Newbie 1876 - Game Over!

[Formerfish]

VOTE: Iceman

He knows why. And God, according to kid rock God knows too.

[Formerfish]

VOTE: Formerfish

I know what he used to be, but what is he now?

Right now I'm a worried dad. I spent 6 hours this morning in the er with my daughter and they weren't able to tell me anything more than keep her hydrated and monitor her temp...

Happy fucking Father's Day!

[Formerfish]

Oh God, don't get him started on the whole numbers thing. Just call him 2.8, he loves that.

And thanks guys, I'll be in an out today. She's finally asleep for a bit, so I'mma try and nap too.

[Formerfish]

Yeah, so

Code: Select all

[vote]person1[/vote]

will do
VOTE: person1

Similarly the

Code: Select all

[unvote]person1[/unvote]

will do UNVOTE: person1. Sometimes we just do UNVOTE: so it is not confused for a vote.

---

I would like to make it clear that I still VOTE: nonny.

Why are you making sure that we know you are still randomly voting someone?

[Formerfish]

Oh you cheeky scumboi you.

I hope you learned your lesson.

[Formerfish]

Oh you cheeky scumboi you.

I hope you learned your lesson.

I learned to stand my ground more. Don't be in a hurry and don't let people push you into reads.


The meta on this site so far has been difficult to pick up on.

Those are perfect lessons from last game. Town it up in this one like you did there and you'll do well. Or just sheep me and ride my coattails to victory.

And thanks, we were home for a bit and then I took her back because her fever spiked to 104. They looked at her appendix and that was fine, they are testing for strep throat now.

That's not fun if it turns out to be what the problem is. I hope she feels better soon. -Mod

[Formerfish]

I like to think that town it up means to play in such a way that the only logical conclusion is that they are town.

[Formerfish]

Town it up in this one like you did there and you'll do well. Or just sheep me and ride my coattails to victory.

This seems a very odd statement. At this stage why would you suggest this unless you already know someone's alignment. Please elaborate. The statement is almost suspicious enough to change my vote but that would put you at L-2 and not sure I want to go there yet.

So its going to be one of those games is it? With newbies try-harding right out of the gate.

Iceman and I just finished a game where we butted heads as tvt. I was killed night 1 and he made it to end game where we lost. He did a very good job of making it seem like he was town, but didnt arouse enough suspicion as one of our prs to get night killed. The ride my coattails comment is mostly a joke, but also if he is town than we could do some good work together, if he is scum and follows my townlead than im still getting the result I want.

You do what you feel you have to with your vote, for some of us all we have is that and our words, right? Think about this though, do you really believe that I am going to scum slip on page 1 day 1 of a newbie game? Do you think that if Iceman was my partner as scum that I would be talking to him like this instead of in our scum pt?

Stop tilting at windmills and let the game progress a bit before making baseless statements like that. Unless youre scum, then by all means push down this path and find out what happens

[Formerfish]

Another word for try-harding is LAMIST.

[Formerfish]

Except trinity asked about the same post in #25 and I addressed it already in #26.

And asking a question is different than threatening me with a serious vote on page 2, putting me to l-2 when the first 2 votes were rvs.

To me it looks like you saw that I had the biggest wagon on me, and if you could push an action as scummy to hop on the wagon you might be able to get some traction with it and get an early mislynch.

And dont misrep what I was saying, i have no issue with questions. I have an issue with someone taking an obviously tongue in cheek comment and trying to make it into something its not. Build your straw man somehwere else.

[Formerfish]

Except trinity asked about the same post in #25 and I addressed it already in #26.

And asking a question is different than threatening me with a serious vote on page 2, putting me to l-2 when the first 2 votes were rvs.

To me it looks like you saw that I had the biggest wagon on me, and if you could push an action as scummy to hop on the wagon you might be able to get some traction with it and get an early mislynch.

And dont misrep what I was saying, i have no issue with questions. I have an issue with someone taking an obviously tongue in cheek comment and trying to make it into something its not. Build your straw man somehwere else.

I know I’m new at this, but it does look like there are a couple of ways to read your posts, which are sounding a bit defensive:

(1) You are town and worried about being mislynched.
(2) You are scum and trying to misdirect so that you don’t get lynched.

Maybe I’m being too simplistic, but isn’t it part of the game that we should poke and prod a bit, to try to get a reaction, and see what comes out?

Look at the way you asked your question and how I responded vs. how nonny phrased their post and what my reply was.

You asked a simple question that you wanted clarification on. To me it seemed like nonny picked what should have been an innocuous statement from me and tried to use it to justify a serious vote.

Those two scenarios are very different, which is why my response to you two were different.

[Formerfish]

Here's a lesson I learned: don't town read newbies on that basis alone. Everyone's new and everyone expresses different degrees of confidence. If someone's playing VI past the first week, odds are they're a good lynch.

Contribute, make sure people don't observe from the sidelines too much, and think hard about your reads. Take your time with it. We have two weeks and it'd be good to use almost all of it.

Another word for try-harding is LAMIST.

Guys, this bit of advice I'm gonna give is super important: BE HONEST ABOUT MAKING MISTAKES. Don't rationalize around them. Don't justify them. Look at your behavior honestly and critically, especially in how it'll appear to both town and scum. It's more important that you let town players know this than it is to win an argument.

I have half a mind to vote nonny cuz of those two posts up there.

Why are you talking about game theory so much? And as a newbie. See this looks a lot like someone trying to make it seem like they are posting things, without ever actually saying anything.

You almost seem to throw some shade at the end of that last post towards nonny. What do you see in the 2 posts you mentioned that is a mistake that they aren't owning up to? Why do you think that you see something there in a more serious way than I do? You would think that if anyone had a problem with what they posted and was going to throw a vote that way it would be me, but I haven't even talked about that yet.

[Formerfish]

Yeah, so

Code: Select all

[vote]person1[/vote]

will do
VOTE: person1

Similarly the

Code: Select all

[unvote]person1[/unvote]

will do UNVOTE: person1. Sometimes we just do UNVOTE: so it is not confused for a vote.

---

I would like to make it clear that I still VOTE: nonny.

Why are you making sure that we know you are still randomly voting someone?

Because I was also using a whole bunch of unvote and vote tags, and I wanted to clear any misconceptions in the vote count by a mod who make merely skim for vote tags.

No, no. I get that part, my question is why you are so concerned about an RVS vote being counted correctly?

[Formerfish]

OK, so...

All right. We have friction between nonny and Formerfish. I want to scumread nonny except that it is reminding me of my last game (1872, especially in day 3).
However this is NOT day 3, this is day 1.

I still want to keep my vote on nonny. This could be a mislynch, but we can afford 2 mislynches, so...

Would you like to defend yourself or claim a power role?

Holy shit this is ugly.

Friction is fine, and just because there is friction doesn't make one of us scum.

You voted nonny as an rvs vote, but now it seems like you are making it a legit one, why? And if you really think it might be a mislynch, why keep it there? Yes we get a few built into the game, but do you really want to potentially use one on day 1 from something you think you gleaned from like a 4 post back and forth?

And the whole "defend yourself or claim a PR" is just disgusting and reeks of role fishing, especially when its said this early on, and without much steam behind the wagon.

VOTE: 2.8

and this vote is very real.

[Formerfish]

Maybe you didn't read his post, but I did. Claiming my role would be a last resort.

I just find it kind of ironic that in my next post I clarify that I'm female and yet you got it wrong. It doesn't bug me, but it speaks to you actually reading my posts or not...



While nUmBeRs post was pretty funny, I'm not sure if it's scum. I mean... just think... what scum really goes "Hey, so, like, claim now, please?".

Bins have you played with 2.8 yet? I just got done with a game he was in and he is a newb through and through, but he didnt have this set of balls in that game at all.

[Formerfish]

Seriously?

I am saying Bins is town, GuerillaWoo is a scum lean.

It's really simple sorting of slots.

Lynchpool are the people you are willing to lynch, so, scum reads, because only an idiot would lynch a town read.

Is this getting too advanced?

I like brass, sounds a lot like myself when im annoyed at people in the game.

I like Iceman so far as well, the joke about door prizes seems relaxed and town to me.

[Formerfish]

You misread that. But good to know that I'm on your list? Nothing I can help you with bud. And I don't wanna do a D1 post-RVS back and forth tunnel again, so lemme know if you have some new info for me to answer.

You could answer my questions towards you. I know it was probably hard to find, it was like 5 after the one from brass, I should do a better job to make them visable for you.

Here's a lesson I learned: don't town read newbies on that basis alone. Everyone's new and everyone expresses different degrees of confidence. If someone's playing VI past the first week, odds are they're a good lynch.

Contribute, make sure people don't observe from the sidelines too much, and think hard about your reads. Take your time with it. We have two weeks and it'd be good to use almost all of it.

Another word for try-harding is LAMIST.

Guys, this bit of advice I'm gonna give is super important: BE HONEST ABOUT MAKING MISTAKES. Don't rationalize around them. Don't justify them. Look at your behavior honestly and critically, especially in how it'll appear to both town and scum. It's more important that you let town players know this than it is to win an argument.

I have half a mind to vote nonny cuz of those two posts up there.

Why are you talking about game theory so much? And as a newbie. See this looks a lot like someone trying to make it seem like they are posting things, without ever actually saying anything.

You almost seem to throw some shade at the end of that last post towards nonny. What do you see in the 2 posts you mentioned that is a mistake that they aren't owning up to? Why do you think that you see something there in a more serious way than I do? You would think that if anyone had a problem with what they posted and was going to throw a vote that way it would be me, but I haven't even talked about that yet.

[Formerfish]

Not much happening, so maybe it’s time for another dumbe question. Some of you have mentioned post numbers, but these numbers don’t match up with the numbers on my board - maybe because I’m viewing posts in descending order. Any ideas on how I can find a post if all I have is the number?

Change to ascending? (Go to user control panel> board preference>display options)

Woo and 2.8 I'll get to your posts later. I'm sleepy now.

[Formerfish]

I'll be around this weekend. I've had a lot going on this week and I'm trying to get my life right.

Don't you worry Woo, with a face like that how can I stay away from you for long?

[Formerfish]

VOTE: unvote

I am skimming now, and will do a more in depth read later.

I have my daughter tonight (she is doing much better. Fever is gone, labs came back negative for UTI, Strep and her appendix looks fine. Just a false alarm, still unsettling though).

I drop her off at the ex-in-laws tomorrow and I have nothing to do this weekend. Get ready for a shit ton more from me.

Is there anyone who has standing weekend vacation/limited access? I like to do most of my sorting in person, meta dive me and you will see this.

[Formerfish]

Also, we are not lynching a pr claim today. Anyone who pushes that is bad and they should feel bad. If he isn't a pr then we will probably know tomorrow. If he is then he probably does tonight. We are not doing the scums job for them.

Anyone who feels differently can fight me.

[Formerfish]

Glad to hear it bud.

(Thank you. Being a parent is scary sometimes. And not in the way anyone ever warned me about. The helplessness you feel at times is fucking crushing)

[Formerfish]

I am by no means saying he should make it to endgame, but doing this on d1 is bad form. I'll get more into it when I'm fully caught up. I just felt like I needed to say something when I saw him claim a pr and then saw people still calling for his Lynch.

[Formerfish]

Ok, I read a bit more. That claim is suspect as hell. I hadn't gotten to the part where he full claimed yet.

Grrr.... We have time to figure this out, I might not be so belligerent in his defense anymore, but I still don't like the idea of lynching a claimed doc. I also will point out that I have made that fake claim as scum before, it wasnt in a newbie game though, and I made it a few more days off the wifom alone.

[Formerfish]

I agree with Woo. If I had just claimed and people were still questioning it I would stick around and interact with them. The whole "not lynching without a CC" thing from 2.8 bugs the shit out of me as well. And doc is one of the easiest claims to fake, someone dies and he just claims that scum is leaving him alive for wifom and that he picked someone else to protect the night before explaining away the nk.

VOTE: 2.8

[Formerfish]

Then it was all survival instinct -- it is one thing to lynch a townie, but to lynch one of only 2 (or maybe even only 1) power roles?

This is what hit me hardest. Like the only way that this line of thought makes any sense is if he were a cop. I just went through this myself in a game that just ended. I was the cop who on day 2 had to try and figure out if there was another pr while trying to solve the game with the info I had.

If he was a cop he wouldn't even mention the fact that there may only be 1 PR because he would be 100% outing himself as that cop.

It makes even less sense with the doc claim, and if it don't make dollars it don't make cents.

[Formerfish]

I never trust people who very early on throw shade at someone and then claim they don't want to vote them because of the vote count. It looks like a way for scum to test the waters and see if a wagon will stick without actually joining the wagon.
I don't trust that sort of play.

I like this post from brass, it echos my own thoughts, and is the main reason I clapped back at nonny the way that I did, where I was pretty calm in answering Trinity.

Trinity is also townlean, good questions.

Questions are pointless unless that player follows up on them. I’ll have to see if she does that.

I didn't quote a lot of your other posts, but from a tonal standpoint I like you a lot. I get town feels from you. It's cool if you don't feel the same way, people tend to warm up to me once they figure out what I'm about.

[Formerfish]

OK, so...
All right. We have friction between nonny and Formerfish. I want to scumread nonny except that it is reminding me of my last game (1872, especially in day 3).
However this is NOT day 3, this is day 1.
I still want to keep my vote on nonny. This could be a mislynch, but we can afford 2 mislynches, so...
Would you like to defend yourself or claim a power role?

I didn’t get a chance to address this way of thinking in the last game but not every interaction has to have a winner/loser or is scum v town, which is how you make it seem like it is to you. Also, I think you were too aggressive in pushing for nonny to defend or claim because of “protocol” when in reality you were probably just fishing. Scum points for you, and honestly town points for nonny.

Moving forward... UNVOTE: for now just because I want to step back for a while and analyze the situation. It is hard to say "day 1 is always tough for me" after so little experience but I also know that lurking (the most obvious way around this kind of difficulty) is also a scum read.
Are we out of random vote stage yet?

This post is icky as well. He has a (supposed) serious vote on nonny which he unvoted here, and then asks if we are out of RVS yet…

I want to wait and see how the replacement acts before doing anything else here, unless something major happens among the other 8 of us.

This is weird too. Kitty site flaked before even posting, why would you want to wait around to see how they act before doing anything? Like what about that slot was special enough to announce to the thread that you weren’t going to do anything? And then you come out of retirement a whole 2 posts later after Iceman asked you a question. And in that post you are back to calling your vote random

UNVOTE: , because doing a random vote at this point seems like Incorrect Protocol.

I may be losing a grasp of my Numbers townread.

Um, I thought we were supposed to pressure people by voting for them?

To everyone else, it's always good to be using your vote. Pressuring people with a vote may be the only way you can get a proper read on them.
VOTE: brassherald

Is there a reason why adding more pressure to the player

you

voted for (within reason, but I doubt two scum would instantly jump on this wagon unless they were suicidal) causes you to lose the townread?
Or am I misinterpreting something?

Sheeping Bins and then using the excuse that we are supposed to use our votes to pressure people is pretty bad when I can’t remember 2.8 ever saying anything about brass looking like scum. This feels like he is just trying to see what shit will stick on the wall without ever having a read of his own to follow through with. And yes votes are for pressure, but they need to have some substance behind them to be effective. Voting to make someone a wagon without a whisper of a case against them is just an empty threat. And the second part looks like a clear attempt at buddying Bins. It reminds me of a dog looking up at an owner not understanding why they are mad at him for digging through the trash.

Further evidence to support my scum read on 2.8

[Formerfish]

While nUmBeRs post was pretty funny, I'm not sure if it's scum. I mean... just think... what scum really goes "Hey, so, like, claim now, please?".

I think that he might have done just that. The way that he looks at things and how he stands on protocol he may have expected that to be the way things played out.

I'm fine with putting a wagon to L-2 this early.
VOTE: nonny
Early read, this is sus.

Sus, why?
I voted nonny for a reason too, but it was more just tonal. Anything in particular?

After seeing brass revote nonny I remembered this post existed, Bins, did you ever explain this?

I can see him hitting puberty from his first game to his second game. I don't really like how you're voting him even after his explanation leads me to believe this is more just a communication/awkwardness thing. I'm STILL not sure if it's scum, but I'm more just getting the vibe that he's a newb.

I guess it’s just that I saw a very different player from him in the first game. The play that I’ve seen from him this game makes me think he is scum in comparison to the other game where he was town. I don’t know what else to say about a guy who has 1 game under his belt and in his second…

Counterclaim is definitely the right play. All this softing going on is just a mess to deal with later. There's no reason to stall a conf!scum out until the day after, it's honestly going to put us in a much worse position.

Is this the IC talking or your personal opinion? And I don’t know if its just the way you play, but I am getting some distinct flashbacks to a game I think we played together where you were scum. Did we have a game like that? I’m lazy and hope you have a better memory than me. If not I’ll have to bite the bullet and look. It has something to do with your tone. Like here I feel like you could be backing your partners play (which if its true, would probably be your own play) to try and get someone to CC, or again, to show that no one is going to CC because that role is not in the game. And the reason why someone wouldn’t CC here is because if 2.8 is scum fake claiming then the real slim shady gets nked because they stuck their neck out. If 2.8 is going down regardless it’s a much better play for the PRs to keep their traps shut and force scum to guess.

If I had to pick a scumpartner for 2.8 this would be it. Is there enough for me to scum read her on her own? Maybe not. But definitely worth looking at more closely.

[Formerfish]

1) Those are part of my first five posts. There is nothing of substance one can offer in RVS.
2) My being a newbie means I shouldn't be able to understand game theory? I acknowledge that I'm inexperienced, but I don't think it's bad form to offer advice. You don't have to listen to me.
3) It was RVS.
4) She either willfully or unintentionally read scumminess into a blatant joke. I've seen it happen before from town, though.
5) Uh what. Is this an ego thing rn, cuz like I barely know you and I'm not interested.
6) Two people can behave independently. I wasn't defending you.
I gotta say your tone reads as purposefully aggravating as an attempt to pressure me to see what shakes. That can go lamist or earnestly town. But it is not helpful to town at all. My concern is you're gonna start jumping between read to read with this overeager pressure and dominate the thread.

1. My point was that it seemed like you were posting a lot about things that are game related, but not really specific to this game, if that makes sense. I kinda saw it as posting to seem active without saying anything of substance.
2. Wasn’t saying that you shouldn’t know about game theory, just that we have an IC and SEs for that kind of thing, again it goes back to why are

you

posting that kind of stuff instead of playing the game. It could have been a premature thing to look at from my part, but like you said, not much going on early game so things tend to get blown out of proportion.
3. I get that it was RVS, but that doesn’t mean I can’t suspect someone for shitposting (Not saying your posts were shit, they just weren’t really progressing the game at all).
4. I gotcha.
5. It’s not an ego thing, I just think that as the person who was involved with that thing directly if anyone was going to have a major issue with it it would be me. But 4 was a serious question and I liked the answer you gave to support why you felt the way you did, so 5 kinda becomes a moot point.
6. Fair enough, it came off as a chainsaw defense to me, but that isn’t AI.
And yeah, I can be aggressive in that way. Look at my last game (1872 I think?) I had almost 28% of the posts in that game and I flitted form read to read for a bit until I got my legs under me. I explained a little bit about my play sometimes, calling it steamrolling. I do it for effect and for reactions. I don’t know how well it plays yet, but we did win that game as town with 4 of us still alive on day 3. I did get feedback that I was a little too extra in that game, I will attempt to tone it down a bit in volume but hopefully not effectiveness.

Can you describe what intuits to you that I'm town? I feel like I haven't actually said anything AI.

I like this post because I feel like town will more often question baseless town reads. I feel scum do it at times as well, but those are much more infrequent and far between. Scum would, IMO, just take the town read for what its worth and run with it.

I'll take you up on that fight.

I don't want to fight you anymore. Can we make some sweet sweet dance moves together instead?

And by dance I do mean lets talk about some of our other reads in relation to each others to help sort people.

[Formerfish]

Hello all, thank you for what I can only assume will be a very warm welcome.

I mean... I still have a little bit of lean on nonny = Scum, although not as strongly as before..

Why is that?

Is this where you started reading? I find it odd that nothing before post 92 tickled you in any way enough to comment on them.

@2.7: It's not just the self-deprecation (at least for me, I can't speak for anyone else), it's about the weird push on formerfish without a vote (this could potentially be a scum move in that she could be trying to plant the idea of a formerfish lynch without drawing attention to herself by placing a vote/she could be attempting to gain towncred by pointing out how cautious she's being) and the fact that she seems to be more interested in defending herself than scumhunting in her last few posts.

I like this post from sky. It shows a clear idea of why they are finding someone scummy by looking at the motivation behind their words and actions and seeing how they could benefit the player from a scum point of view. I like it because it makes sense and they say it in a way that should be clear to anyone.

Depending on how you answer my first question I am leaning town here, but only very slightly.

[Formerfish]

Not sure how I feel about the role claim. To me role claiming day one is just asking to be killed night 1. You didn't really try to build a defense prior to a role claim. Wouldn't you want to build a defense prior to claiming, claiming does not really help town at this stage. SE or IC if my logic is wrong here please explain.

I liked most of this post, but this part in particular. It makes a lot of sense especially after she just called 2.8 out for saying he had many reasons for voting brass, but would have to go back and look, only to make a reads post where he basically said he only had 1 weak reason. I don’t feel like 2.8 made any real attempt at a defense, or even made an attempt to case anyone who he thought was scum. He just leapt at claiming he was a PR because his idea of protocol says that you don’t lynch one unless there is a CC. I think that his scum partner realized that his ship was sunk and the only way to get anything out of him at this point was to try and claim a pr that A. They know isn’t in the game, so there wouldn’t be a cc (I haven’t looked to see if there are any combos where that’s possible, I’m just brainstorming right now), or B. Picked one that has a higher chance of being CCed so that they could take out the real one if there is one.

[Formerfish]

I feel like brass, Woo and Iceman are town.
Trinity, Sky and nonny are in null territory.
And my mostly likely scum right now are 2.8 and bins.

I am much more confident with my read on 2.8, and my read on bins could change dependent on how 2.8 flips. But thats where my head is at right now.

[Formerfish]

UNVOTE: cuz I'm getting cold feet.

This could go the other way though too. Unless you think that both scum are already on the wagon, which I highly doubt, then one of them should have been able to come up with at least a plausible reason to have hammered him already.

[Formerfish]

That's kinda what I was getting at in my last post. The only thing it could be, other than 2.8 is scum and his partner not thinking there was enough to gain from bussing or they think he won't get lynched, is that both scum are on the wagon already, which I see being a very low probability.

[Formerfish]

I feel like ... Iceman [is] town.

What are you seeing here that I'm not seeing? Ice is completely null to me right now but I'd like more townreads.

I'd have to go back and pull actual posts, but mostly it's the way he posts, the tone, the fact that we just played together and I'm seeing a lot of the same behaviors here that he had as town there, and a similar thought process to myself. Like there is one post where he literally said almost the exact same thing I had written I'm response to a post I had just read. It was like reading my own posts from him. So mostly a gut thing.

[Formerfish]

Nah, it's fine. People quickly figure out how to manipulate thier own meta and use it to their advantage. A lot of times you see vets use the relationships they have with other players as weapons. Like if I were scum and had a friend in the game I would know what they were looking for from me and would be able to play that aspect of my game up to get a town read.

Not having that means you have a clean slate to work with and you can avoid any bais or congnative dissonance as a result of those relationships.

[Formerfish]

So I don't know about you guys, but I do a lot of my best thinking on the john. So as I'm sitting here I have this thought:

We might be better off killing 2.8 today no matter what.

I know. I know. That sounds kinda crazy, right? My question to you all is this, is it?

Say he is town. I as scum would not kill him tonight. I would leave him alive because tomorrow when he's not dead it's almost a free mislynch right there for them. Also, I would probably no kill for the simple fact that as the towndoc he could pick one of the scum team to protect, which would in effect clear that scum player when town2.8 is killed and flips green.

Now from the flip side. If 2.8 is scum I would probably no kill as well. It would ratchet up the wifom to unbelievable levels on not only himself but also on whoever he "protected."

Thoughts (I suggest rereading this while sitting on a toilet, it might make more sense that way)?

[Formerfish]

I’m not sure what else I need to do to follow up?

You asked a lot of questions. Have the people who you were asking replied to all of them? If you want me to I can do an ISO on you and quote all the places you asked questions.

[Formerfish]

No Lynch is only really a viable option in lylo or mylo, I always get them confused though. Ly(nch correctly or) Lo(se) and M(is L)y(nch and) Lo(se) for those who don't know the abbreviations.

So I guess it would be an option in mylo. Not lylo.

[Formerfish]

Formerfish - Neutral. I should be reading them as town to be honest but, the play style in this game seems different from the last. The Last one he was extremely aggressive when he found someone he thought was scum. Like over the top aggressive. This game it seems more like he's trying to be persuasive to get people to vote his way. It's different. I wouldn't say that makes him scum. He only survived one day and the entire day was EXTREMELY drama filled.

I wouldn't disagree with you here. 1872 was my first game back on site after a year off. I was rusty and had trouble finding my feet due to that and the game state. Then I died n1. As a VT, drawing a night kill n1 is the best thing they can really hope for. I know I was aggressive, but it was because it helped hide the PRs that were able to hide. Not saying that was on purpose at all. Just kinda how it turned out from nerves and over eagerness.

If you want to see a completely different game check me out in 1873. I was uber-aggressive in that one as a town cop. I lived on to day 3 where we figured out the game after I hard pushed a lynch on scum day 2. I also had 28% of the posts in that game and was a bit over the top. Again, I didn't set out for that to happen, just what did.

This is going to be a combo of the two. Or nothing. I did say a scummer with skill can manipulate a meta. Or you just wait and roll with me and see where this goes....

[Formerfish]

So I don't know about you guys, but I do a lot of my best thinking on the john. So as I'm sitting here I have this thought:

We might be better off killing 2.8 today no matter what.

I know. I know. That sounds kinda crazy, right? My question to you all is this, is it?

Say he is town. I as scum would not kill him tonight. I would leave him alive because tomorrow when he's not dead it's almost a free mislynch right there for them. Also, I would probably no kill for the simple fact that as the towndoc he could pick one of the scum team to protect, which would in effect clear that scum player when town2.8 is killed and flips green.

Now from the flip side. If 2.8 is scum I would probably no kill as well. It would ratchet up the wifom to unbelievable levels on not only himself but also on whoever he "protected."

Thoughts (I suggest rereading this while sitting on a toilet, it might make more sense that way)?

Hey this is my argument :p

I started to be able to see it that way, just took the long way.

[Formerfish]

I'm fine with putting a wagon to L-2 this early.

VOTE: nonny

Early read, this is sus.

Sus, why?

I voted nonny for a reason too, but it was more just tonal. Anything in particular?

You could talk about this Bins. I have a wall post out there with your name on it too with some questions.

[Formerfish]

But, right now the train is firmly on E2.7 so there is NO NEED to counter claim.

Think your analysis of the situation is wrong here, but OK. We can wait and stall more.

This post was made friday morning, 930am.

Hi all, been in Paris.

I’ll post tomorrow when I’m back at work!

Haven’t read the last two pages. But there’s no reason to rush anything just yet.

In the future please let us know if you are going to be away like this. It takes only a few seconds to do a simple "V/LA a few days due to (reason)" post. -Mod

This came at 330pm sunday. So just over the 48hrs between them. like 54ish. Not a huge deal in of itself, but also corresponded with the time frame 2.8 claimed and then went dark. Addressing the bold, if we use the broad sense that she is going to post "tomorrow at work" says that anytime on monday is acceptable. And she does between 330a-409a, we get 297, 298, 303, and 305 where you have basically just sat on your brass read.

I think brassherald is still my strongest scumread. I have pretty much every other slot at varying levels of town,

which I'll try and get into.

And to address the bold. Unless this is why she is upset that in her mind people didnt wait, its not exactly an explicit statement.

What part about me catching up after getting back from Paris so wait 24 hours is so hard for you to understand? Not everyone has weighed in yet. There's still other players in the game I want to talk about.

This one comes in around 11am monday.

And then another two at 5pm. One where she basically said she didnt want to give out info, and blames it on the doc dying. Does she feel like she has such good reads that she is going to out which of us have higher roles than the others and help scum direct their nightkills? The other she drops trs on woo, sky and myself, leans town on trinity and ice. Also said 2.8 is not scum, so that 6 trs of varying degrees, adding herself, means that she only sees scum in nonny/brass right now. To be so sure when most of her posts are waffling fence sitting piles, to seeming bored and indifferent (Not wanting to push a 2.8 lynch because "its a yawn".) in a lot of her posts doesnt instill me with a lot of confidence in her reads.

And you have a habit of avoiding questions it seems. I kinda feel like I can say that now without you getting upset about the time frame being inappropriate since its technically tuesday morning, but I think you have a few out standing questions where I have asked twice now. Is that something we can expect attention to, or should I consider your oversight of my questions as intentional as a way to avoid a little twirl with me?

You wanna talk about other players, lets go. If you wanna talk about brass reads, then figure out where people stand on him and you ask the questions you think would bring insight into your thought process and show us why you think brass is the best, case him. Appeal to the town to see yours as the best option. Or dont and dont be surprised when its a hard sell.

[Formerfish]

Hey scum bags, why kill me n1? It didn't seem like you were PR reading me in the scum PT, and I'm just curious.

[Formerfish]

I picked you because you seemed like the most aggressive and the thought of having to defend myself against you was scary and I didn’t know if I could do it.

I will gladly accept that as a reason. I may even quote.

[Formerfish]

Also what is "the claim"? Mine, or someone else's? I never found anything.

It looks like she is talking about nonny claiming her role, and saying she jailed Bins n1, which unless there was a role blocker meant Bins was town and nonny was cleared.

[Formerfish]

Also what is "the claim"? Mine, or someone else's? I never found anything.

It looks like she is talking about nonny claiming her role, and saying she jailed Bins n1, which unless there was a role blocker meant Bins was town and nonny was cleared.

So should I have made a fake claim?

It might have given you a day more to come up with something better at best, but you could have been instalynched if you chose poorly.