Mini Normal 2329: complex. [game over!]

[Hu Tao]

RN who are you most suspect of today

[Hu Tao]

Personally I'd eliminate NAS and not look back

[Hu Tao]

vote count 1.final

with 13 votes in play, it took 7 to make a decision. day 1 ended.

yeet

Naerys [7]:

Random Nurse

, davesaz, geraintm, Hu Tao, Titus, Aristeia, NotAScum

[HAMMER]

NotAScum [2]:

Dannflor, Klick

not voting [4]:

Naerys, KayJayQueue, Political Clout, Psyche

mod notes

fun fact: all flavour images this game have been provided by our wonderful backup mod GeorgeBailey!

flavour

So based on wagon stuff. Naerys is town, PC is town, Kay is highly likely town, Psyche I think is town based on Klick kill (if it actually was a vigilante then they should say so, cause that changes this read)

We know Klick is town. So that means all 3 scum were on Naerys' wagon or Dann is scum assuming everything above is correct.

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: Naerys

Given that there's probably zero chance HT or Psyche (the two most probable scums in my eyes) would be limmed today, I'm going with the third most probable option. Also another nearly 5 days to end to D1? I'm getting bored with these random D1 banters.

VOTE: Naerys

Weird votes in quick succession it feels like.

I agree with that

[Hu Tao]

I think reading hu tao as trying to stroke RN’s ego is an uncharitable interpretation

I was hoping you'd be the night kill so I wouldn't have to worry about trying to read you

[Hu Tao]

well if I'm the only person who is actually annoyed at how RN played d1 I guess maybe I'm wrong and that is how most people actually views this so whatever

UNVOTE:

I feel your anger is a bit weird. Since it's not like RN controlled everything. In fact I'd say it took way too long to vote Naerys. And you're acting like you and NAS quick votes weren't a factor

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: titus

I think you're still on the wrong track here

[Hu Tao]

I await your majesty's commands

This doesn't feel real. Seems like you're trying to create the narrative of "upset townie" than actually being upset. Like I don't see what RN did that was so bad

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: titus

I think you're still on the wrong track here

no offense but i don't think highly of your reads this game

I was wrong on Naerys but right on Klick

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: NotAScum

Okay how about we vote the obvious scum so we all feel better about ourselves tomorrow

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: Ari

Don't tempt me with a good time

[Hu Tao]

well if I'm the only person who is actually annoyed at how RN played d1 I guess maybe I'm wrong and that is how most people actually views this so whatever

UNVOTE:

I feel your anger is a bit weird. Since it's not like RN controlled everything. In fact I'd say it took way too long to vote Naerys. And you're acting like you and NAS quick votes weren't a factor

so it took a long time to kill Naerys but also I voted quickly

you can't even keep your shitty narrative consistent in one post

Clearly I mean you and NAS voting quickly together

[Hu Tao]

i'll kill not a scum too

I don't think Ari is scum

Join!

[Hu Tao]

I've never seen Ari act like this before. Any one else?

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: Ari

Don't tempt me with a good time

what even is this perspective

do you even think i'm mafia

Do you think I'm mafia?

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: Ari

Don't tempt me with a good time

what even is this perspective

do you even think i'm mafia

Do you think I'm mafia?

yes

Then it's clear what perspective you think it is then. Why ask?

[Hu Tao]

Apparently I sleep at the wrong times. And already we have another self vote? Okay, this is going to get interesting. (Are self votes this common? I find it odd but if it’s normal I will stop getting hung up on it)

They aren't

[Hu Tao]

I suppose it's possible may have had that mindset and opted for Klick instead. Perhaps they haven't shot at me Night 1.

Guess I'm gonna actually have to read this thread.

I think it's more likely scum were scared of a watcher or doctor than vig shooting obv town klick

[Hu Tao]

Then it's clear what perspective you think it is then. Why ask?

just because I think you're mafia angling to vote me doesn't mean I won't give you a chance to explain yourself in case i'm wrong

Who else do you think is scum?

[Hu Tao]

Because your case yesterday was me and Naerys scum together

[Hu Tao]

I think gera and Dave are the only ones who didn't check in.

[Hu Tao]

Who else do you think is scum?

If I had to bet on a team it'd probably be like hu tao, dave, political clout

0/2 probably 0/3 tbh

[Hu Tao]

we should be killing off notascum

Agreed!

[Hu Tao]

well you'd be objectively wrong.

not voting [4]: Naerys, KayJayQueue, Political Clout, Psyche

I have at least weak suspicions of two of the living on this list, so no I'm not wrong.

what are you even talking about?

I'm saying that focusing only on the people voting Naerys is wrong, and this is an objectively right position to take.

VOTE: davesaz

Don't be distracted, comrade. Vote NAS

[Hu Tao]

maybe its just Hu Tao + Titus + Psyche

Maybe!

[Hu Tao]

do you even have a case for not a scum

so notascum ended as the second biggest wagon of yesterday and was discussed at length as a potential scumread by tons of people
but aristeia, who went out of her way to push through the naeyrs wagon through against a wealth of resistance, apparently did not notice anyone post reasons for voting NAS either 1) back when anyone made these posts, or 2) while reflecting on the outcome of Day and Night 1
aristeia even bothered to spend a post examining NAS's game history before peeking at even one post someone's made this game explainaing their NAS scumread
supposing this slot is town -- which i suppose is not certain! -- the amount of wasted effort here is breathtaking

Good post

[Hu Tao]

Who townreads NotAScum and why?

[Hu Tao]

ok so my hesitation with NotAScum is that I think Political Clout is scum and I am pretty sure if that's the case then PC's weird hard town case on NAS yesterday was a TMI town read

PC is likely town. So NAS is a good vote

[Hu Tao]

do you even have a case for not a scum

so notascum ended as the second biggest wagon of yesterday and was discussed at length as a potential scumread by tons of people
but aristeia, who went out of her way to push through the naeyrs wagon through against a wealth of resistance, apparently did not notice anyone post reasons for voting NAS either 1) back when anyone made these posts, or 2) while reflecting on the outcome of Day and Night 1
aristeia even bothered to spend a post examining NAS's game history before peeking at even one post someone's made this game explainaing their NAS scumread
supposing this slot is town -- which i suppose is not certain! -- the amount of wasted effort here is breathtaking

Good post

Aristeia and Psyche both scumread each other but go out of their way to FoS me together. Just sayin

Let's vote NAS together

[Hu Tao]

hu tao how come you are steam rolling ahead after what happened d1

Cause I was pretty confident on NAS before I got distracted with Naerys

[Hu Tao]

i don’t have a guilty on NAS
my promise wouldn’t have any meaning if i did

I also don't have a guilty on NAS if that is what was assumed

[Hu Tao]

i dont care im going to case political clout anyway

Stop getting distracted by town

[Hu Tao]

hu tao how come you are steam rolling ahead after what happened d1

Cause I was pretty confident on NAS before I got distracted with Naerys

you literally said we should yeet you on d1 and then sheep you on Naerys on D2

Good morning fellow townies! This game looks really complex to me.

Okay well. This post was the 2nd post I didn't like. Seems like new scum. I feel the nervousness in this post. Trying to blend in

VOTE: NotAScum

I think this is my preferred vote.

I also think I'm more weary of scum being off that wagon. Scum knew RN was town so they probably soft defended to gain townie points

I also think I'm more weary of scum being off that wagon. Scum knew RN was town so they probably soft defended to gain townie points

there were only like 2 slots that defended random nurse, why are you voting notascum as opposed to looking at them

Because I'm pretty sure he's scum. Where as I would need to look at people and decide which might be scum.

I also think I'm more weary of scum being off that wagon. Scum knew RN was town so they probably soft defended to gain townie points

No, scum wants as many town PRs to oust as possible. Thats why i am pretty sure atleast 1 scum, maybe 2 scums were on Nurse.

How would scum know RN was a pr? This makes no sense.

Naerys might be scum

Me saying I prefer NAS then getting distracted by Naerys

[Hu Tao]

i dont care im going to case political clout anyway

Stop getting distracted by town

think it’s important for dann to feel heard if we’re going to make any progress.

I am willing to hear Dann. Just not on PC being scum and him basing his reads off that.

[Hu Tao]

Kay why aren't you voting NAS

[Hu Tao]

Hu I honestly forgot you had the NAS read before naerys, I’m glad you posted that but was your read solely based off his first post sounding nervous or was there more to it?

No. I mean his end of day was sus with the quick hammer when he started being sussed.

[Hu Tao]

We made one miselim and a VT got killed. Really not a terrible situation

[Hu Tao]

i am busy tonight and will have to wait to fully summarize my thoughts / figure out what i want to do

idk why hu tao is trying to rush today it's very disheartening

I'll let you summarize your thoughts.

[Hu Tao]

We made one miselim and a VT got killed. Really not a terrible situation

everything is fine the wolf said and he tried to convince the sheep to jump into his stewpot

the water is just the right temperature

What gave it away?

[Hu Tao]

We made one miselim and a VT got killed. Really not a terrible situation

everything is fine the wolf said and she tried to convince the sheep to jump into his stewpot

the water is just the right temperature

fixed pronouns sorry the big bad wolf is usually male in the stories.

it's fine that kinda stuff doesn't bother me

[Hu Tao]

What gave it away?

you jumping off naerys to vote PC even though you thought she was lockscum
you not really re-evaluating after naerys elim
your "scumread" of PC that just mysteriously vanished for no reason
you buddying Random Nurse because he has the awareness level of head of cabbage
you showing absolutely no fustration with RN whatsoever despite him just being completely delusional
you not voting me even though you're posturing you think I'm mafia
you defending titus/drew on lol grounds and never re-evaluating the slot after they had the shadiest wagon hop on ever into Naerys
you never re-evaluating the Naerys read even though she did like thirteen different contortions
you cared too much on the initial push on d1

What if I were to tell you..

I'm town.

I know. It's hard to believe. But I am. What would you say

[Hu Tao]

otoh i can’t shake the feeling that not feeling frustrated at this point in this game is a light scumtell

I've had worse events happen day 1 and n1 as town. Maybe that's why I'm not bothered

[Hu Tao]

What if I were to tell you..

I'm town.

I know. It's hard to believe. But I am. What would you say

if you're actually town we'll lose together so I'm fine with it

I just wouldn't believe you at your word because like its trivially easy to lie about

Luckily for you, we are going to win this game. If you're also town. You're not on my to vote list today anyway

[Hu Tao]

My drew/Titus read is pretty good. I don't think I've been wrong on either of them before. Remember that cop game I played with you and Titus I set the bait for her and she took the bait and I called her scum correctly.

[Hu Tao]

That was literally one of your reads for scum reading me

[Hu Tao]

Idk but probably should avoid that

[Hu Tao]

after you went all in on Naerys and she flipped town im ngl i dont trust your reads even if you're town

Were you not also scumreading her???

[Hu Tao]

UNVOTE:

I don't think the odds are like amazing that this is some S-S thing but it's the explanation that makes sense to me because it makes most of the pieces fit.

Hu Tao self voting and yelling that Naerys is mafia to distance

Naerys unvoting and sabotaging the Hu Tao wagon at its Apex

Hu Tao abandoning Naerys to vote PC as soon as a viable CW popped up while saying she still thought Naerys was a "good" vote also - then popping back on Naerys.

Naerys claiming she doesn't care about the game and then re-engaging into the thread when this subject comes up.[this would make sense with a scum mentality of "I'm done, my job was to die for Hu Tao today" to "oh no maybe they are onto us and panick"]


I think Dave said something earlier about how Hu Tao/Naerys interactions felt like scum theatre and its just been in the back of my head.

You called us S/S. Now you're whining about the clear forcing you to vote her

[Hu Tao]

Nope. You made the #1 mistake of mafia. You were wrong about a read day 1. You might be mafia then

[Hu Tao]

i don't know if you're town with really bad reading comprehension or mafia trying to cherrypick random shit out of context to misrepresent my thought process

You've literally called me scum for 11 reasons now I might be town?

[Hu Tao]

I 100% take the blame on Naerys being voted out. That one was on me, and I admit that.

[Hu Tao]

If this is you claiming you’d be a mislim, do you have anyone you’d rather see pushed with more evidence than just Hu jumping on a wagon and then self-voting? (you’d have to vote half the players if that’s your stance) Is there literally anything that’s happened after post 183 that you can offer to support this Hu vote or give a different option? If not, I’m voting you.

Fair warning, if NAS doesn’t answer me or gives some bs non-answer, I’m placing my vote and it’ll be E-1.

This feels like you're trying hard to find any excuse to vote me. Curious, you've never shown any intent on voting me so far, just when a train forms on me you're full on finding any excuse to vote? Go ahead and help yourself then. As for your questions, I've already answered them.

This is actually a fair take.

[Hu Tao]

Gonna he honest, Kay has been giving me some scum pings today. But unsure.

[Hu Tao]

Be*

[Hu Tao]

I’m still not sold on Hu Tao possibly being bad, my read on her has pretty much stayed town since that whole naerys debacle. Dave was originally a pretty strong town read for me but now I’m just kind of indifferent, but not enough to read him as anything but a question mark. Ari is a mystery to me after the past 24 hours. Truly, I just can’t see why scum would act that way but I didn’t understand why naerys would act the way she did and she was then so I don’t really know what conclusions to draw about Ari (and to a lesser degree) psyche after last night. The other 3 possibilities to me seem better but I’m biased since that’s literally the entire bottom of my read list.

I forgot if I asked but what's your extent of playing mafia?

[Hu Tao]

Maybe I should make a reads list

[Hu Tao]

Town

Hu Taown
Random Nurse
Political Clout

Leaning Town

Psyche
davesaz
Titus

Slight Town

KayJayQueue

Unsure

Aristeia
Dannflor
geraintm
NotAScum

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: PC

Naur

[Hu Tao]

Only very roughly sorted.

Random Nurse
davesaz

KayJayQueue -- seems more concerned about being right/doing right things than about looking good, which gives townish vibes to me
Psyche -- not a huge fan of the tunnel, but I don't see scum motivation in pressing it against this kind of blowback.
Klick -- primarily gut from agreement. fair disclosure, I'm susceptible to agreement bias and it's really vague memories

Political Clout -- vague memory of feeling up and down, placement is mostly about not being sure what I felt
Doctor Drew -- historically have trouble reading and not much that I remember
Aristeia -- seems very underwhelming but I'm susceptible to projecting a burden of proficiency so keeping a null read
geraintm -- similar to Drew, I don't think I have a good track record of being able to read
Dannflor -- similar to Aristeia, I'm used to there being more presence and haven't put in the work to adjust that expectation
NotAScum -- what's there is admittedly a bit sketchy but wary of jumping to conclusions on so few posts

Hu Tao -- really dislike the self vote along with delay in pushing what then appeared to be a strong scumread, and seeing some possible opportunism.

Naerys -- dislike the self vote even more, actively avoiding some questions. Despite that, most likely read to be wrong, very swingy meta

PC moved a lot from here. Why Dave?

[Hu Tao]

Gonna he honest, Kay has been giving me some scum pings today. But unsure.

can you uh be more specific

Maybe it's a bit more passive

[Hu Tao]

I still think NAS is best Elim. I don't want to out a PR either. He's scummy and already claimed

[Hu Tao]

sorry,

i

should have been more specific
can you point out specific posts that are scummy and tell us why you feel that way

It's not a specific post more like a mood. They seemed to be more in the conversation day 1. And seem to have taken a step back day 2. Something I think I could see scum doing especially after that day 1. But I don't think it's enough go say she's scum or anything

[Hu Tao]

I'm also surprised we don't have a vigilante. Or maybe there is a vigilante tonight. If so I would shoot gera tbh.

[Hu Tao]

Town

Hu Taown
Random Nurse
Political Clout

Leaning Town

Psyche
davesaz
Titus

Slight Town

KayJayQueue

Unsure

Aristeia
Dannflor
geraintm
NotAScum

If I'm wrong with someone here, I think it's someone in leaning town tier. I'm most confident in Psyche in this tier. I think the Klick kill spews Psyche as town

[Hu Tao]

sorry,

i

should have been more specific
can you point out specific posts that are scummy and tell us why you feel that way

It's not a specific post more like a mood. They seemed to be more in the conversation day 1. And seem to have taken a step back day 2. Something I think I could see scum doing especially after that day 1. But I don't think it's enough go say she's scum or anything

Wait you feel I’ve taken a step back today? I feel literally insane right now, because I feel like I haven’t shut up lol this game is making everything feel backwards. I need to go drink a bottle of water and chill for 10 minutes (I say this but watch me respond to Dann the minute after he posts again lol)

Okay maybe you are town

[Hu Tao]

Town

Hu Taown
Random Nurse
Political Clout

Leaning Town

Psyche
davesaz
Titus

Slight Town

KayJayQueue

Unsure

Aristeia
Dannflor
geraintm
NotAScum

If I'm wrong with someone here, I think it's someone in leaning town tier. I'm most confident in Psyche in this tier. I think the Klick kill spews Psyche as town

How? I haven't ruled out Klick as a vig shot. I think if Klick is not a vig shot, Klick's reads are a good place to start. I just see Dannflor posturing and feel ick though.

I really doubt that Klick was a vigilante shot. If so it was a terrible shot.

[Hu Tao]

How? I haven't ruled out Klick as a vig shot. I think if Klick is not a vig shot, Klick's reads are a good place to start. I just see Dannflor posturing and feel ick though.

Wouldn’t the vig have come forward if that’s what happened?

Agreed. Also gera or NAS would have been the vig shot imo

[Hu Tao]

Klick was softing Mason with Psyche. I think that's why he was killed. Which is why I think Psyche is town.

[Hu Tao]

So Psyche is basically an IC
I think Random Nurse is town as well

[Hu Tao]

masons with an ic sounds criminal.

Probably but who knows. I think that's why he was killed.

[Hu Tao]

hu tao why are you town reading titus and PC

Drew I liked before he left with his questions. Titus I like her vibe. When she was scum before she was obvious in the last game I was in with her. PC I'm just pretty confident in. I don't think he's scum based on end of day yesterday and how he approached me.

[Hu Tao]

tinfoil hat I think someone gave nas those things to post. they feel like two different people posting today and yesterday.

Maybe

[Hu Tao]

let's say I have this belief. That we should kill on the wagon. let's also say that people on the first hammered wagon are a lot of the same people on the second wagon today. and let's say that everyone is doing whatever they want. will a statistical proof or essay change anyones mind that we should for sure kill on the wagon since it is most probably that scum are on that wagon since it aligns with their win con and that we should reexamine our reads of the people on the wagons.

- love, light, and peace
PC

I agree. Which is why we are going for NAS

[Hu Tao]

honestly maybe add dave to my pool

[davesaz/titus/geraintm/PC]

I'm reasonably confident everyone else is town at this point

I think Klick was the most likely player to stand in the way of Hu Tao getting run over today and that might've been why he was killed idk

he was also just very towny

VOTE: dann

VOTE: Titus

?

[Hu Tao]

I'll just say this. I am a gated roleblocker. I roleblocked Dann and scum are scared. If Klick is a vig kill, Dann did the scumkill. I've eluded to it but scum Dann is pissed.

Okay. Vig should out. But i doubt there was a vigilante

[Hu Tao]

I am so confused. first the lolhammer which makes me want to policy notascum and now the claim from titus they weren't even at -1 yet. I want a bold intent to hammer I want a phalanx of people going through day 1. I want more posting. I want more conversation. I don't get it. I'm eating my tamale. why aren't people playing how I want?

UNVOTE:

do I believe titus claim I'm not sure. in the end I just don't know.

Vote NAS

[Hu Tao]

I pretty much automatically SR anyone who doesn't appear to be trying to find scum.
NAS fits that. I don't do the "poor newb doesn't know how to play so cut some slack they're town" thing. Try to find scum or get yeeted.
Naerys fit it for most of D1. It looked like she was going to pick herself up and play and I might have had a change of heart and vote if the trajectory continued, but it got cut short by others as soon as that looked likely.

That's not the only way I look for scum, hence my recent arc, but I think it's important to say that I'm not off NAS because of a townread.

Okay. Then why not vote NAS

[Hu Tao]

Klick was softing Mason with Psyche. I think that's why he was killed. Which is why I think Psyche is town.

and you know that how? Got any post to show that? I haven't seen Psyche refuting it, so it could be true. However, unless you can show that post, I've doubt a townie would be able guess about such things. I think it's likely that a scum would be able to figure these things faster, given they probably have more info at their disposal. You're not playing as town HT, cracks are starting to show

I already did

[Hu Tao]

Shows that you are not reading and just trying to make posts

[Hu Tao]

Why NAS today?

Gut's not pinging on this one currently.

Gut was wrong once already. Try going the opposite

[Hu Tao]

Okay. Then why not vote NAS

I don't want a quick lim.

I do. He's already claimed VT. If we just voted him then Titus would have never outed. This is what happens when we go in circles sometimes

[Hu Tao]

I still think we vote nas

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: political clout

Not a good vote.

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: political clout

Not a good vote.

you would be much more pleasant to play with if you actually engaged people instead of just repeating what you wanted over and over with little to no substantiation

Well this isn't fair I'd say I engaged a lot day 1 on my Naerys read, providing lots of reasons and proof from other games. And not only was it wrong, not many people listened anyway. So.. either way I agree what you said earlier. Day will move on when NAS is eliminated

[Hu Tao]

I'm on phone. Would prefer to be less abrasive but it would take too long to type that with one finger. Only morons or scum would scumread me.

I don't think Dave is scum either tbh. But not that strong of a read

[Hu Tao]

dave feeling so sensitive is probably towny?

in which case im a little lost again

NAS imo is scum. I think he has to be

[Hu Tao]

Lots of people here have given me reasons to tr them for one reason or another. NAS is the lowest on that pole

[Hu Tao]

ok Hu Tao

let's say you actually believe NAS is mafia

what's NAS's scum team doing right now

What even is this question? You could say this for anyone not just NAS

[Hu Tao]

Okay listen to me again today. If I'm wrong I'll reevaluate tomorrow

[Hu Tao]

Okay listen to me again today. If I'm wrong I'll reevaluate tomorrow

my point is you dont seem like you've even done the basic work of evaluating today

You too

[Hu Tao]

do you want to eliminate hu tao, ari

yes

Naur

[Hu Tao]

Maybe I am bad at the game. But any team I can come up with has NAS in it.

[Hu Tao]

I literally cannot see a path to Hu Tao being scum. I think we’re going in circles trying to find reasons Hu might be bad. If we’re voting NAS, I’m fine with it. PC? Sure let’s do it. But I think we’re chasing our tails with the Hu discussion. I’m ready to put Hu next to RN on my list.

WHY? HOW? WHAT???????

Because I received a green PM

[Hu Tao]

I'm willing to settle and eliminate gera today since he'd likely just be voted out tomorrow.

[Hu Tao]

If there is a vigilante which there probably is. I feel all my games have vigilante these days I'd shoot gera or NAS. Both have eluded to or claimed VT. They are safe shots

[Hu Tao]

noo follow ur heart. someone w the heart of a true vig would never just take the safe shot. their gun is for scum only.

I think once those 2 are gone the scumhunting begins. If one of them is scum that would be great

[Hu Tao]

noo follow ur heart. someone w the heart of a true vig would never just take the safe shot. their gun is for scum only.

I think once those 2 are gone the scumhunting begins. If one of them is scum that would be great

i think you might be right but it's kind of boring. where's the rule of cool? are you still hoping it's dann?

I'm scared of Dann. He's like the 1 player I'm scared of for some reason

[Hu Tao]

Actually I think I remember catching Dann as scum before awhile ago. I need to skim that game I'll be back

[Hu Tao]

Actually I think I remember catching Dann as scum before awhile ago.

wasn't that also the only game you've played with scum!me? why are you afraid of me

Idk I think cause I miselim'd you once and I felt bad. And then another time you replaced a slot I thought was obvious scum but I started to town read you

[Hu Tao]

aw not my undeliverable promises

fine. if it is our destiny to lose let's stop dilly dallying and sail ahead

I want to live in a world where the scum team is hu tao kjq and dave

Luckily we live in a world where neither of us are scum

[Hu Tao]

I do feel a bit iffy from Kay town reading me so much here. But like. I don't want her today

[Hu Tao]

I do feel a bit iffy from Kay town reading me so much here. But like. I don't want her today

It’s the only thing I have to add to this game lol everyone else is playing ping pong with my reads. You’ve stayed consistent from my perspective of how I initially read you. So I’m apparently going to die on this hill.

If you're scum you're good at giving off new town energy so there is that

[Hu Tao]

Can you just vote

[Hu Tao]

No more stalling

[Hu Tao]

Kay can you vote

[Hu Tao]

Vigilante you literally had 1 job.

[Hu Tao]

Vigilante you literally had 1 job.

Unless Gera is the Vigilante

But if that's the case the game is solved already

[Hu Tao]

Town

Hu Tao, Random Nurse, Political Clout

Sus pool.

, Aristeia, geraintm, , KayJayQueue, Psyche, Titus

[Hu Tao]

ill be honest there's not a slot alive right now that i don't lean town about on a gut level. i'm really worried in a way

Nope. Game is pretty much solved. As long as RN isn't the vigilante

[Hu Tao]

I think we mass claim today

[Hu Tao]

Town

Hu Tao, Random Nurse, Political Clout

Sus pool.

, Aristeia, geraintm, , KayJayQueue, Psyche, Titus

explain how we can still sus ari or kay

I'm just putting this out for myself. Don't worry

[Hu Tao]

geraintm, Aristeia, Titus, KayJayQueue, Psyche, Political Clout.

This should be the claim order IMO

[Hu Tao]

titus already claimed gated roleblocker

Full claim day

[Hu Tao]

Hmmm

[Hu Tao]

Hmmm shouldn't the role blocker claim earlier? They can be caught in a lie if scum

[Hu Tao]

I'm okay with speed limming gera rn.

No.

That's just bad.

[Hu Tao]

the basis for my townlean on titus is that i feel convinced by her conviction around dann in particular. the roleblocker claim itself is null at best for me. but again i have a "the basis for my townlean on " cooked for everyone. i guess im more interested in confirming titus than vice versa...

Why wouldn't scum kill her? Or are they not scared of roleblocker

[Hu Tao]

Also. If you're the vigilante, don't say what your gate is until the end. Just say vigilante

[Hu Tao]

I have to make up for Naerys

[Hu Tao]

the basis for my townlean on titus is that i feel convinced by her conviction around dann in particular. the roleblocker claim itself is null at best for me. but again i have a "the basis for my townlean on " cooked for everyone. i guess im more interested in confirming titus than vice versa...

Why wouldn't scum kill her? Or are they not scared of roleblocker

i don't know if i'd be afraid of a gated roleblocker, particularly with bad reads

still the NKs suggest a "who am i most afraid of skillwise" heuristic instead of mechanic-based rationale.

...but maybe not. you've been more right than dann so far. though i guess naerys happened.

How do you know who the night kill is?

[Hu Tao]

True. Let's wait for Gera to claim

[Hu Tao]

I want to yeet PC

I am Vanilla townie

Too bad

[Hu Tao]

I think its p dumb for the vig to claim today.

is there even any equity in doing it

I think vig should claim. We will have 2 clears

[Hu Tao]

I think vig claims so we can narrow down things. RN will die tonight and then vig will claim tomorrow regardless

[Hu Tao]

And tomorrow there could be a cc for vig if we don't Elim scum today

[Hu Tao]

Because they need to kill confirmed town

[Hu Tao]

gera claiming vig would be the best thing

I'm hoping this

[Hu Tao]

the self vote thing gets a lot more sus if she's not vt lol

[Hu Tao]

Kay and psyche claim in any order

[Hu Tao]

I think my information would be better to give once everyone has claimed but I can give what my role is now. I almost want to insist on holding my info because it could be useful if anyone doubleclaims.

Just claim now. Only the base role. Not modifiers

[Hu Tao]

am not going before titus

Titus already claimed a role blocker, no?

[Hu Tao]

So just go

[Hu Tao]

You don't need to claim any actions. Just your base role

[Hu Tao]

Titus - Roleblocker
Naerys - VT
Random Nurse - BP IC
NotAScum - mafia night 3+ bulletproof-immune goon
Aristeia - VT
geraintm - 1 shot doctor
Political Clout
Klick - VT
KayJayQueue - Informed Townie
Dannflor - VT
davesaz - VT
Psyche -

I think this is where we are so far

[Hu Tao]

I think that can come later. We can line that up to catch people in lies. So can you claim your role

[Hu Tao]

Why must you be difficult. Okay Titus just claim your actual role

[Hu Tao]

We aren't talking reads. Only claims. You're free to claim if you don't wanna wait for titus

[Hu Tao]

Unfortunate that my 2md strongest town read was the vig

[Hu Tao]

So we have no doubleclaims then right? My info is about just one player.

Who is the specific player?

[Hu Tao]

Titus - Roleblocker
Naerys - VT
Random Nurse - BP IC
NotAScum - mafia night 3+ bulletproof-immune goon
Aristeia - VT
geraintm - 1 shot doctor
Political Clout - VT
Klick - VT
KayJayQueue - Informed Townie
Dannflor - VT
davesaz - VT
Psyche - Vigilante

This seems to be the setup.

[Hu Tao]

So we have no doubleclaims then right? My info is about just one player.

Who is the specific player?

PC

Darn. Okay. Out it. What is it?

[Hu Tao]

So we have no doubleclaims then right? My info is about just one player.

Who is the specific player?

PC

Darn. Okay. Out it. What is it?

I found out PC’s alignment. I only got information night 2 though.

Any guesses? lol

Just say it. Also why was it PC in particular?

[Hu Tao]

So we have no doubleclaims then right? My info is about just one player.

Who is the specific player?

PC

Darn. Okay. Out it. What is it?

I found out PC’s alignment. I only got information night 2 though.

Any guesses? lol

Just say it. Also why was it PC in particular?

I have no idea why it was them in particular. I didn’t get to like choose who to get the information about or I might’ve chosen someone else. It just said I learn that they are aligned with the town.

What's your full role name?

[Hu Tao]

Copycat

[Hu Tao]

Okay well. I believe it. But this is gonna get awkward

[Hu Tao]

getting awfully close to having to re-eval my hu tao read tbh

Just wait. It's about to get better

[Hu Tao]

I'm not a VT.

[Hu Tao]

I'm a gunsmith. My n1 result was that PC has no gun. I softed it pretty obviously over and over again.

[Hu Tao]

So unless he's a traitor or Doctor he's town. And with Kay's result the only way PC can be scum is if Kay and PC are scum together

[Hu Tao]

Or mafia doctor*

[Hu Tao]

That's also why I knew there was a vigilante this setup day 1

[Hu Tao]

so shameful. i should've claimed vt. ok n2 result

No result for n2

[Hu Tao]

As in, I don't get a n2 check

[Hu Tao]

Which is why I believe Kay saying her role has n2 in it

[Hu Tao]

I think Titus should full claim

[Hu Tao]

Yeah we pretty much wait for Titus. I think this game is pretty much over

[Hu Tao]

(Famous last words)

[Hu Tao]

If Kay is a mastermind that's the only way imo

[Hu Tao]

Pretty much. But I'm likely dying tonight

[Hu Tao]

Yeah probably but we still wait for Titus to full claim

[Hu Tao]

I think Kay is pretty off the table

[Hu Tao]

If I'm scum and led on my partner and cleared a random townie in a scenario with a vigilante and IC I deserve the loss

[Hu Tao]

yeah gera sounds great. but who after gera?

probably Kay

i dont think anyone with experience would fake claim doctor

for my sanity
let's talk about the hutao scum scenario
you used to scumread hutao -- where'd that go?

high scum equit me thinks waiting to be last to claim when info doesn't really give impactful information plus titus assuming there was a vig and with gera revealed it all makes sense this is my current tin foil hat theory or it's just easily titus.

I mean. I didn't expect Kay to also have you as town cleared

[Hu Tao]

bahhh idk if the game is worth this much additional effort. if the ari/kay reads are right we win; if they aren't we don't. maybe we just get titus's final claim and seem this through.

I think you're town binning ari way too easy.

[Hu Tao]

I already explained how yesterday her frustrations didn't match what the game state was.

[Hu Tao]

I think titus' full claim could potentially give us a confirmed win though if we get scum today

[Hu Tao]

No. I planned to make the deal since I figured I'd be getting a scum so it would be fine

[Hu Tao]

So I think PC is probably town BTW. Day ended before I could go over final reads, he started to act like he did as his last town game I was in with him and he started to ask more questions toward the end with me.

vote count 1.final

with 13 votes in play, it took 7 to make a decision. day 1 ended.

yeet

Naerys [7]:

Random Nurse

, davesaz, geraintm, Hu Tao, Titus, Aristeia, NotAScum

[HAMMER]

NotAScum [2]:

Dannflor, Klick

not voting [4]:

Naerys, KayJayQueue, Political Clout, Psyche

mod notes

fun fact: all flavour images this game have been provided by our wonderful backup mod GeorgeBailey!

flavour

So based on wagon stuff. Naerys is town, PC is town, Kay is highly likely town, Psyche I think is town based on Klick kill (if it actually was a vigilante then they should say so, cause that changes this read)

We know Klick is town. So that means all 3 scum were on Naerys' wagon or Dann is scum assuming everything above is correct.

ok so my hesitation with NotAScum is that I think Political Clout is scum and I am pretty sure if that's the case then PC's weird hard town case on NAS yesterday was a TMI town read

PC is likely town. So NAS is a good vote

i dont care im going to case political clout anyway

Stop getting distracted by town

think it’s important for dann to feel heard if we’re going to make any progress.

I am willing to hear Dann. Just not on PC being scum and him basing his reads off that.

Town

Hu Taown
Random Nurse
Political Clout

Leaning Town

Psyche
davesaz
Titus

Slight Town

KayJayQueue

Unsure

Aristeia
Dannflor
geraintm
NotAScum

VOTE: PC

Naur

hu tao why are you town reading titus and PC

Drew I liked before he left with his questions. Titus I like her vibe. When she was scum before she was obvious in the last game I was in with her. PC I'm just pretty confident in. I don't think he's scum based on end of day yesterday and how he approached me.

I literally cannot see a path to Hu Tao being scum. I think we’re going in circles trying to find reasons Hu might be bad. If we’re voting NAS, I’m fine with it. PC? Sure let’s do it. But I think we’re chasing our tails with the Hu discussion. I’m ready to put Hu next to RN on my list.

WHY? HOW? WHAT???????

Because I received a green PM

I want to yeet PC

I am Vanilla townie

Too bad

Look how many PC town softs I did

[Hu Tao]

Pretty much. But I'm likely dying tonight

You think you'll die before a confirmed IC?

Scum can't keep a gunsmith alive. Especially if we hit scum today.

[Hu Tao]

I literally gigabrained this and set it up perfectly for this moment. I made scum think I was VT. And me claiming later allowed Kay to even out something that is credible.

[Hu Tao]

Anyway. I guess we still wait for Titus

[Hu Tao]

Please full claim when you're back

[Hu Tao]

It is worth the sacrifice to get 1 scum out the game. But only if it is agreed that she is the elimination tomorrow

that's really dumb! why would anyone agree to that? has an entire town ever agreed to that?

Well if town thinks I'm scum better for them to see I'm town and just vote out my scumread after. Last time Naerys was scum and I was town I literally had to beg for 3 pages for town to eliminate Naerys after I flipped town.

For context:

1 or 2 more for hammer. I probably die tonight. Good bye everyone. I think Naerys is last assuming Prince is scum

Last scum is likely not vanilla.

So enchant is prob town if he's confirmed vanilla.

I think Dunn and kyouko are town.

PoP is likely scum .

Broccoli by vibe is town but by play is sus.

Naerys is likely scum partner and should be the elim tomorrow assuming PoP is scum

Naerys
Hu Tao
Broccoli Quest 2
Guillotina
Enchant
Dunnstral
ssbm_Kyouko

This is the alive list - 7 alive, 4 to hammer - Naerys, Hu Tao, BQ2 and I voted you

I trust your judgement tomorrow but please have naerys as the Elim tomorrow assuming pop is scum

I repeat kill Naerys tomorrow, she chained self to mafia claiming DOCTOR.


Naerys and fresh replacement may be reason why mafia didn't bother to skip kill, they are both just didn't knew hell about it.

I agree naerys is most sus

I'll trust town to decide if naerys isn't scum. But yeah, that should be the vote tomorrow. Sorry for repeating myself so many times.

And yes she was scum.

not helping the "more focused on selling yourself as genuine than finding scum" accusations

Well it won't matter when I flip town? So who cares. There is no mystery anymore.

these posts are not consistent w an experienced player holding an town gunsmith role pm

I should be at E-1 now I think. Remember after you see me flip town to vote Naerys tomorrow or I'll be pretty upset.

To go back to this. That's why I made the post above. Because I'd be giving up a PR role for it. But I realized since you all didn't know I was pr it sounded more like a tactic than an exchange since you can't see my role. Which is why I stopped after

I find this tactic really obnoxious and would appreciate if you avoided it in the future

But I think you're not that likely to have partners

This isn't a tactic or play. I'm just trying to do an equal exchange. In my mind once I flip town maybe people will see what I mean.

[Hu Tao]

I was gonna ask that. I thought that meant he couldn't be vigged after n3? Confused.

[Hu Tao]

I see. Well, if I'm being honest. I think last 2 are gera and Ari. But we will see Titus' claim.

[Hu Tao]

I was gonna ask that. I thought that meant he couldn't be vigged after n3? Confused.

No, my Bulletproof modifier will not work on him on N3. He becomes immune to it.

That makes sense why they didn't try to shoot you then. And waited. Also we should see who was very against going NAS yester

[Hu Tao]

i'm fine with gera dying today...

im not

You were fine with dying yesterday. Why?

[Hu Tao]

Since Titus claimed odd night role blocker. I think we can win this tonight if she's town.

Psyche, do you have a vigilante shot for tomorrow? If so I think we win

[Hu Tao]

Idk why Titus would claim rb day 2 and lock herself into that claim so early as scum.

[Hu Tao]

Gera can you explain why you didn't want to target the IC with your doc shot?

[Hu Tao]

geraaa
if you don't wanna get eliminated, you've gotta show us you trying to find and eliminate scum
you can't give us this "i can't believe this" act without doing anything to meaningfully transition from your "d1 is worthless" act

Do you have a vig shot tomorrow

[Hu Tao]

i'd need really strong reasons to say either way — like "it'll change what we do today" reasons

If you're vigilante tonight: We Elim gera. If he flips scum there is 1 scum remaining. You vig Ari. Titus roleblocks Kay. The reason for the Titus Roleblock on Kay is that it was also confirm PC as town even more while confirming Kay as town (if there is still a kill). If there is no kill then we still have all our conf towns. Lmk if this sounds good or not

[Hu Tao]

If there is a kill I guess that leaves me and Titus as the only options and makes the game a win. I doubt scum have a strong arm because of NaS' role

[Hu Tao]

worst case scenario:
gera flips town, and roleblock fails to prevent a kill on a confirmed or clear a slot, and a hypothetical vig shot hits town (let's say ari), leaving 2 scum remaining in 3 of:

Titus
Hu Tao
KayJayQueue

4v2, mylo.
town has 2/3 chance of guessing right.
town would be three of: me/rn/pc/???

then if town guesses right and scum get a kill,
3v1, mylo again
maybe a choice between hu tao and kayjayqueue
spooky

If it comes to that last scenario I'd be fine losing to Kay. That would be amazing play by her if she's scum here somehow

[Hu Tao]

i will ramble on and on if allowed. backbone coalition needs to kick in

VOTE: geraintm

Before we vote we should make sure everyone is on the same agreement on the plan

[Hu Tao]

who is the best bet? im inclined to say it's kayjayqueue. more than any other slot, i can't conceive of a world where she's scum.

I don't really believe Kay's claim it feels really unlikely for there to be a informed townie who can on night two learn that a dead person is town, or maybe find out a live person is town

the swing in that role doesnt feel like it would pass review.

perhaps I just lack imagination ig

Well. Without me and Kay, town would have no "investigation" results. Vig can be swingy in general and so can role blocker if they blocked be n1. So I don't think it's terrible. I don't see where gera fits though.

[Hu Tao]

who is the best bet? im inclined to say it's kayjayqueue. more than any other slot, i can't conceive of a world where she's scum.

I don't really believe Kay's claim it feels really unlikely for there to be a informed townie who can on night two learn that a dead person is town, or maybe find out a live person is town

the swing in that role doesnt feel like it would pass review.

perhaps I just lack imagination ig

I do believe because unless they know my role it just fits with mine. And i don't see scum role copping me after my day 1

[Hu Tao]

UNVOTE:

we shouldnt put gera at e-1 until titus says whos shes roleblocking

I want to hear Hu's solving first. I'm not feeling well. Brain power work

I already posted it. Would you block Kay

[Hu Tao]

I do believe because unless they know my role it just fits with mine. And i don't see scum role copping me after my day 1

how does a night two informed fit with a night one gunsmith

The informed Basically gives a result. Otherwise without us there is no investigate roles

[Hu Tao]

UNVOTE:

we shouldnt put gera at e-1 until titus says whos shes roleblocking

I want to hear Hu's solving first. I'm not feeling well. Brain power work

I already posted it. Would you block Kay

Link me please. Brain dead but not opposed. Just need to check.

i'd need really strong reasons to say either way — like "it'll change what we do today" reasons

If you're vigilante tonight: We Elim gera. If he flips scum there is 1 scum remaining. You vig Ari. Titus roleblocks Kay. The reason for the Titus Roleblock on Kay is that it was also confirm PC as town even more while confirming Kay as town (if there is still a kill). If there is no kill then we still have all our conf towns. Lmk if this sounds good or not

[Hu Tao]

Worst case scenario if gera is somehow town here I think you still block Kay. If Kay is scum with a traitor/doctor PC that's the only way PC is scum so that basically confirms PC town. Psyche I think you still shoot Ari if gera flips town. Otherwise she's unaccounted for.

[Hu Tao]

I'm fine with psyche shooting hu tao actually.

Thank God I checked you cause you've been scum posting since day 1

[Hu Tao]

I do believe because unless they know my role it just fits with mine. And i don't see scum role copping me after my day 1

how does a night two informed fit with a night one gunsmith

The informed Basically gives a result. Otherwise without us there is no investigate roles

we have an IC and a vig, having two investigatives+roleblocker is way too much power.

Maybe it's just Titus and gera or something but I think my plan covers the most options

[Hu Tao]

I'm fine with psyche shooting hu tao actually.

Thank God I checked you cause you've been scum posting since day 1

lol I only get useful towards the end.

Shooting me is not being useful and we are getting toward the end now. Do you really think I'm scum here? I wanted NAS shot n1 and basically forced NAS being eliminated day 2 and wanted gera shot n2.

[Hu Tao]

I do believe because unless they know my role it just fits with mine. And i don't see scum role copping me after my day 1

how does a night two informed fit with a night one gunsmith

The informed Basically gives a result. Otherwise without us there is no investigate roles

we have an IC and a vig, having two investigatives+roleblocker is way too much power.

Also going back to this. Your thought is assuming Gera is scum correct? Well having Titus block someone is optimal since it either gives us a clear or gives us a 1vs1 regardless if Titus is scum or town

[Hu Tao]

i think there's a decent chance. of course higher if gera flips town

Okay should we discuss possibilities where Gera is town then?

[Hu Tao]

Is there a play where using Gera's doc shot and eliminating someone else would work out better?

[Hu Tao]

does it matter if i shoot hutao instead of ari?

Yes. Because you didn't listen to my vigilante recommendation yesterday

[Hu Tao]

yeah well i didnt listen to your naerys recommendation either

Fair play

[Hu Tao]

Is there a play where using Gera's doc shot and eliminating someone else would work out better?

Who would scum be shooting? RN? You?

Scum is shooting me or Psyche I'm pretty sure