17 Kilos of Cocaine - [GAME OVER]

[FakeGod]

VoteCount 1.13

Bins [3] - Ginngie, Bulbazak, Kagami
Firebringer [1] - xyzzy
Ellibereth [3] - Spiffeh, Bins, Cephrir
ActionDan [1] - grapes
chesskid3 [1] - xRECKONERx
Ginngie [1] - WhemeStar
xyzzy [2] - Firebringer, Wickedestjr
Wickedestjr [4] - hitogoroshi, Ellibereth, ActionDan, chesskid3

Not Voting [1]

- Desperado

With 17 alive it takes 9 votes to lynch.

Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2017-09-28 08:00:00)

[ActionDan]

The Vount count. It beckons me.

For all must become 3

VOTE: Xzzxy

[Kagami]

Nah.

VOTE: Wickedestjr

Btw, I had been reading this name as "wickedjester" the entire game.

[chesskid3]

It's not? lmao mod even took my vote: jester

[Wickedestjr]

It is clear that there are a lot of people who are unfamiliar with my play style. I'll do the meta work for you all using my two most recent town games. Hopefully this is followed by some un-votes.

Wickjestr catchup is horrible btw

This game with so many solidly justice players and you have 4 townreads and they're mostly gut? Nah man.

See this:

Spoiler: this

I don't think I can support a Suzune lynch anymore.

FA can be town, I like Radiant's meta point.
Hinduragi and Reck both seemed townish.
My gut/past experience says that Red is town here.
Suzune has seemed pretty genuine the last few days.
TheDominator has been incredibly useless, but I can't see him playing that way as cult. I could support a lynch on him as punishment for his poor effort (if he's cult, I don't want to let him get away with doing nothing) but my gun to head read is town.

That leaves Radiant, who I haven't seen anything alignment indicative from, and ika, who has bothered me for reasons that I've already given.

If it's not ika, then I'm going to

Unvote. Vote: RadiantCowbells

.

This was my entire rational behind voting a player 20+ pages into an eight player game. I'm very much a feel player. I don't believe that people commonly make blatant errors and my gut has just worked out better for me in the past. Case in point RadiantCowbells was the scum in that game. You'll see the quote I'm giving Kagami also illustrates this aspect of my play style.

Why on earth did you list players alphabetically within groups, jestr?

Why not? Does it really matter who's 11th as opposed to 12th on my scum list? Alphabetical is just what I felt like doing. I broke it up into three categories, I voted the person that I suspect the most, and I've already provided more of my thoughts than several players in this game. Here:

Spoiler: Check out this

DiamondSentinel - leaning town.
Klingoncelt - neutral. Agree that her reads list was bad, but that doesn't necessarily mean she's scum.
ErrantParabola - neutral. Unlikely that I'll develop a read on him before his post restriction is removed.
The Cool Cucumbers - neutral.
Drunken Pirates - slight town lean. I disagree with a lot of what they've been saying in-thread, but that doesn't mean they are scum, they at least seem to genuinely believe what they're saying
Yimmy - neutral.
Drixx - neutral.
Rylai and Lina - leaning town. Rylai's play early on felt off for some reason but I feel good about her after reading the last 20 pages or so, haven't seen anything particularly telling from Lina
Skybird - slight town lean. Gut.
Albert B. Rampage - strong town.
CooLDoG - slight town lean.
DrippingGoofball - neutral.
MaxwellPuckett - slight town lean. Some of his posts in the first 20 pages or so gave me town vibes - I quoted them. Looking forward to seeing more from him.
Yosarian2 - neutral. I'm honestly not sure why so many people are strong town reading him, because he's probably capable of everything that he's done here if he's scum. I agree with a lot of the opinions that he has given and kinda liked his reaction to Drixx's "I'll give you the rings when you town-tell". But he's still somebody that I'm cautious in reading.
Lowkey - strong town.
Fluminator - neutral. The desire for hammers seems like a null tell, I think anyone trying to paint that as scummy needs to rethink it. The "not miller" claim is a slight town tell if anything and I think anyone trying to paint that as scummy needs to rethink it. He might be town just because of his poorly justified bandwagon, but I'm not sure yet. I've correctly strong town read him in the past and it bothers me a little bit that I'm not reaching that same conclusion yet. Looking forward to seeing more from him too.
Sensei - slight town lean. I agree that his comment regarding the DP links might be a town slip. Haven't seen anything else particularly telling from him.
ZZZX - strong town. Almost entirely based on gut/meta that I'd struggle to articulate. He seems convincingly relaxed - doesn't feel like he's trying to earn town credit.
ArcAngel9 - scummy. She felt weirdly confident in her Flum vote. She's kinda flown under the radar (even when she was posting) and I haven't seen much from her to indicate genuine interest in scum hunting.

That was 60+ pages into a game. Chesskid notice that I only have three strong town reads in that post. Kagami notice that the reads list is ordered by playerlist. It's very similar to the reads list that I posted in this thread in that you can't see every position, I just didn't sort the players by category. When I'm playing a game with players that I'm either unfamiliar with or haven't played with in a long time (I've been on hiatus for a year and a half ish), then it takes me time to figure out reads. I'm not going to bother sorting every single position because it's day 1, it's completely unnecessary, and I had half a dozen people breathing down my neck to produce content.

More specifically, it's a little weird how little stock he puts in his townreads town and scum reads. Of course, someone being town doesn't mean they're right, but usually in practice it's at least kind of correlated that you think someone is town based on their reads. But he's got bulbas scum read in town, bulbas town reads in neutral, Bins top scum read in neutral (she's on Elli now but was really vs Ginngie at time of posting)...I guess Spiffeh's reads are stale and despes reads never existed so really it's mostly just Bulba that caught my eye here.

Here's a very relevant comment of mine from my last town game:

Spoiler: Comment of mine

you have no reason to think that I'm easily manipulated. For what it's worth, I'm actually a very independent player - I almost never hydra, never vote someone just because I'm told to (barring deadline), and reach most of my conclusions on my own.

I have had to explain that in multiple games and if you looked at my town meta, you'd probably see that I'm oftentimes not following the crowd. I'm the only person that I know is town, so I follow my own instincts. And when I'm reading other players' arguments, my town read on them has no influence on whether I am convinced by the argument or not. I determine if the argument is valid based on the argument itself. I believe that Bulbazak is town and I believe that he is a smart player, but I don't agree with all his reads. If his reads are more accurate than mine, then he can convince me of that by making a case that convinces me, not just by virtue of looking like town.

[Wickedestjr]

I really don't like giving xyzzy a free pass here. He has given one scum read, one town read, and he has yet to justify his current vote. I'll switch to Elli if nobody is interested in pressuring him, but he needs to do more.

[Wickedestjr]

Oh. I guess he's actually getting as much pressure as everyone else, thanks to Dan. Forgot that he and FB were voting with me.

[Ellibereth]

dan stop pretending to be a poet and switch back

[Kagami]

There's a pretty big difference between playerorder and alphabetical.

The former means that you copy and pasted the list in the OP, and used that to be sure you didn't miss anyone. The latter means that you copy and pasted the playerlist, then deliberately rearranged the list of players in a way that is objectively systematic after placing them into bins, which doesn't have any obvious motivation beyond the desire to eliminate any order-based interpretation.

[Ellibereth]

we'll need 4 more after dan gets back.

gingie, bulba, grapes, and wheme lets go.

[Wickedestjr]

I have OCD

[Ginngie]

VOTE: jester

I'm out to eat and left before I finished a big post

Talk later

[ActionDan]

Why on earth did you list players alphabetically within groups, jestr?

Nah.

VOTE: Wickedestjr

Btw, I had been reading this name as "wickedjester" the entire game.

There's a pretty big difference between playerorder and alphabetical.

The former means that you copy and pasted the list in the OP, and used that to be sure you didn't miss anyone. The latter means that you copy and pasted the playerlist, then deliberately rearranged the list of players in a way that is objectively systematic after placing them into bins, which doesn't have any obvious motivation beyond the desire to eliminate any order-based interpretation.

Are you for real?

Is there a reality where these posts exist together?

I guess I'm living it.

VOTE: Kagami

Oh Elli wants me on estjr. Sure I'll listen to a guy that wants me dead d2 or something. Or is that Chesskid.

W/e

VOTE: Wicked

[Wickedestjr]

There's a pretty big difference between playerorder and alphabetical.

The former means that you copy and pasted the list in the OP, and used that to be sure you didn't miss anyone. The latter means that you copy and pasted the playerlist, then deliberately rearranged the list of players in a way that is objectively systematic after placing them into bins, which doesn't have any obvious motivation beyond the desire to eliminate any order-based interpretation.

See this one: viewtopic.php?p=7462736#p7462736

Alphabetical. Three categories. I was town.

[ActionDan]

Actually

Brilliant idea

Just came to me

VOTE: Grapes

[Ellibereth]

[ActionDan]

Can you explain his absence?

I can't.

Therefore he must be scum

[Kagami]

Ok, fair enough.

I was pointing out something that struck me as oddly deliberate in what is theoretically an organic readslist, AD.

The most town thing wicked has said thus far is "thanks to Dan" in 906.

[Kagami]

fair enough was re: 913

[ActionDan]

Aware of your point. But it looked like you voted him for that regardless of content (not that I read it past my own portion).

[Wickedestjr]

Kigami why are you voting me if not for my 'ordering' ?

[Kagami]

No, but I wanted an explanation for that. The town explanation I was expecting was something along the lines of "I take notes in excel or whatever and had them sorted already" rather than "look, I sort things, here's an example of me sorting in a very common way: playerlist order." The example given in 913 is sufficient to demonstrate that that's just a quirk of his, however.

[ActionDan]

even if he had replied the second way without an example attached, that would be sufficient for a scum read?

The funny thing is based on your thought process here Grapes would call you town for it. Because you asked a question with a clear "town answer"/"scum answer" in mind.

Oh grapes.

How I miss him.

---

But yeah, still boggles the mind.

[Kagami]

Are you reading the game, AD?

[Wickedestjr]

Oh Elli wants me on

estjr

.

That's a new one lol

Also, I can't tell if the "thanks to Dan" comment is serious or just a cute way of saying that I haven't said anything townish.