Open 55 - Vanilla 2:10 (Abandoned) before 542

[destructor]

I have a better idea. How about we play the game instead of voting based on bullshit metareasons! Yeah!

What are the bullshit meta reasons? I want to know if you or Flameaxe are scum but you're both being evasive. Why would townies need to be evasive? They wouldn't.

I will be seriously pissed if these guys skate through as scum just because we have all got used to not taking them seriously in anything that they do.

This is one of things I don't like about metagaming. Having a consistently anti-town or scummy playstyle shouldn't be an excuse to not get lynched for it.

Also, Lowell need some pressure. He hasn't really done much this game either.

[Lowell]

unvote, vote flameaxe

. Almost exclusively for meta reasons. I've seen him play as town, and I don't buy this performance as the same guy.

[pwayne66]

Also, Lowell need some pressure.

Before or after we lynch FA? He seems to want to wait until after.

[Skruffs]

Flameaxe: Saying town can be a dick as much as scum is not a good defense. Perhaps a better response would be not acting like a dick. AKA : Don't pull the Battle Mage defense. Or I will call you Battle Mage and try to get you lynched constantly.

Also, I'm a day-miller.

Also: Don't ridicule people for not scum hunting; I believe you refuse to scum hunt as a policy.

Elmo:
I started the wifom? I beg to differ. I called out what Pwayne was doing by makign it openly obvious. I was pretty sure one of us would be killed after that, which was fine - someone had to go. But PWayne definitely instigated it by trying to reason that if I died during the night it would look bad on him; pwayne as scum would want to kill me more than others in the first place after mini 499, so i was pretty suspicious of that.


avinashv: JDodge, Flameaxe, and to a lesser extent PEG are not going to be helpful. They demand that everyone else scum hutn for them and then ridicule them when they do. Ignore them, and pretend you are a private eye, deep in the seedy underbelly of a scum cartel. The only person you can rely on is yourself.


destructor: you attacked me day 1 for wantign to bandwagon onto players that other players wanted to meta on, but now you want to do that on jdodge. At least, I'm pretty sure it was you who was suspicious of my rampant bandwagoning. Why the change?

JDodge:

I have a better idea. How about we play the game instead of voting based on bullshit metareasons! Yeah!

vs

I'm fine with the deadline, it doesn't look like this town is going to pick up until they get close to lynch or lose anyways.

So does anyone have any policy-lynches they would like to advocate, it being day one?

I would like to be an advocate for the "lynch ryan" foundation. Remember this Tuesday when you head to the polls to vote for the right person - vote ryan: and keep him from fucking up

America

???

Fos : Destructor, JDodge

[pwayne66]

pwayne as scum would want to kill me more than others in the first place after mini 499, so i was pretty suspicious of that.

pwayne as scum would have nked you without feeling obligated to WIFOM the situation one iota. You had already cleared my game play and nobody else here was in mini 499 that I need preapologize to, making my attempt to "WIFOM your death" decidedly anti- pwayne scum.

[Flameaxe]

unvote, vote flameaxe

. Almost exclusively for meta reasons. I've seen him play as town, and I don't buy this performance as the same guy.

Where was this?

[Flameaxe]

Also,

Vote: BBM

Never cared about this game. Still don't. Y'all are fucking retards who need to use a brain.

I'm out.

[avinashv]

I agree Lowell has been acting a little strange, but whether Flameaxe is scum or not, I'd like to see him lynched. If he's scum (and you can't deny that he is playing very scummy), then fantastic, otherwise that's one less idiot we need to handle. I think that after one lynch and a night where roles can be used (if any) we will have more to go on.

What's a day-miller? Is that someone who shows guilty when investigated during the day? Or is there some other trait?

[avinashv]

Oh, and where's TylerJ? Don't think I've seen him post in a few days...

[Flameaxe]

I agree Lowell has been acting a little strange, but whether Flameaxe is scum or not, I'd like to see him lynched. If he's scum (and you can't deny that he is playing very scummy), then fantastic, otherwise that's one less idiot we need to handle. I think that after one lynch and a night where roles can be used (if any) we will have more to go on.

What's a day-miller? Is that someone who shows guilty when investigated during the day? Or is there some other trait?

A day-miller was a role I mentioned in scumchat one day.

I would like you to outline my scummy play as well. Like I told destructor: I say that when you make a claim, its often a good thing to back it up.

[pwayne66]

^^I already did this... try reading...

[pwayne66]

...wait...what?

[avinashv]

Outline your scummy play? Apart from the fact that it has already been done several times, you aren't making any effort to play pro-town.

Mod: Vote count on this page, please.

[Flameaxe]

pwayne: as I said in #308, I felt that, especially in D1, you were riding general sentiment and posting to provoke reaction without really giving any valuable feedback. There was a long string of posts where you just voted, unvoted, voted etc. etc. over and over again, all without any reasoning.

Flameaxe: don't spoil it for other people; play the game like a jackass and you'll get called out for it. Maybe you're just playing like an idiot; there are too many lurkers to know for sure, but all I know is that more so than anyone here, you are playing most anti-town.

pwayne; I'm going to let you off the hook for a bit:

Unvote; Vote: Flameaxe[\b].

I see nothing outlined here.

[avinashv]

I thought you were out? Why do you care?

[Flameaxe]

I thought you were out? Why do you care?

Because I'm not letting you by without actually putting up a case past the point of "he's scummy, it's obvious". If it was that obvious, why haven't you posted it yet?

[JDodge]

Flameaxe: Saying town can be a dick as much as scum is not a good defense. Perhaps a better response would be not acting like a dick. AKA : Don't pull the Battle Mage defense. Or I will call you Battle Mage and try to get you lynched constantly.

Also: Don't ridicule people for not scum hunting; I believe you refuse to scum hunt as a policy.

i agree

JDodge:

I have a better idea. How about we play the game instead of voting based on bullshit metareasons! Yeah!

vs

I'm fine with the deadline, it doesn't look like this town is going to pick up until they get close to lynch or lose anyways.

So does anyone have any policy-lynches they would like to advocate, it being day one?

I would like to be an advocate for the "lynch ryan" foundation. Remember this Tuesday when you head to the polls to vote for the right person - vote ryan: and keep him from fucking up

America

???

Fos : Destructor, JDodge

[/quote]

this is where we learn the difference between "joke" and "serious time"

[Skruffs]

Wow, backtracking.
I've never seen JDodge do this before, I don't know how to handle it...

[JDodge]

I have a better idea. How about we play the game instead of voting based on bullshit metareasons! Yeah!

What are the bullshit meta reasons? I want to know if you or Flameaxe are scum but you're both being evasive. Why would townies need to be evasive? They wouldn't.

You see, I would like this time to tell you the wonders of something called "metagaming".

This "metagaming" is when you go back and look on past behaviours to see what someone would do as town and as scum. The main issue here is that Flameaxe, as a general rule, is never in any way helpful as scum or as town. This would indicate that any unhelpfulness is at most a nulltell. Now, you assume (and I assume that this is because you are fairly new) that any behaviour that you would find scummy in a vacuum will be a good indicator of scumminess. I call this two-dimensional playing. If we were playing in a vacuum, where only town players committed certain tells and only scum players committed others, then this would be good.

However when you remember that you are playing against human beings, and not against robots, you realize that in any given circumstance someone may act in a manner contrary to what you would normally perceive to be scummy - this is when looking at past behaviours comes in handy as in most cases people will tend towards at least one thing as scum. I know one very reliable tell for Flameaxe-town that I have not seen committed yet, and no I will not tell you what it is. However, with no concrete

scum

tell, I cannot - and will not - commit to his wagon as I feel it is based solely on his own playstyle.

And as you can see, I like to lurk when things get boring.

[Flameaxe]

I have a town-tell? Really? Snap.

unvote

also. I'm waiting on that newbie guy.

[destructor]

Yes, I'm advocating Flame's lynch based on his playstyle in this game. Like I said, I don't see the fact that he's consistent about it to be a reason not to lynch him. I probably wouldn't be so ruthless about this if we weren't playing an open mountainous game where if we're going to mislynch, it's best we do it on the weakest links, which is what will logically happen anyway, so long as the town plays well.

I don't believe there are universal scum-tells and understand why people metagame and how it's useful, but my stance on Flameaxe isn't about the metagame anyway. He's being evasive, unhelpful and so by proxy scummy or at the very least extremely anti-town. How is this

not

a reason to support his lynch?

His self-vote was ridiculous. If he's town, he was sabotaging the game and should have just gotten himself replaced. Otherwise, he's scum. But he's unvoted now and is apparently staying in. If he keeps his current behaviour in this game up, I'll keep my vote on him.

[destructor]

destructor: you attacked me day 1 for wantign to bandwagon onto players that other players wanted to meta on, but now you want to do that on jdodge. At least, I'm pretty sure it was you who was suspicious of my rampant bandwagoning. Why the change?

There has been no change. I'm not metaing anyone. I assume you're talking about ryan. His contribution to the game had not been negative. He was perceptibly playing the game, asking questions, generating content. This perception has been notably absent from both JDodge's and Flameaxe's play. I'm throwing Lowell in there too.

[avinashv]

Flameaxe: read pwayne's posts. I never said

I

made those points, just that they had been made.

Furthermore, Flameaxe, whichever newbie you're referring to, whether it is me or someone else, has a name.

And if you're out, then for god's sake contact the mod and get a replacement. As destructor said, his self-vote and town sabotaging (and this assuming his

playstyle

contradicts the fact that he is town) meant that he should be lynched or replaced.

[Flameaxe]

Flameaxe: read pwayne's posts. I never said

I

made those points, just that they had been made.

Furthermore, Flameaxe, whichever newbie you're referring to, whether it is me or someone else, has a name.

And if you're out, then for god's sake contact the mod and get a replacement. As destructor said, his self-vote and town sabotaging (and this assuming his

playstyle

contradicts the fact that he is town) meant that he should be lynched or replaced.

So you're admitting to not scumhunting, and riding other's scumhunting. Thanks, but I wanted YOU to outline it for a reason, so stop being a lazy ass, newbie.

[avinashv]

(1) Being an asshole - there's no good pro-town reason to do that. If you're town, then you're calling attention to yourself and letting the real scum stay out of the way and survive another day. It's stupid--whether you're town or not, it's worth lynching so that you don't disrupt the game any further.
(2) Bringing past prejudices into this game - same reasons as above.
(3) Bullshit day-cop claims.
(4) No-reason votes or trying to start BW (Feb 01, your 10th post, Feb 23, your 15th post).

Get off your damn high horse. And get replaced, or play the game properly. You don't want to be here, and very few people want you here with the way you are playing right now.