Large Normal 247 - Postgame

[Enchant]

VOTE: Oblivion


I stand by RM+Psyche solve as two towns.

Why oblivion first? Not gonna hide it, i am petty. There's really no difference in order which we vote.

[Oblivion]

VOTE: Enchant

This slot was in a possible bussing slot on Ranger (Titus) especially with RN being probably town and was pushing away from Gera on day 2, trying to have Gypyx have control at multiple attempts.

This slot has a good scum equity.

[Lycanfire]

I think both of you are town.

[Lycanfire]

I don't want to be that uncompromising person that only wants to push one elimination through but I definitely wouldn't eliminate {gypyx, psyche, kay} with you two pretty close from me being willing to bet the game on, too.

[Lycanfire]

Enchant, how do you feel about how Oblivion and Ranger interacted day 2?

Furthermore, how do you feel about the rhetoric geraintm was using day 2? This would run counter to Oblivion's continued push onto Ranger.

[Lycanfire]

Oblivion, why do you think RN town?

[Oblivion]

Oblivion, why do you think RN town?

It wonders why after it failed on its hammer yesterday and Gypyx was ready to kill it, RN hammered before other slots could remove their vote and change the kill to it.

[Enchant]

Enchant, how do you feel about how Oblivion and Ranger interacted day 2?

I mostly forgot anything.


I know that mafia while having pretty good chances to pivot wagon on someone else just by supporting Gypix, prefered to sit on teammate. There's reason why i believed flip will be town, because how counterintuitive it is, if mafia didn't vote teammate, you would need to convince Gypix to vote, Thomith or Me.

[Lycanfire]

anyway i read through LF's posts again and still think RN is town.
LF's case is somewhat close to a gish gallop though -- quite long and i'm a bit too lazy to try to contradict every part of it
think his approach for using vca and relational tells to sort slots like RN and potentially also kay is a bit limited when applied to players who might not reliably come to reasonable post-to-post conclusions about the status of their strategic interests
maybe the right compromise that includes enchant's preference is just to lim RN and my preference to avoid tedious debate and return to the topic tomorrow -- supposing he really is town

I don't see anything wrong with the case. Random Nurse's day 2 vote sucked, by his own admission it was better placed (not wanting to eliminate in the hood), never truly interacted with the person he voted, acted sketchy when getting onto the dave/ranger wagon, spent the entire day arguing with gypyx/thomith. Shaded the only other flipped scum eod2.

Accused the only other flipped scum of lurking 6 times d3.

On day 4 the only other flipped scum lied about liking Random Nurse's push onto Ranger d1. At this point, I asked Random Nurse for their opinion on geraintm

Random nurse, thoughts on geraintm? You mentioned being wary of their lack of presence. They've been here lately. Based off what they are giving us do you have an opinion on this slot?

I never got any after waiting a full day

He seems to back up geraintm and forgets his SR, again on the only other flipped scum.

Yes this is why I've done literally nothing for a day out of the chance random nurse came in and called bullshit on their own.

Call bullshit on whom? You?

He pushed the same agenda as geraintm on d2 (questioning "townblocks"/thomith/gypyx and "not wanting to eliminate in the hood").

etc etc. i can keep expanding the case with more context if you want, but holy shit how can we overlook how he defended geraintm yesterday?

[Psyche]

i think that's just RN stuff! am somewhat ok to see if i'm right though

[Lycanfire]

Oblivion, why do you think RN town?

It wonders why after it failed on its hammer yesterday and Gypyx was ready to kill it, RN hammered before other slots could remove their vote and change the kill to it.

Geraintm was gonna go no matter what. Doesn't matter if it was yesterday or today.

[Random Nurse]

Enchant replaced Titus, correct?

Ranger put geraintm at the bottom of her reads list, and Titus at the top. Is it meaningful/possible that Ranger could/would put both teammates on opposite ends of her list?

[Lycanfire]

Enchant, how do you feel about how Oblivion and Ranger interacted day 2?

I mostly forgot anything.

I know that mafia while having pretty good chances to pivot wagon on someone else just by supporting Gypix, prefered to sit on teammate.

There's reason why i believed flip will be town, because how counterintuitive it is, if mafia didn't vote teammate, you would need to convince Gypix to vote, Thomith or Me.

I get that from the perspective of a town!you there must have been a bus. Based off what you're saying in the italicized portion, does this relate to Oblivion?

[Random Nurse]

Oblivion, why do you think RN town?

It wonders why after it failed on its hammer yesterday and Gypyx was ready to kill it, RN hammered before other slots could remove their vote and change the kill to it.

Geraintm was gonna go no matter what. Doesn't matter if it was yesterday or today.

If I was Scum I wouldn't be hammering geraintm, especially when already down a teammate.

Did you respond to my prior point about why I'd be picking fights with Thomith/Gypyx over their alignment as Scum?

[Lycanfire]

If geraintm goes day 4 or day 5 it doesn't change the number of town eliminations required to win. this is WIFOM

[Lycanfire]

If I were Scum wouldn't it just make more sense to just blend in and agree that they're both Town and just go along with it while killing them at night?

Easier yes. My point is that this was a d2 distraction and your focus didn't line up with your vote. Your continued SR of the homies is very easily explained by how Gypyx kept townreading you, plus, you shouldn't have known they were informed until mid-late d3.

[Random Nurse]

Hold on a minute.

Someone made a point here earlier that I wasn't on the successful Ranger wagon?

I was on both Ranger's and geraintm's final lims.

If I was Scum why would I ensure both of them were eliminated? Makes no sense.

[Lycanfire]

You voted Davesaz, you didn't vote Ranger. Really epic vote park

[Lycanfire]

2.FINAL

Votecount 2.FINAL

Ranger (EXECUTED): Random Nurse, Titus, Oblivion, PenguinPower, Lycanfire, Thomith, Gypyx
PenguinPower (2): KayJayQueue, Hu Tao
Gypyx (2): geraintm, Naerys
Hu Tao (1): Ranger
Thomith (1): Snow2697

With 13 players alive, it took 7 votes to secure an execution.

Mod Notes: The combined mod ISO is here.

Just saying everyone alive right now has eliminated scum at least once. Kay and Gypyx only once.

[Random Nurse]

If I were Scum wouldn't it just make more sense to just blend in and agree that they're both Town and just go along with it while killing them at night?

Easier yes. My point is that this was a d2 distraction and your focus didn't line up with your vote. Your continued SR of the homies is very easily explained by how Gypyx kept townreading you, plus, you shouldn't have known they were informed until mid-late d3.

If you're Town you

really

need to work on how you phrase things.

What exactly was a Day 2 distraction to

you

?

What do you mean my focus didn't line up with my vote?

What do you mean by the last sentence? Initially I didn't trust them because they kept Townreading each other so much, like no paranoia or doubt at all like normal Townies should, so that was a red flag from the start. And then later they mentioned the Mason/Informed Townies part that I was wrangling with. Are you Scumreading me because I was paranoid and trying to figure those two out?

[Lycanfire]

VOTE: random nurse

The fake hammer was ick, and the real hammer following it up was real ick.

Seeing as we got scum I'll forgive Oblivion. Didn't feel good before the flip, and I'm not sure how much credit random nurse gets for pushing it through because they seem to really want the credit.

I think this is the most sensible partner of Ranger and Geraint.

Let's look into this.

1) Where would Ranger put her partners? Random nurse bounced from null, up and down the town portion of her reads and ending in {top tier} on page 44. Geraint bounced between town-null-scum, ending up in the middle. I think random nurse being town or scum being given a TR to be listened to on d2 is +scum, so while I think placing him here is more scum indicative than not, it isn't by much.
2) Random Nurse was a Dave voter, not so much a Ranger voter. He never interacted with Ranger outside of asking for her reads one time. He re-voted Ranger (hinting he was sheeping Hu Tao on the suspicion on TPR), only to make a comment that he was already voting her. Didn't seem as obvious as Titus' as-I-call-it townslip, because she never corrected herself, and nobody seemed to catch it until I did yesterday.

Y'know what I did when I suspected someone of having a result on someone? I kept my mouth shut until after they claimed VT.

3) He didn't vote Ranger though, and spent most of the day arguing with Gypyx. He continued doing so even after Ranger was caught in damning inconsistencies, which scum may have been too hopeful would be overlooked as pressure briefly swung against Snow/Hu Tao.
4) I'm of the opinion that despite being a Ranger voter he tried to save her, and this was the plan according to his ascent to {top tier}. Let's look at what happened on Day 2 for Random Nurse:

Ranger Mentions: 6
implied ranger mention: 1
Gypyx Mentions: 27
Thomith Mentions: 18
implied gypyx/thomith mentions: 3
Other 12 players: 15

Random Nurse's d2:
Votes dave, accuses willow of manipulating them, implies Naerys scum or they will scumhunt them easily, susses gypyx on the hood once revealed, asks thomith why they want to eliminate in the hood. asks to know of what has happened in the hood. repeatedly asks gypyx if they would vote thomith. asked thomith is they would "launch" gypyx. asked the both of them why they haven't clarified why they townread each other. asks if the game is singleball. asks about scum vig and serial killer. after ranger's claim, says they do not want to eliminate in the hood (still hasn't changed vote). asks for "thoughts on geraintm". susses geraintm on a post that i actually liked. implied a ranger scumread (referenced her post number but no name or quote). once again said they didn't want to eliminate in the hood.

[Random Nurse]

You voted Davesaz, you didn't vote Ranger. Really epic vote park

2.FINAL

Votecount 2.FINAL

Ranger (EXECUTED): Random Nurse, Titus, Oblivion, PenguinPower, Lycanfire, Thomith, Gypyx
PenguinPower (2): KayJayQueue, Hu Tao
Gypyx (2): geraintm, Naerys
Hu Tao (1): Ranger
Thomith (1): Snow2697

With 13 players alive, it took 7 votes to secure an execution.

Mod Notes: The combined mod ISO is here.

Just saying everyone alive right now has eliminated scum at least once. Kay and Gypyx only once.

...

...do you see where I was the first vote on Ranger and stayed there the whole freaking time until she was eliminated?

[Lycanfire]

Dude, you voted Davesaz and vote parked the slot for the entirety of the day and did fuck all. Is this the "good push" geraintm was talking about?

[Random Nurse]

You voted Davesaz, you didn't vote Ranger. Really epic vote park

2.FINAL

Votecount 2.FINAL

Ranger (EXECUTED):

Random Nurse

, Titus, Oblivion, PenguinPower, Lycanfire, Thomith, Gypyx
PenguinPower (2): KayJayQueue, Hu Tao
Gypyx (2): geraintm, Naerys
Hu Tao (1): Ranger
Thomith (1): Snow2697

With 13 players alive, it took 7 votes to secure an execution.

Mod Notes: The combined mod ISO is here.

Just saying everyone alive right now has eliminated scum at least once. Kay and Gypyx only once.

...

...do you see where I was the first vote on Ranger and stayed there the whole freaking time until she was eliminated?

[Random Nurse]

Dude, you voted Davesaz and vote parked the slot for the entirety of the day and did fuck all. Is this the "good push" geraintm was talking about?

Do you see the bolded yellow vote?