Newbie 1927 | Stuff I Found Online Xi | Over

[Skygazer]

hi

[Skygazer]

oo which game

i've been gone from mafia for a bit until like the start of this month

hi NM!!

[Skygazer]

NM is good at mafia for the record.

Sorting him can be tough sometimes, though.

[Skygazer]

Exilon - defensive and offensive. Either town trying to scum hunt or scum trying to lynch town. Further investigation necessary.

This feels unnecessarily fence-sitty

[Skygazer]

oh shit we have less than two days

[Skygazer]

I'll be around later for a more in depth catch-up before deadline but I'm doin easter stuff rn

[Skygazer]

for the record im fine w/ moomn due to the deadline

[Skygazer]

NM literally posts like this in most games ive seen him in; its not alignment indicative and its not going to change his posting style in this game so just trust me when i say if he's town he knows how to catch scum (esp later in the game) and if he's scum it'll just take some process of elimination sorting

[Skygazer]

im concerned that NM could be seen as an easy mislynch for scum to pull off w/o catching any flak

i wouldn't go as far to describe him as lynchbait because the people who've played w him tend to know better but i'm p sure none of you have played w him so maybe in this context he has lhf qualities

[Skygazer]

what's even more concerning is moomn has NM as a slight townread even though I'm assuming he hasn't played with him

it feels like classic too much information/white knighty considering NM is extremely null here imo

[Skygazer]

you'll notice a lot on this site that scum (especially newer scum) tend to townread players they see getting lynched down the road in order to buddy up to them (aka pocket them) and to score towncred if they wind up getting lynched and flipping town

[Skygazer]

I'm not splitting the votes intentionally, this is just to see if anything surfaces in the last 10 hours.

This feels like a preemptive defense towards something they're worried others will perceive as scummy

[Skygazer]

oh hey

yeah hypoing is bad imo because it locks u into ur inno and gives scum a ton of pr info

if you hypo inno scum? they know ur not a cop
if you hypo inno someone and then end up scumreading them at some point? they know ur not a cop
if you hypo inno someone and continue to pretend to not SR them because itd give up too much info? thats not optimal play
if you hypo inno ur strongest TR to try and avoid that whole dilemma? the above can still happen and scum would know ur probs not cop for checking ur strong TR

basically it gives scum wayyyyy too much info to work with in a game where theyre almost always at an advantage (esp on this site) when crumbs can be p easy to hide and p easy to find after u see a PR flip

[Skygazer]

/SE rant

[Skygazer]

NM how confident r u on exilon

[Skygazer]

im gonna
VOTE: Froce
because i really dislike how they tried to preemptively explain/defend their NM vote

[Skygazer]

the preemptiveness makes me think theyre worried about how other ppl are perceiving their posts and actively thinking about whether or not their actions will be perceived as scummy

[Skygazer]

Actually I think I don't really have to be voting with the majority here. I can pick the next best thing which is N_M and give you the 10 or so hours to think it through.

VOTE: Not_Mafia

I'm not splitting the votes intentionally, this is just to see if anything surfaces in the last 10 hours.

[Skygazer]

i thought u had froce as null

[Skygazer]

hypoing is like when everyone goes "hypothetically, if i were a cop, i have an inno on so and so"

[Skygazer]

Why do you dislike it? I voted him out of necessity because while Moomn was my top pick for a lynch, he was on L-1 and there was still 10 hours when I was going to bed. Therefore, it made sense to vote N_M who was my second top pick and only had one vote on him so I give the rest time to think about it.

it wasnt the vote itself, it was the way you were preemptively defending your vote; ive already explained this

[Skygazer]

Hi! I'm sorry, I had a busy 48 hours and forgot about this game (my debit card was compromised Thursday and my car broke down in the middle of I-95 yesterday...)

I will catch up now!

[Skygazer]

Scum are actually more likely to be consistent for appearances.

Baezu, I'm so sorry... I don't think I could begin to understand what you must be going through.

[Skygazer]

was waiting to say something because their goin through a rough time but baezus unvote seems lamist or somethin in line with that

[Skygazer]

wait im literally being counterwagoned by froce lmao

NM if youre around how do you feel about Froce/Baezu as a solve? feels like Froce is voting me as a survivalist counterwagon and baezu's vote/unvote feels like an aborted bus

[Skygazer]

It is time to lynch Frolf

[Skygazer]

urist: scumreads froce, votes with them on my wagon

i think that comes from town actually i just successfully cleared someone for doing the same thing in nsg's news micro

[Skygazer]

arguing for why im town feels like something scum me would do

i cant remember urist's fos and i dont think there was much there to respond to but ill take a look when i get home to my laptop

the deadline in the votecount autoupdates, we still have 16 hours left as of right now

[Skygazer]

my problem with NM being scum is why would he try to setup/endgame with an exilon mislynch

[Skygazer]

hi i just got off of work

i wanna work through this a bit tonight or tomorrow

[Skygazer]

i feel like NM would be the easy obvious choice here and my gut is torn between lynchbait and scum

i was TRing exilon/gimmick coming into today but baezu/NM just feels too easy? like theyre both historically lynchbait ig

[Skygazer]

thats fair

i just got out of a game where scum were in the rlly obvious scum pool and it threw me off because scum usuallyyyyy doesn't just neatly fall into the majority consensus

and i said NM can be sorted through PoE and PoE basically has him at scum for me rn

lylos got me paranoid tho

[Skygazer]

my opinion is im not scum

will effort post if i can find some coffee

[Skygazer]

I am thinking about it and I did a few skimthroughs and ISO reading in order to get something.

My starting point readlist is as follows:

Gimm Town
NM scum

hold up!! what changed between now and 421??

Skygazer comes in and doesn't change Wilky's vote, which I find interesting and suspicious. Back then the reason was compromise lynch but scum!skygazer has a lot to gain from shifting attention from NM and defending him based on meta. Also in hindsight skygazer doesn't actually produce a read on NM and just shoves sorting NM into a future occasion... which is fine but it's now day 3 and no attempt has been made on Skygazer's part to do so. (even assuming Town!NM here this is an easy and reliable setup for a mislynch later on.)

Yes, I didn't change wilky's vote. Moomn was the largest wagon and we had less than two days til deadline. I'm not sure how that's interesting or suspicious. If you go and read literally any NM game this aligns with his town meta and scum meta. I'm not going to let a player who could very easily be town get lynched when I had readon to SR moomn (as I mentioned, their read on NM was tmi, there should be no reason to actually have a TR on NM there). I mentioned that NM needed to be sorted on process of elimination. I have myself as town, gim/ex as likely town, leaving baezu and NM as likely scum. That's how I've arrived at my NM read today. Up until both PRs died, I also had a PR read on NM which is why I didn't want to see him voted off D1. He's playing almost exactly like he was in a game I modded off-site where he got lol-lynched as an

innocent child

(!!!) who hadn't outed yet. Now that both PRs are dead, NM's play here makes less sense to me and I don't need to white-knight him to save what I thought was a power-role.

I'm absolutely willing to believe there were 2 scum on the Moomn wagon especially when the other wagon was NM; this makes it more likely that NM is scum along with someone on the Moomn wagon and the only possibility would be Skygazer.

scum very much don't like voting together. if you meta dive me you'll see I especially don't like voting with scum and would gladly D1 bus if i needed to. regardless, i think it's poor play to arrive at that gamestate conclusion and say that i must be the only option just because you arbitrarily cleared gimm earlier for no apparent reason after having gimm as scum D2.

Day 2 a wagon starts to form on NM with Gimm and Baezu both voting for him and then conveniently Skygazer does not address the NM case and instead votes Froce, beginning a counterwagon that Not_Mafia follows later on the day after being prodded. Baezu then puts Froce at L-1, but removes the vote after realizing what it is (and btw this pings me as townie). Quick note post 352 is pvturist posting an interesting readlist and I think he was on to something there, where had Skygazer as scumleaning.

again, why would I address a wagon on what I thought was a PR? it'd be bad play to scream from the rooftops "hey everyone! stop voting NM! I think he's a PR!" I think you're reading too much into Baezu's unvote, it definitely seems like something scum would do to avoid the attention of an L-1 vote and to gain towncred since it looks townie at the surface level but is easy to fake.

[Skygazer]

VOTE: notmafia

meh dont bother

[Skygazer]

Hi Sashaddin! Sorry you had to roll scum.

[Skygazer]

a read/PoE! also you havent been hammered yet!

[Skygazer]

you being quickhammered by two scum thus ending the game in a town loss

[Skygazer]

go for it

[Skygazer]

Town

Skyraider

Lean Scum

Exilon, Gimm1ck

Scum

Baezu

lol scum you didn't even realize that I should be confscum from your perspective, that's a pretty bad slip

[Skygazer]

feel like sash came in trying to buddy me before realizing that mechanically he had to vote me lol

[Skygazer]

could go for sash/baezu, having baezu at the bottom of his scum list could've been distancing

[Skygazer]

24 hours to reach a lynch or scum wins by default

[Skygazer]

NM gave literally no read on baezu

:thonk:

[Skygazer]

baezu is definitely the most likely sash partner

[Skygazer]

nah ur confscum to me right now

there's a good chance you're distancing with that to avoid the lynch tomorrow and a slight chance you're not scum with baezu and trying to push us there for a scum win

[Skygazer]

gimm has some slight equity with NM i can go into why soonish, im on my phone rn

[Skygazer]

you haven't been hammered after i voted

[Skygazer]

NM literally posts like this in most games ive seen him in; its not alignment indicative and its not going to change his posting style in this game so just trust me when i say if he's town he knows how to catch scum (esp later in the game) and if he's scum it'll just take some process of elimination sorting

im concerned that NM could be seen as an easy mislynch for scum to pull off w/o catching any flak

i wouldn't go as far to describe him as lynchbait because the people who've played w him tend to know better but i'm p sure none of you have played w him so maybe in this context he has lhf qualities

thats fair

i just got out of a game where scum were in the rlly obvious scum pool and it threw me off because scum usuallyyyyy doesn't just neatly fall into the majority consensus

and i said NM can be sorted through PoE and PoE basically has him at scum for me rn

lylos got me paranoid tho

VOTE: notmafia

meh dont bother

This looks like she was setting a trap for my slot from the start.

if i was setting a trap why would i open the day up still paranoid that your slot could be a trap/easy mislynch for scum to push? it literally took me until midway through the day to be comfy with you being scum and even further than that to lay down a vote. calling me defending NM for being lynchbait (which he is usually) early game to set up a trap for lylo is a big stretch and it just seems like ur grasping at this point

[Skygazer]

y'all gonna be online before deadline

the 21 hours thing makes me uncomfy

[Skygazer]

are you just going to call me fake instead of responding to my actual content

[Skygazer]

if i was setting a trap why would i open the day up still paranoid that your slot could be a trap/easy mislynch for scum to push? it literally took me until midway through the day to be comfy with you being scum and even further than that to lay down a vote. calling me defending NM for being lynchbait (which he is usually) early game to set up a trap for lylo is a big stretch and it just seems like ur grasping at this point

By his style, N_M is better off being killed later in the week. By keeping the lynchbait around longer, scum risk hitting better lynches sooner.

you're missing my main point which is if i was setting up a trap why wouldnt i just come in guns blazing d3 trying to lynch NM

[Skygazer]

you're missing my main point which is if i was setting up a trap why wouldnt i just come in guns blazing d3 trying to lynch NM

Subtlety? seeding the idea, then waiting the right moment to pounce...

why would i need to seed the idea of NM being scum lol

i still came into D3 defending your slot. i wasn't seeding anything.

VOTE: notmafia

meh dont bother

This post comes 10 minutes after the announcement of a replacement, voting the empty slot so the new guy has a harder time filling N_M's shoes. I find this opportunistic.

you were gonna catch a vote from me regardless after my last string of votes before the replacement, how is it opportunistic to vote you before the slot is filled compared to after?

[Skygazer]

calling me opportunistic with regards to your slot is such an inaccurate shade considering how i've been treating your slot all day

you're flailing

[Skygazer]

*all game

[Skygazer]

i think this is kinda obvious by now tbh

[Skygazer]

i feel like baezu's just gonna lurk this out tbh esp if they're scum but ok

[Skygazer]

can you link to that game

[Skygazer]

it was sky/baezu, does that mean we deserve the win less?

[Skygazer]

can you link to that game

I thought this post in was kind of a slip for me; the only reason I would ask to see a game of their's in this context is to shade them for meta reasons, considering I already would have them as confscum

[Skygazer]

good game! 2/2 in wins for 2019, got that 100% win rate going

[Skygazer]

In general nightkilled townies should be sheeped more, I thought that I'd at least pick up some flak for urist dying! I'd say that me going high-effort in lylo after being relatively low effort is a pretty good scum indicator as well, at least for me. Sashaddin also correctly guessed that we were planning on having his slot be the most likely lylo lynch. Sasha, I feel like you could've pushed me harder considering you knew I had to be scum, but you also replaced into NM's slot so you can't really be faulted for being lynched.

pedit: sasha, twilight posting is generally okay as you're technically alive up until you flip