Post Apocalyptic Mafia - Mini 1226: Over!

[CSL]

Vote: Nicodemus

Bullshit reason to vote me.

[Gaoth]

Palisade thinks he's clever, but a claim this early is simply bullshit. Nothing says, "Kill me now to spare a real PR" like claiming cop day one. When he doesn't wind up dead, it would basically be confscum. Palisade is townie.

Nice doublespeak, but you're sending conflicting messages, in discrediting both Palisade's claim and credibility while calling him town. Riddle me this: why would Palisade go to all the effort of faking a post restriction, then creating a code for said post restriction to convey a claim, instead of just saying "Yo guys I'm a cop dawgs don't kill me bro"? Lend an air of plausibility, you say? Well obviously it hasn't convinced anyone but me, and he hasn't dropped the "fake" restriction yet, so why keep it up if no one buys it?

Lets see if i can spell this out for you, since you seem focused on saving not yourself, but nico, by trying to push a lynch onto me. (i will get back to this).

Palisade "claimed" cop. If there is the slightest chance that he is indeed cop, scum would be retarded not to kill him tonight. So, by his claim, he should die tonight. To me, this is textbook distraction claiming. A real PR wouldnt want to out this early, a scum gambitting would not pick such a common role. Palisade is trying to draw the nightkill so that a real PR doesn't take the bullet. This is town move.

I will amend by assertion that a living palisade is a scum palisade. He could live for a variety of reasons, which include lots of WIFOMing.

@Wraith. I can tell you exactly why I'm not voting you. It's because only one player can be voted on at a time. I find Nicodemus more scummy than you, and voted accordingly, just as you find reg scummy but voted me because you think I'm scummier. I think this goes for several players.

[diddin]

Vote: Nicodemus

Bullshit reason to vote me.

CSL continues to be scum.

Nico is town, idk what you guys are talking about.

[xvart]

Slaxx hates post restrictions and think they detract from the game meaning the post restrction is 100% fake. There hasn't been any point stating so until now because him posting like that means I don't have to hear his illogical and non-sensical reasoning behind his reads (I asked to /Out if Mastin /Inned but caved last minute due to the player list being amazing and me being a pussy). I've seen Mastin act and fake things like this previously as town and I'm failing to see him claim cop this early on as mafia as a counter-claim (Which is likely for a role as common as cop) would lead towards his lynch.

Okay, that's good enough for me to consider the post restriction fake; but I would feel a whole lot better if this was public knowledge somewhere or was it a private conversation? Furthermore, as you pointed out, Mastin has apparently site flaked so I think mastin's motivations for doing this is irrelevant as it would actually be TwistedSpoon doing it. If TwistedSpoon felt he was under pressure due to the restriction he created it seems like a plausible claim to either snuff the suspicion and hope for no cop or no counter claim; or at the least get a claim out for his buddies to capitalize on. Why do you think the fake post restriction is mastin's master plan when you said he had site flaked and therefore not around to actually scheme?

UNVOTE:
VOTE: palisade

Don't get me wrong, I know where you're coming from the (More information is always better) angle but it's not the reasoning behind CSLs read that means anything it's his actual read, his reasoning is going to be piss poor or 'gut' regardless of his alignment thus asking him is fluff. Speaking of which I need to get to reading Nico later but I have to leave for cricket soon.

I think you are improperly assigning motive to my intentions. If CSL had come back and said "oh no guys, I didn't mean it" or "reaction fishing" or "lol stuff" that would be something worth digesting and possibly lynching over it. I'm never going to assume what someone else is going to say and therefore not bother to ask it because of that.

@xvart: I have expanded. I think the scum are Gaoth, Regfan, and Nico. Everyone else is in the other camp except for the people who really don't care for the bullshit the scum and stupid are trying to push on me.

Yes, sorry. I was reading your post in isolation and not in context of your previous post. Do you really believe that all of the scum would so heavily push the exact same agenda and the exact same methodology? Isn't that a little risky, especially if you were to flip town? I think the assumption that you are scum isn't a foregone conclusion but neither do I think it is without any merit at all; which brings me to you saying these three people are scum for trying to lynch me by exhibiting the exact same behavior when no scum team in their right mind would push through a lynch like that on Day 1.

Palisade "claimed" cop. If there is the slightest chance that he is indeed cop, scum would be retarded not to kill him tonight. So, by his claim, he should die tonight. To me, this is textbook distraction claiming. A real PR wouldnt want to out this early, a scum gambitting would not pick such a common role. Palisade is trying to draw the nightkill so that a real PR doesn't take the bullet. This is town move.

So you are saying that instead of actually scum hunting and playing the game they decided to fake a post restriction and then gambit for a NK while potentially outting a real cop? This is a town move how? And how is it a town move if it is apparently so obvious what he is doing and now everyone apparently knows that he isn't fake. If they are town they just screwed the town over by fabricating a debilitating and distracting restriction that they can't get out of now because if they do they are appear to be lying scum; plus they aren't going to get night killed now that everyone thinks they are LOL NK BAIT. Regardless, and I'm surprised I even have to say this, but there are plenty of reasons why a scum team would not target a claimed cop for a kill N1, so that line of thinking is invalid.

[Regfan]

I'll have highly limited activity for the next two days (Frends 21st/Family Events) but I'll try and make sure to get through Nicos ISO properly and read the posts above this properly as soon as possible. See you all in two days though!

[AurorusVox]

vox what do think about pali/pr

Already said I don't really buy the PR, but he's not for lynching today imo.

---

Or they're your scumbuddies not wanting to bus their buddy to a lynch D1...

So by this logic...about 8 people in this game are my scumbuddies? Or we could use Occam's Razor to cut through the WIFOM and deduce that there is no vast conspiracy surrounding my so-called scumbuddies, but that I am in fact being set up for a mislynch. I mean, scum and so-called scumhunters alike are using cheap tactics to make it look like I'm guilty.

Obv not all of them can be your buddies, but given that some of the players doing it would HAVE to be scum if you're town - since they could

easily

place what looks like a pro-town vote on you, but are NOT doing it, I have to wonder why.
If you are town then a vote on you is a good vote for a scum to make since almost everyone considers you scummy.
So why are there so few people willing to go through with it? Some of them are town with stronger scumspects elsewhere, but some must be scum, and this is what leads me to conclude that they're wary of bussing their buddy to a lynch on D1.

---

@xvart - the rest were included to show that even if the scummy people are scummy townies, there are plenty of others who could fit the bill. Yes I know this lessens the impact when looking to people OTHER THAN Wraith, but I think it's a legitimate concern when considering Wraith himself.

[Timeater]

Or they're your scumbuddies not wanting to bus their buddy to a lynch D1...

So by this logic...about 8 people in this game are my scumbuddies? Or we could use Occam's Razor to cut through the WIFOM and deduce that there is no vast conspiracy surrounding my so-called scumbuddies, but that I am in fact being set up for a mislynch. I mean, scum and so-called scumhunters alike are using cheap tactics to make it look like I'm guilty.

Why are you still crying? The lynch has obviously changed to Nico.

You sound a little more genuine I'll give you that.

What are these cheap tactics you speak of?

CSL continues to be scum.

Nico is town, idk what you guys are talking about.

Replace scum with useless.

Already said I don't really buy the PR, but he's not for lynching today imo.

I dont care if you buy it or not. Do you think it belongs in this game? Would Slaxx make a dumb PR role like that? Do you think his restriction could be a consequence of another player or do you think its innate? Is Reg's hypothesis correct?

[Timeater]

Palisade thinks he's clever, but a claim this early is simply bullshit. Nothing says, "Kill me now to spare a real PR" like claiming cop day one. When he doesn't wind up dead, it would basically be confscum. Palisade is townie.

Nice doublespeak, but you're sending conflicting messages, in discrediting both Palisade's claim and credibility while calling him town. Riddle me this: why would Palisade go to all the effort of faking a post restriction, then creating a code for said post restriction to convey a claim, instead of just saying "Yo guys I'm a cop dawgs don't kill me bro"? Lend an air of plausibility, you say? Well obviously it hasn't convinced anyone but me, and he hasn't dropped the "fake" restriction yet, so why keep it up if no one buys it?

Lets see if i can spell this out for you, since you seem focused on saving not yourself, but nico, by trying to push a lynch onto me. (i will get back to this).

Palisade "claimed" cop. If there is the slightest chance that he is indeed cop, scum would be retarded not to kill him tonight. So, by his claim, he should die tonight. To me, this is textbook distraction claiming. A real PR wouldnt want to out this early, a scum gambitting would not pick such a common role. Palisade is trying to draw the nightkill so that a real PR doesn't take the bullet. This is town move.

I will amend by assertion that a living palisade is a scum palisade. He could live for a variety of reasons, which include lots of WIFOMing.

@Wraith. I can tell you exactly why I'm not voting you. It's because only one player can be voted on at a time. I find Nicodemus more scummy than you, and voted accordingly, just as you find reg scummy but voted me because you think I'm scummier. I think this goes for several players.

Gaoth is so town it hurts.

[AurorusVox]

Timeater: I think it's fake but I'm not naive enough to think that automatically makes him scum.
He isn't today's lynch, so that's all there is to it atm.

[Fate]

K so


...

We done dickin around yet?

Regfan lynch.

Pallisade tomorrow

PROFIT.

[Timeater]

Regfan lynch?

Are you high?

[xvart]

If both Wraith and Nico are scummy, then someone's wrong and one of them isn't scum because my link isn't a bus. I don't think it's Wraith.

Can you explain this the logic behind this and to what it references? I can barely process the ambiguous "someone", the relevance to your connection not being a bus, and the connection to the link you posted.

@xvart - the rest were included to show that even if the scummy people are scummy townies, there are plenty of others who could fit the bill. Yes I know this lessens the impact when looking to people OTHER THAN Wraith, but I think it's a legitimate concern when considering Wraith himself.

I see the converse (if all suspicious people are voting someone I'm less likely to think the person being voted is scum) but the way you are doing this is really only valid pending a Wraith flip, and even then it's still pretty weak. Especially considering the vote count right now:

CSL(3): Nicodemus, Diddin, Zajnet

The three people you have isolated out are the first and only three on the CSL wagon right now. If they were trying to push a counter wagon jumping in like that would be suicide if scumWraith ended up getting lynched and flipped town, unless of course they are smooth talkers but seeing the things you commented about their suspicion/voting list I don't think that is the case.

The most concerning thing about your line of suspicion is that your vote on Zajnet was beyond legitimate and very justified but then you jump to Wraith because of the lack of people voting him. You essentially stopped voting someone who was scummy because of his unique behavior and are now voting someone based on other people's scummy behaviors. Additionally, if the most justified reason for you pushing Zajnet was because he wasn't voting where he apparently should be then you should be voting either Nicodemus, Diddin, or Zajnet for the same reason and not the person you think they should be voting.

Gaoth is so town it hurts.

How is he so town it hurts? His observation is totally inaccurate unless you think the following behaviors are town behaviors (hint: they are not):

1. Faking a post restriction that eliminates all ability to effectively communicate;
   
2. Faking a post restriction that eliminates all ability to convey messages; and,
   
3. Claiming cop on D1 in an attempt to draw a NK and risking outting a real cop.

You didn't even comment on my observations when I quoted your invalid logic in my last post.

Furthermore, and this is unsubstantiated speculation, but I don't see the benefit of playing in a hydra and faking a debilitating post restriction as it defeats the purpose of having a collective hydra mind; and seriously, how much enjoyment would two people get out of a game if they faked a restriction that is so difficult to communicate that they only posted every once in a while with a message that is so short and ridiculous. So much for two minds seeing the same game and communicating about how to help the town win. And the lurking doesn't help. Andy said in SoS mafia that if you have a restriction and you are town you find a way to communicate reads. I haven't seen anything of the sort from paliside.

Paliside is scum. AV is likely scum.

[Timeater]

Is it wrong of me to assess town reads based on how hard a person tries? Thats just of course a part of the pie, but a large part. Sort of a non sequitor, has nothing to do with why I know Gaoth is town. Anyway -

Xvart is most certainly town. Invalid logic quote of mine in your last post eh, not seeing it. You mention me in your third post, but I see nothing there to really bother talking about. I agree with you about the Vox read.

[AurorusVox]

xvart: I still would like a Zajnet lynch today. However, my vote on Wraith was an attempt to get people to "put their money where their mouth is" and join me on the wagon. The absolute lack therein is very concerning and makes Wraith the best place for my vote atm.

[Timeater]

Nico, what do you think of Hind's position on you? Do you think that you're an easy lynch (lynchbait) therefore the target of many people's vote? Is that unfair? Do you have someone new you'd like to vote for besides CSL?

[Timeater]

Vox.

Zajnet lynch is simply not happening. Get with the program.

Diddin: In http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 2#p3377072 you say Zajnet's posting feels forced. Can you elaborate on that? You also say you'd rather vote CSL or Wraith. What happened to Regfan? Change your read? Why? Also, is voting for Nico scummy?

[xvart]

Invalid logic quote of mine in your last post eh, not seeing it. You mention me in your third post, but I see nothing there to really bother talking about. I agree with you about the Vox read.

Sorry, I got you and Gaoth mixed up on the page flip. It was supposed to be directed at Gaoth, but he hadn't posted between my last post so it is irrelevant.

xvart: I still would like a Zajnet lynch today. However, my vote on Wraith was an attempt to get people to "put their money where their mouth is" and join me on the wagon. The absolute lack therein is very concerning and makes Wraith the best place for my vote atm.

Again the problem is you were (and supposedly still are) willing to lynch Zajnet for voting someone for Behavior X. Then you switched your vote to the target of a handful of people displaying Behavior X, one of which, I might add, is the person you were originally voting for (Zajnet).

Additionally, I believe you are making up things that don't fit with the chronological events of the game. The justification you are providing for abandoning your Zajnet scum read and wanting to lynch Wraith was to test other players and the fact that they didn't "put their money where there mouth is" makes your vote justified in the end. The assignment of "best place for your vote" comes after you already placed it.

Furthermore, in this post you said Wraith and Palasine were buddies of Zajnet. What was the connection between Wraith and Zajnet? Based on your posting you suggested that Wraith was scum based on his lack of vote while reading along and then even referenced this "case" later on.

I'll ask the same question about how Wraith and Palasine are buddies together and what their connection was. At that point in the game you haven't even mentioned them. Finally, what was the turnaround here when you said that the restriction "is fake but I'm not naive enough to think that automatically makes him scum." He was scum before and the only thing that came out between your contradictory posts is that the restriction is nearly confirmed fake.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: AurorusVox

Adjust your votes accordingly.

[AurorusVox]

xvart, you say it's a turnaround, but where have I ever said I thought Pallisade was scum?
I've not said Pallisade and Wraith are scumbuddies. That was timeater. Stop confusing everyone with other people and maybe you'll stop being wrong in your reads :\

I voted Wraith to SEE whether people would join in. I can't test whether people would put their votes where they say if I don't start the wagon.

Step 1: I vote Wraith
Step 2: See if people vote him
--> no: Wraith is likely scum, maintain vote
--> yes: question my Wraith scumread, with potential return to Zajnet wagon

[AurorusVox]

That was timeater.

Derp derp irony alert.
I don't think Timeater said that, I think it was Hindu, talking about Wraith and Nico.
So wrong on all accounts and I have no idea where you got the idea from.

Also,

Zajnet lynch is simply not happening. Get with the program.

If a Zajnet lynch "is simply not happening" am I better off beating that dead horse or voting Wraith as I did to test the waters on other players' sincerity with their "Wraith makes a good lynch" bullshit?

[xvart]

On phone. Post 106 is where said palisade was evil with zjanet. More later.

[Timeater]

Vox: You dont think Nico is scummy and worthy of a lynch?

[Fate]

HERE LET EM ANSWER FOR HIM




NOPE

[Timeater]

http://youtu.be/ySFmgEBC-tg

[AurorusVox]

Pallisade & Wraith make good buddies though, yup.

I meant buddies for Zajnet. Not sure if there's a reason to connect Wraith and Pallisade up at this point, Pallisade hasn't even mentioned him as far as I can tell. Though Wraith implying "Palisade has a daycop" with his Nico vote is pretty stinky.

Meh, Pallisade read shifted towards lolnull with his secret cop claim.

Nico has been pro-town as far as I can tell. I don't think he makes a good lynch today.

[Timeater]

How has he been pro-town?