Mini Normal 2239 | AQAtPimP | Game Over

[MargotRosa]

Also, for what it's worth, the "in your faction" bit was what made me wonder whether there was a mafia aligned vigilante in the game. Likely just a standardised part of role PMs based on others saying it's impossible

[MargotRosa]

I hope it is at least obvious why I felt that it was likely scum has some power we don't know about.

That said, I think it's worth pointing out that my role is pointless at this stage in the game. There is no universe, except one in which Town kills ssbm today (which I don't think we should do) in which my role actually does anything

[MargotRosa]

Like, the way I see it, I exist just to be a backup in case the vig dies before they can shoot their one shot, otherwise the likelihood I actually do anything is miniscule to none

[MargotRosa]

I didn't crumb because I felt, given that I'd said outright, d1, that I had an interesting role I was willing to reveal, I made clear that:

a) My role would reveal something interesting about the type of game that we are in; and
b) If I was targeted by Mafia, it wouldn't be the end of the world.

Which was as much as I was willing to reveal about myself anyway

[MargotRosa]

I also didn't want scum to know there was a vigilante until everyone else did, but given that the vigilante finder died d1, it became obvious to me that Mafia already knew

Revealing my role wouldn't have given anyone else any more information than they already had

[MargotRosa]

Margot, your only gate is Backup? You have unlimited shots once the Vigilante dies?

My gate is that I inherit any vigilante role from my (Town) faction. I took from that that I get the same modifiers.

[MargotRosa]

Adding on to earlier fwiw, I think it's almost certainly Salsa and Datisi, given that they both jumped onto a wagon against me as soon as I revealed my role, which I imagine would give just about any Town slot at least reason to pause for 5 seconds and think it through, rather than immediately jump onto a wagon against the claim

[MargotRosa]

If I get whacked before I come back (I have to oversee the many hour student politics election/grand event of the year this afternoon/evening *shudders*), here is my reads list, without going back through the thread meticulously

Town lock, obvs:
Enchant
Ssbm

As close as possible to town lock without being town lock:
Ari

Probably scum:
Chaos
Salsa

Scum:
DAtisi

[MargotRosa]

I will try to keep an eye on the thread nonetheless. Likely going to be in Zoom meetings until around 1am my time (or about 9 hours from now)

[MargotRosa]

To make sure I am not accused of not responding to things, I am going to go through important posts (admittedly, this is obviously subjective) from the last two odd pages, arranged to respond to each slot all at once:

Spoiler: Datisi

That's exactly what I thought your role was.

i'm sorry, how did you manage to work that out? was there a super obvious crumb i'm missing?

and uh. town backup vigilante. so there's already 3 confirmed towns in the game, two ic's and our vig. (i'm assuming 1-shot.) so you're telling me, once scum manages to do the mechanically correct play and kill the 1-shot vigilante, their reward is... town getting a full vigilante? who is practically another ic since they can confirm themselves once they shoot? and it's most likely gonna result in town getting an extra yeet (since two vig shots = 1 extra yeet)? *and* even if scum knows of the backup vig, and even if they kill them the night after they kill the og vig, they're still fucked because the vig will be able to get the shot off during that night anyway?

i dunno. if this mess is somehow balanced, then scum has a literal metric shit ton of power to counteract the town.

and worse, it still doesn't explain where tf the nightkill went. nobody here is something like bulletproof and sitting on this info for shits and giggles, right?

I have a theory about the missed NK, but I don't think it's helpful to discuss.

well, you're not outing any power roles, and it doesn't seem like we have much else to talk about now, so...?

ok, if someone here is a bp, you are aware that scum already knows you're bp because they tried to shoot you and failed, right? (unless ari is the protective or our protective is purposefully staying silent in which case i will have words post game)

but also like, you're expecting me to believe
3 ic's, one of them is a 1-shot vig
either one of them being some sorta bp OR there being a some sorta protect/block role

AND a backup vigilante who just goes full berserk ungated vigilante once scum manages to kill the gated vig?

nah. nah fam. kyouko has a good point that scum was aware of the fact that vig exists from the beginning. which is why margot's crumbs of "i could reveal my role if i wanted" give even less towncred considering she could have been planning a backup vig claim for a long while. and not like that "crumb" is backup vig specific either. like she could've had multiple of them planned and then decided to go with that once she saw that she won't have to "prove" the fact she's a vig

I think it's pretty obvious to everyone why my role would be something like this honestly

If anyone is wondering, I think the reason Mafia didn't have a night kill, if not because of BP, was because Mafia intentionally NKd. It's the only thing that makes sense to me, especially given that most players who are left are regular posters on the site.

I don't know if this is justified by unrevealed Scum power, or some other galaxy brain play, but who knows?

I also find it really odd that it hasn't occurred to you that, maybe, the reason my role doesn't explain why Enchant is still alive might be because, shock horror, I'm telling the truth, and the truth of why Enchant is still alive is yet to be revealed?!?!

Spoiler: Ari

i think 2 ICs, a vig and a backup vig is already pretty stacked in terms of town power so probably scum forgot to shoot at night?

I don't think Datisi forgets to submit a nightkill

I don't think anyone forgets to submit a night kill. This game has been so high stakes, and Mafia is clearly playing so well, the idea they throw at the night before ELO-1 is astonishing. As I have said earlier, either they were blocked, or they've done it intentionally.

Spoiler: Salsa

Yeah, keep the obvscum(s) alive and kill me, town will literally win

Yes, I'm vt.

UNVOTE: CO

VOTE: MR

I have no clue what to make of this. I find it suspicious that you have gone from being a pretty reliable slot, and fairly engaged in Scum hunting (from memory) to this. I feel more confident in my scum read of you by the hour.



I had quoted things from ssbm and Chaos as well, but upon reflection, they are all things I've already responded to, so I won't waste time and respond twice

[Salsabil Faria]

Hmm, now I'm much more confused! Thanks

IF,

MR

vs

Datisi

is TvT, then the scum team is

Ari

/

CO

.

UNVOTE: MR

VOTE: CO

[Aristeia]

if they were blocked i think the blocker would claim?

i doubt we have a protective since the first IC died.

i can't think of a reason why mafia would choose to no kill and give the town an extra elim

[MargotRosa]

if they were blocked i think the blocker would claim?

i doubt we have a protective since the first IC died.

i can't think of a reason why mafia would choose to no kill and give the town an extra elim

In which case, who in this game do you see as forgetting to submit a NK.

Like, what's more likely? Scum has managed to mastermind their way to this day and forgotten to NK at a critical moment, that Enchant was BP or someone isn't claiming protective, or that scum has some reason to not kill.

Hell, the fact we are having these wild arguments based on this very question seems to me one reason to not kill.

Idk, I just think people are taking two scum who are foolish enough not to kill at a critical moment as totally within the realms of poasibility

[Enchant]

Not popular opinion, mafia turned peaceful and can be pardoned.

Imo, i think Salsa is better choice for now.

[Datisi]

Also, for what it's worth, the "in your faction" bit was what made me wonder whether there was a mafia aligned vigilante in the game. Likely just a standardised part of role PMs based on others saying it's impossible

no, no, and no. a role-specific backup inherits the role as soon as one role dies, regardless of if the alignment is the same or not. the universal backup is the one that only inherits the same alignment's role. so there's no way that is a part of the "standardized role pm".

now, the reason i'm not going to kill you for this mistake alone is that vig is town only, so there is no way that a scum vig can die anyway. but to now think you're town, i also have to buy that the role pm was written in an unusual and indirect way. sounds more like you saw the sample role pm for univeral backup and decided to parrot it, not realizing they aren't the same.

which, btw, you should become a full vig once any vig dies. you wouldn't become 1-shot, and even if you did, you would have your shot regardless or not kyouko got her shot off. but i'm putting this one as a mistake that is more likely to happen during review, because normal games can be kinda wonky. but yeah.

[Salsabil Faria]

Enchant

is born to tunnel me

[Datisi]

I also find it really odd that it hasn't occurred to you that, maybe, the reason my role doesn't explain why Enchant is still alive might be because, shock horror, I'm telling the truth, and the truth of why Enchant is still alive is yet to be revealed?!?!

WHEN. everyone has claimed vt. unless someone is fakeclaiming for shits and giggles, when is this happening.

and please get your facts straight. i was voting you long before you claimed.

[Enchant]

Enchant

is born to tunnel me

Can't do anything with that. But i feel maybe we should take unexpected approach and take third option with Ari? Atleast i can't comprehend why she is townreaded, but i am not good at this so i tend to believe Kyouko at this matter.

[Salsabil Faria]

Uh! Don't feel bad! You're VERY GOOD at tunneling me This thing is started from that newbie where I was scum against you and you're salty from that game (but don't have balls to admit it ) which is hilarious because I lost that game

[Aristeia]

I somewhat doubt we have a protective because if we did then Roden shouldn't have died on N1.

Also 2 ICs + 1 Shot-Vig + killblocking role seems overpowered for a 13p mini.

it's possible both scum were just inactive and did not submit a nightkill - which would point towards Salsa/Chaos as niether have any posts on the site overnight and Salsa was VLA.

^

this is who I believe would forget to submit a nightkill because afk.

[MargotRosa]

Also, for what it's worth, the "in your faction" bit was what made me wonder whether there was a mafia aligned vigilante in the game. Likely just a standardised part of role PMs based on others saying it's impossible

no, no, and no. a role-specific backup inherits the role as soon as one role dies, regardless of if the alignment is the same or not. the universal backup is the one that only inherits the same alignment's role. so there's no way that is a part of the "standardized role pm".

now, the reason i'm not going to kill you for this mistake alone is that vig is town only, so there is no way that a scum vig can die anyway. but to now think you're town, i also have to buy that the role pm was written in an unusual and indirect way. sounds more like you saw the sample role pm for univeral backup and decided to parrot it, not realizing they aren't the same.

which, btw, you should become a full vig once any vig dies. you wouldn't become 1-shot, and even if you did, you would have your shot regardless or not kyouko got her shot off. but i'm putting this one as a mistake that is more likely to happen during review, because normal games can be kinda wonky. but yeah.

I'm going off a perfectly valid nterpretation of a role pm which I copied and pasted from a mod, which specifically says "in your faction"

[Aristeia]

You may not quote private communication of any kind. This includes moderator-supplied information (either real or fabricated) of any kind. Paraphrasing (for role claims, etc.) is acceptable.

[Aristeia]

do you like not know the rules around here :<

[MargotRosa]

Why wouldn't I have claimed universal backup then?

And I didn't quote. I copied and pasted. I figured that was ok

[MargotRosa]

I figured there was a difference