Newbie 2129 - Postgame

[humaneatingmonkey]

good evening ladies and gentlemen

could someone give me a rundown to help me catch up faster, that would be wonderful

[humaneatingmonkey]

so who's scumreading me, and why

[humaneatingmonkey]

and Seven's approach to happy was kinda inconsistent, especially now we know it was a PR

first she said he's leaning scum in her eyes

then I'd asked who she'd lim, and she didn't mention him

when I reminded her that she scumreads him, she said she'd be okay with limming him after all

kinda dancing around the person they knew they'd nkill?

and if Seven had been town, how would you have explained it? or have you stopped figuring out an alternate explanation here?

[humaneatingmonkey]

i put slight scumlean for happy because most of his posts were unclear/not that relevant/general tomfoolery which can be a bit scummy in itself, since he's not contributing much game-relevant info. i put down smiley as a second choice candidate to lim while looking at my own post on my reads, and recalled that his earlier stuff was mayhaps slightly scummy/generally odd, which is why i put him down. his later posts however are more contributory, definitely more so than happy, and now that i think about it harder, happy might be a better candidate for a lim rather than smiley, since it would be better to keep somebody who has more relevant input in the game rather than someone who doesn't.

no one sees this very town stream of consciousness here?

[humaneatingmonkey]

is the idea she's scum because she's avoiding to eliminate happy?
if scum!seveneyes identified the pr, why would she need to avoid pushing the slot if the opportunity presented itself? doesn't she want to push the slot?

[humaneatingmonkey]

1.FINAL

Votecount 1.FINAL

MagicalSteve (ELIMINATED): iamveryhappy, The Bulge, SmileyDude1, TheHoldSteady, Civil Scum
SmileyDude1 (1): CCGeek
Civil Scum (1): SzmarzLeek

Not Voting (2): SevenEyes, MagicalSteve

With 9 players alive, it took 5 votes to secure an elimination.

So we eliminated town yesterday with this motley crew of four beautiful people (happy flipped town), and we're shopping for answers outside of it?

[humaneatingmonkey]

guys who's running the game

good chance they're scum

[humaneatingmonkey]

with the green flip we can pretty much guarantee there was at least 1 scum on the wagon, maybe 2. fmpov i think its likely the scum on steve's wagon were also on mine/brassherald's.

Votecount 1.FINAL

MagicalSteve

(ELIMINATED):

iamveryhappy

,

The Bulge

, SmileyDude1, TheHoldSteady, Civil Scum

Votecount 1.06

brassherald

(E-1): KawaiiMikuStan,

MagicalSteve

, Civil Scum, TheHoldSteady

i solidly tr szmarz (kawaii slot) and smiley so will be looking at how viable a cs/holdsteady team is today, but just from the wagon analysis id bet money its at least one of them.

well this guy has the right idea. at least he isn't scamming this game.

[humaneatingmonkey]

though if scum, very clever to push the right strategy forward and then gently excuse yourself from the narrative

[humaneatingmonkey]

hello Merlyn, nice to have you here

my reads hasn't changed because we didn't have much content

townleans


Bulge (very adamant to lim innocent Steve)
Smiley (I like the engagement and attempts to break the silence and move the game
patchwork (when Geek wasn't feverish he played well)
THS (overall low volume but decent observations)


scumreads
Merlyn
humaneating monkey

scummy game from Civil Scum and Seven, avoiding the game much, especially with Seven dancing around happy; also it seems like they only provided input to the game when prodded to do so or questioned by other, no own thoughts

ehhh

are your townreads just activity-based?
except for THS, interesting, you think their observations are decent? what about their observations are decent?

[humaneatingmonkey]

is the idea she's scum because she's avoiding to eliminate happy?
if scum!seveneyes identified the pr, why would she need to avoid pushing the slot if the opportunity presented itself? doesn't she want to push the slot?

the thing is, she scumread it but "forgot" to push it

and the whole game was scummy, playing to avoid the prods and mostly talking when pushed to that

that doesn't sound like scum, but rather just a player who wasn't really that interested in playing the game

[humaneatingmonkey]

come on guys, who's been running the show. i want intuitive answers. type a name in your reply box and then hit submit. ultra instinct. go.

[humaneatingmonkey]

leek, it's my slot. i know it's town. do you want me to pussyfoot around the obvious?

[humaneatingmonkey]

seven being "scummily lurking" and giving "forced, weird answers" is your opinion and the story you're telling.

i clearly see a newbie who thought she'd try mafia, was uninterested, and politely excused herself out of the game.

[humaneatingmonkey]

can you really tell me looking at Seven's iso that it's an obvious town?

yeah man, it's a town iso. she's been nothing but off-the-cuff replies. it's the stream-of-consciousness shit that makes it obvious.

[humaneatingmonkey]

i think we can slightly speculate that iavh was probably tempting the kill a lot by softing clumsily in the beginning

[humaneatingmonkey]

i'm finding it hard to believe that leek would really think that seven is scum for not pushing what leek thinks is an obvious PR slot. surely it's more beneficial for scum to push for a TPR elimination, and then seal the deal with another chance at a TPR during the NK?

i'm reaaaally finding the reason to be forced.

[humaneatingmonkey]

i'm going to sleep. tomorrow i'll iso everyone (or at least start with Bulge, SmileyDude, THS, and CS). if i got too busy, then let's hope i survive until day 3.

good night guys

[humaneatingmonkey]

woah there

what truths am i manipulating, my dude

i hear you, you wanna eliminate seven because of activity
but what i'm concerned is that you're reinforcing your activity-based scumread with speculations about dancing around a slot seven wants to NK

[humaneatingmonkey]

and just now, you've tried to call me scum for defending my own slot and being manipulative and deaf about your arguments

it's hard not to feel like you've decided i'm your elimination, and just inventing reasons to justify that now

[humaneatingmonkey]

do you want me to clarify so my post makes more sense and so that we can communicate better?
or do you just want to portray me as nonsense so you can continue pushing me

[humaneatingmonkey]

i'm not trying to put it like that at all

if you feel like your reason is deeper, feel free to elaborate

i don't think seven's inconsistency was weird. i think it's obvious that she's an uninterested player who didn't really like the game, and everything else makes sense after that. in a vacuum, even if i don't know seven's alignment, i'd say that still NAI.

[humaneatingmonkey]

what you need to know is... ~I~ think your reasons are shallow as heck. If you think your reasons run deep, please elaborate. I'm not making you anything.

[humaneatingmonkey]

i thought her tone was really honest. her readslist is just emotions about players in the game and i think newbscum usually feels a bit more fabricated and "right" because they're informed. she reads totally uninformed.

[humaneatingmonkey]

life has been very busy, there's not much time for me to sort through the thread

i think we should eliminate between The Bulge, Merlyn (Civil Scum slot), SmileyDude1, and THS.

Whoever gets popular support, I'll back.

If it's still me then I will claim in 24 hours.

[humaneatingmonkey]

VOTE: Merlyn

[humaneatingmonkey]

still good with my vote

[humaneatingmonkey]

yeah leek the limpool is pretty wide that's why we need to just end the day and get a flip

[humaneatingmonkey]

if you really want reads, i think you're town leek

[humaneatingmonkey]

but wait a second

Smiley did you really write this pairing post in 10 minutes

like c'mon

you published it 10 minutes after the nkill announcement

how

it's a prepped post through the night. i'm still trying to figure out if as scum or if as town. he did this in the last game i modded for.

[humaneatingmonkey]

if i want to no effort, i'll just drop a vote on obviously between Smiley and THS

1.FINAL

Votecount 1.FINAL

MagicalSteve (ELIMINATED): iamveryhappy, The Bulge, SmileyDude1, TheHoldSteady, Civil Scum
SmileyDude1 (1): CCGeek
Civil Scum (1): SzmarzLeek

Not Voting (2): SevenEyes, MagicalSteve

With 9 players alive, it took 5 votes to secure an elimination.

i think if i did that, game wouldn't end.

[humaneatingmonkey]

leek's posts aren't impossible to fake as town

[humaneatingmonkey]

between Smiley and THS, i'd rather vote Smiley because i think the prepped post is probably a scumtell

[humaneatingmonkey]

THS is fine, he didn't hammer me yesterday before i had the chance to claim. that's probably +town

[humaneatingmonkey]

i don't townread flower

[humaneatingmonkey]

leek why are you town

[humaneatingmonkey]

Immediately, the fact that the scum team hit 2/2 in terms of PR night kills points to an experienced scum team (i'd need to check later, but I don't think The Bulge gave off PR vibes either so at least one of those shots were like non-obvious)

bad vibes

[humaneatingmonkey]

Was not expecting to see The Bulge slot flip night 2 (thought it was going to be a Leek kill if I had to guess). Going to need some time to think if there are any ramifications on such a kill (beyond PR hunting).

really bad vibes

[humaneatingmonkey]

i wonder if i iso this dude, what other shit would i see

[humaneatingmonkey]

if they found another role then I'd guess they have a role cop? but it doesn't matter I guess anymore

are you familiar with the setup?

[humaneatingmonkey]

relax chief, day just started

[humaneatingmonkey]

obviously we are in ELo and the smartest thing to do is assume everybody's playing the best scum game ever.

[humaneatingmonkey]

i was busy. you'll understand if it was your nth mafia game in the newbies as a replacement. see how engaged you will be when you're on the chopping block and you're VT anyway

[humaneatingmonkey]

ok so i'm sick and have dm'd alianna to replace out

before that very rushed thoughts:
i expected clems to flip pr, albeit not doc, all his d1 nonsense was kind of telling to me more than it usually is, but am more surprised at whoever decided to kill the iavh slot.

i do not like smiley's case because i had been reading, and surely people could tell from my live read session that was cutshort by my fever; I'm pretty sure that's room enough for progression, you may disagree tho. also keep in mind that I never actually even voted for the lim, which partly was due to all this, but imo having steve in my limpool should not really equate scummy by itself.

i still HATE the szmarzleek slot that just feels weirdly coasty and pockety and IMHO shouldnot be trusted. him being the main resistance to steve does not prove anything because it's very easily fakeable as scum.

holdsteady is the one person i still believe is hard town in my eyes.

i also think bulge can make or break this game with proper decisions because it seems like he's the one town is gradually gravitating to as the leader. imo look at one of civil scum (by wagonomics) or szmarzleek first.

side thought, smiley+bulge team would probably mean disaster for town.

this was flower's slot, and this looks like the most town-indicative post in the game thus far

[humaneatingmonkey]

he was about to replace out and i don't think there's scum motivation to drop this on his way out

[humaneatingmonkey]

leek i'm concerned because i said there was a rolecop, and i find it impossible that you wouldn't read the setup for this game, and i'm thinking that you saying that is LAMIST behavior -- a scumtell

assure my mind that i'm just being paranoid.

[humaneatingmonkey]

*you said there was a rolecop EBWOP
(edit by way of post)

[humaneatingmonkey]

sorry, did you just say it's your third newbiegame

[humaneatingmonkey]

would you give examples of town games where you have prepared posts through the night

[humaneatingmonkey]

But why do you find motivation now with town in ELO and two dead PRs.

do i have motivation now? that's debatable. i haven't even read the entire game yet, FWIW. i'm just mostly skimming through events and isos. i'm gonna get there though.

[humaneatingmonkey]

by all means i think through VCA, smiley should be our number one elimination here. this guy only voted town. but the only reason i'm not instavoting smiley here is the prepared post is either a very strong scumtell or a very strong towntell.

i feel like the fact that the post was made without the night kill in mind and there was no post that was a reflection on the nightkill points towards smiley having no preparation for the night kill result at all (which if he had prepared, he would have had due to his work ethic) iirc in the game i modded, smiley made the post with the nightkill in mind.

i mean, smiley did play maybe the best newie scum game i've seen in this site. so it's 50/50 IMO.

[humaneatingmonkey]

Immediately, the fact that the scum team hit 2/2 in terms of PR night kills points to an experienced scum team (i'd need to check later, but I don't think The Bulge gave off PR vibes either so at least one of those shots were like non-obvious)

bad vibes

Elaborate? Think that's a reasonable observation to make given the events of this game so far

Was not expecting to see The Bulge slot flip night 2 (thought it was going to be a Leek kill if I had to guess). Going to need some time to think if there are any ramifications on such a kill (beyond PR hunting).

really bad vibes

Elaborate again? I thought Leek would eat the NK due to being a consensus townread. What's off about that?

i see "experienced" and it's just really referring to me. i'm the only experienced guy around left. but it's weird that you're not saying that. it's like you're setting me up as the losing elimination through subtle language and i don't see why you would do that as town.

[humaneatingmonkey]

I was wondering why you asked me that question when you should know I don't have many games that I could pull from.

i wanted to know, and i haven't read any of your games apart from the one i modded.

[humaneatingmonkey]

leek, i think my reasons were pretty clear and if you don't understand anything, you can ask me questions.

i established why i had the limpool of 4

and I'm pretty sure i'm perfectly capable of getting your townread by efforting in this thread, it's clear how to manipulate you

I'm just not interested in doing that

[humaneatingmonkey]

i think we're living in a {smiley, ths/leek} world

[humaneatingmonkey]

why did you sr Merlyn yesterday?

VCA as Civil Scum, and when push came to shove, she opted to eliminate me instead of going for a scumread.

[humaneatingmonkey]

a lot of what i know and understand about this game is just intuitive for me at this point. I've been doing this a long time. my process might seem opaque, and i might find it difficult to relate my ideas about this game to you because i'm unsure which would be confusing to newbies or not. but there's a process there. you just have to meet me halfway so we can understand each other.

that's if you're really interested in trying to sort my slot. i understand it's gonna be very easy for scum to push for my elimination here. at some point, it's also town's responsibility to make that outreach so they can make the right vote. otherwise, we just lose - but this isn't my newbie game. it's

your

newbie game.

[humaneatingmonkey]

you dont talk to others, you dont ask questions to your scum candidates, you dont share your thoughts on them

don't you think that's an exaggeration? if you're town, avoid doing this. exaggerations cloud objective judgment.

none of your reasons are clear

which ones?

at the end you vote Merlyn to save yourself

i voted Merlyn because i thought she was the most likely scum

[humaneatingmonkey]

and i'm not sure where you get the idea that defending myself from elimination is a scumtell

what do you imagine town would do? if you were town, how would you avoid your elimination -- which could end up losing the game? do you just roll up to a ball and die?

if you have a set of scumtells that you blanketly apply on every game to judge a slot's alignment... then you're doing it wrong.

[humaneatingmonkey]

the reason i'm not voting smiley here dude.. is because flower's slot hasn't showed up yet

[humaneatingmonkey]

i also pretty much explained that flower's slot made the most town-indicative post in this game, and i'm just not gonna vote that in a 5p ELo when Smiley has that obvious scum bloodlust for a perfect game.

[humaneatingmonkey]

it means the game isn't my learning experience, so i'm less inclined to do the homework.

[humaneatingmonkey]

Why were other three people in your limpool?

i feel like you really haven't done the VCA, that's why you're asking this question

if you're town, you probably should

[humaneatingmonkey]

you're exaggerating that i haven't been talking to others, asking questions, sharing my thoughts

[humaneatingmonkey]

Why were other three people in your limpool?

i feel like you really haven't done the VCA, that's why you're asking this question

if you're town, you probably should

if you're so experienced, you should know that VCAs can both help you and lead you astray

would you agree that townies are more often wrong than scum in their voting?

like Bulge limmed Steve in cold blood, should I've scumread them for it? I did the opposite

no, but then you'll get why i had them as my D2 elim pool.

[humaneatingmonkey]

this is gonna sound like a gaslighting question: but what gaslighting have i been doing?

[humaneatingmonkey]

you didn't case anyone

your reasons to lim someone fit inside one line

"i didn't case anyone" is also an exaggeration

you should stop this nephew

[humaneatingmonkey]

...leek, you're gonna have a hard time accepting this, but yes that's how forum mafia is played at the highest level.

[humaneatingmonkey]

that's your contribution to this game

okay stop. this is starting to feel like bad faith.

[humaneatingmonkey]

no, it's also my fault in that case. but i'm explaining why i don't feel like doing the homework.

[humaneatingmonkey]

im really not interested in teaching anyone. i think this game can't be taught. you just lose and lose and lose until you eventually get an intuition for it. my first attempts at being good at this game is developing an almost mechanical rubric and it was fucking trash.

[humaneatingmonkey]

why woul iit be easier to push you, an experienced player, instead of a newbie like me? shouldn't an experienced player know how to get townread easily? how to clear themselves?

mate experienced... newbie... it doesn't matter. that's not what gets people to vote people. it would be very easy to push me because i came into this slot already under fire, and i do not have the time to establish control over the thread. and i bet if you ask the three of you active ones, you'll all choose me as the elimination so i think I'm accurate in my statement.

an experienced scum player would probably play to get townread easily, but an experienced town player is more often than not the first choice for elimination among a group of newbies. just browse the other games.

[humaneatingmonkey]

why not THS?

[humaneatingmonkey]

You don't look for potential associations towards me.

it's a crappy way to play the game, or at least it hasn't worked for me. it only works to justify a case and get locked into confirmation bias. i could enumerate permutations of relationships, but it's really a fools errand.

it's much more efficient for me to identify alignment-indicative moments and then judge the slot through that.

i don't think your slot has any town-indicative moments, compared to leek or ths

much more difficult to discriminate between leek and ths both had given me town vibes

[humaneatingmonkey]

you answered your own question not that long ago

you being more likely town doesn't make you locktown. there's no reason to eliminate you from the pool if leek doesn't believe you can never be scum.

[humaneatingmonkey]

(sort of) mentioned Merlyn once in 552, 694, and then never again before this vote

inaccurate. I've been talking about Merlyn's slot outside of the posts you mentioned.

[humaneatingmonkey]

Cook what's your Smiley read

[humaneatingmonkey]

it's just smiley guys, don't overthink it

[humaneatingmonkey]

i remember the previous day i was

today i actually felt like you were genuinely trying to sort me, which makes me feel better about your slot

[humaneatingmonkey]

dude, it's not a lowblow. newbie is not an insult.

[humaneatingmonkey]

it's more like

ask me questions. i'm unmotivated. i do understand i'm most likely the lim, but it's not enough to push me to tryhard because it isn't really my game.

[humaneatingmonkey]

i just said man. it's not my newbie game. i replaced in to help you guys move the game forward and not get stuck, mostly.

[humaneatingmonkey]

that said, it's becoming obvious from my POV that it's Smiley and THS.

[humaneatingmonkey]

tsk i really dont wanna read the game to confirm that

[humaneatingmonkey]

ugh fine. whatever. i'll go get coffee and i'll read the game.

[humaneatingmonkey]

from this page:

one of these people is scum trying to distance from my flip

[humaneatingmonkey]

There's four players scumreading HEM so we need to ask ourselves at this point is this the town lim that scum is trying to ride to end of game or is someone here trying to distance from him

damn THS I thought that too

it's going too easy isn't it

[humaneatingmonkey]

woah you're right

i forgot we're in limlo

[humaneatingmonkey]

if you eliminate me because of that, I'll take the blame for the loss

[humaneatingmonkey]

i'm gonna get coffee

[humaneatingmonkey]

yo so this is going to be the last newbie

thats so sad

[humaneatingmonkey]

i wish i didnt replace in lmao

[humaneatingmonkey]

honestly guys i wish i could do more

i still have work in the next 8 hours

i can probably rummage through the thread for answers later

[humaneatingmonkey]

HEM if you're town I honestly hope you're not like this every game

Not how SEs are supposed to act at all

no I'm not like this every game

it's poor timing for me

[humaneatingmonkey]

i'll give this my best shot later

[humaneatingmonkey]

VOTE: SmileyDude1

i'm so sorry. this will really bum you out but I'm not scum. I'll accept the blame postgame

[humaneatingmonkey]

everything i said was bullshit btw

[humaneatingmonkey]

THS, congrats on winning the game.