pursuing it any further due to potential embarrassment. if i'd been in a vacuum with no other players to give feedback i might have backed down.

considering how we had the game one with like 3 conftown, however, i'm not sure it would have mattered. but Hiraki going to limbo instead of being main thread lynched would have added some uncertainty and no conf-town Leonshade, so maybe not.

speaking of, McMenno's role was too powerful. in town hands it immediately made him impossible for scum to lynch, and if he hit suspicion later he could just die and bring someone else back.

i did like my role a lot. pity we didn't lynch at all until we were lynching

everyone

at once, or i would have gotten to use it.

[MathBlade]

No hard feelings for trolling y'all?

You did great Not Chara Town MVP. IMHO. Your reads were wrong originally but you led Town really well.

[Leonshade]

Oh, I was right on Infinity after all haha.

There were some really unique and interesting ideas in this setup, but by the time we got down to one scum, winning was pretty much inevitable. Maybe it's a matter of results bias, but it seems like this setup can be won by getting a handful of strong townreads and killing everyone else. I'd be interested in playing a similar setup again (the idea of entering someone's subconscious would be really fitting for a game based on flavor like Psychonauts or Persona), but nightless plus infinite lynches is pretty town-sided.

[MathBlade]

I agree with townsidedness. I just hope I made it fun for everyone. <3
No hard feelings Leonshade?

[Not Chara]

no, that was Almost. ;> i only helped by being trustworthy. no idea why this game was the one where that happened.

no hard feelings, it was fun. but next time don't do it until you're dead and flipped. it convinced me that the cop on you was correct. otherwise i might've gotten it in my head to try and help you, and doubt the slip too.

[gerryoat]

this was fun but like impossible to win, i think i was townread well though. i wish we had stronger abilities, really. thanks for hosting, scout and dunn! if there is another that's more balanced, i'd definitely join!